Dad takes blockbuster to video store...

[Fatty]

Heh.  I believe the force was a small explosion which drove a small projectile.  Keep trying though, I think I'm starting to feel something....oops, no that was just gas.

[Ripsnort]

Tahgut, I feel remorse and sorry for the parents of not understanding how to properly raise a child, how to "interfere" with their lives by knowing who they hang out with, know 24/7/365 what they're kids were doing.  Granted these "kids" were adults when they committed the crimes, the chances are favorable that they wouldn't have even been in this situation if they had proper upbringing.

[koala]

Human life is precious.

Not all human life is precious.  Some humans are scum and are not "precious" by any stretch of the imagination.

No, it's never a cause for celebration. This young hoodlum was one of OURS.

Bullsh*t.  He wasn't one of mine.  Good riddance to the POS.

[CavemanJ]

Originally posted by midnight Target
No, it's never a cause for celebration. This young hoodlum was one of OURS. We should be aware of the forces that drive this kind of behavior and try like hell to stamp them out.

Watch the video on the link...Mr. Shockey doesn't even agree with you. He expressed his remorse and regret to the families of the young man he shot.

I think you would all feel differently had you been on the trigger end. Even you Eagler.  

The punk is gone and the world is a little better for it.  Is it cause for celebration?  Yes and no.  The world is a little better place now, good reason to celebrate in my book.  It was the death of an 18yr old that made it better.  Not really a reason to celebrate.
What is sad is that they decided to cross the line.  I agree with you that we should work on the cause of the problem.  But that's hard to do.  It usualy comes down to the Haves and the Have Nots.  They wanted to the money to buy something they couldna afford yet.  And the one that lived had a job! (probably doesn't any more though).

As for Mr. Shockey's feelings expressed in the video, I've no doubt that he is sorry he had to use his weapon.  He took on a pretty big burden when he decided he was going to get his license and carry.  He magnified that burden at least 10fold that night in Blockbuster.  He'll probably carry an image of that kid with him to his grave and his life is forever changed.


banana I don't think you're as anti-gun as ya make yourself out to be.  At least you acknoledge the difference between criminals and citizens protecting themselves/others.  Most of the full bore anti-gun folks are gonna wanna see Dad brought up on some kind of charge for shooting the kids and will only admit under threat of imminent death or something worse that what Dad did was actually a good thing.  Of course first thing they're gonna try to do is sweep the whole thing under the carpet because it undermines thier case about concealed firearms.

[Eagler]

Originally posted by midnight Target
No, it's never a cause for celebration. This young hoodlum was one of OURS. We should be aware of the forces that drive this kind of behavior and try like hell to stamp them out.

Watch the video on the link...Mr. Shockey doesn't even agree with you. He expressed his remorse and regret to the families of the young man he shot.

I think you would all feel differently had you been on the trigger end. Even you Eagler.  

I pray every night that I or my family will never be in such a situation.
But put in the same circumstances, I pray I'd have the clarity of mind to act swiftly and surely enough to prevent loss of "innocent" life.
As for what he said in the video, what else do you expect him to say? Anything else, he'd end up in some screwy lawsuit..

[mauser]

Someone should make a frequently run commercial or "public service announcment" that brandishing a knife or a gun in that situation explicitly means that you are willing to use deadly force to accomplish your means.  Thus you are also accepting the fact that you can be dealt with through deadly force.  This may or may not get through to certain folks tho.  

Never draw a gun or knife unless you're damned well prepared to use it, or have it used against you.  

I echo the sentiments of others... criminals do not necessarily follow "rules of conduct."  The hijackers on Sept. 11 didn't follow the accepted "rules of conduct" of hijackers.  Relying on criminals NOT to harm your loved ones is foolish...  I hope the father and his family get through this ok w/o lawsuits.  I hope I will have the strength to protect my family if the need ever arises.  

mauser

[Sikboy]

Sometimes we just need to look to the Vandals for guidance.

A Gun For Christmas
From the Album "Oi To the World"


Families lock their doors in fear that criminals might get them - But this Christmas rest assured that I will have my own protection.
- I'll get a gun for Christmas to protect my other gifts
- If burgers touch my property they won't leave here with out a limp
- Packing heat this Christmas I'll shoot it off on New Year's Eve,
- cuz bullets go in outer space when pointed up I believe
- A bullet sends a Christmas message that is clear and loud
- it says that I will not take all of this roadkill lying down
- I'll get a gun for Christmas to protect my other gifts
- I'll only tell you once "Stay the diddly away from my toejam"
- I will use my new weapon in self-defense and sport
- and to keep the carolers off my Golly-geen porch
- and preventing Yuletide homicide's this year
- I won't be a victim this year thanks to Santa Clause
- Sleeping with no fear of danger, and it's all because
- I'll get a gun for Christmas to protect my other gifts
- I'll only tell you once "Stay the diddly away from my toejam"
- Christmas needs security , security is weapons.
- Vigilante action teaching criminals their lessons
- It's the greatest gift we have taking out our rivals
- Thank you Santa, thank you God
- for guaranteeing my survival
- A bullet sends a Christmas message that is clear and loud
- it says that I will not take all of this roadkill lying down
- I'll get a gun for Christmas to protect my other gifts
- I'll only tell you once "Stay the diddly away from my toejam"
- I won't be a victim this year thanks to Santa Clause
- Sleeping with no fear of danger, and it's all because
- I'll get a gun for Christmas to protect my other gifts
- I'll only tell you once "Stay the diddly away from my crap
- or I'll bust a cap in your ass!!!"


