Just gonna drop this here...

[-gg-]

Just out of curiosity, what are the planes that people want to fly, but can't, because of ENY?

- oldman

Bombers  for some. Others were fighters but not sure which ones. They just get frustrated and log off. A couple guys are really, really good and they fight people who are really good - and get frustrated that they can't go up in equal planes.

[-gg-]

Honestly, I don’t think ENY is nearly as bad as people make it out to be—at least until you start getting above about 20 ENY.

I think a lot of the complaining really starts when people lose access to the 5 ENY aircraft. Those are the planes people are comfortable in, and when they're suddenly unavailable, it feels like they've been forced into something terrible. But between 5 and 20 ENY, there are still plenty of very good options.

Take the P-51B, for example. At around 20 ENY, it's still a very capable airplane. I think the biggest reason more people don't fly it is simply the armament. The performance is there, but a lot of players don't like giving up the heavier guns.

The P-47 lineup is probably one of the best examples of ENY not being a huge problem. There are good Thunderbolt options across a wide range of ENY levels.

The P-38 is also surprisingly ENY-proof. The P-38J at 20 ENY is, in practical terms, almost as good as the 12 ENY P-38L probably 99% of the time. And even the 30 ENY P-38G can be a lot of fun if you keep it extremely light.

Once you get into the 30 ENY range, though, things definitely change. You can still fly effectively, but you have to work harder. The aircraft generally become slower, less forgiving, and less capable of controlling the engagement.

On its own, I don't actually think that's a problem. Having to fly less capable aircraft when your country has a numbers advantage is a reasonable mechanic.

The real problem is what happens at the same time.

Your country has the numbers advantage, so you're restricted to worse aircraft—but you're also often fighting on multiple fronts and getting gangbanged anyway. So you have the population advantage on paper, but that doesn't necessarily mean you personally have an advantage where you're actually fighting.

That's where the ENY system starts producing frustrating gameplay.

You end up with situations where the only available fight is trying to launch a 30 ENY aircraft while a group of guys in 5 ENY Ponies is orbiting over the field waiting to kill anything that takes off.

Sure, you can up from an uncontested base and fly over instead of repeatedly getting vulched. But now you're flying a slower, lower-performance airplane and spending more time just trying to reach the fight.

And look, I'm absolutely in favor of upping a mediocre airplane against a vulching horde and seeing what you can do with it. Sometimes that's one of the most satisfying things in the game.

But that's the difference: doing it occasionally because you chose the challenge is fun. Being forced to do it repeatedly because ENY has taken away your viable options while the enemy is sitting over your field in their best aircraft is where it stops being fun.

That's the part of the current system that bothers me. It's not simply, “I can't fly my favorite plane.” It's that the combination of high ENY restrictions, bad local fights, and enemy hordes can leave you in a situation where you're simultaneously supposed to be the side with the numbers advantage and the guy trying to take off in a 30 ENY airplane against 5 ENY fighters already positioned above your runway.

On paper, that makes sense as balancing.

In practice, sometimes it just means the side with more players gets punished globally while individual players still get slaughtered locally.

for me it's when the ENY starts taking away even p47-40s. I rarely get to fly 5 eny planes, and I fly the p-47 d 40 a lot.

ENY for sure gets people frustated.

Last night we had like 3 bases and some guys in our squad just logged because we couldn't take decent bombers or really do much to try to get  a base back

Just remove ENY until numbers hit 100 or something.

[-gg-]

The easy ones.

nope

Anyway, the point I've been making is that I don't want ANYONE having a plane v plane advantage, even when it goes MY way.

If we have 3 less players in flight than a country who can fly whatever they want and we're supposed to have fun getting plowed over because we have lesser planes, then that sucks. It's just not fair.

Balance the game some other way, but let players be able to get the same planes as anyone else.

Your comment is typical. It's not like anyone is trying to get an unfair advantage by flying "easy" planes, it's that we want EQUAL planes.

Balance the game play in some other way that doesn't penalize some people and not others.

I personally feel that catering to crybabies and nerphing stuff to help them ruins ALL games I've ever played. always the crybabies getting their bottle and ruining the game.




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[toasted]

for me it's when the ENY starts taking away even p47-40s. I rarely get to fly 5 eny planes, and I fly the p-47 d 40 a lot.

ENY for sure gets people frustated.

Last night we had like 3 bases and some guys in our squad just logged because we couldn't take decent bombers or really do much to try to get  a base back

Just remove ENY until numbers hit 100 or something.

im all for capping eny to a max of 20. at 20 you have solid options that aren't an immediate death sentence. by 30 the handicap feels a bit too harsh especially against seasoned pilots. 

[Animl-AW]

Pointing out a problem with no possible solution is kind of an oxymoron.

The solution available is being worked on. What other solution is there?

Some players get hung up in ENY and no matter how it’s looked at their only solution will always be get totally rid of it. No matter what. Yet offer no replacement solution.

I will also make note that if like group logs in later after prime time they are bond to get hit with ENY, same thing in AM.

Concentrate on perfecting what we have.

It’s not so much ENY as much as when it’s applied. I refer to my post above on not hitting a country with ENY when they are already beat down. Then consider the next tweak when you see that reaction as a pattern.

ENY is not a bad tool, but until recently it was mire design fir higher numbers that masked it’s flaws. Now the flaws are more evident and can be addressed and perfected.

