Author Topic: And the Winner is? F4U-1C  (Read 3530 times)

Offline Duckwing6

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #45 on: March 28, 2000, 02:37:00 AM »
Kieren:  again .. i don't know what you complain about .. the 109 with gondolas and a Tank climbs as well as a F4U.. it accelerates FASTER, it has better turn capability and you have also ping/KILL capabilities with those 30mm's .. your only disadvantage is the lower roll rate.

Jeezz .. they hold so many advantages and still have to say the other bird is UBER ...

Offline Hristo

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #46 on: March 28, 2000, 04:32:00 AM »
...and range disadvantage, Duckwing. 30 mm is useless against fighters at more than 300 yards even in straight chase. Lightyears away from 900 yards kills the Hog delivers  

MG 151/20 is better, it can actually damage planes up to 500 yards in straight chases.


Offline Duckwing6

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #47 on: March 28, 2000, 04:35:00 AM »
hmm Hristo i don't hit a barn door in a straight 6 chase .. i usually kill my targets at about 300 to 400 yards with some slight angle .. and i KNOW you do the same  

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #48 on: March 28, 2000, 07:34:00 AM »
One on One the F4u1C is no uberplane. When you fight someone in the trainingarena you'll see that it's easily beaten even if it gets the headstart (more alt). That's why you won't see many guys dueling in the trainingarena in it (except of course Leph and Torque).

In the Main Arena it's a different situation. When I fly a 109 in the main arena it's always dangerous to get kills... because most of the time you need time (multiple passes) to get a kill. Everybody knows that the longer the fight lasts (the lower it goes) the more dangerous it becomes (other higher bogies showing up etc).

The F4u has definatly the advantage in this regard (the best plane IMO) cause if the con screws up (breaks to late, or split S's to late) he'll be dogmeat. The large ammoload helps alot too cause you can spray and pay (when he breaks) from about 700-600 yards without much worry. In short the perfect BnZer.

In a 109 even a spit or N1K you have to work the kill (unless it's a perfect bounce). In an F4u 50% of the time it's all over after the first pass (= safer).



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Offline Kieren

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #49 on: March 28, 2000, 09:28:00 AM »
Duckwing-

Sift through my above posts and point to any reference of the F4U as uber.

I am not the 109 poster boy. I have only said that the F4U-1C is a serious threat in the arena, I see a lot of them, and for me it is the easiest plane to get kills in because of the limited time needed to keep guns on target.

I am in no way asking that it be removed or even limited. My point to stating what is obvious to many is that there are apparently some who do not feel the F4U-1C is the most lethal plane in the arena, that is only flown by little old cookie-baking women on their way to bible study. I believe there are some valid questions concerning the lethality of the Hispano cannons vs. the other guns- but this does not mean I take one side or the other.

The minute someone says "the lethality of the guns should be looked at" one of the 1C defenders will say "you need to do this to avoid HO's" or "a low hawg is a dead hawg". These statements are true enough, but they evade the root concern; the lethality of the guns should be looked at.

Offline bloom25

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« Reply #50 on: March 28, 2000, 01:22:00 PM »
When I fly the 1c, I will rarely fight any other plane except a bomber or another 1c under equal terms.  When I fly other planes like the 109g10 or c205, I will.  I don't know how others fly, but in my case I will spend several minutes getting the 1c up to around 20k before heading into a fight.  When I get there, I wait until I have a HUGE position advantage, and preferably 1 vs 1, before I make a bnz pass.  If I miss, or the enemy tries to get me to turn, I just regrab alt and try again.  My opinion is that this is how the p51, and f4u are generally flown.  In my experience unless the other player makes a huge mistake, or goes for the HO, under equal E terms, I'm usually dead.  When at a disadvantage, I either run, or if the opportunity presents itself (not often) try for a quick snapshot and then dive at full speed.  (I've had 4 people compress and auger this tour alone.   )  I think, in my case at least, I get more kills in the 1c versus other planes because of:
A. I'm more careful about E management.  B. The plane is pretty fast down low and can take a TON of damage.  C.  I try to avoid fights, except where I have an advantage.  D.  (Ok, I'll admit it.)  The GUNS!  Need I say more?  Give me one good shot at under 500 yds and your toast 99.99999% of the time.  E.  No one in their right mind will HO you.  (Funny thing is spits do it a lot for some reason???)

