Aircraft Carriers

[Busher]

Hey Gents

There has been some discussion in the Main Arena about the quantity of ordinance required to sink carriers. It seems to vary between maps.

If I am not mistaken, WW2 AC Carriers were built with wood decks, presumably to allow easier repair in the battle field.

Offered for discussion, I wonder if it would be an interesting damage model if it took one level of ord (say 2K) to destroy the carrier deck such that aircraft ops were suspended for a period of time (say 15 minutes - much like a fighter hangar); and a much higher quantity (say 6 or 8K) to sink the carrier.

Only a thought but interested in other's opinions.


Busher

[Ripsnort]

FYI: Yesterday I hit a "virgin" carrier (ie, no one was near it for a good hour) with 6,000 lbs. of bombs.  Direct hit.  It did not sink.  I do believe it requires 8,000 now.  

As far as history goes, a well placed 500 lber would be enough, but you have to have gameplay in mind when your talking Simulations as this.  8,000 seems about right, takes away the suicidal dweebs that took out the cv with one flight. Now they got to do it 4 times

[K West]

 It would be nice of the CV's had a progressive damage model such as...  Loss of flight ops after xxx damage, loss of recovery for aircraft after even more damage, loss of individual gun mounts (be it heavy guns or simple ack-ack) from direct hits,  a progressive capsizing as damage builds untill there is eventual loss of propulsion and ultimately the capsizing/sinking.

 As it is now it's an "either..or" situation. There is no indication that any ship in the fleet is damaged untill it's going teats up and sinks beneath the waves. I imagine a ship indicating damage via means above could be withdrawn for repair and could make fleet use and engagements much more interesting.

 IMO.

   Westy

[FDutchmn]

Originally posted by Ripsnort
FYI: Yesterday I hit a "virgin" carrier (ie, no one was near it for a good hour) with 6,000 lbs. of bombs.  Direct hit.  It did not sink.  I do believe it requires 8,000 now.  

What??? A B17 can't sink a CV anymore??

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by FDutchmn


What??? A B17 can't sink a CV anymore??

Thats what I flew.  all 6 bombs hit dead center of the ship.

[Wanker]

Rip, you attention-starved-no-talent-gotta-ruin-everyone's-fun dweeblet-fluff-driver. How dare you fly what you want and do what you want to do! The nerve!

You're inability to fly fighters has been noted. What's next Rip, some lazsterbation to go with all that fluff, huh?

[whels]

Originally posted by Ripsnort


Thats what I flew.  all 6 bombs hit dead center of the ship.

Island has been 8k to sink CV for about 2 months. all
other maps are still 2k to sink.


whels

[Swoop]

Originally posted by banana
Rip, you attention-starved-no-talent-gotta-ruin-everyone's-fun dweeblet-fluff-driver.  

LMAO.

[Hooligan]

I believe (I may be wrong) that the CVs in AH are Essex class.  They do have wooden decks but they have 1.5" of armor under that and the hangar deck has an additional 2.5" of armor.

According to: "Striking Power of Airborne weapons", US Naval Intelligence, 1944

The probability of sinking a US CV per number of 1000lb AP bomb hits was:

1 hit 23%
2 hits 41%
3 hits 55%
4 hits 70%
5 hits 90%
6 hits 99%

Level bombers almost never hit a ship in motion.  At Midway 15 B-17s each dropped 8500 lbs of bombs on the Japanese fleet which resulted in no hits.  No moving US or Japanese CV was ever hit by level bombers during the entire Pacific War.  The only case of a major Japanese warship being hit by a level bomber that I am aware of is when the DD Mutsuki was sunk by B-17s in the Solomon islands on 25 August 1942.  And the Mutsuki was dead in the water at the time of the attack.

Level bombers should only hit moving ships as a matter of extreme good luck

Hooligan

[K West]

" At Midway 15 B-17s each...."

That's because they didn't have the ultramodern ordinance aiming and delivery devices that the AH bombers do.

 Westy

[Sabre]

I'm a big proponent of improving the damage model of ships in AH.  In addition to hits causing visible damage (fire, list, holes), I to would like to see hits on the CV cause an impact to flight ops, similar to hanger damage.  Hit the bow or elevator and launches are disabled, but not successful landings.  Hit the stern and no arresting gear available (not to mention you better not hit the hole in the deck when you come in).  Torpedo hits cause a list and loss of speed; hit with enough torps and she's dead in the water and eventually sinks.  AP bombs that hit near the engine spaces would also reduce speed.

In addition to these effects, I'd also like to see several ships added to the fleets, specifically a tanker and an ammo ship.  Sinking either would have the same effect as killing fuel and ammo at a field, i.e. reduced fuel and load outs for a/c.

[Busher]

Thanks Guys

All intersting points!

[Octavius]

I took a Typhoon loaded with rockets, salvoed 8, sunk a CV and lived in the Baltic map.  I was happy for the kill, but it was still a bit dorky to sink a ship with rockets .

[Kutt]

I would like to see realistic damage modeling on the fleet. A couple of things to prevent this from being exploited would be to put more carriers in each task force. Also to include the modeling of critical hits.

I spent five years on the USS Saratoga CV-60 in their engineering department. I was not worried about what hit us as much as where it hit us. A hit in areas where we stored our munitions or in our Oxygen plant would have been disastrous. A hit to our mess deck would have done little to reduce our operational capabilities. We may have had a party, the food got pretty bad on a long deployment.

My $.02

[gavor]

banana...funny ... laszterbate...