Your in Service,

-Sikboy

[Nifty]

It's sad that anyone is so screwed up as to commit an armed robbery.  It's sad that the kids' parents have lost their child.  That's about as far as it goes.  Kids had a rifle and threatened people.  Kid holding the rifle gets killed.  The other kid went for the rifle and dad shot him too.  Better the perps than the innocents.  

Leave Elfenwolf alone.  He's just looking for the three billy goats gruff.  

[midnight Target]

(Tahgut shuffles off to try to explain the sanctity of human life to a brick wall.......the wall seems to be more understanding.)

[GRUNHERZ]

Tahgut are you stupid?

Has it escaped your bizzare morality thatr the two guys were armed robbers?  

Armed robbers?

With Guns?

With Bullets?

They were using them in a crime?


Is this because they are black?

Are your sons armed robbers too and you are worried?

[Apache]

If some of you really saw what happens on the streets every stinkin' day as I have, you wouldn't let your loved ones out of the house. You see only the sensational, the "news worthy" events.

You don't see the filth, the pure, unadulterated evil. There is nothing in the eyes. No compassion. Creatures such as these robbers don't even see you. You don't exist. You don't count. Only they and thier desires do.

Sure. Go snivel & wail. Some of ya haven't a clue.

[Maverick]

Followed this thread for a bit and was mildly surprised. (I already knew ellendork has nothing of any merit to say)

What surprised me was the comment about the cell phone. I feel fairly certain the police were called after the first robery. That pretty much sums up the veracity of the cell phone solution for a problem in real time. FWIW. average time to respond to a crime in process, assuming there are Officers available, is about 2 to 15 minutes. More than enough time to commit the robbery, multiple murders AND get far away.

As a retired Police Officer I can't fault the dad in any way. Just becuase there has been no loss of life in previous robberies has no bearing that there won't be any killings by subsequent robbers. Unless of course you subscribve to the theory that these were the same robbers in ALL robberies and that THEY made the decision before hand to NOT shoot any one under any circumstances. I find that hard to believe given that, 1. they came to rob the store at gun point: and 2. the second robber decided to pick up the gun AFTER his partner was shot instead of surrendering. These 2 items lead me to believe they were intending to use deadly force to get what they wanted and that force would be used if they decided to do so.

For those who wish to willingly be a victim, you are on your own. For those who do not, I see nothing in the constitution or laws (at least in this country, as I know this doesn't apply in Canada and Europe) that negates the right of self defense for non criminals. Lest you think otherwise, the mere threat of deadly force during the crime (such as armed robbery) constitutes a deadly threat to the victims life. No criminal has the right to threaten a victim with their life. Coincidentally, in conflict with what some may think, there is no right to commit a crime either.

YMMV

PS I didn't see how many shots were fired in any of the articles but there was no mention of "spray and pray" tactics either. Well done, many Police Officers haven't done that well in deadly situations.

[Maverick]

Originally posted by Apache
If some of you really saw what happens on the streets every stinkin' day as I have, you wouldn't let your loved ones out of the house. You see only the sensational, the "news worthy" events.

You don't see the filth, the pure, unadulterated evil. There is nothing in the eyes. No compassion. Creatures such as these robbers don't even see you. You don't exist. You don't count. Only they and thier desires do.

Sure. Go snivel & wail. Some of ya haven't a clue.

Amen Apache, but then we share a common background. We have been there and most here haven't a clue to the reality of the situation.  

[midnight Target]

Originally posted by midnight Target


The kid went into the store carrying a weapon...you don't have a clue about his intentions regarding capping people, that is irrelevent. The shooting was probably justified. No argument as I said earlier.

Grunherz....Are you stupid? Can you read? Should I put it in big capital letters? I posted at least 3 times I thought the shooting was JUSTIFIED.

It is the careless disregard for the loss of a TEENAGER that makes me wonder what kind of TWISTED MORALITY you all have.

I also never once mentioned RACE, or my sons, so why did you?

[GRUNHERZ]

Well I dont get why you feel so bad about this? They werent nice people?

Anyway I asked if your symathy was more to them because you have black sons, maybe you see it different?