Target for Today - "Bavaria 1945" - Event Write-Up

[swareiam]

TFT Bavaria 1945 Event Write Up

12 Hour Event Date - May 18, 2019

[Brooke]

Folks, please note that a previous announcement put Bavaria 1945 on a different day.

I am told that was Mother's Day weekend, so Bavaria 1945 will happen on May 18th.

Bavaria 1945 ----> May 18th.

[BTPage]

Well hell I was not going to be able to make it because of mother's day weekend.....now am will be able to make for a few sorties. Thank you for the date change Brooke! 👍
Looking forward to this event sir. 

Tactus

[FBDragon]

Okay, so when does registration open for it. I WANT MY A8!!! lol

[Arlo]

There are no launch windows and fields are open at all times during this event.

vs.

Takeoffs happen on every hour mark (noon, 1 pm, 2 pm, etc.) and are shut down otherwise in between.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Bomber maximum altitude is 25k and minimum altitude is 18k When descending for landing or when an aircraft is heavily damaged.

(What does this mean, exactly? Does it mean that bomber alts are 25k to 18k except for landing decent or damage that prevents maintaining altitude?)

The event map spawns bombers at 20k. Will this be adjusted to 24k (max) or 18k (min)?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Fighters have an unlimited altitude. Fighters on either side are not allowed to strafe airfields.

(What about attacking aircraft on final approach at, say, 5k?)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The two AR 234 “Scout” are restricted from attacking the USAAF bomber formations at anytime.

(If a bomber or bomber formation fires upon said scout I suppose they can return fire? How close are these Arado scouts allowed to get to the bombers? Can they do close fly-bys which may draw fire?)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

For a Successful Drop, +3 points for a destroyed object.
“Successful Drop” for bombers is achieved during a Mission to a Valid Target once a bomber pilot destroys at least one object in the assigned   
 target area.

Note:   Once you get enough for a Successful Drop in a Mission, you don’t get more points for killing more objects in the mission. 

(Does this mean a player flying a formation of bombers can only earn 3 points per target no matter how many objects are destroyed - or - by mission you mean 3 points per sortie if one object is destroyed between a primary and secondary target? Is this in order to mitigate the potential for bombers to score too many points? Should players drop as few bombs as possible to leave destroy-able objects for other players?)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Phase 1 Allied recovery base: A51, Phase 2 Allied recovery base: A74, Phase 3  Allied recovery base: A72, Phase 4 Allied recovery base: A89

(Noticing that offline these bases are Axis, will they all be changes to Allied before the event? Will they and can they be changed as the event progresses?)

(Same goes for the Allied fighter launch fields.)

[swareiam]

There are no launch windows and fields are open at all times during this event.

vs.

Takeoffs happen on every hour mark (noon, 1 pm, 2 pm, etc.) and are shut down otherwise in between.

Yes... we would prefer that every pilot be in uniform and flying in squad colors, but this is a open event with now a more open approach to allowing players to participate. The CM team will be looking to the COs and GLs to ensure that this runs as smoothly as possible. Most walk-ons that take a plane out and doddle in the combat area without coordinating with the mission, find themselves quickly pounced upon by marauding prowling fighters. That is the chief deterrent to flying alone.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Bomber maximum altitude is 25k and minimum altitude is 18k When descending for landing or when an aircraft is heavily damaged.

(What does this mean, exactly? Does it mean that bomber alts are 25k to 18k except for landing decent or damage that prevents maintaining altitude?) Yes...

The event map spawns bombers at 20k. Will this be adjusted to 24k (max) or 18k (min)? No... The bombers will need to climb to their maximum altitude if they desire to climb that high.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Fighters have an unlimited altitude. Yes...

Fighters on either side are not allowed to strafe airfields. Not exactly... Axis fields are either placed in areas where there is enough ack from strats as a deterrent to attacking Axis aircraft in the target areas, or they are set many kilometers away to allow Axis aircraft to recover without being "Vulched". As for the Allies, the Axis aircraft cannot enter the shaded areas on the strategic map provided in the write up. They must attack and destroy Allied aircraft before reaching this point.

(What about attacking aircraft on final approach at, say, 5k?) See answer above...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The two AR 234 “Scout” are restricted from attacking the USAAF bomber formations at anytime.

(If a bomber or bomber formation fires upon said scout I suppose they can return fire? No... the rules clearly state that the AR 234s "are restricted from attacking the USAAF bomber formations at anytime."

How close are these Arado scouts allowed to get to the bombers? They can fly as close as they want. But they cannot fire upon the bombers.
Can they do close fly-bys which may draw fire?) Read previous answer...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

For a Successful Drop, +3 points for a destroyed object.
“Successful Drop” for bombers is achieved during a Mission to a Valid Target once a bomber pilot destroys at least one object in the assigned   
 target area.

Note:   Once you get enough for a Successful Drop in a Mission, you don’t get more points for killing more objects in the mission. 

(Does this mean a player flying a formation of bombers can only earn 3 points per target no matter how many objects are destroyed - or - by mission you mean 3 points per sortie if one object is destroyed between a primary and secondary target? Is this in order to mitigate the potential for bombers to score too many points? Should players drop as few bombs as possible to leave destroy-able objects for other players?)

