Author Topic: I am not sure if I understand this correctly...  (Read 1166 times)

Offline FDutchmn

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2002, 06:05:03 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by J_A_B
EDIT:   Upon closer inspection, it appears the system will be completely configurable at the host.  


Indeed.  This I knew... depending on this configuration, the player will be given the option to control his/her stall characteristics... that is if I am understanding this corectly...

Quote
Originally posted by Fariz
It may be only for training arena, I guess,


maybe... it might well be HTC is going to place another arena with this option in it.  Perhaps like Relaxed Realism in Air Warrior.

so what is being planned?  the concept itself has been published already... kinda wanna know...

Offline cajun

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2002, 06:51:13 PM »
Relax, this feature won't make it "arcadish", in fact I think poeple using it will have a disadvantage, it will not let the plane do more, it will just keep you from pulling high G's so u don't stall, but can't do many manuvers you could with it turned off.

This will help beginners learn the game, but keep it balanced and make flying with out the limiter benifitial once you have learned to fly.

Offline FDutchmn

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #17 on: June 29, 2002, 07:02:41 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by cajun
This will help beginners learn the game, but keep it balanced and make flying with out the limiter benifitial once you have learned to fly.


how is this?  So far, what we heard is not comparable to what is said of the combat trim.  On combat trim, the reaction speed is purposely made slower so that the optimum can be achieved faster controlling manually.

I am trying to whine by me self for the sake of whining.  The concept was published, can't I ask about it?  Can't somebody clarify further without me being told to shut up?

Offline J_A_B

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #18 on: June 29, 2002, 08:05:49 PM »
"A stall limiter might just convince me that AH is about arcade fun and not about complex difficulty "

If--IF-- it works like we suspect, and just prevents you from pulling the plane far enough to stall, how does that change anything at all for you?  It'd still be better to fly the "hard way", and by using the system new guys would have one less thing to worry about till they got comfortable with flying.

Also, since it appears this will disableable on the host side, perhaps they're intending it for the TA and H2H or something.

We'll just have to wait and see.  Or, as you might say--relax, it's just a game  :)   .

J_A_B

Offline fullback

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #19 on: June 29, 2002, 08:25:11 PM »
Maybe the only accurate answer is that we don't yet know how or where it will be implemented?

I do think the business model of AH is just as important as flight modeling. Imagine a challenging golf course with only championship tees. The course may be great for low-handicappers, but would soon be bankrupt.

I would consider AH flight modeling and game play to be championship level tees compared to other on-line flight sims. The market size for those of us who appreciate as close to realistic as possible flight modeling (on a 2D screeen) is pretty small.

Ignoring the arcade market is financially foolish. If stall limiter is a relaxed-type flight mode, then income generated from an "arcade arena" would only help to support continued game development. And that helps us all.

Maybe, tabun, perhaps...

fullback

Offline X2Lee

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #20 on: June 29, 2002, 08:30:33 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by J_A_B
"A stall limiter might just convince me that AH is about arcade fun and not about complex difficulty "



We'll just have to wait and see.  Or, as you might say--relax, it's just a game  :)   .

J_A_B


Yes the game is not about difficulty, especialy complex difficulty. Its a game. Its very very gamey. Just give it a think. 2 Planes collide, one flies away. Next version you will be controling 3 bombers from one seat. Take offs and landings are childsplay. Great GAME, but its about fun, not realism.   :D

Offline Saintaw

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #21 on: June 29, 2002, 08:30:48 PM »
..
(should not post things like that that late)
« Last Edit: June 30, 2002, 03:46:40 AM by Saintaw »
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Offline Tumor

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« Reply #22 on: June 29, 2002, 09:37:22 PM »
PERK THE STALL LIMITER!!
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Offline EvilDingo

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« Reply #23 on: June 29, 2002, 10:15:08 PM »
Wouldn't an 'arcade' arena take from the main arena's population? I'd hate to see the main go from 400+ a night to 30-40 a night (just speculation). I like the main's population and would never fly an arena considered arcade -- which is the primary reason I'm not playing Fighter Ace right now.

What doesn't bother me is an AoA limiter. That just seems like a disadvantage for the person using it.

Anyway, like others have mentioned, it's premature to be worrying about it now.

