More cherished delusions defeated by research.

[Pongo]

Just got
VIII Fighter Command At War
"Long Reach"
The official training document compiled from the experiances of the fighter escorts of the "Mighty Eighth"

Its an Osprey Aircraft of the Aces Special.
Accounts written in wartime by serving pilots to prepare trainees for combat...
Well
In order of the things that I thought AH had trouble with...
Even from dead 6 violently manuvering planes are VERY difficult to hit.
This is recounted several times just in a quick reading.....Always bugged me but there is definate consensus in this book.

Poor control of diving german planes. I always felt this was over done in AH. Only because it doenst seem to make scence to make an E fighter that handles poorly in a dive....
They were sure that all three US planes could countrol better in a dive then the german planes,they counted on being able to maintain control in a dive much better then the germans.

The HO....
Not one of my pet peeves but I have seen time again on this board and on channel 1 people stating that HOs are non historical...
Well these guys were all HO dweebs. Bounced...HO Gerry doent have the balls for it. HO HO HO...everywhere. the Jug pilots lived for it. I have allready seen this mentioned in Canadian spitfire accounts. They went for the HO as a matter of course...
...Live with it.

Ranges of fire..
The majority seem to hold true to the Whites of their eyes kind of thing. But they are talking about opening up on bombers and twin engine planes at 7-800 yards...


They dont seem to be sure if they can out turn the germans or vis versa..the particular E state of the planes at the time seems to be what they say to watch when determing turning ability.

I really enjoy this book. It certainly is a ringing endorsment for AH as an imitation of WW2 NWE late war air combat.

[iculus]

Also, the 109G/K is a 1939 airframe modified by adding plenty of armour, and a big 1944 engine.

[Torgo]

Yep, you see a heck of a lot of HOs mentioned in the accounts of WWII fighter pilots.

And regarding another thing that people get their panties in a bunch about, there are a heck of a lot of accusations of "chute shooting" by the other side, too.

[funked]

I'll have to check that book out.

[funked]

Agreed Torgo, especially about the chute shooting.  Every country did it.  And every country says they only did it because the other side did it to them first.  

[Torgo]

Funked,

Well, according to the LW, US chute-shooting of LW really ramped up after the Battle of the Bulge..

The SS Malmedy massacre really had a powerful impact on the US....a lot of people were out for revenge.....

[Jekyll]

In Tom Blackburn's book about the history of VF-17 he quite unashamedly talks about 'chute-shooting' as a matter of course.

And in 'The First and the Last', by Adolf Galland, he recounts a conversation with Goering in which he regarded chute shooting as murder, and something he would not condone from his pilots.

Interestingly, he also talks about the Me-262 pilots being regularly 'chute-shooted' by US pilots.

Maybe chute shooting is a US disease, and that's why you see it advocated so much on these forums  

 

It certainly is a ringing endorsment for AH as an imitation of WW2 NWE late war air combat.

Yup it sure is.  Many a real life WW2 pilot was thankful that he couldn't be bounced because the enemy hard large red neon signs floating in space above his aircraft.

Get real.  The ONLY similarity between AH and WW2 air combat is the names of the aircraft  

[This message has been edited by Jekyll (edited 02-03-2001).]

[funked]

Utter roadkill.

[Pongo]

"Killer" Caldwell got his nickname for shooting chutes.

[RAM]

I dont recall who, but I read in this forum some days ago that one US pilot crashed while straffing chutes.

The F*cking idjot got what he deserved.

[gatt]

Yes, the book is a very good reading. About HO's ... I understand that breaking into the bandits was the first maneuver to do. But I'm not sure that they pressed the attack to the very end ... more likely the germans broke away when they saw HOing Jugs. They (US pilots) broke into attacking bandits even when they were low and bounced, just to disrupt enemy formations.

[This message has been edited by gatt (edited 02-02-2001).]

[Jimdandy]

 

Originally posted by Pongo:
...The HO....
Not one of my pet peeves but I have seen time again on this board and on channel 1 people stating that HOs are non historical...
Well these guys were all HO dweebs. Bounced...HO Gerry doent have the balls for it. HO HO HO...everywhere. the Jug pilots lived for it. I have allready seen this mentioned in Canadian spitfire accounts. They went for the HO as a matter of course...
...Live with it...

I'm going to get it. Sounds great. I read Boyingtons Baa Baa Black Sheep. He talks about HO'ing a Zero. He noted that the .50's didn't drop as much as the Zero's 20mm's. The 20mm's dropped under his plane. He got the HO. It didn't sound uncommon from his story. I have also read that it wasn't something any pilot liked to do. The risk of collision was greater. I think AH matches this fairly close. You can HO for sure but you are taking a greater risk when doing it generally.

[Suave1]

Galland was shot down like 11 times . Think of how many lives would've been saved if he'd have been shot while in his parachute harness the first time .

[Gadfly]

Using that logic, Suave, Hitler was right.

Man in a chute(in real life, not this game) is a non-combatant.

[whels1]

yes HOs were in RL, but far less deadly then they are here.

 

Originally posted by Torgo:
Yep, you see a heck of a lot of HOs mentioned in the accounts of WWII fighter pilots.

And regarding another thing that people get their panties in a bunch about, there are a heck of a lot of accusations of "chute shooting" by the other side, too.