Proposed gameplay changes for Main Arena

[nugetx]

Rolling plane set will drive away players if they don't have access to the planes they want to fly.  It didn't work for WB and one of the main reasons why I left that game.  It sucked having to wait 2 week to fly the P-38F and then an additional week if I wanted to fly the J model and had to wait until almost the end of the campaign to fly the L model.

Well it could be the same like there is with the 163 and 262 currently.... once you get enough points you can fly your plane  before its 'release' date.

And not to make it super hard or frustrating, once you get enough points, you get for example 4 uses of that plane. If you get back to base you don't loose any uses, but if you die you get one plane less.

This way you would have to make lets say 1 sortie with kills with the 'base' plane of the current year to have a higher tier plane, 3-4 sorties for even higher tier etc. This would have people fly early and mid planes.


So have all planes possible to fly by accumulating enough points, and have them gradually being introduced by the time of year.




Everyone is happy = more players = HTC is happy

This isn't a WW2 flight sim, the core game in no way tries to simulate or replicate WW2.

Ugh i might be missing something, but this is from the  front page of the website


'Welcome to the best WW2 combat experience online'

[Ack-Ack]

Well it could be the same like there is with the 163 and 262 currently.... once you get enough points you can fly your plane  before its 'release' date.

And not to make it super hard or frustrating, once you get enough points, you get for example 4 uses of that plane. If you get back to base you don't loose any uses, but if you die you get one plane less.

This way you would have to make lets say 1 sortie with kills with the 'base' plane of the current year to have a higher tier plane, 3-4 sorties for even higher tier etc. This would have people fly early and mid planes.


So have all planes possible to fly by accumulating enough points, and have them gradually being introduced by the time of year.




Everyone is happy = more players = HTC is happy

Again, look how many complain about not being able to fly the plane of their choice when ENY kicks in.  There will be far more complaints and players leaving if they are denied for a period of time the plane of their choice, which will happen when a RPS is introduced. 

Ask yourself why the creator of WB hasn't introduced a RPS system into AH.  You can find the answer if you search the boards from HiTech himself saying the RPS was a mistake.

Ugh i might be missing something, but this is from the  front page of the website


'Welcome to the best WW2 combat experience online'

Ask HiTech yourself.  He has said many times himself that Aces High does not try and recreate WW2, it's a combat simulator using WW2 aircraft and vehicles.  If the game did try and simulate WW2, we wouldn't be fighting using chess pieces as countries.

[nugetx]

There will be far more complaints and players leaving if they are denied for a period of time the plane of their choice, which will happen when a RPS is introduced.

What about the point system, which is being used right now for planes like 163 and 262 (tempest?).

Maybe expand it further and tweak it, so everyone starts with a early war plane.

But this could potentialy be worse, because with RPS, everyone in the end gets to fly most of the planes.

[BowHTR]

Nugetx, I honestly think your best bet of this happening would be with a completely different arena than the Melee Arena. The Melee Arena needs to stay as it is, a sandbox style arena. Most of this can be accomplished in the AvA arena. Maybe you can talk with one of the AvA guys and they may give it a whirl.

[Oldman731]

Maybe you can talk with one of the AvA guys and they may give it a whirl.

Good advice. 

Years ago we tried a historical RPS in AvA.  Some determined person figured out all the when-were-they-introduced/when-were-they-withdrawn data for the ETO, then compressed it all into a span of about a month.  I'm sure I have it somewhere, and certainly other geezers do, too.  People who naturally gravitated to the AvA found it was a lot of fun, but clearly it isn't for everyone, or even for most people.  We only ran it twice.  It was a lot of work for the AvA staff, but they have always been a dedicated bunch.

My own most vivid recollection was how long the Spit V vs. 109F lasted - seemed like it took weeks, rather than days, before that plane set changed.  As others have said, in light of the horror that many people experience when they can't get their favorite plane for ten minutes, it's no wonder that RPS emptied out Warbirds.

- oldman

[puller]

AvA had an evolving war type thing not too long ago...they didn't get the support needed to keep it going

If you want these types of things either make an arena for them, join a FSO squad

[The Fugitive]

Yea that's the idea.

I called it the 'main arena' because it's where the most players flock to.


Also 3 sides is not the best solution for low players numbers. Even if Steam bumps the play numbers, in time, they might go lower again, and AH might be in same situation.

While writing this I not only thinked about low player numbers, but also a long term perspective of the game...... new players after time might get bored with all planes unlocked all the time.

I don't know about you guys, but all planes unlocked is bad for the metagame, because early and mid war planes are ciminaly underused, leaving people using 2-3 types of late war planes.

That's why rolling plane set is a good solution for this, because  early med and late are shared through times.


If they had been talked to death it means people would like to see them and something that should be considered imo.


What about a handfull of planes being used only ?
When I'm in a spit...... and a spit goes against me.... I always get this feeling 'wait.....something is not right here', and plenty of other people get also that play flight sims for over 20 years.



And if we would be doing this in a historical setting, I guarantee you, that more people would come.




Again, like in the other thread i made.... I am pro HTC and i'm posting this as a solution to a problem that is right there in the face.
I am not saying this is perfect solution, but I proposed something which I would consider to be logical.


Saying all that, I enjoy the game, but something should be done about atleast:

All planes available to all sides -- because fighting vs the same side plane in a ww2 flight sim REALLY makes people run away.

What kind of guarantee are you talking about? For HTC a lot of money is on the line, you willing to cover the loses?

I have been here for almost 15 years playing this game. In that time a matched setup with a two sided world has been available and has NEVER had the people we have in our 3 sided, all planes and vehicles available world. It wont work.