Offline 4343

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stall limiter
« Reply #24 on: June 29, 2002, 11:28:53 PM »
i agree with those of you supporting the stall limiter because, supposing that the planes with the limiter on will turn slower than those able to stall a bit, this makes it less frustrating to learn to fly.  although really, who will use this and how is it implemented?  
if it is used by inexperienced pilots who just need "training wheels" to fight the frustration and overall "danger" of stalling, there shouldn't be a problem. however, if implemented in the wrong way (i.e. making aces high an "arcade game") there could be real problems.  perhaps this system should only be available to those being actively trained by a normal member (well, none of us are normal...but you get the idea :-D).i would also suggest a time-controlled set of training wheels as the deciding factor in this.  say for example that after 50 flight hours or three weeks of play the system is automatically shut off, or that after the training system itself is used for a set amount of hours it shuts off.  of course, a few will still go around by creating new accounts and playing for two free weeks before changing again to another two free weeks, or whatever the case (i assume u all understand what i mean), but the truth is that this would be A REAL PAIN IN THE ARSE to do, what with the changing of the id's and such, and only the most determined idiots would continue this behavior for any length of time, during which the uninhibited pilots would be waxing them to the nth degree, and that is if and only if the system works as it sounds like it will.if it doesn't and AH ends up like so many other flight sims, a victim of it's own advancement, then we'll all end up in some other flight sim, donig this same spiel over, and over, and over....

Offline cajun

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2002, 12:57:22 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by FDutchmn


how is this?  So far, what we heard is not comparable to what is said of the combat trim.  On combat trim, the reaction speed is purposely made slower so that the optimum can be achieved faster controlling manually.

I am trying to whine by me self for the sake of whining.  The concept was published, can't I ask about it?  Can't somebody clarify further without me being told to shut up?


FDutchmn, I never said anything negative, or to shut up,
All I'm saying that your manuverability will be greatly decreced with aoa, where if you chose to turn it off you can push it to the limit, giving you a much greater advantage in manuverability if you are a decent pilot.

Offline FDutchmn

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2002, 04:16:00 AM »
Sorry, I should have taken it more lightly but I did not understand the tone that some people started to take my question as a whine to begin with.  Yes, it can lead to a whine in the end but it is even too early to judge if it even worth a whine.  I think this should be clarified further whatever the case.  If let's say, I rope a guy and find out he doesn't stall, without accurate knowledge of this feature, I might accidentally go around accusing the guy unjustly.  What I saw here was some people started to downplay this concern by labelling my question as a whine.  For this reason, I would rather have this question answered more accurately than just speculation, otherwise we are playing with speculation with another speculation.  Again, especially to cajun, excuse me to have taken your comment sensitively.

Now then, it seems from the comments now, this stall limiter is not quite I as first envisioned.  The "stall limiter" that was "there" in Air Warrior Relax Realism was the type that automatically adjusts your joystick input which will leave your plane at the maximum AoA allowable for the speed that you are flying.  So even if you pull your stick all the way, you will not stall.   I left Relax Realism for Full Realism because after playing to two months in Relax Realism, I found that it was like yank and bank all the time and nothing much else.

However, it seems that this feature on AH limits the AoA "pullable" well below the maximum allowable AoA before stall.  If this is the case then it is of no concern, as manuverability is greatly reduced while this feature is enabled.  I hope that this is the case, and  not the stall limiter that we saw on AW.

Offline Flossy

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #27 on: June 30, 2002, 04:16:27 AM »
If this is what I think, it won't need a separate arena, but will help those who are used to flying RR in other sims while they get used to FR.  I don't think it will give them any advantage at all other than helping to prevent them getting into spins, and the rest of us who don't use it won't be affected either - except we may get more kills!  :D  I'm no fighter pilot, but I believe "riding the stall" is a tactic often used, which won't be possible if using the stall limiter, putting anyone using it at a distinct disadvantage.  I really don't think there is anything to worry about, and am sure similar was said when Combat Trim was introduced - which I do use!  :D
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Offline Lizard3

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #28 on: June 30, 2002, 05:19:01 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Fariz
no need to start prewhine now :)


Hehe, no whine here, maybe just ...the crushing of the grapes:D

Offline moot

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I am not sure if I understand this correctly...
« Reply #29 on: June 30, 2002, 05:58:50 AM »
Is this not like F1 traction control; people criticised it was cheating, but it only helped the pilot limit slipping, not create traction?
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