Proximity Dar

[mustng2]

I would at least like for it not to show very low aircraft like the dar bar and radar don't show very low aircraft.

[guncrasher]

nobody is forcing you to use the proximity dar. let the rest of us who arent awesome use it to find fights.


semp

[LilMak]

nobody is forcing you to use the proximity dar. let the rest of us who arent awesome use it to find fights.


semp

It would be great if players weren’t using it to simply to pad their stats. What’s happening is you have players literally refusing to fight without an advantage because they can see what’s going on in real time. Fights have devolved to a point where players simply refuse to engage because they don’t want to put themselves in jeopardy. It’s turned into a middle school dance where all the kids are standing against opposite walls waiting for someone else to go first. Players don’t even have to guess where everyone within icon range of a teammate. So they’re avoiding any danger that might come close to getting them in trouble.

I literally watched this happen to Skyyr specifically as I was climbing out the other night. Two blobs of players basically orbiting on their respective sides refusing to be the first one in. He came in as the lone red dot breaking from the pack. Immediately all the green guys on my side went in for the lone guy. I passed that lopsided fight and immediately became the lone guy being bounced by 5 or 6 players from his team. Shortly we were both dead and the blobs went to avoiding each other again. So aggressive pilots who are actually instigating fights are being punished for doing so as the entire enemy team can gang them simply because they can see that it’s easy meat simply by looking at the clipboard. Radar on both sides was down but it was basically pointless. I used to carve a lot of my favorite fights on the fringes of large enemy furballs because there were plenty of targets but not so many that I immediately get overwhelmed. I can’t do that anymore because the players that I encounter don’t even have to actually see me (AFK). Once I’m in icon range of AFK player their entire team knows exactly where I am. Instead of fighting one two or three players, I’m immediately pounced on by everyone who’s even remotely close. It is perpetuating timid gameplay. Timid gameplay is killing the game.

[guncrasher]

It would be great if players weren’t using it to simply to pad their stats. What’s happening is you have players literally refusing to fight without an advantage because they can see what’s going on in real time. Fights have devolved to a point where players simply refuse to engage because they don’t want to put themselves in jeopardy. It’s turned into a middle school dance where all the kids are standing against opposite walls waiting for someone else to go first. Players don’t even have to guess where everyone within icon range of a teammate. So they’re avoiding any danger that might come close to getting them in trouble.

I literally watched this happen to Skyyr specifically as I was climbing out the other night. Two blobs of players basically orbiting on their respective sides refusing to be the first one in. He came in as the lone red dot breaking from the pack. Immediately all the green guys on my side went in for the lone guy. I passed that lopsided fight and immediately became the lone guy being bounced by 5 or 6 players from his team. Shortly we were both dead and the blobs went to avoiding each other again. So aggressive pilots who are actually instigating fights are being punished for doing so as the entire enemy team can gang them simply because they can see that it’s easy meat simply by looking at the clipboard. Radar on both sides was down but it was basically pointless. I used to carve a lot of my favorite fights on the fringes of large enemy furballs because there were plenty of targets but not so many that I immediately get overwhelmed. I can’t do that anymore because the players that I encounter don’t even have to actually see me (AFK). Once I’m in icon range their entire team knows exactly where I am. Instead of fighting one two or three players, I’m immediately pounced on by everyone who’s even remotely close. It is perpetuating timid gameplay.

you guys are better than me.  would be nice if I could get a kill once in a while.  you use your skills as an advantage, some use proximity dar.  some use both.  I've seen skyyr use both.



semp

[Banshee7]

What’s happening is you have players literally refusing to fight without an advantage because they can see what’s going on in real time.

Timid gameplay is killing the game.

Unfortunately, I don’t think changing DAR will change that. We’re at a point where there are no new players, and the existing ones don’t want to get any better. No offense (especially to you Mak), but AH has become a retirement home social club. I think most play to pass the time. There’s hardly any competition anymore because the players that seek the path of less resistance have taken over. I’ve seen it far too many times since my return. A large DAR bar attacks a base and as soon as defenders up, they attack a different field on a different front.

Sure, there used to be NOE raids and base sneaks all the time, but those usually instigated a fight.

[LilMak]

you guys are better than me.  would be nice if I could get a kill once in a while.  you use your skills as an advantage, some use proximity dar.  some use both.  I've seen skyyr use both.



semp

I use proximity dar all the time. It’s basically unavoidable. I literally got a kill I never would have the other night because I could set up my attack before there was even a dot outside my canopy. That fight was over before I even got there and all the guy was doing was trying to get home. I got bounced last night by 4 players and watched as my teammate flew wide around me because he didn’t want to get involved. He probably would’ve never been able/bothered to do that before. I’m not upset that he didn’t help. He was high enough that he wasn’t in any danger but may have peeled one of my instigators off. But decided to avoid me simply because what prox dar was showing him.

