Author Topic: A-20G missing a gun? (Read 1656 times)

Charon · « **Reply #45 on:** November 05, 2002, 06:37:51 PM »

Here's the upper twin .30 mount on the A-20C. You can see the extra armor "face plate" on this mount and on the ventral MG as well. You don't see it in AH or in other external photographs, so maybe it was a good idea in theory but a disadvantage in the field.

Charon · « **Reply #46 on:** November 05, 2002, 06:39:02 PM »

The A20A cockpit

Charon · « **Reply #47 on:** November 05, 2002, 06:39:43 PM »

The A20G Cockpit

Zanth · « **Reply #48 on:** December 12, 2003, 02:10:52 PM »

If they had delivered the a20 for play in AH they would ALWAYS have had the gun. AHII is a chance to do it right. Make it as factory made not as sometimes field modified

Zanth · « **Reply #49 on:** December 12, 2003, 02:16:31 PM »

http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=1060322#post1060322

Bodhi · « **Reply #50 on:** December 13, 2003, 06:16:06 PM »

I took the time to look through our manuals on the A20G series, and could find no mention of the ventral gun in either the IPM or the Erection and Maintenance manual. My bet is, like previously stated, it is a field or theatre added item.

United · « **Reply #51 on:** December 15, 2003, 09:07:25 AM »

The first block of A-20G's were completed with four 20mm cannons in the nose. The cannons were prone to jamming and had a relatively slow rate of fire, so beginning with the 251st aircraft, the nose armament was changed to six .50-cal. machine guns. Four of these guns were mounted in the nose in the same position as the cannons on the A-20G-1. Two additional .50-cal. machine guns were added in a fixed position in the lower forward fuselage in the same location as on the A-20A, -B & -C models. The aft armament stayed the same -- a flexible twin .50-cal. machine gun in the dorsal position and a single flexible .30-cal. machine gun in a ventral tunnel position (some aircraft had .50-cal. ventral guns).

Taken from http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/research/attack/a3/a3-10.htm

Not sure if you can see it, but there is what looks like a gun barrel pointing out of the bottom of the plane, right under the U.S. insignia. Not sure what it is, but It could be a Machine Gun.

Zanth · « **Reply #52 on:** December 15, 2003, 09:07:35 AM »

http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/research/attack/a3/a3-10.htm

best online reference I could find was The USAF Museum, and I would have to think they have pretty good sources:

"The first block of A-20G's were completed with four 20mm cannons in the nose. The cannons were prone to jamming and had a relatively slow rate of fire, so beginning with the 251st aircraft, the nose armament was changed to six .50-cal. machine guns. Four of these guns were mounted in the nose in the same position as the cannons on the A-20G-1. Two additional .50-cal. machine guns were added in a fixed position in the lower forward fuselage in the same location as on the A-20A, -B & -C models. The aft armament stayed the same -- a flexible twin .50-cal. machine gun in the dorsal position and a single flexible .30-cal. machine gun in a ventral tunnel position (some aircraft had .50-cal. ventral guns).

Douglas built 500 aircraft in three blocks with this basic armament configuration: 50 A-20G-5; 300 A-20G-10 & 150 A-20G-15's. The block 10 & 15 -G models incorporated various changes and improvements based in part on feedback from the operational squadrons using the A-20G in combat. Some changes incorporated included additional and improved armor plating, larger engine air filters for hot weather operation and heaters for cold weather operation."

OT: Also note that there were about as many Havocs in the war made with 4x20mm as there were La7s with the 3 cannon loadout (hint hint)

Bodhi · « **Reply #53 on:** December 15, 2003, 10:06:00 AM »

United,

I agree that it was probably there at some point, but what perplexes me about the whole thing is that if it were a "standard" production feature, then there should be mention of it in the IPB, as being a gun mount location, formers and other structure are likely to be subject to high stress and break, thus needing spares. Then, to not see it in the Erection and Maintenance manual is even stranger too, as that alone should have inspection procedures tbf for that area and periodic maintenace for the pos too. Who knows, Until a good pic is found, not much chance it will be added IMHO.

Innominate · « **Reply #54 on:** December 15, 2003, 01:14:13 PM »

Used to be farther up in the thread, but the link got changed.

Got it from the people at http://trfn.clpgh.org/ah/a20.html

Urchin · « **Reply #55 on:** December 15, 2003, 05:28:28 PM »

Punt. Innom, that is an awesome picture, and probably just what Pyro needs to model the ventral gun. I believe he said he didn't model it because he didn't have any idea what it looked like. That is a great picture of it. You might want to email it to him, it'll probably get into AH2.

scJazz · « **Reply #56 on:** December 16, 2003, 06:58:33 PM »

BTW at this point I'd say that enough people have shown enough evidence that even IF and I'm sayin IF the A-20G and BOS III didn't come off the production line with a rear gun there is more than enough evidence to say it wuz widespread. Now there is plenty of art to go with it.

Innominate · « **Reply #57 on:** December 16, 2003, 07:18:01 PM »

But still the fundamental problem that we have no idea what the interior of the A-20 looked like.

Urchin · « **Reply #58 on:** December 16, 2003, 08:08:04 PM »

Got a good enough idea, I would think. Got the one picture showing from the handle of the gun looking out, and the other one showing from the barrel looking in. Should be enough, in my opinion.

ra · « **Reply #59 on:** December 16, 2003, 08:25:26 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Innominate
But still the fundamental problem that we have no idea what the interior of the A-20 looked like.

Knowing the interior is not really important. Look at the B-26 interior, there's not much detail. What we would need to know are the swivel limits of the gun.

ra