Like any other plane, it has it's strengths and weaknesses.  In the case of the 1c, however, its main strength is HUGE compared to other planes (guns).  Recently I've tried to fly a few other planes the same way that I fly the 1c.  I did pretty well.  (I keep breaking p51 wings off though.   )  Usually if I can get within 500 yds of an opponent's 6, I usually win, regardless of plane.  I really like the 109g10 now, and if I don't burn up all the ammo taking silly snapshots, I have a lot of fun flying it.  Unlike the f4u, if you get in trouble and have wep left, usually you can accelerate and climb away to safety.

When it comes to what types of planes I see in the arena most frequently, I'd have to say I see more spits than anything.  Next, I'd say it's a toss-up between n1ks and 109s.  After that, usually f4u's, p51s, and then p38s.  Rarely I see a 190, 205, or la5.  (Does anyone that isn't a knight fly a la5?)
I'm waiting eagerly to see what will happen when a plane similar to the f4u (Typhoon) is relased.  I also think that ground vehicles will also change arena dynamics somewhat.  I think that Typhoons and F4us will be seen primarally shooting a vehicles and vulching.  I also anticipate a drop in f4u-1c k/d to around 1.5 by the end of tour 3 as a result.
As far as my own k/d, it usually stays around 1.3.  In the f4u-1c it is over 2 to 1.  Besides the deaths in c47s and bombers, I can only attribute the difference to:  A. I don't up from vulched bases in f4us.  B.  I'm more cautious in f4us.  C.  GUNS!!!!!!!    YES, I ADMIT IT, THE GUNS ARE AWESOME.  (4 20mm with that much ammo will ALWAYS be awesome though.)  There is only one gun that has better leathality, and that is the 30mm in the 109.  Last night (convergence at 250) I landed 1 ping at 150 yds, using only 30mm, and was rewarded with a BIG explosion.    Ok, I've gone on long enough, time to shut up and fly.  
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Offline Pongo

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #51 on: March 28, 2000, 02:34:00 PM »
Kieren
I agree. The 1c has a very powerful and forgiving gun package. Is the Hispano Mk2 a little over modeled. Probably. But HT could have much better numbers than me on the guns.
RAM just asked about if the A8 and the 1c should not be more comparable in broadside in another thread. Pyro kinda mysticaly shut that down. From the numbers I have you would probably need a slide rule to tell the difference between a 4 * 20mm A8 and the 1c(except better ammo load for the 1c) I dont think its like that in the game.  On the other hand I often get the best of 1c in a HO with a 2 gun FW.
I would say that there is no comparison between the fire power of a 1c and a 3 * 20mm 109 in the game....a spit with 50cals is way more comparable in fire power to the gondola 109.


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CANNON

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« Reply #52 on: March 28, 2000, 03:47:00 PM »
  Torque is about as good as it gets in a 1c. I took a 190 up today and went after him a few times. I out turned him (he died), and held my own in the HO s. So much for the uber 1c nonsense.

Offline Minotaur

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #53 on: March 29, 2000, 02:30:00 AM »
BTW the 1C K/D is 2.01 and the 1D still hanging at a dismal .63.  

Uber?  

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[This message has been edited by Minotaur (edited 03-29-2000).]

Offline Minotaur

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And the Winner is? F4U-1C
« Reply #54 on: March 29, 2000, 02:37:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by weazel:

 The P-51D has 486 kills and has been killed 976 times against the F4U-1C.

 The Bf 109G-10 has 357 kills and has been killed 572 times against the F4U-1C.

 The Spitfire Mk IX has 1042 kills and has been killed 2055 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The B-17G has 96 kills and has been killed 501 times against the F4U-1C.

 The P-38L has 556 kills and has been killed 1119 times against the F4U-1C.

 The Spitfire Mk V has 663 kills and has been killed 1552 times against the F4U-1C.
 
<snip>

 The Bf 109G-6 has 120 kills and has been killed 175 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The Bf 109G-2 has 52 kills and has been killed 118 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The Bf 109F-4 has 44 kills and has been killed 83 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The B-26B has 180 kills and has been killed 716 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The F4U-1D has 36 kills and has been killed 122 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The C.205 has 235 kills and has been killed 462 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The Fw 190A-8 has 226 kills and has been killed 315 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The N1K2 has 461 kills and has been killed 980 times against the F4U-1C.
 
 The C-47A has 9 kills and has been killed 212 times against the F4U-1C.
 
<snip>

For the unbelievers, find another plane with this record.  All wins no losses...

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Mino
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[This message has been edited by Minotaur (edited 03-29-2000).]