Author Topic: Kills per sortie / hour  (Read 15073 times)

Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #60 on: September 09, 2018, 09:16:19 AM »
Bit dark old boy, is the game  (Image removed from quote.)  as far as you're concerned then?

... as far as many are concerned I think.

Whoa whoa whoa, the score's way more complicated than I'm interested in. I'm gathering here playing for score is a question of shortcutting 'normal' gameplay. You just do this that or the other and bingo.

The pertinant question is: is it representative or a game unto itself?



It cant possible be representative as it is easily gamed to adjust the numbers/ranking.

As for it being a "game unto itself" for those in the top 20-40 Id say it is. Out side of that most dont know how it works and while they may be trying to play that game they are not a factor.

Id like to see total kills, kill/hr, hit percentage emphasized over k/d. Those metrics would encourage more risk taking.

Or id like to see a score broken out by plane. So that people who fly worse/more challenging aircraft can see how they perform compared to other players in the same plane.


Sorry violator, i was gone the last 2 weeks:). In any case buff hunting in a 262 is the easiest way to get high ratios. Id gather flying a la7 for a tour would get similar easy numbers.

Id love to see some tweaks to the score to promote fighting, or atleast getting INTO the action other than avoiding it. The bolded text would be huge! The system is already there for the data (ENY). KillPoints and bonus multipliers could be adjusted for a high ENY plane/pilot defeating a low ENY plane/pilot combo. It would help encourage players to get out of the "easy mode" planes and into the more challenging rides. Fewer LAs and spits!

« Last Edit: September 09, 2018, 09:23:00 AM by The Fugitive »

Offline Lusche

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #61 on: September 09, 2018, 09:35:48 AM »
Or id like to see a score broken out by plane. So that people who fly worse/more challenging aircraft can see how they perform compared to other players in the same plane.

I don't think that this would work well in the single tour score frame AH has. IMHO most individual data samples would just get too small, when players spread their sorties over several planes in different modes.
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Offline Vraciu

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #62 on: September 09, 2018, 10:25:43 AM »
Can we find out who the top five players are in total air-to-air kills for a tour?

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Offline BaldEagl

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #63 on: September 09, 2018, 11:27:49 AM »
The pertinant question is: is it representative or a game unto itself?

I used to play the whole game (fighter, bomber, attack, GV) in all it's aspects.  At some point I noticed I was ranking pretty well so started to play for overall rank.  At that point it did become a game in itself and became more so the more I tried to climb the rankings.  I knew I always had to seek opportunities to and improve upon my weakest scoring metrics and approached the game that way.

I managed top 10ish ranking several times but fighter score was always my weakness.  While my K/D, K/S, hit%, etc. were always decent it was K/H that always held me back.  I'd rarely exceed 4K/H, most likely because of the way I played (climbing out, buff hunting, seeking 1 on 1's, always landing if possible, etc.).
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Offline DmonSlyr

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #64 on: September 09, 2018, 11:39:40 AM »
“Time played” has nothing to do with my suggestion.

You said that a player who has a good score in minimal sorties is "gaming" the ranks. Even though it does take skill in these sorties to get those #s. You implied that there should be a limit so that players who played more should score higher. In that case, I'm not really sure what you are suggesting.

Is this the reason why half (*) of the people are sitting in tower instead of flying? So basically score makes people fly less. And score also prevents people from contributing to the war to a certain extend (waaah I'm bingo, can't stay for the next five minutes until the capture and land here. Or up where there is a risk in general, even if the risk is that there' just not enough or the wrong kind of enemies).

(*) slightly exaggerated, but not much.

Well, its just one reason. I don't really like rolling for one bad guy any way, when it only showed a tiny dar. Although now that dots show up, I may roll more now that I can see where they are. I don't like spending 10 minutes for one red guy.  It's actually more about the radar and field distance that keeps me from rolling more than the time per sortie, but I was just throwing it out there.

I actually think it does help the war effort. By achieving the metrics on the score, you have to be involved in the game. In fighter mode, keeping a capped base or keeping cons from killing your M3s/c47s or keeping from getting your teamates bombers ect ect, actually do help. Flying defense also helps your kills per time. If your base is getting vulched, roll from a back field, this will help you get alt and get some advantage over the vulchers. Then you can kill them and that helps your score.

