Is the real problem a lack of an RR arena?

[DES]

I don't notice any difference in the amount of jerks now or when I payed $30 a month.

DES

[Tumor]

Originally posted by 2Late4U



A relaxed realism arena does nothing but make the game into air-quake.  All the new players would flock to the RR arena, as well as all marginal pilots, and they all learn bad habbits and crutches, and never move into the "real" arena, all dedicated pilots move on.................just how many people were in the AW full realism arena again on average....10...15 ?

...well, 5 or 10 is a completely inaccurate statement.  For the better part of Gamestorms life the FR arena had a huge amount of players.  I'll tell ya what else, many of those players were RR converts AND allot of that happened on various occasions when a few guys who's country was low on numbers went to the RR arena's and begged help.   Here's the difference.  When newbie/RR types show'd up in the FR with their kill macro's and attitudes, they were more often than not "counseled" in a very respectful manner and they usually worked out ok.  What happens in AH is some smart-ass show's up, fires off on channel one and I'll wager 7 out of 10 people who answer him/her do so in a manner no more adult than they.  Further, allot of the advice they get that isn't inflammatory to the situation is done in a "directing" manner, what do you expect to happen?  I'm of the opinion that if the super-secret so-called "monitor's" spent less time warning/muteing people for dirty wordy use and took a more active role in INFORMING people whats expected we'd all get along allot better.  The other night...uhhm...can't remember who but the guy spent at least 3 hours acting like a complete ass.  Never used a single "bad" word but IMO should've been muted for a week.

An RR arena would be a good thing.  However...those who go and stay?....goood. Those who never come?...better.  RR could have less restrictions where all the kiddies could be kiddies.   I've seen very few people migrate from FR to RR and remain.  The reverse is true for RR to FR.

[faminz]

Thanks Tumour. thats what I was getting at.
Its like reverse logic from all the make it more realistic discussions. I want more realism too but I think we need a play pen / arena for the less serious players more attracted to arcade style play. Its certainly not how much you pay that governs your attitude, its your maturity and committment to treating a WW2 air combat game with some respect for its historical and 'simulation' aspects. If you want to treat it like quake in the sky then fine, stay in the 'RR' arena.
Personally I think (as I said) that we already have the makings of this in the MA / CT arenas. Dumb down the MA and rebrand the CT and I reckon a large percentage would immediatly migrate to CT thus fulfilling the pleas of those hard working individuals pleading for more numbers there.

and while were at it, the historical names in CT are sooo much better for me too. I dont really like going to A23 or D67 or whatever, no versimilitude (is that right?). Personally Id rather hit Hickam or Wantuk or Rabaul etc. and CT has that!!

squelch 1 eh? hmmm Ill try that tonight!

and hey, I still remember a Pearl harbour scenario with you Tumour (I hope it was you) in old AW. was great!!!

[MikeKA]

but FR vs RR is as simple as a different set of variables.  No such thing as FR in a game as far as im concerned.

If a person's buddies move to FR that person is more like to move to FR as well.  If their friends mostly stay in RR, they will probably stay there.  At least thats the way I feel.  I wouldn't be opposed to an FR arena at all.  I think if the current arena is classed as "FR" and an RR arena is made... most people will stay in FR because thats the FM they know by heart, why learn all over again eh?  I'm not sure if RR would be all that successful in AH's enviroment because I tend to think people generally stick with what they know already.  But then again people might just up and move there.  Humans are frickin unpredictable.

My squad did a few campaigns in FR AW and we didn't find it to be that much more "difficult" than RR.  It's just a vastly different flight model that you have to learn.  However, most of the people we liked to fly with and against were in RR so we chose to stay there in the long run.  Sure there were more tards in RR for reasons stated above, but they are easy to deal with (just shoot them down until they log lol).  Jerks and amazinhunks are nothing but entertainment to me.  I'm sure others feel differently, but I say (someone else said it first) "If you can shoot someone down, great.  But if you can shoot them down enough to piss them off it's like icing on the cake."  My squad e-mail list has a riot of a time talking about people that start whining on the radio after being shot down.  You know the guys im talking about... whaaaaaa whaaaaa... every single time the other guy must have cheated, or warped, or dweebed... anything but simply got the best of them.   Whatever, kinda got off on a tangent there, sorry.  

[10Bears]

Air Warriors, your lobbying effort ain't gonna work--- Just ain't. HTC isn't planning to dumb down anything. Newbies can go to the training area, and I've noticed quite a few in there the last few weeks. Think they give them a little extra ammo thats it.

Why don't you use your good writting skills and lobby for stuff we all want?

I'd prefer cockpit damage, busted compass stuff like that. Different types of gages.  Cowling flaps.. Hmm saw that on Il2... like it. Personal plane skins... You wouldn't rather have that?... How bout an object editor?

Why are you trying to seperate the community?.. what is your agenda? We can handle a few kids.. many of us are parents

I remember from years ago at AW the people in the RR area wouldn't even know if an event was coming up... They wouldn't visit the boards.. Just lived in their own little world no changes... ever!!  Over here they on the same bus.. They hear guys talking about upcoming events and might.... just might decide to participate

But go ahead try one of those poll thingies --results might disapointe you.

[mrsid2]

There is no need for a RR arena. The kids from AW will adapt and learn the new model.

If they won't, they're better off playing arcade boxed sims offline. That is, because in the end it's all about player skill not realism rate and the better player will always shoot them down online.

