Pongo - Equalized Numbers Discussion

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Toad you're the one that constantly personalises an issue that I've stressed over and over being a general one.

When I'm talking about bish, I'm talking about the bish that play during my time. You know that well, you're just trying to twist everything I say into something else. That doesn't work quite that way Toadie.

All FPS games I've played have had a built in limit that prevents a big imbalance in playernumbers.

Beyond that, on a scale of 1 to a 100 with 100 being a SERIOUS problem.. this problem in an online computer game charging $15 per month is a -5,376.

Where do you get that serious life-threatening problem all the time? Can't you fathom I'm talking about the gameplay? I know, it's another attempt of yours to twist my original text in effort to aggravate and flame me.

I'm very confident that if this situation I've been seeing continues a long time, something will be done about it. Simply because it kills the fun for the other half of the arena that aren't on the gangbanging side. Not good business.

Toad if you think fights can't be won on fair terms or countries overrun others on 1:1 odds, it's your own problem. MA doesn't need the dweeby gangbang mentality to have field takes and action - that is proved every time odds even up and the field takeovers stop being sole (insert gangbang country here) property.

After all, why tell US of your sorrow? WE can't do anything about it.

On the contrary. There are about 200 bishop players that could well do something about it. The world doesn't spin around your bellybytton Toad. Come to think of it, why do I even bother replying to you? You seem to have no clue whatsoever. My issues have nothing to do with you, yet you seem to take anything I say very personally. Go figure.

Originally posted by Toad: I am, of course, "a bit thick." After all, I'm a bish.

You see, not only you can take words out of context in order to make the other say reverse things.

[Toad]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Toad you're the one that constantly personalises an issue that I've stressed over and over being a general one.

Au contraire. I don't see this as personal at all.

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
When I'm talking about bish, I'm talking about the bish that play during my time.

Look at your first post in this thread. It's a generic slam against all Bish. No mention of timezones or specifics. Just "bish". Your other posts in other threads are essentially the same.

Now, explain how everyone reading the BBS should automatically know what you mean.

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Toadie.

Ah! The diminutives come out! Well, substitute whatever you have if rational thought is too much for you.  

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
All FPS games I've played have had a built in limit that prevents a big imbalance in playernumbers

Reallly? How did that work in the other 24/7 persistent flight sims you've played? What was the mechanism?

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Where do you get that serious life-threatening problem all the time? Can't you fathom I'm talking about the gameplay?

It's gotta be serious.. it's all you talk about it seems.

Really now.. repeat after me... "it's just a game".

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Simply because it kills the fun for the other half of the arena that aren't on the gangbanging side. Not good business.

Yeah, I've noticed that most nights it's dropped from about 495 two months ago down to 485 or so now.

I also noticed the huge clamor here on the board supporting your position. An uncountable horde.  

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Toad if you think fights can't be won on fair terms or countries overrun others on 1:1 odds, it's your own problem.

I don't have a problem. It's YOU that has a problem.

Fair fights, odds, etc. are immaterial to me. It is what it is. That's how a 24/7, persistent, unlimited log in/log out arena IS; it is what it is. I simply accept what IS and play the game.

I don't care how landgrabs are made. I don't think there is a "chivalrous" way to take a field. I don't think there is a "chivalrous" way to defend a field.

I don't think a "fair fight" is going to happen in an open arena with 500 players in it unless you are real lucky and find an empty sector for a moment. Even then one of the combatants will either have a "better" plane or more alt or more E or some advantage. That's just the way it is. The MA is NOT a dueling arena.

I seriously doubt anyone would dream that the odds will be exactly 1:1 when they enter a Main Arena, a furball or a base defense or base attack. Most are way more grounded in reality than that.

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
On the contrary. There are about 200 bishop players that could well do something about it.

Oh, there's probably somewhere in excess of 3000 players that could do something about it. If only they would see the light and play the way you want them to play.

Haven't I seen you somewhere before? Well, someone just like you then.

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
My issues have nothing to do with you, yet you seem to take anything I say very personally. Go figure.

No, again I tell you I have nothing personal against you. I DO have something impersonal against all folks who try to tell someone else to "play the game the way I say to play the game."

There's plenty of Supreme Leaders here that will tell you what plane to fly, how to fly it, what shots you should or should not take, how to engage, how not to engage, how to mount an attack, who to follow into battle, which mission you MUST join and, lately, how you should switch sides every 30 seconds to balance the sides. As if we all don't get enough of that cr*p in real life.