... as far as many are concerned I think.

It cant possible be representative as it is easily gamed to adjust the numbers/ranking.

As for it being a "game unto itself" for those in the top 20-40 Id say it is. Out side of that most dont know how it works and while they may be trying to play that game they are not a factor.

Id love to see some tweaks to the score to promote fighting, or atleast getting INTO the action other than avoiding it. The bolded text would be huge! The system is already there for the data (ENY). KillPoints and bonus multipliers could be adjusted for a high ENY plane/pilot defeating a low ENY plane/pilot combo. It would help encourage players to get out of the "easy mode" planes and into the more challenging rides. Fewer LAs and spits!



The misconception is that avoiding planes and fights doesnt benefit your score. This is what Kills / time is for. If you are a very timid flyer, this hurts your K/T and thus hurts your rank. Being more aggressive at the right times is what gives you a good fighter rank.

While there is no score broken down by plane, you can check the stats by plane at the end of the tours to see top K/D per plane.

I do actually think a ratio should be added that measures the average ENY of the planes you fly, then put into rank. So if you fly a 109G2 you get a higher rank ratio than someone who flies only La7s. Don't know how that would be coded though.

Can we find out who the top five players are in total air-to-air kills for a tour?



No but you you can search stats by planes. Start with Judge. He had over 1061 kills in a 109G14 last tour. 1400 total I think. Rud3boi gets a lot of kills.

All in all, what people need to realize about this score model is that it's not about scoring high in just one metric. It's about scoring high in all of the metrics. These means that flying timidly is not good for score. I literally die 50% of the time by getting down and dirty. But I also try to get at least 3-5 kills every sortie. If you die once in a while, it will actually help your K/T.

I think the scoring model is great to measure your success and ability in performing better by working on your metrics in the scoring system.

If it were so easy to "game" the score. More people would do it. But I don't see that very often and those players typically lose that rank because of kills points. Getting a higher top 5 rank in AH actually does take some skill and is deserved for players who can achieve it.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2018, 11:44:34 AM by DmonSlyr »
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Offline Vraciu

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #65 on: September 09, 2018, 12:13:52 PM »
You said that a player who has a good score in minimal sorties is "gaming" the ranks. Even though it does take skill in these sorties to get those #s. You implied that there should be a limit so that players who played more should score higher. In that case, I'm not really sure what you are suggesting.

Dude, please focus for a second my friend.

A minimum number of sorties played would be like a minimum number of games played in a sport to qualify for a record.  *TIME* is not the factor.  SORTIES is.    X sorties to qualify.

« Last Edit: September 09, 2018, 12:40:13 PM by Vraciu »
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #66 on: September 09, 2018, 12:19:12 PM »
Can we find out who the top five players are in total air-to-air kills for a tour?

You go here to check the top 5 players in fighters....

http://www.hitechcreations.com/component/ahscore/index.php

Then you go to the stats page for each player here to see how many of the kills were A2A. Be sure to double check kills in bombers that take out vehicles and remove them as well.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/scores/players.php

Once you have all the totals you can see what your looking for.

Good luck!

Offline Vraciu

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #67 on: September 09, 2018, 12:22:28 PM »

Addendum: He's at 371K kills now. I don't think anyone else comes even close to that - For comparison, I played this game full time for ten years and 'only' have 104K kills  :uhoh

Funny....

Violator played for ten years and Skyyr has more kills than he does in only about two and a half years* (with better across-the-board stats).   


SKYYR TOTAL
Kills: 37,267
Deaths: 11,994
K/D: 3.11 (3.10714)

VIOLATOR  TOTAL
Kills: 24167
Deaths: 8137
K/D: 2.97

*Skyyr 33 months/tours vs Violator 126 months/tours.


That being said, playing too many hours will drag down your overall metrics and if you have a lot of points but lower other metrics, it's very hard to increaese those metrics to rank higher. (Think skyyr, hi points, lots of sorties, lower other metrics. )

Hmmmmmmm.........