Essentially Yes... There are no points for a gross number of objects destroyed. If a bomber pilot hits a "Legal" target object, then they produce their maximum score for that mission. Bomber pilots will continue to produce their score, per mission, as "required" missions are launched by the Allies.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Phase 1 Allied recovery base: A51, Phase 2 Allied recovery base: A74, Phase 3  Allied recovery base: A72, Phase 4 Allied recovery base: A89

(Noticing that offline these bases are Axis, will they all be changes to Allied before the event? Will they and can they be changed as the event progresses?) Yes... the CM team will be managing this process.

(Same goes for the Allied fighter launch fields.) Read previous answer...

Thanks for your questions. We hope these answers have brought clarity.

 

[Brooke]

Swareiam, I think what he means for a couple of these is that the writeup also needs correcting.

In "MOTD" section, it says "Takeoffs happen on every hour mark (noon, 1 pm, 2 pm, etc.) and are shut down otherwise in between. If you miss a takeoff hour mark, please join us for next one."  Please delete.

"Main Rules" says "Bomber maximum altitude is 25k and minimum altitude is 18k When descending for landing or when an aircraft is heavily damaged."  That needs to be "Bomber maximum altitude is 25k.  Minimum altitude is 18k except when descending for landing or if an aircraft is heavily damaged."

[Devil 505]

Some issues concerning the Luftwaffe units.

2./Jg 52 is incorrect. They were in Czechoslovakia fighting the Soviets at this time. I assume you confused "2" for "II". In Luftwaffe units, arabic numerals indicate individual squadrons - in this case "2" is 2 Staffel(squadron). Roman numerals indicade an organized group of squadrons - in the case of Jg 52, II Gruppe(group) is comprised of 5,6,7, and 8 Staffeln(squadrons) in 1945. You should choose one of those squadrons.

14./Jg 26 was not operating in the area of our map. They were based in northwest Germany. I and II/Jg 6 were operation in Southeast Germany with Doras. I suggest renaming this squad to 6./Jg 6.

A unit labeled "Stab." denotes the command staff of either the entire Geschwader or an individual Gruppe in a Geschwader. In either case, the Stab would only have 4 pilots and 4-6 planes. I recommend changing Stab./Jg 300 to a proper staffel from II/Jg 300.

[swareiam]

Some issues concerning the Luftwaffe units.

2./Jg 52 is incorrect. They were in Czechoslovakia fighting the Soviets at this time. I assume you confused "2" for "II". In Luftwaffe units, arabic numerals indicate individual squadrons - in this case "2" is 2 Staffel(squadron). Roman numerals indicade an organized group of squadrons - in the case of Jg 52, II Gruppe(group) is comprised of 5,6,7, and 8 Staffeln(squadrons) in 1945. You should choose one of those squadrons.

14./Jg 26 was not operating in the area of our map. They were based in northwest Germany. I and II/Jg 6 were operation in Southeast Germany with Doras. I suggest renaming this squad to 6./Jg 6.

A unit labeled "Stab." denotes the command staff of either the entire Geschwader or an individual Gruppe in a Geschwader. In either case, the Stab would only have 4 pilots and 4-6 planes. I recommend changing Stab./Jg 300 to a proper staffel from II/Jg 300.

Devil,

We are open to making some modifications on unit names and any mistakes we have made. Thanks for the suggestions on unit changes. One of the things we are trying to do is to ensure that we have a skin to go with each unit that we have called out. Of course you being a skinner can appreciate the value of this.

We absolutely want units that were in the area, but are falling short on units with available skins.

Can you help redirect us to participating units that have "skins in the game".

Thanks for your help.

 

[Arlo]

In "MOTD" section, it says "Takeoffs happen on every hour mark (noon, 1 pm, 2 pm, etc.) and are shut down otherwise in between. If you miss a takeoff hour mark, please join us for next one."  Please delete.

This is a very important clarification for me. No takeoff windows means a lot. 

[Devil 505]

Devil,

We are open to making some modifications on unit names and any mistakes we have made. Thanks for the suggestions on unit changes. One of the things we are trying to do is to ensure that we have a skin to go with each unit that we have called out. Of course you being a skinner can appreciate the value of this.

We absolutely want units that were in the area, but are falling short on units with available skins.

Can you help redirect us to participating units that have "skins in the game".

Thanks for your help.

 

Piece of cake.

190D-9: 6./Jg 6
190A-8: 7./Jg 300 (I'm currently making this skin)
109G-14: 2./Jg 300
109K-4: 12./Jg 27

 

[Arlo]

Essentially Yes... There are no points for a gross number of objects destroyed. If a bomber pilot hits a "Legal" target object, then they produce their maximum score for that mission. Bomber pilots will continue to produce their score, per mission, as "required" missions are launched by the Allies.