Hitech has tested many different numbers of teams and 3 works best for a Melee type arena which is their "bread and butter".

You sound like your looking for a full out WWII simulation. Well I hate to say it, but you may have to look someplace else. This is NOT a simulation. It is a GAME that uses WWII type equipment for PLAYERS to battle it out on the land, in the air, and at sea. 

[Wiley]

No really guys.  An RPS has never worked for a game like this in the past, but this time it will work!  Really!

I wish HTC would just remove the population cap from the custom arenas.  If someone can come up with an idea like their Awesome WWII Simulation Arena, or No Icons Blind Man's Bonanza, or 2 Sided War (Pick Allies or you'll be horde rolled), or whatever other set of specialty settings they think would fix every problem the game has why not let it hold as many people as it can?

I realize most of the ideas won't draw enough people to hit the cap of the custom arenas, but it would be nice if the cap wasn't there, just so they couldn't use that as a reason for why the arena's empty.

Wiley.

[Mister Fork]

Good advice. 

Years ago we tried a historical RPS in AvA.  Some determined person figured out all the when-were-they-introduced/when-were-they-withdrawn data for the ETO, then compressed it all into a span of about a month.  I'm sure I have it somewhere, and certainly other geezers do, too.  People who naturally gravitated to the AvA found it was a lot of fun, but clearly it isn't for everyone, or even for most people.  We only ran it twice.  It was a lot of work for the AvA staff, but they have always been a dedicated bunch.

My own most vivid recollection was how long the Spit V vs. 109F lasted - seemed like it took weeks, rather than days, before that plane set changed.  As others have said, in light of the horror that many people experience when they can't get their favorite plane for ten minutes, it's no wonder that RPS emptied out Warbirds.

- oldman

It WAS a lot of work - I know cause we ran it (Jaeger, Soda, Ranger, you and I).  It was also a lot of fun.  I was also the one who gathered all the historical plane sets service dates and Jaeger put that into a RPS table that we used to create the maps. The RPS every week based on a 14 month advance. Was fun and we had anywhere from 30-50 players per night partaking.

If we're talking about a faster RPS arena, it would be kinda cool to do it in an arena that every hour opens up aircraft per service date. I.e. 4pm 1939, 5pm 1940, 6pm 1941, 7pm 1942, 8pm 1943, 9pm 1944, 10pm 1945.  That might be fun!

[Vraciu]

No really guys.  An RPS has never worked for a game like this in the past, but this time it will work!  Really!

I wish HTC would just remove the population cap from the custom arenas.  If someone can come up with an idea like their Awesome WWII Simulation Arena, or No Icons Blind Man's Bonanza, or 2 Sided War (Pick Allies or you'll be horde rolled), or whatever other set of specialty settings they think would fix every problem the game has why not let it hold as many people as it can?

I realize most of the ideas won't draw enough people to hit the cap of the custom arenas, but it would be nice if the cap wasn't there, just so they couldn't use that as a reason for why the arena's empty.

Wiley.

RPS was one of my favorite things in WBs.   

The game didn't die because of that or two sides.   It had other issues and fierce competiton from AH.

[jimson]

I find it pretty amusing when someone thinks there is a magic bullet that will fill the AvA arena. It's ALL been tried with some only temporary successes.

I had recently come up with a war concept that followed 2 particular units from 1941 through 1945 in the ETO.

We had to use staged missions to guarantee action, but I did think it had some potential...then my personal life blew up.

Sigh..I hope someday to try again, but it's not easy to get the required help you need when you can offer no compensation and have limited arena scoring /logging options. I was also spending my own money on additions that I decided I really couldn't afford.

That said, we have room for a couple new staffers, I am currently on LOA, so to speak. Might inquire if you can try your ideas with us.

Contact captain1ma or Jeager as he is known.

[Wiley]

RPS was one of my favorite things in WBs.   

The game didn't die because of that or two sides.   It had other issues and fierce competiton from AH.

As I'm sure you're aware, you are deeply in the minority.  It surely wasn't just that, but anywhere I've seen an RPS mentioned you see a few guys saying it's swell, and a vast majority despising it.

YMMV.

Wiley.

[nugetx]

RPS was one of my favorite things in WBs.   

The game didn't die because of that or two sides.   It had other issues and fierce competiton from AH.

Yes Warbirds died because Aces High does everything it does and better and not because of 2 sides or AvA.

Besides if I understand correctly, Hitech is the one behind WB also, so it's only natural people came here.

[Vraciu]

As I'm sure you're aware, you are deeply in the minority.  It surely wasn't just that, but anywhere I've seen an RPS mentioned you see a few guys saying it's swell, and a vast majority despising it.

YMMV.

Wiley.

We had full arenas the entire time the RPS was up when I was there. 

The most fun ever was Spit I vs 109E in the Euro map and Zeke vs F4F-3 in the Pacific.   People loved it. 

Jet day sucked.   That was a universal gripe.   

RPS was awesome.   Frankly, I wish there was a mechanism to encourage more EW plane fights without forcing a rolling plane set.   I can't think of anything, though.

[nugetx]

.   Frankly, I wish there was a mechanism to encourage more EW plane fights without forcing a rolling plane set.   I can't think of anything, though.

Current point system could be used though, all players start with few early war planes, and to unlock mid and late planes you need to get points for them (like for the me 163 and 262 currently).

Once you die you have to restart, and for it not be hard and frustrating have a few planes uses of the unlocked plane.


This way we would see waaaaaaay more early and mid war planes.