Author Topic: Should we remove "God" from this too?  (Read 497 times)

Offline Ozark

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« on: June 28, 2002, 04:04:00 PM »
In CONGRESS, July 4th, 1776.

The Unanimous Declaration of Independence of the thirteen united States of America.


When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the Powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

     We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, having its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Such has been the patient suffrance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

     He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

     He has forbidden his Governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, has utterly neglected to attend to them.

    He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

   He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their Public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

  He has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

  He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the Legislative Powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the meantime exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

  He has endeavored to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migration hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.

  He has obstructed the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary Powers.

  He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.

  He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance.

  He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures.

  He has affected to render the military independent of and superior to the Civil Power.

  He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their acts of pretended legislation.

  For quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:

  For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from Punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

  For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world:

  For imposing taxes on us without our Consent:

  For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:

  For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offenses:

  For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighboring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies:

  For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally, the Forms of our Governments:

  For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with Power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever:

  He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.

  He has plundered our seas, ravaged our Coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.

  He is at this time transporting large armies of foreign mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.

  He has constrained our fellow Citizen taken Captive on the high Seas to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands.

  He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavored to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.

  In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.

  Nor have We been wanting in attention to our British brethren. We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred to disavow these usurpations, which would inevitably interrupt our connection and correspondence. They too have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends.

  We, therefore, the Representatives of the United States of America, in General Congress, assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the name, and by authority of the good People of these Colonies, solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States; that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the State of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent States, they have full power to levy War, conclude Peace, contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent States may of right do. And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the Protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.

The Original Thirteen Colonies:
- Carolina (Later divided into North and South Carolina)
- Connecticut
- Delaware
- Georgia
- Maryland
- Massachusetts
- New Hampshire
- New Jersey
- New York
- Pennsylvania
- Rhode Island
- Virginia

Offline john9001

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2002, 04:14:52 PM »
if the 9th circuit court rules the Declaration of Independence is "unconstitutional" does that mean we are part of canada??

Offline Eagler

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2002, 04:18:12 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by john9001
if the 9th circuit court rules the Declaration of Independence is "unconstitutional" does that mean we are part of canada??


jeez a fate worse than death :)

Ozark
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Offline Skuzzy

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2002, 04:18:55 PM »
By all means, and while we are at it, the Bible should be removed from every hotel room in the country as someone just might open the drawer it is in and get upset, who is not of Christian beliefs.
Someone will surely bring this to court and we can't have that.

We should seek to remove anything from sight that could be construed as a religious ICON or remotely be of a religious origin.  This would prevent any court based religious arguments, thus keeping the government from ruling on any of these issues.

Hmmmm,...didn't South Park do that episode?  I guess those guys are smarter than I gave them credit for.
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Offline capt. apathy

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #4 on: June 28, 2002, 04:38:59 PM »
I propose that any rulings made by any court on the subject of religion (either banning or requiring anything, for any place or time on the subject of religion or lack there of) should be considered null and void.  As employee's/officers of the gov't the constitution forbids them from getting involved in matters of god.  As citizens they should be free to believe or disbelieve, and express these beliefs or not as they see fit.  But no officer of the gov't should be allowed to make rulings on issues concerning religion, as that would be a constitutional violation.

Offline Thrawn

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #5 on: June 28, 2002, 04:46:59 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Eagler


jeez a fate worse than death :)

Ozark



I'll say!! :D

Offline miko2d

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #6 on: June 28, 2002, 04:52:31 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Skuzzy
By all means, and while we are at it, the Bible should be removed from every hotel room in the country as someone just might open the drawer it is in and get upset, who is not of Christian beliefs.

 For your information, Constitution applies to the Federal Governmernt, not private individuals or companies.

 miko

Offline Kratzer

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #7 on: June 28, 2002, 05:11:12 PM »
And no, we shouldn't change a document that was written 200 years ago that doesn't actually affect our gov't.  You need to differentiate between historical documents and in-school christian mantras.

Offline Ozark

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #8 on: June 28, 2002, 05:16:25 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kratzer
And no, we shouldn't change a document that was written 200 years ago that doesn't actually affect our gov't.  You need to differentiate between historical documents and in-school christian mantras.


Doesn't actually affect our goverment?

That is the foundation of the United States of America.

Offline Sandman

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #9 on: June 28, 2002, 05:24:49 PM »
The Declaration of Independence doesn't carry any weight. As a legal document, it's worthless.
sand

Offline Kratzer

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #10 on: June 28, 2002, 05:26:54 PM »
Well, most people would argue that the Constitution is the foundation of the good ol' USA.

The Declaration is certainly an IMPORTANT document, and one that affected the hell out of our gov't 200 years ago, however, the words in that document (unlike the words in the Constitution) don't affect the running of our gov't today.

Why does everyone think that we SHOULD make kids say 'under God'?  Christianizing a political statement weakens the very ideas on which this country (and the Declaration) was based - namely freedom of belief.

Offline miko2d

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #11 on: June 28, 2002, 05:29:50 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Ozark
That is the foundation of the United States of America.

 It's a historical document of great sentimental value and can be viewed as "spiritual" foundation but it has no legal status - same as private writings of Founding Fathers however wise they were. Constitution, on the other hand is The Law of The Land.

 miko

Offline Ozark

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #12 on: June 28, 2002, 05:35:55 PM »
Well, Have a happy irrelevant, worthless legal document holiday. :)

OMG! It happened again! Holidays should be banned! Too holy. :eek:

Offline Kratzer

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #13 on: June 28, 2002, 05:37:59 PM »
Nice aggrandizement of what people said. :rolleyes:

Offline Fatty

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Should we remove "God" from this too?
« Reply #14 on: June 28, 2002, 05:41:10 PM »
I agree Ozark, changing historical documents and pledges is a crime.

Eisenhower's alteration of the pledge of allegiance should be struck and it should be returned to its former status.