[faminz]

well reasoned 10bears. Made me think, "what was my agenda"?
It was to offer a lateral thinking solution to the problem of the apparent infux of players who whine moan and generally act immature cf the players who want realism in all things including historical perspective.

I DO want those realistic changes you mentioned, but I am annoyed by the immature behaviour of some pilots. and I had seen many posts pleading for more CT players. Sooo i thought well, you cant force players to move but you can set things up so they automatically go where they feel happiest. i think AW managed that with the FR/RR idea and therefore I offered it as a potential solution.

Whatever, Ill stay in MA myself for now (with the occasional foray to the CT.

It made us think!

I consider the thread closed.

[Tumor]

Originally posted by faminz
Thanks Tumour. thats what I was getting at.
Its
and hey, I still remember a Pearl harbour scenario with you Tumour (I hope it was you) in old AW. was great!!!

Why yes!!  I knew I knew your name from somewhere.  Pearl?...you didn't go on that retarded "dive a kate straight down from 30k level and launch torpedo" mission with me didja??  Heheh...it was almost as fun as it was dumb...but...it worked eh?? lol.

[Tumor]

Originally posted by 10Bears
Air Warriors, your lobbying effort ain't gonna work--- Just ain't. HTC isn't planning to dumb down anything. Newbies can go to the training area, and I've noticed quite a few in there the last few weeks. Think they give them a little extra ammo thats it.

Why don't you use your good writting skills and lobby for stuff we all want?

Well, I don't think AH needs an RR arena that much, but I do think it needs a "Fighter-Town".

One thing is for certian, I really think if there were an RR arena there would simply be MORE of a playerbase for HTC.  Did Fighter-Ops ever open up in WB? I know it was the RR version of WB....anyone know?  Did it bring any players?

[akak]

Making a seperate arena for RR and one for FR will only divide the community.  

As for the other stuff, the biggest whiners I've seen in AH so far have been these so called "AH Vets" that whine like a friggin' sheared sheep.

[Mayhem]

As a former Air warrior I have to say dumbing down the reality engine is a bad idea infact I think the exact opposite I think HTC should strive to make it as accurate as possible.

Air warrior had one of the longest and best online flightsim communities. it was around before warbirds and aces high. many of the so called vets here came from air warrior alot of us went to warbirds before coming to Aces high. and like AH air warrior had it's influx of whinners cheaters loosers and quake heads. it will happen to every game reguardless of cost as long as you have a big player base.

The sollution to "quake head" problem is community. Squads and Vets should be leading by example. each squad should establish rules of conduct for there members and enforcing them. Vets are currently encouraged to help new players, We shoudl be doing this as a community as a whole.

I would go as far as to say there should be a good Etiquette section on the HTC website and in the player manuel infact every squadron should have good player etiquette rules and guids estab;ished and enforced.

lastly we are a community, if the community goes to hell it is becuase we failed as a community.

[Toad]

Well said 10 Bears.

IMO, this attitude is more of a problem:

"MA is the general 'dump everyone here' type arena and CT is for serious players."

This type of elitism is uncalled for, unnecessary and will split the community. Just like the RR/FR issue did in that game.

[Grimm]

Hey,  That Price Hike Idea is right on the mark.  This means only GOOD players will play.   The Idea of $30 to $40 isnt enough to get rid of those unwanted players.  I suggest $300 to $500 a Month.   Heck if you cant afford $6,000 a year for AH,  You shouldnt fly.       Lets see if Hitech can survive with only a couple players.  

I personaly believe Hitech creations is moving along in a very positve direction.  I support their approach to the game.  Im glad its competivley price.   I think additions like combat trim and auto take are good improvments for the more casual player.   If your die-hard,  you simpley do it all manualy.  

Id like to see additional skins someday, and more aircraft types, but I pleased that we get improvments on a fairly regular basis.  
The screen shots of the Ki67 and ME110 are pretty cool.  1.09 cant be too far away

[K West]

RR-vs-FR and MA-vs-CT is not the issue. Neither are they band aids to fix anything. No one can fix the players who are a problem excpet the player themselves or HTC.

  AH has always had idiots spouting off in the arena and not just due to the free two week trial as we also saw them when the subscription was $30/mo.  The problem is where we have had a 200-300% increase in players online. Along with that huge influx we've also saw a similar increase in idiots and jack asses. Who find that THEY have control of the environment in the arena and not HTC and they behave in any manner they wish just about.

 The community is too big and most players too indifferent for the community to police itself. The solution can only come from HTC. And not soon enough either IMO.

 Anyway.

 Here is what HiTech said in the 'gameplay' forumn this week in answer to direct questions about the online behavior in the MA.

 http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43780


"My opinion is simple, but implementing my opinion is very complicated.

 We can not put in our TOS that using bad language will result in the closing
 of an account. The reason is simple, if we put that in the TOS it meens that
 if you use 1 bad word, and anyone complains to us about it, we have no
 choice but to kick that person out.

 This would not be a good arrangemnt.

 Rather, we leave the TOS very open that we can kick you out for any reason
 we disire.

2. It is not possible for us to police the arena 24/7.

3. We do have monitors who control the situation a lot of the time. Our view is
  that we want to minimize profanity in the arenas as much as possible, at the
  same time we realize the difference between continual mis-use vs the occasional
  frustration.

  HiTech"


 -  Westy

[blutic]

How 'bout this: Make the flight model more difficult. The more time spent trimming ac and keeping the ac flying; the less time for typing nonsence in the buffer.
Just my 2 cents.

Blutik