[Animl-AW]

im all for capping eny to a max of 20. at 20 you have solid options that aren't an immediate death sentence. by 30 the handicap feels a bit too harsh especially against seasoned pilots.

Hmm
1) limit base captures
2) don’t apply ENY to a country at bare bone base numbers
3) cap ENY at 20

These sound like good compromises.

[LilMak]

Plane selection, GBs, players logging off are all perpetuated by the radar (AWACS) settings. Proximity radar plays a part in all of this. Will it stop any of these things? No. But it is absolutely a contributing factor in the length and severity of these issues. I certainly don’t speak for everyone but I can tell you that winning the war, being outnumbered, or being forced into a 47D-11 doesn’t make me want to log off.

What does?

-Being hopelessly outnumbered over friendly airspace and not being able to get whiff of a good fight or contribute to strategic defense because every swinging jonson can see me on radar over my own airspace before I get my gear in the wells.
-Being thoroughly bored out of my skull on the quiet front that the best option is to leave the jug and go fighter mode in an SBD. Then be accused of “baiting” because their K4 didn’t encounter lancs. Fight over.
-Being number six in line to hammer the one poor soul who had the audacity to try to defend territory. Or worse being number one in line with five firing over my shoulder in a AWACS fed frenzy.
-Being left for dead because my teammate can see the six idiots on my 6 because they’re on AWACS.

[toasted]

Plane selection, GBs, players logging off are all perpetuated by the radar (AWACS) settings. Proximity radar plays a part in all of this. Will it stop any of these things? No. But it is absolutely a contributing factor in the length and severity of these issues. I certainly don’t speak for everyone but I can tell you that winning the war, being outnumbered, or being forced into a 47D-11 doesn’t make me want to log off.

What does?

-Being hopelessly outnumbered over friendly airspace and not being able to get whiff of a good fight or contribute to strategic defense because every swinging jonson can see me on radar over my own airspace before I get my gear in the wells.
-Being thoroughly bored out of my skull on the quiet front that the best option is to leave the jug and go fighter mode in an SBD. Then be accused of “baiting” because their K4 didn’t encounter lancs. Fight over.
-Being number six in line to hammer the one poor soul who had the audacity to try to defend territory. Or worse being number one in line with five firing over my shoulder in a AWACS fed frenzy.
-Being left for dead because my teammate can see the six idiots on my 6 because they’re on AWACS.

i could see how a little less awacs could be fun. the dar bar does a pretty good job of letting you know how many enemies in an area. i would be for cranking the dar down a bit to see what happens. general SA would probably actually go up a bit if everyone didnt have a live awacs feed.

its one of those things that probably cant go away completely, but maybe could be toned down a bit. even reducing the prox range and maybe slowing the update freq would probably help some.

[toasted]

you could also do something like 2x perks if you take off with awacs off.
1/2 perks if awacs on.

maybe combined with toning down the awacs.

[CptTrips]

you could also do something like 2x perks if you take off with awacs off.
1/2 perks if awacs on.

Who gets 1x perks?

[toasted]

the gvs i guess.

you could leave it at 1x for on and just boost the guys that turn it off. or maybe 1x should be with it off and 1/2 with it on. lots of options that all play out slightly differently but should have the sameish effect.

[CptTrips]

the gvs i guess.

 

[toasted]

And the more I think about the DAR, the more I think LilMak may have a point.

I’d like to see what happens if we reduced the proximity range, went back to dots instead of more precise indicators, and limited how many aircraft a single plane can contribute to the DAR.

For example, say you fly a fighter over an enemy field and there are six defenders up. Maybe only 2–3 of them show on the map, with a much smaller proximity range—say 3K instead of 6K—and their positions aren't represented with perfect accuracy.

One pilot can only process so much information while actually fighting. I don't care how good the pilot is; if they're dogfighting one aircraft while simultaneously trying to keep track of and call out the AWACS positions of six other aircraft, that's a hell of a lot of information to process.

That might preserve the usefulness of the DAR without turning it into a near-perfect picture of what's happening in the sky. It would also make getting jumped or setting up an attack more dependent on actually spotting and tracking aircraft rather than simply having the entire fight laid out on the map.

[Animl-AW]

And the more I think about the DAR, the more I think LilMak may have a point.

I’d like to see what happens if we reduced the proximity range, went back to dots instead of more precise indicators, and limited how many aircraft a single plane can contribute to the DAR.

For example, say you fly a fighter over an enemy field and there are six defenders up. Maybe only 2–3 of them show on the map, with a much smaller proximity range—say 3K instead of 6K—and their positions aren't represented with perfect accuracy.

One pilot can only process so much information while actually fighting. I don't care how good the pilot is; if they're dogfighting one aircraft while simultaneously trying to keep track of and call out the AWACS positions of six other aircraft, that's a hell of a lot of information to process.

That might preserve the usefulness of the DAR without turning it into a near-perfect picture of what's happening in the sky. It would also make getting jumped or setting up an attack more dependent on actually spotting and tracking aircraft rather than simply having the entire fight laid out on the map.

One issue at a time. Different thread. Lets on track. Dar has nothing to do with gang banging, INO

[LilMak]

Dar has nothing to do with gang banging, INO

That is absolutely 100% false. Gang bangs are sustained, sought out, and harder to push back against because of AWACS.