Reverting back to the way radar was isn’t going to stop pickers, hordes, or timid players. But it would restore some of the balance to lopsided fights. Much of the fog and decision making is gone. Again… you don’t even need to change your view to see where an enemy is and which way he’s going. If you’re engaged there’s no need to look behind you to see if someone is there. If you’re below their tail and they can’t even see you they know about how close you are. You can’t even sneak by in a goon because the second you’re in any enemy icon range you’re dead. Even if that player doesn’t actually see you, everyone else on their entire team will. The strategic advantage of having a local radar tower is basically non existent. Even GVs are pointing out exactly where you are.

[LilMak]

Unfortunately, I don’t think changing DAR will change that. We’re at a point where there are no new players, and the existing ones don’t want to get any better. No offense (especially to you Mak), but AH has become a retirement home social club. I think most play to pass the time. There’s hardly any competition anymore because the players that seek the path of less resistance have taken over. I’ve seen it far too many times since my return. A large DAR bar attacks a base and as soon as defenders up, they attack a different field on a different front.

Sure, there used to be NOE raids and base sneaks all the time, but those usually instigated a fight.

That’s kinda my point. Supposedly prox dar was added to make it easier for new players to find action. There are few (if any) new players so why change something that wasn’t really broken when it’s ruining things for us retirees?  No one asked for it. It just appeared one day and had terrible unintended consequences and makes it easier for people to take the path of least resistance. I’ve pretty much spent the majority of AH my time seeking large enemy darbars and it’s infinitely harder for me to do that now.

For the record, I’d love test to see NOE (200 AGL) come back with the numbers we have now. But prox dar wouldn’t even allow that to be effective.

[Banshee7]

For the record, I’d love test to see NOE (200 AGL) come back with the numbers we have now. But prox dar wouldn’t even allow that to be effective.

I think NOE is 60ft AGL now, which makes it even harder.

[popeye]

This was my thought when I supported it.. to help the map look more active and help new guys find the fight.

Maybe a bigger delay on these proxy dars would be a middle of the road?

This would be easy to try.  No new coding required.  It is currently 5 seconds, maybe 15 seconds.  Or...?

Downside is that field porkers and CV killers would be near impossible to stop if they would only be detected 15 seconds after breaking the dar ring.

[LilMak]

I think NOE is 60ft AGL now, which makes it even harder.

I think that’s too low if you’re flying NAP of the earth. Only works over water.

Here’s my suggestion for changes…

Remove icon range radar or make it specialized. Like certain aircraft/GVs can provide it. Maybe give it to bomber formations, C-47s, M3s (anything that’s actually hauling troops) and PT boats.

Make the radar towers harder. Minimum of 500lbs of ord to bring them down. I always thought it was kinda bogus that I can bring them down with a single gun pass.

NOE aircraft (200 AGL) don’t show on darbar but do show in radar rings and for the above excepted equipment.

Increase the darbar update to almost instant.

[whiteman]

I think that’s too low if you’re flying NAP of the earth. Only works over water.

Here’s my suggestion for changes…

Remove icon range radar or make it specialized. Like certain aircraft/GVs can provide it. Maybe give it to bomber formations, C-47s, M3s (anything that’s actually hauling troops) and PT boats.

Make the radar towers harder. Minimum of 500lbs of ord to bring them down. I always thought it was kinda bogus that I can bring them down with a single gun pass.

NOE aircraft (200 AGL) don’t show on darbar but do show in radar rings and for the above excepted equipment.

Increase the darbar update to almost instant.

Remove icon range radar or make it specialized.

Yea, like the P-61, F4U-2 and F6F-5N

[save]

When the all-seeing radar was introduced into AH, it made me and many from my squad to quit.

Even hiding behind a mountain was not possible anymore, and if you lose SA you just look at the radar and se what direction the enemy plane is.

Small maps would fix this and SA would matter again, and higher ENY planes would have more of a chance again in a hostile sky.

[fudgums]

Howdy Save! Good to see ya!

[DmonSlyr]

When the all-seeing radar was introduced into AH, it made me and many from my squad to quit.

Even hiding behind a mountain was not possible anymore, and if you lose SA you just look at the radar and se what direction the enemy plane is.

Small maps would fix this and SA would matter again, and higher ENY planes would have more of a chance again in a hostile sky.

Exactly this. Smaller maps condense the fight areas and creates bigger battles overall where you don't need a proximity dar. It's funny, decision are made on "what the noob would want" vs what the player base whose been here for years want. If you replace the regulars with noobies, did the plan actually work? In other games you don't get a dar, icons, or any dots, it's much harder there IMO. Need to bring some strategy back to the game. 30 players on Oceana during the afternoon isn't bringing hardly any action regardless of DOT Dar.

[Eagler]

This would be easy to try.  No new coding required.  It is currently 5 seconds, maybe 15 seconds.  Or...?

Downside is that field porkers and CV killers would be near impossible to stop if they would only be detected 15 seconds after breaking the dar ring.

Even that level of effort seems too much these days for us to expect...

Me thinks this wishlist forum is just therapy for the oldest subscribers...

Eagler