I dont really think skyyr could have been #1 every tour. His K/D and kills per sortie suffered and he was really only successful in the MA when he flew top speed/performance planes.

Yet he had 150% of your kills in one quarter of the time (37267 vs 24167)....with a higher K/D (3.11 vs 2.97).    He also has a higher K/H as well.  I can pull that if you want.   :devil   I'm not sure what your point is.

As for #1s...   Well he got it a couple of times right before he was booted.   I think he was about to go on a roll.   Then Starfox won a couple as well.  Same thing.   

I also pulled my stats over my career.   I have 6515 kills with a 2.2 K/D (may alternate account is 2.58:1...both are way better than I thought it was) but nowhere near what you guys do in any metric.    :salute :cheers:


« Last Edit: September 09, 2018, 12:43:49 PM by Vraciu »
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Offline Vraciu

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #68 on: September 09, 2018, 12:23:01 PM »
You go here to check the top 5 players in fighters....

http://www.hitechcreations.com/component/ahscore/index.php

Then you go to the stats page for each player here to see how many of the kills were A2A. Be sure to double check kills in bombers that take out vehicles and remove them as well.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/scores/players.php

Once you have all the totals you can see what your looking for.

Good luck!

Thanks man.  I will try and figure that out.    :cheers: :salute
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Offline DmonSlyr

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #69 on: September 09, 2018, 12:26:23 PM »
Dude, please focus for a second my friend.

A minimum number of sorties played would be like a minimum number of games played in a sport to qualify for a record.  *TIME* is not the factor.  SORTIES is.    X sorties to qualify.

Right, but you missed what I said earlier. Good players tend to spend most of their time in the air getting kills. So a player who rolls one time and gets 5 kills should have a better rank than a player who rolls 5 times and gets 1 kill every sortie. The thing will score is that if you get 5 kills in one sortie, that's great, still have to have a high Hit% and K/T to score even higher. But if you want to maintain that rank, you have to continue to get 5 kill sorties to keep your same score + keep your points balanced to stay on top. That is the hard part. The more sorties, the more risk, but you have to be risky if you want to maintain that score.
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Offline nrshida

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #70 on: September 09, 2018, 12:27:49 PM »
Violator played for ten years and Skyyr has more kills than he does in only about two and a half years*

How many hours for each player?

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Offline Vraciu

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #71 on: September 09, 2018, 12:28:22 PM »
Right, but you missed what I said earlier. Good players tend to spend most of their time in the air getting kills. So a player who rolls one time and gets 5 kills should have a better rank than a player who rolls 5 times and gets 1 kill every sortie. The thing will score is that if you get 5 kills in one sortie, that's great, still have to have a high Hit% and K/T to score even higher. But if you want to maintain that rank, you have to continue to get 5 kill sorties to keep your same score + keep your points balanced to stay on top. That is the hard part. The more sorties, the more risk, but you have to be risky if you want to maintain that score.

But a guy like me can roll two sorties and wind up in the top 50.   That's just dumb to my mind.
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Offline nrshida

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #72 on: September 09, 2018, 12:30:19 PM »
I used to play the whole game (fighter, bomber, attack, GV) in all it's aspects.  At some point I noticed I was ranking pretty well so started to play for overall rank.  At that point it did become a game in itself and became more so the more I tried to climb the rankings.

That's a very interesting insight. Thanks.

I actually only started to look as I was trying to calculate something which the stats conceal, actually because of a lack of elemental data.

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Offline Vraciu

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #73 on: September 09, 2018, 12:33:09 PM »
How many hours for each player?

I remember Skyyr looking this stuff up because he and Violator were talking about this awhile back.

It was around 3000 hours.   Average hours per tour for Skyyr was around 97 with a max of 120.

If you divide his total hours over Violator's tour number total you get about 30 hours a tour which is less than V's career hours played.

In any event, Skyyr's K/H remains better than Vio's.   (And both are way better than mine.)
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Offline nrshida

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Re: Kills per sortie / hour
« Reply #74 on: September 09, 2018, 12:36:50 PM »
This baffles me, this tour I've got 29 kills for 4 deaths (I don't know how) and my Kills per Death+1 is 1.86  :headscratch:

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