Author Topic: 4 maps that need to go  (Read 8197 times)

Offline hazmatt

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #45 on: April 24, 2021, 03:16:48 AM »
Down with Buzzkill! I log off immediately when I see that map is up.

Has anybody considered a Naval focused maps with land at the far edges of the map?

Offline nrshida

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #46 on: April 24, 2021, 03:45:57 AM »
as for the acm thingy, there's not one player that I know of, from those finishing in the top to the lowest of us who doesnt do everything possible to not get killed. and that includes running to ack or friends.

If you encourage a reduction of the former to the minimum, and increase the latter to the maximum in an air combat game, you'd end up with awful gameplay which would likely drive people away. Oh wait...

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Offline JimmyD3

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #47 on: April 24, 2021, 11:01:01 AM »
[quote author=nrshida link=topic=402852.msg5338135#msg5338135 date=1619190852

More realistic or convincing natural terrain could be something like a large diameter caldera with high cliffs and bases halfway down. Imho a surplus of energy is less of a problem to air combat than people melting away at will. Remember others would enter later at a higher energy state, that's just the nature of it.

[/quote]

I like this idea. A small map, 256. Outer perimeter at 7500 ft, with everything sloped to a central area at 100 ft. Bases in close proximity, no more than 22 miles apart. The slope to the central area would help focus the combat due to the altitude assistance from the outer areas.
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Offline guncrasher

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #48 on: April 24, 2021, 12:43:50 PM »
If you encourage a reduction of the former to the minimum, and increase the latter to the maximum in an air combat game, you'd end up with awful gameplay which would likely drive people away. Oh wait...

but can you get a consensus on what awful or good game play is?

semp
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Offline Wiley

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #49 on: April 24, 2021, 01:18:31 PM »
but can you get a consensus on what awful or good game play is?

semp

nrshida is right.  Everybody who disagrees with him is wrong.  There, that was easy.

Wiley.
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Offline guncrasher

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #50 on: April 24, 2021, 08:55:42 PM »
nrshida is right.  Everybody who disagrees with him is wrong.  There, that was easy.

Wiley.

naw nishida believes in what he believes, i think different but we both have the same idea in mind.  just different paths to it.


semp
you dont want me to ho, dont point your plane at me.

Offline nrshida

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #51 on: April 25, 2021, 03:58:46 AM »
but can you get a consensus on what awful or good game play is?

Good question Semp if slighlty loaded. You don't need a consensous in an inherently zero sum-game multiplayer combat sim. You need to support all opportunities of gameplay on the frustration-reward line if you aren't to drive preference-factions away. The purely ACM-combat fans clearly have been if you look for independent reviews of AH. Not my opinion. Go and look, you will notice the strong theme of that point (even ex AH-players).

Memory likely won't serve accurately now, and I'm too busy / lazy to bother researching. But I think the Yak-3 was the last fighter aircraft to be introduced. Quite a long time ago. After came the 88-mm, several tanks, the TU-2 maybe? Side-switching was changed (arbitrarily it seemed like) to 24-hours - the protest of which essentailly drove the majority of the Muppets and their kin away. The DA was removed and replaced by something even less popular (about which several informed suggestions were offered and disregarded). Private arenas are possible if you're prepared to dedicate your computer and self to is essentially as they only persist for 20-minutes and no one who doesn't know you will go there alone. There are some events but not on the 24-7 basis of the MMOG. Every suggestion bar one, as far as I can remember, to enhance this aspect of gampeplay rejected and dismissed by both the forum members (a subset of actual players) and the company who runs the game.

All those things in sequence and combination rather points to a bias against the ACM-faction. 


nrshida is right.  Everybody who disagrees with him is wrong.  There, that was easy.

It's a shame I evidently present this way when I post. It ought to be true but apparently isn't that the stronger, more evidenced 'argument' (an echange of diverging or opposite views, not the f**k you, nah f**k you kind of daily life / roadrage argument) should have more weight than weaker arguments or - as in this case for example - ones based on informal fallacy. It's neither here-nor-there who is saying this or that or why they're saying it. The question is do they have a point? Do they evidence their argument?

It is really a weird situation when people like Violator and I are marginalised for being fanatical about prop-driven air-combat in a game entitled Aces High. Waaaaaaay off base to assume we want everyone to play our way on some sort of weird power-trip on our behalf. I don't know about Violator because I think he has limitted time (as now do I actually). But when I was a very active player I have spent an awful lot of time training other players one-on-one with the only motivation to enhance their AH-ACM experience. I had offered this to anyone who asked, even enemies. I fought Robert Shaw in the DA. Bought his book, annotated it, tore sections out and threw it away. Here was the last repository of Prop-driven ACM. Not IL-2, not DCS, not in printed manuals. Here in the hands and eyes of remarkable players. Nearly all gone now.


naw nishida believes in what he believes, i think different but we both have the same idea in mind.  just different paths to it.

 :salute


I like this idea. A small map, 256. Outer perimeter at 7500 ft, with everything sloped to a central area at 100 ft. Bases in close proximity, no more than 22 miles apart. The slope to the central area would help focus the combat due to the altitude assistance from the outer areas.