So, I assure you, it isn't personal at all.

 

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
You see, not only you can take words out of context in order to make the other say reverse things.

You've been slamming bish in every thread in this vein for a week or more. Basically every chance you get.

Are you saying that you've changed your opinon or saying that you didn't mean what you said?

Now: Again I offer.

I will pay your July subscription fee of $15 USD AFTER you call HiTech <(817) 251-1540> and discuss this problem with him. I think you will gain an incredible amount of insightful information with regards to the gameplay of AH if you do. HT is one smart dude in case you've never stopped and thought about it.

You may even provide him with information that will make him smarter.. who knows. You may give him an idea and you'll become famous. Perhaps they'll name a "Chivalry" arena after you or something.

AFTER you talk to him, post me a note in this thread. I'll call and confirm your call HT and then I will have them bill me for your July fee.

Can't beat a deal like that can you? Or are you afraid to talk to him?

[Killjoy2]

Lets remember, that this is an evolving game.

Toad, what worked 6 months ago was for a game with 250 in the arena.  They dynamics of 450 players vs 250 players are very much different.

The number mismatch might not be a problem that is that will go away.  I'm fed up and it is effecting my view of the game.  It is effecting many others.  

Lets discuss ideas and work for solution.

Toad, frankly I find your tone to be counter-porductive.  It is harsh, abrupt and rude.  If I find you in the arena, I'll shoot you down.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Well said Killjoy, I'll promise to do the same..

Reallly? How did that work in the other 24/7 persistent flight sims you've played? What was the mechanism?

I thought we were talking about FPS as in first person shooter games. There the server forces players to even up sides - joining the bigger side that has up to 40% advantage is simply not possible. Probably wouldn't work directly in AH though.

Look at your first post in this thread. It's a generic slam against all Bish. No mention of timezones or specifics. Just "bish". Your other posts in other threads are essentially the same.

I thought we had been doing this discussion earlier, actually your post was a continuation to an earlier one. I stated very clearly my stand on this issue. Either you have a short memory or a very selective one.



I'll disregard the rest of the post and just make a simple question to you:

Can you really see any reasonable justification for one country to have 2:1 advantage over the others on constant basis? [edit] Notice to Toad, only a certain timezone in question, arena fluctuation with time as previously proved does not affect single players nor does the countries in question stay the same in comparison to numbers with the change of timezones.[/edit]

I'm sorry but I just can't see any.

Despite your accusations Toad I'm not the one telling people how they should play the game. I'm just saying that in my opinnion the fun factor would generally speaking be higher if the other side wouldn't have a ridiculously large advantage over the rest.

I'm all for a reasonable difference in numbers, lets say 50% for example.. But when it goes near or past 100% and stays that way, I can't call it a competition anymore but a one-sided slaughter.

If you don't see arena balance as a problem and generally don't care about the numbers, why do you spend so much of your time making counterarguments to my posts, which do not seem to affect you in any way?

Oh and btw keep those $15 I don't need you to tell me what to do or not to do any more than I need you to pay for my subscription. I'm pretty sure HT monitors these discussions anyway and has already looked into the dilemma. As previously said, he has been thinking of restricting squad rotations to prevent constant fluctuation of numbers in the arena (which naturally are the main cause of the lack of balance also.)

[Toad]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
I thought we were talking about FPS as in first person shooter games. There the server forces players to even up sides - joining the bigger side that has up to 40% advantage is simply not possible. Probably wouldn't work directly in AH though.

Ah we agree! It wouldn't work.

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
I stated very clearly my stand on this issue. Either you have a short memory or a very selective one.

Well, one of us does. Should I go clip all your Bish diatribes and post 'em in one place so you can see how many are Euro time specific? :d

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Can you really see any reasonable justification for one country to have 2:1 advantage over the others on constant basis?

Justification? This isn't a question of justification. It is simply the way the game is designed.

It is what it is. I don't assign morality to it; it is.

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
If you don't see arena balance as a problem and generally don't care about the numbers, why do you spend so much of your time making counterarguments to my posts, which do not seem to affect you in any way?

To remind you that not everyone agrees with you of course!

BTW, nice "stacked" poll you put up there. Love the replies too, don't you?

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Oh and btw keep those $15 I don't need you to tell me what to do or not to do any more than I need you to pay for my subscription.

Refusing a free chance to describe your position directly to the one man who can immediately change the situation?

I thought so.  

In fact, I was SURE of it.


