Luftwaffe guncamera

[keyapaha]

i noticed on the one where the bf110 gets up close and personal on the b17 there were no guns shooting back on that one my guess was that they were dead or wounded.

  and those poor chaps on the b17 with both its wings on fire gotta hope every one got out ok on that one ok.

    yup the p47 one was quite interesting with the self seal fuel tanks.

    and the p38 one was good too  good wingsmanship assuming that is the wing man making a 3 o'clock attack while the other is diving in from a 5 o'clock kinda hard to tell but i think it is.

[eddiek]

One thing I noticed was the ruggedness of the buffs.  Only saw one AH-like catastrophic failure, the rest of the time the buffs took the gunfire and kept on flying.  Just another thing to think about when you attack an AH B-17 and it keeps on flying.  The dead 6 attacks I had seen before, or ones just like them.  What makes attacking buffs in AH so deadly is the all-guns-slaved-to-one-station feature.  You don't just face a pair of MG's, you face every gun that can fire at you.  That one feature makes all the difference in the world IMO.
Not to cause a flame, but those clips also kinda shoot the uber LW cannon myths to pieces, no pun intended.  The clips of the 110-G2 hanging in there and pouring fire into the B-17 and the old buff kept right on chugging along............ to Boeing designers!  That is one TOUGH plane!

[Daff]

"Did you guys notice how the P47s self-sealing fuel tanks worked? "

Nice idea, but not quite. The P-47's tanks was in the fuselage, not wings. That hit, it's most likely hydraulic oil and it goes out as the hydraulics system runs out.

Daff

Edited for faff's made after a 15 hour workday:)

[CMC Airboss]

Originally posted by Daff
The P-47's wing was in the fuselage, not wings.
Daff

I had to read that three times before I realized you meant the fuel tanks

MiG

[senna]

That P-47 shot was very strange in my mind. As I watched it again and again, could not help but to wonder what the FW pilot was doing or thinking. Why did he stall or lag so long. When he finally did hit the jug, why didnt he persist on. No ammo, low ammo? Was he drained from pulling Gs or did he have a problem with killing somebody that day? That jug could have rolled, split S or simply nosed down but instead he choose to turn turn turn. Then he did get hit but didnt maneuver. Did he live? The video stopped. Either he went down in a bad way after that or he went home limping, I'll never know.

[SFRT - Frenchy]

Did you noticed all thos wings ripped off by those 20mm shells?

[-ammo-]

thx for the video, I have alot of it on VHS but didn't have the P-47 clip.

THX!

[EvilDingo]

That was very good. I downloaded the mpg file.

About the 110g2 sitting on the back of the bomber, most of the gunners were probably dead or wounded. Did you notice him targetting the ball turret? No way anyone survived that. After that he goes for the engines. I wonder how many in those clips actually made it back, if any.

[Fester']

The link isnt working for me :/

[Duedel]

Isnt working for me either.

Could u plz plz fix it?

[fats]

Think it was the second last footage, Fw 190 vs. P-51, where the pursuer appears to spin out of control while trying to split-S or did he just lose the target and rolls kind of funny to reaccuire it?

How many pictures per second did the camera take and at which rate were those displayed?


// fats

[Tuborg]

Ooops, server was out of order for an hour or so. Should be runing again.

Btw, what realy is interesting, is the poor judgement of most of the pilots when it comes to estimate the correct distance. Almost everybody, including the aces, are far of the real figures. 2/3 of the film, which i didnt put on, shows a lot of dweebs fireing at up to 4k (12ooo yards). The big mantra of the Luftwaffe these days was (besides assembling in huge formation) get realy realy close to the Buffs, before opening up.

Another thing is, the 110G2 in the long shot propably belongs to the famous ZG76, which i believe was quite succesfull against the bombers spring 44 in the southern region (notice the alpes). But a few weeks later half of the group got killed when bounced by escortfighters, so the entire group was withdrawn out of action.
As far as i can see the 110G2 is fireing with 2 cannons, so i dont know where this AH arment setup  with 4x20mm and 2x30mm comes from. My guess is that this was only  used on the nightfighters.

Cheers

[Mitsu]

Wow, P-47 is very tuff.

[Wilbus]

Didn't read all posts, too many.

How ever, Swulfe, yes, gunners got hit easily (gunners hardly ever get hit in AH) in real life, they had no armor and was easy to get a AP shell through much of a B17's or B24's body.

But LW, specially Sturmbocks (190 A8/R8, had extra armor, not modelled in AH AFAIK, and the 30mm guns). They flew in in V formation after the B17, going the whole way from 1000 yards to 100-200 yards where they opened up. A formation of 9 Sturmbocks would wreck havoc (Allied fighters tock their toll when they arived) amongst the bombers without much loss to them selfs, possibly 1 or 2 190's shot down at the most during a normal attack on several hundred Buffs. Of course not all buffs were in range to shoot at them.

[Wilbus]

Just a thing after seeing teh film again, seen it before but... check the film where the LW attacks the formatins (you see more then just the B17 being attacked). You don't see any gunners firing their either, from any of the B17's. It could very well be that it's very hard to spot on a film like this, a small muzzle flash from a 50 cal is FAR harder to spot then a 20mm or 30mm explosion.