Author Topic: P51's vs FWa5's in SEA; ROE Discussion (Read 1167 times)

Hristo · « **Reply #45 on:** July 07, 2000, 12:29:00 AM »

F4UDOA,

How many C-Hogs were produced ? Surely less than 262s.

I remember some 1400 262s being producced.

P-80 in greater numbers than 262 ???! Weren't there some 40 or so P-80s by war end ? And how many by end of war in Europe ?

Face it. 262 in German sky in late 1944 and 1945 was the reality. Any Allied jet plane simply doesn't enter this category, it enters the what-if scenario category.

Hristo · « **Reply #46 on:** July 07, 2000, 12:38:00 AM »

Hang, I cannot speak in names of all Luftwaffe pilots that will participate in this duel. Personally, I can go with icons-on. Even though I might be able to see the outcome.

However, note that I don't consider Fw 190A-5 a match for P 51 in such a fight (with icons on, that is). Neither historical, neither in performance. It can defend itself allright, but to press fight, hmmmm.....

If we had the Dora, then it would be a different story.

Diving to the merge ? Historical ? Historically any side was able to dive to the merge. RoE are not historical either, but so aren't the icons. You can't have it all your way, you know.

Diving in faster plane on slower plane, with radar range finders and shooting aids ? So Luftwaffe starts on defensive, huh ? Is there anything else you need to win this one ?

Historically you should have enough fuel to return home few hundred miles away, since you will probably be fighting deep inside enemy territory. 190s, OTOH, should be able to land anywhere below them

As for no icons again, wouldn't it be nice to have SEA with icons eliminated, so no-icons fanatics can choose their place to fly ? I know where I'd be

[This message has been edited by Hristo (edited 07-07-2000).]

Torque · « **Reply #47 on:** July 07, 2000, 12:39:00 AM »

kewl you mean we get the B29 then awesome 262 killer.

hey when the uberspiter comes out i'll duel your 109 mank!

Hristo · « **Reply #48 on:** July 07, 2000, 12:51:00 AM »

Wouldn't that just prove your opportunist approach ?

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Hangtime · « **Reply #49 on:** July 07, 2000, 01:18:00 AM »

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Hang, I cannot speak in names of all Luftwaffe pilots that will participate in this duel. Personally, I can go with icons-on. Even though I might be able to see the outcome.

Great! I take it then you'll lead a team of superior LW A5 jockeys in a fight against our opportunist p51's? 15K merge, icons on; max speed, etc; etc?? We need a time and date.. I have proposed July 22nd or 23rd at 3pm eastern, giving you two weeks to recruit and train your experten. Is this acceptable?

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However, note that I don't consider Fw 190A-5 a match for P 51 in such a fight (with icons on, that is). Neither historical, neither in performance. It can defend itself allright, but to press fight, hmmmm.....

LOL.. you mean that with the cloaking devices off; it's a fair fight?? Buck up; man.. yer still drivin the only plane in the sim that can roll faster than the system can display it.. lol.. it turns better; climbs better; accels better, it's better armed and of course; let us not forget that the LW has better pilots... surely; you are not concerned that our opportunist ponies will win the day??

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If we had the Dora, then it would be a different story.

Maybe. maybe not. We don't know yet how THIS story's gonna come out! Tell you what. What ever the LW elite gets for a main ride; I'll fight yah in it. Any time.. lights on; of course and without chains to limit the aircrafts performance, anything within reason is possible. I look forward to the arrival of the Dora as much as you.

But first; lets get THIS fight on.

I've heard from lots of folks that would like to have a Spit vs FW&109 fight.. as well as a mixed bag LW vs allies fight next after this one; regardless of results. The LW have any intrest in that?? Icons on of course; and a reasonable merge alt without speed or other hinderances to A/C performance would apply...

Back to you....

[This message has been edited by Hangtime (edited 07-07-2000).]

Hristo · « **Reply #50 on:** July 07, 2000, 03:53:00 AM »

Hang, I can't give you any date yet. Our first training will be this Sunday, 3 PM GMT. All interested pilots please attend. Quite a few JG 2 members are going to show up.

We might form an 8 men team, along with reserves.