******


Killjoy... Please... Please.... mercy sir! MERCY! I have a wife and children! Don't shoot my pixel-plane down on the internet! Mercy!

Hey, I'm not hard to find. Or shoot down for that matter. Just ask when you log in, I'll tell you where to find me. I'm usually in a low furball somewhere either in a -51D, 205, yak or La-5. Bring our friends if you like and hit me 10 v 1. Afterwards, let me know if was good for you too!  I promise not to cry on CH1.

It is what it is.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Toad what makes you think I'd do anything you tell me to do? You were sure of my response just as I'm sure that you won't stop being bishop no matter how much I dare you to do it. Furthermore as we both know I alone won't make a difference (further making any direct contact futile.) I did however mention the arena balance as one of the reasons why I'm cutting off my subscription for the summer vacation.

I'm raising the discussion here in order to get people to notice the situation and discuss it on a creative basis, something your conservative mind seems to oppose.

Well, one of us does. Should I go clip all your Bish diatribes and post 'em in one place so you can see how many are Euro time specific? :d

Should I clip and post then all the instances I've clarified the fact over and over? I see no reason to repeat it during every single post I make on the subject.

Ah we agree! It wouldn't work.

Yes it wouldn't work mainly because of players like you. That's why I said directly - there has to be another means if you want to create a balance.

.

Justification? This isn't a question of justification. It is simply the way the game is designed.

The game was originally designed without profanity filters too, but as the players are human they tend to curse. A filter was created in response to the player related problem. Just as there should be a filter or a carrot that would prevent mass behaviour at its worst.

Now please Toad, as this subject doesn't concern you in any way, leave the people who want to discuss the problems of the game as they perceive them in peace. We all clearly found out your stand on the subject, it has been duly noted and filed

[pbirmingham]

Only an idiot thinks that there is any actual "character" that attaches to any of the three synthetic countries, especially given that people immigrate among them all the time.

[Toad]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Toad what makes you think I'd do anything you tell me to do?
I'm raising the discussion here in order to get people to notice the situation and discuss it on a creative basis, something your conservative mind seems to oppose.

I'm not telling you to do anything.

I'm offering you the opportunity to place a $15 call to HT in Grapevine, Texas at absolutely no charge to yourself. I offer this opportunity in the hopes that if you talk directly to the game designer he will be able to explain the situation to you in a way that you can understand. Additionally, there is also the hope that you may have an idea, as yet unposted here, that might be a workable way to achieve what you so clearly desire. I'm sure HT would listen.

But I am not suprised that you have no interest in talking directly to the game's designer, without telephone charge, when you can instead hurl invective at the Bish here to no avail.

I'm conservative, eh? The idea that everyone should be allowed to do what they choose to do (since THEY are paying their own bill) in AH is conservative?

The idea that players should conform to a standard of "equality" deemed appropriate by a minority is a "liberal" stance then?

 

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
The game was originally designed without profanity filters too, but as the players are human they tend to curse. A filter was created in response to the player related problem. Just as there should be a filter or a carrot that would prevent mass behaviour at its worst.

The difference being, of course, that a profanity filter is easy to program and has no effect whatsoever on gameplay in a persistent, 24/7, unlimited log on/log off Main Arena.

You have not, to date, proposed ANY solution that would work in ANY similar fashion. Nor has such a device ever been implemented in ANY persistent, 24/7, unlimited log on/log off Main Arena in AW, WB or FA.

But we all wait with baited breath. Surely you will reveal the solution to us? Since you won't be calling HT anyway.

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Now please Toad, as this subject doesn't concern you in any way, leave the people who want to discuss the problems of the game as they perceive them in peace. We all clearly found out your stand on the subject, it has been duly noted and filed

Doesn't concern me? I'm a player. Does it not concern all players?

So, anyway, this is a "liberal" approach to open debate?  

[MrRiplEy[H]]

No Toad the basic fact is that you are against any change. That's conservatism.

You meticulously deny any problem even though you well know that the situation is much worse for players who play during your sleeping time.

But I am not suprised that you have no interest in talking directly to the game's designer, without telephone charge, when you can instead hurl invective at the Bish here to no avail.