Unfortuantely I am not good enough with this medium to make a prototype but I think you very much have the gist. More than 7500-ft would disallow pickers to float around on a top layer and still leave at will.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2021, 04:03:56 AM by nrshida »
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Offline LCADolby

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #52 on: April 25, 2021, 05:55:02 AM »
nrshida is right.  Everybody who disagrees with him is wrong.  There, that was easy.

Wiley.
Typical Wiley, no reading of the points being put forward, just zips straight to the ignorant dismissal and unhelpful remarks.
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Offline DmonSlyr

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #53 on: April 25, 2021, 03:18:43 PM »
This is the kind of thing I am talking about. Once again, this map is taking up the weekend. Mindnao was on Friday and saturday. I get stick with Bowlma again. It's 4 PM eastern and we've got 73 players in the arena, small dars, and no real fights anwhere. The Bish have 42% of bases and rooks + knights arent even tryin over there. Just 5 or 6 planes over there according to idea of how big of a fight those dars might be over there. I am stuck on the Bish because of their low #s.




Here was crater last weekend, nothing going on. I watched it for 4 hours while doing other things to see if I could get into a fight. Just tiny dars..




Here is a map that provides much better action where players can get a much better sense of where the fight is and hop in. This is an example of a healthy map during the afternoons.




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Offline svaalbar

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #54 on: April 25, 2021, 04:28:03 PM »
I agree with your recent points Violator. Cant we do shock therapy and just try some of the new maps for a few weeks? They will only be up for a day or two.

I know that the players really liked the Fjord map that came out last summer (or maybe it was sometime in 2019), and I enjoy the NorthCo map too. The Fjord map might be too big for current numbers, but I remember signing on for that day and our Country chat (Knights) was quite happy with the new map
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Offline Wiley

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #55 on: April 25, 2021, 06:18:01 PM »
Typical Wiley, no reading of the points being put forward, just zips straight to the ignorant dismissal and unhelpful remarks.

Nah. He not wrong a lot of the time, he just couches that correctness in a giant ball of condescension and bemoaning of the current sorry state of players that he deigns to grace with his words of wisdom.

It is very important that we all know how great he is at ACM with every post he makes and how lowly the average player in the MA is.  He went to the DA with Shaw. Be impressed! He knew which chapters of the book to throw away. Be impressed!

Effective vs skilled is dead on. I wasn't thinking of it in as many words but he articulated what I have thought for a while very well.

Personally, in a melee arena I am looking for opponents that are actually trying to kill me. I happen to agree with most of Violator's points particularly his last post. But the vast majority of players simply aren't trying to outskill their opponents, they are trying to win. You're not going to change that mentality any more than you are going to change the mentality of a player that flies to live.

People for a myriad of reasons simply aren't going to put in the work to get to the top shelf level of skill in a game that is as open ended as this one.  You can either accept that or move on.  Until the game absolutely forces people to fight fair, a lot aren't.

Wiley.
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Offline hazmatt

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #56 on: April 25, 2021, 08:38:56 PM »
Fight fair?

Does that mean you have to - an A6M with a 262?

That's the thing I fail to understand. People fly slow planes and call everyone in a faster plane cowards, runner whatever.

Offline Oldman731

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #57 on: April 25, 2021, 08:42:16 PM »
Nah. He not wrong a lot of the time, he just couches that correctness in a giant ball of condescension and bemoaning of the current sorry state of players that he deigns to grace with his words of wisdom.

It is very important that we all know how great he is at ACM with every post he makes and how lowly the average player in the MA is.  He went to the DA with Shaw. Be impressed! He knew which chapters of the book to throw away. Be impressed!


You forgot that he threw away the parts of Shaw's book that he didn't like.  Poor Shaw, he had so much to learn...

We suffer from the impersonality of the internet.  I'll bet that if we met NrShida - not to mention TinyShida - we'd probably like each other and have fun drinking various alcoholic treats.  (Well...maybe not TinyShida...).  But Wiley's interpretation of the Shida BBS input is not off base.

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Offline Wiley

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #58 on: April 25, 2021, 09:06:00 PM »

You forgot that he threw away the parts of Shaw's book that he didn't like.  Poor Shaw, he had so much to learn...

We suffer from the impersonality of the internet.  I'll bet that if we met NrShida - not to mention TinyShida - we'd probably like each other and have fun drinking various alcoholic treats.  (Well...maybe not TinyShida...).  But Wiley's interpretation of the Shida BBS input is not off base.

- oldman

Hehe.  Could be.  I have also known guys that sounded IRL pretty much exactly like Shida does in text. ;)

Wiley.
If you think you are having a 1v1 in the Main Arena, your SA has failed you.

JG11

Offline Banshee7

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Re: 4 maps that need to go
« Reply #59 on: April 25, 2021, 09:47:38 PM »
I will say that I have logged on many times and logged right back off after looking at the map.  As someone else pointed out (I think Fugitive), the low numbers just makes several of these maps stale. As summer approaches, I will be considering spending more time on AH while my other gaming buddies are all at work. I guess I need to start learning how to make my own fun again. 😂😂. Heck, most of the time I find myself flying in the training arena by myself.
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