Fw 190A-5 vs Spits ? Oh, yes !!!! If there is plane A-5 fights the best, it is the Spit (of course, V and IX

).

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JG2 "Richthofen"

[This message has been edited by Hristo (edited 07-07-2000).]

Nash · « **Reply #51 on:** July 07, 2000, 01:31:00 PM »

Hristo,

Where is your 8 man team with reserves? You need to e-mail me with your list or have the guys email me individually. I only have you down with 3 or so FW drivers.

Also, for both of you, I've made an active news area on the site. For announcements such as training times etc. I'll include the training time you mentioned Hristo, but in the future if you want something posted you will have to e-mail me.

These things sometimes get burried in the threads and it's hard for me to sift through and pull out the pertinent info. Having it displayed on the website ensures that any participant can go there and get the latest news, if they've missed or can't find something that was written here on the BBS.

Sounds like the ROE has been hashed out. Can someone let me know what the final status is?

All updating of the site will take place after 6pm Pacific (when I get home from work).

F4UDOA · « **Reply #52 on:** July 07, 2000, 02:53:00 PM »

Hristo,

The C hog is an unusual representation of the F4U in AH. It certainly was not the predominate varient of the A/C. But keep in mind that there were 1700 F4U-4 and -4B's(20mill cannon) built during WW2.

notice the pretty cannons and the date.

Also WW2 didn't end when Germany surrendered. It went on for a while longer. Just like after the Italians surrendered or turned around and faced the other direction whatever. There were P-80's in prodution before and after along with the P-51H and F8F Bearcat. My point is that the ME262 had no significant impact on the airwar in WW2. If it did you would have seen a far more urgent response IE the arrival of small numbers of jets A/C from the US along with updated versions of existing A/C. Case and point. There were no Aircraft carriers present during D-Day the largest Naval invasion in history. Why? because of absolutely no Lufwaffe A/C that could have taken off in any significant numbers to make a difference. So why model them to appear in A/H in any signicant numbers? The ME-163 Komet, V1 and V2 bombs were all weapons of desparation with no strategic significance to the war at all. The Me-262 was a superior design but was never a factor in the strategic planning of the war for the allies or the axis. Bonus plane yes, every day fighter??? No. Why punish the allies for winning without having to resort to flying prototypes?

Later
F4UDOA

[This message has been edited by F4UDOA (edited 07-07-2000).]

[This message has been edited by F4UDOA (edited 07-07-2000).]

Torque · « **Reply #53 on:** July 07, 2000, 04:17:00 PM »

Wouldn't that just prove your opportunist approach ? LOL Histro you mean a 109 co-alt with 80 ias more than a 51 isn't the above.Cheers mate when uberspit comes I'll duel your 109 no probs and I'll be the one pulling back on stick and waiting for you to tail under me.

UBERDUBER!!!!!

Hang shoulda tak'n 1/2 tank and kept climbing in the other direction till you ran outta gas.

LOL luv to see Ziggy and you duel, him in the P47....ops almost forgot <finger> to ziggy

Actually I'm really look'n forward to duel in equal ACs Hristo

[This message has been edited by Torque (edited 07-07-2000).]

112233 · « **Reply #54 on:** July 07, 2000, 05:29:00 PM »

Hallo I just want to say something to the P51 and the FWa5 you can not compare these two aircrafts as already said , logically because of the time deference of design.
Naturally the developers of AH put the best US fighters in the game but what about the German FW190D9 brought into service in 1944 it is said that this plane was the best fighter of the war and you should not forget the Japanese Ki-84 Hayate brought into service in 1944 it was also as good as P51.
And well the P51 is not really American it's design and specifications and requirements were driven entirely by the RAF in the form of an order from the British Purchasing Commission.

Please I do not what to start a Country fight, just see it Historically. You can not say that a specific country had the best weaponry because weaponry lasts only for a couple of month or years, till some other country brings out something better and besides this everything has its down and up sides.
It is all a circle of technological evolution.

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112233 · « **Reply #55 on:** July 07, 2000, 05:36:00 PM »

.

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Minotaur · « **Reply #56 on:** July 08, 2000, 11:20:00 AM »

You can just barely see a B-26 in the ground clutter.

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Mino
The Wrecking Crew

"So what do you post here? Poetic love letters?"
Ram