I'm not exactly sure what you're after with this, but let's consider the following:

a) You're daring me to do something like a little child and then calling me chicken when I won't do what you want me to do.

b) I don't know Hitech personally so I have no need to call him personally either.

c) Despite your promises there is no way you could make up the phone costs etc. for me as you don't know anything about me.

d) I will call Hitech if and when I want to, with the answer being I don't want to - e-mail is a much cheaper and effective means of communication when we talk about overseas connections.

e) I already sent an e-mail to HTC where I stated that I will reconsider reactivating my account if the balance situation stays the same when I return from my vacation. If there are many others who will do the same, it won't go unnoticed in HTC. If they don't care about it then it means I'm in the small minority with my opinnion and maybe this game is not suitable for me. That also leads to HT not getting my monthly subscription money.

I'm conservative, eh? The idea that everyone should be allowed to do what they choose to do (since THEY are paying their own bill) in AH is conservative?

I'm paying my AH bill and I'm not allowed to curse in the game. Just aswell HT could choose people are not allowed to do gameplay detrimental decisions like switch to a side which already has way too many players for any kind of balanced gameplay.

The thing you can't understand it seems is that up to a certain point being the underdog can be fun and challenging (be it the situation varies or is not severe in nation) and all sides can have a maximum fun of the game.

But when selfish players who only look at their own interests join the largest side in search of easy kills and protection of the group, they finally cause a situation where the remaining two countries can't effectively fight against the larger country anymore. That means vulch kills for the larger country and a hard time (and frustration in the long run) for the smaller ones.

This Toad is something you haven't realised or even tried to realise during all these dozens of messages we've been exchanging. Your stand is simply that just because you see no problem during your timezone there can't be a problem for anyone else either.

[Rude]

I know well why most bishs are against side balancing - they know they can't hold a candle to their enemy if the sides do balance. All the weak material gather there to hide in numbers.

Please....you post's are comical enough as is, now you're gonna start kidding yourself as well?

[sling322]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
they finally cause a situation where the remaining two countries can't effectively fight against the larger country anymore.

Oh please....stop already.  You are only making yourself more foolish one post at a time.

You "smaller" countries didnt have any problem last night pushing us back to our home island in the north and the south.  It seems to me that the methods for balancing are already in effect.  There is very little action on the knit-rook front.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Sling what exact time and what were the country numbers?

Bishops often justify their double numbers by nits and rooks joining forces against them.. That's just an illusion that is on all of the countries. Knights complain about bishrook alliance, rooks complain about bishknits, bish complain about knitrooks.. The truth is that most of the time (resets excluded) all countries hit eachothers. On some occasions though when balance has been 80:80:40 for example, the two larger countries have hit the smallest only in pursuit of a fast reset.

I saw this morning (9:30AM) that bish were on the virge of reset and the playerbase was just about even with 90'ish bish 80'ish knight and 90'ish rooks.

You're still saying that you know something about a time where you never have tried to play. It doesn't matter if two smaller countries ally if the largest has more players than the both combined! Not to mention there is never a 'full alliance' the three countries always fight eachoters more or less.

I just checked again about 10 hours later and the situation in the MA was still evened up!

I'd be really happy if the situation would stay this way.
I hope it's not just for the weekend so that the situation would remain, there is hope afterall.

[sling322]

This was last night after the TOD.  So it was around midnight central US time.

Dude, my schedule changes around some and I fly at a lot of different times of the day.  The only time I ever see it lopsided to the Bish is late afternoon early evening central US time.  Then the problem is rectified later when the 'good' rooks show up and start flying instead of crying.  You couple that with the alliance they have forged with the Leather Wearing knits and it becomes more difficult for us Bish to gangrape the arena like we do all the time every day for the last 3 years.

Just keep up the ridiculous diatribe....you will drive more and more people out of your country.  Or better yet, fire some of the 'little generals' and maybe your country would be more pleasant to fly for.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Sling how often do you fly 4-5 am your local time? Because that's probably when the things I speak of are occurring.

It's so ridiculous to see people accuse me I'm roadkillting, I've given numerous screenshots of the situation to prove it.

Right now the situation seems to be 96-95-89 and if it will remain that way, nobody will have anything to complain about.

Looks like there has been a definate change towards arena balance.

[Toad]

Ripley,

Before I answer you last addressed to me, and I will answer it, rest assured, I have a small request.

I see you registered on the BBS under this personna on 05-02-2002.

I believe you have been posting here much, much longer.

Would you please tell me what other name/names you have used while posting here and when you first started playing AH and using the BBS?

It would be nice to know who I'm really "talking" to, don't you think?

Thanks.

: And also, could you tell me the name you fly under in the arena now? And any name/names you've flown in the arena under before this latest one?

Thanks again!