Author Topic: Subjective Armor model.......Just what is this? (Read 780 times)

brady · « **on:** August 08, 2002, 02:04:25 AM »

I have seen the term Subjective armor model thrown around a bit and I got to woundering. Is it kinda like if I piss and moan at length about how the armor model in AH neads some revamping that eventualy the walls will fall at HTC and we will see a new one?

I mean if you shoot at it long enough, it is regesterd and tallyed and added to other's hit's from other players and then well the program say's the rear armor panel has had enough and just fails? Even though it is physicaly imposable for this to hapen?

Is this how MG 34, 303, and other rifle caliber guns get kill's damage or otherwise. Even on Virgine tanks I can get damage from rifle caliber weapons if I fire long enough.

Is this why 50cal rounds fired from outside the penatration envelope get damage and kill's?

And what about damage from low velocity 20 and 30mm ammo that had no chance of killing a tank.

Hortlund · « **Reply #1 on:** August 08, 2002, 02:26:35 AM »

And what about aircraft MG's being able to rubble stone buildings...

And what about PzIVH's being able to hit and kill other PzIVHs at ranges above 3 000 yards...

Toad · « **Reply #2 on:** August 08, 2002, 08:09:09 AM »

817-251-1540

Ask for Dale.

Cut to the chase. No one on the board can answer your many questions about GV's with absolute certainty. Might as well go to the source.

I'm sure all of your questions will be either answered or at least addressed.

Mickey1992 · « **Reply #3 on:** August 08, 2002, 08:43:27 AM »

YEA!!!! It's another Brady thread about ground vehicle armor!!

Hortlund · « **Reply #4 on:** August 08, 2002, 08:47:21 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Toad
817-251-1540

Ask for Dale.

Cut to the chase. No one on the board can answer your many questions about GV's with absolute certainty. Might as well go to the source.

I'm sure all of your questions will be either answered or at least addressed.

I sent an email to the Q&A forum about the gv/objects damage model. So now I'm hitting the refresh-button every 5 mins to see if there has been a reply. (I figured this would be the perfect question for the Q&A forum)

Wotan · « **Reply #5 on:** August 08, 2002, 09:03:06 AM »

hey mickey dont read it.

His isnt the only one thats interested in this issue.

brady · « **Reply #6 on:** August 08, 2002, 07:18:39 PM »

I know HTC reads these forums, I know HTC are very reasionalbe and Geniunely nice folk's. I have had the pleashure of talking to them in the past ( on busisness, being on the CT staff required me to call them on ocasition), this to is busisness in a sence, but it is a comunitys reaction to a problem like this that is as much a game play issue as it is a matter of physics that will help decide I think what HTC will do about it.

HTC has always been very good and open minded about adreasing failings or problems in their models, as few and far between as they are, they are not above it, that is one of the best things about this sim. One feals that his points are heard and given the proper amount of attention.

Toad · « **Reply #7 on:** August 08, 2002, 07:28:44 PM »

You are asking direct, specific questions; at least that's what it looks like to me.

The only people that know the correct answers work at HTC. You can wait around in this thread or one of the others for them to answer you or you can just pick up the phone.

I'm sure they'll be happy to chat with you about it, shouldn't take that long.

Then you can come back in this thread and tell us what they said.

Seems the fastest way to get the correct answers to me. I'm for fast, correct answers.

Why wonder when a quick call gives you the truth?

Yeager · « **Reply #8 on:** August 08, 2002, 10:42:44 PM »

I used to worry about this stuff brady. Just relax and accept the fact that this is a game. A very good one -and accept with resignation whatever is thrown at you because odds are, with all the intrinsic variables in play online, you will see disimilar results under similar circumstances as the norm.

Just relax and have fun.

PS: If you cannot have fun (quite a few round these parts insist on not having fun regardless of the circumstances), for whatever reason, then thats cool too.

Re: Examples -
I remember getting six direct hits on a M3 with the Hurrc 40mm cannon with no results (this happened several times concurrent). The M3 then procceeded to relieve me of my tail empennage with the single pintle 50 on the M3.

Another time I was an LVT4 at the spawn point of NMY PTs and I landed three good 75mm Howitzer hits under 100 yrds with no results only to have the PT finally disembowel me.
So many other bummers I cant recall.

Was it my connect? The NMY connect, the server bandwidth choking, bad code in the game? bad karma for killing all those kitties....dunno.

I just caved in and decided to have fun. I think thats the main thrust of the idea anyway..........

brady · « **Reply #9 on:** August 09, 2002, 01:35:19 AM »

Yeager I do have fun and ty for your concern.

I howeaver, and I am not the only one who thinks that the armor model is outa wack, and I hope that through threads like this one we can acheave some sort of remidy for the problem, thats why people post on preformance problems with the planes, guns, ect, to adress issues that are outa wack, HTC has a history of adressing problems like this and I hope that eveuntaily it will be fixed.

Hortlund · « **Reply #10 on:** August 09, 2002, 03:41:02 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Toad
The only people that know the correct answers work at HTC. You can wait around in this thread or one of the others for them to answer you or you can just pick up the phone.

I'm sure they'll be happy to chat with you about it, shouldn't take that long.

I'm pretty sure they have alot of stuff to do every day at the office, and the last thing they need is a phonecall from Sweden with me asking all sorts of questions about the current damage model.

Better to mail the questions to the Q&A forum...no? (thats what I did anyway)

brady · « **Reply #11 on:** August 09, 2002, 03:58:24 AM »

Yes Hortland I am happy you did that, I look forward to seing what becomes of it:)

Toad · « **Reply #12 on:** August 09, 2002, 09:01:43 AM »

Actually, Hortlund, I'm pretty sure they'd love a break in their day provided by a phone call from Sweden. They sure seemed to enjoy chatting with the customers during the 4 days of the Con.

Has to be reassuring to know the game has that kind of reach.

So, Brady.... correct me if I'm wrong... you're less interested in getting the CORRECT answers to the direct questions that you've posted in these multiple GV threads than you are in simply attracting attention to what you perceive to be a problem?

Rude · « **Reply #13 on:** August 09, 2002, 09:06:04 AM »

I just called HT and he hung up on me...said he couldn't waste the phone line as he was anxiously awaiting brady's call.

Who would figure?

Ghosth · « **Reply #14 on:** August 09, 2002, 09:12:08 AM »

ACtually the armour model did come up in conversation at the con. Was looked at and adjusted some 3 releases back If I remember the conversation correctly.

However I did not hear anyone talk about subjective armour. What I did hear was that armour is a LOT thicker in some places.

What you got hit with and where makes a huge difference. After thinking about this I relealised that HT was right. That I've taken several hits from front/forward low in panzer np. But 1 good hit on top tends to take it out of play.

As to bomb blast effect HT had a few words there also. Reminding me that the bomb is actually below ground level when it goes off. Energy would go up at a 45 degree angle. Makeing it possible for a moving tank to show as being in bomb blast area when you look back, and still be alive and have taken no damage.

Trust the game guys, HT knows what he's doing,he's got almost all of this stuff figured out WAY in advance.