Sorry, but I must ask again for clarification: There are two targets per phase. "One “Mission” is a launch, traveling toward one or more Valid Targets, and land back at a base if still alive." If the bombers can attack more than one target per mission (once per target, I presume) then are they awarded points for each target? This makes a difference. For instance:

If the points are awarded per player/bomber flight (or remnant thereof) and are only awarded for a single successful bomber drop per mission then the theoretical maximum number of points that may be achieved for 12 players per mission is 36.

If the points are awarded per player/bomber flight (or remnant thereof) and are awarded per valid target per mission then it is double that - 72 (again, theoretically since it would require all bomber flights successfully hit one object per target and that would require minimal [or no] losses).

The 36 point differential per mission could be quite a factor, especially when all four (3 hour) phases worth of missions are totaled.

Also, the bombers are only allowed the bomb load of 6 X 1000 bombs. I'm not sure why, since it doesn't matter how many bombs are dropped or how big they are. I can easily see group leads asking players to limit their drops to a minimal amount or even to designate which objects to target on a given target map in order to leave targets for following flights. On one hand, 3k worth of bombs can deal a fair amount of collateral damage to surrounding nearby targets. On the other, a salvo of three 1k bombs per plane can increase the likelihood of the player scoring a hit if he's not an 'expert bombardier' or he has had to make last minute adjustments due to defensive maneuvering and such.

While having the larger number of 16 X 250 lb. bombs also increases the chance of a player erroneously dropping larger salvos and hitting too many targets (thereby reducing said target availability for others), with discipline and well-placed single salvos, the collateral damage should be minimized.

I didn't see (or may have missed) what the object rebuild time is set to. I respectfully request it be set as low as possible to facilitate target availability for succeeding flights. The logs will still reflect whether or not a player destroyed an object on a sortie (or an object per valid target given the delays in time stamps).

[swareiam]

Arlo,

The bombers have two targets per phase. There will be a single mission per target. The initial target preference will not be known by the defenders, but of course the second one will.

Different fuel and ammo loads cause aircraft to be able or unable to reach certain speeds and altitudes. It is always better for the bombers to carry the same loadouts. You are correct in that it does not matter for the scoring, but it does matter for the BG.

Historically, bomber formations did not make a second pass on a target unless the lead bomber was unable to pinpoint the release and the commander didn't mind putting the group in jeopardy twice, but in large one pass. The larger load of bombs allows a single salvo to have much destructive power and leave the ship quickly. That way the entire formation can get turned around and headed back at the same time.

So to sum things up;

• Two targets, two missions to hit them.
• A single release and a positive hit, gets you all the points you can get for that mission.
• We'll regulate the ordnance type to mimic a more historical bomber mission.
• Yes, there will be a maximum score achievable in a single phase for the bombers. The escort will generate the rest.

Does that clear things up?

We will address these areas to make them more clear in the write up.

Thanks for your questions and inputs.

 

[Arlo]

Without too much errata, I require specific answers (again, my apologies - but the time to clear this up is obviously well before the 12 hour event begins).

A single mission per target = a single target per mission?

Fuel loads at a burn of 1 will likely not be full.

The bomb load weight of 6 X 1000 lb bombs is 6000 lbs.

The bomb load weight of 16 X 250 lb bombs is 4000 lbs.

I didn't ask about a second pass on the same target. I asked about a mission with a primary and secondary target - both being dropped on. Having said that, it is understood that, historically, U.S. Army Air Corps bombers did not generally bomb multiple targets per mission but were assigned secondary and even tertiary targets if the primary (or secondary) target(s) was obscured. This, being an online modified simulation of such (fewer overall bombers, etc.), it could just as easily be designed for multiple targets per group/mission to facilitate point earning (though the odds of the group succeeding in such, in whole or in part are quite slim). It does make a difference. However, you appear to be saying that a mission involves a takeoff, attacking one target and a landing (if the last two can be accomplished) - though you haven't exactly put it in those exact terms, I will take it as such unless a modification to that is revealed later.

Point being - the maximum amount of points that can be earned on one single bomber mission (if all 12 players are assigned that mission) is 3 points per player (36) with all of them dropping on one target and not getting in each other's way by dropping large salvos haphazardly, if I am interpreting the write-up correctly. This can be broken up to 18 per group if simultaneous missions are run against two targets. And that depends on all players making it to target with at least one bomber and successfully destroying at least one designated target object.

Win or loss obviously depends on points. However, my personal fun isn't measured by such. I do want to accurately provide other players on my side with details.

Again, I must ask (I've got a hammer on my desk for daring to type this reiteration) - Will object rebuild times be minimized so multiple runs on a target (another mission/group hitting the same target, later in the phase) will not result in having no objects left to destroy?

Thank you - I'm not trying to tire you in accurately providing answers - honest. 

[Brooke]

Bomber scoring works the same as in Nuisance Raids, Pantelleria, and Kuban.

Bomber pilots get 3 points for a Successful Drop.

A Successful Drop is if he destroys at least one Valid Target in a Mission.  A Mission is launch, go to a target, come back or die in the process.

So a bomber pilot launches, kills 1 building (or 2 buildings, or 23 buildings), and comes back (or dies in the process) -- he gets +3 points.