Author Topic: Other Flight Sims? Compared to AH? (Read 680 times)

rv6 · « **on:** November 20, 2002, 05:41:27 AM »

Hi all..

In my book AH is the best. (long story short,, I need not preach to the choir about great graphics, flight models, massive multiplayer coolness, etc)

But, can someone give a comparison to a good #2 & #3 WWII sim?

I actually got bored one day, and loaded the MS incarnation called "Fighter Ace".. It was cartoonish and generally sucked. I wouldn't play it online for Free!

Never tried newly released CFS-3, but read MANY BBS comments that it is a stinker. (even from some die-hard MSCFS fans!)

I've never seen IL2,, but heard a lot of good things about it, and it's online community. Visited their website and it kinda' reminded me of the MS CFS2 Online site (again, not close to AH)

Can someone in "the know" give a short comparison to AH for IL2?, CFS3? etc..

Rv6

Pepe · « **Reply #1 on:** November 20, 2002, 06:08:49 AM »

For me AH is best....nowadays.

Il-2 close second

Rest...Falcon 4.0, but I really enjoy WW2 airwar.

Yesterday, I log into Il-2 online (Hyperlobby) for the first time. It is a wonderful sim. It is not comparable to AH since its't not MMOG, and this is, by far, the most important thing for me. Nothing replaces the thrill (perkwise) of seeing a bunch of lemmings comming to your position (j/k)

If I want to compare apples to apples, AH in H2H mode and Il-2 online, Il-2 wins hands down due to incredibly good graphics with reasonable powerful hardware to move them (I ride an Athlon 900 Mhz. with Ati 8500, 512 Mb RAM) and comparable flight models.

Cheers,

Revvin · « **Reply #2 on:** November 20, 2002, 06:25:38 AM »

There is nothing to compare to AH right now in the MMOG stakes. Offline though I'd have to say go buy yourself a copy of IL-2. I recently bought CFS III and while it has many nice points I still find myself going back to IL-2 for a smooth running well put together sim. CFS III does'nt feel optimised, both CFS III and IL-2 have some superb eye candy but CFS III stutters and farts as you fly around on my modestly spec'd system (AMD 1.2GHz 266FSB, 512MB and Geforce 3 64MB video card) where are IL-2 with all it's graphical splendour runs smoothly. I did'nt like CFS III at all when I bought it and considered taking it straight back but it has grown on me and the dynamic campaign looks very interesting.

Multiplay in both are leagues apart. I've tried playing in CFS III but the lack realistic stalls and the ridiculous non WWII planes they put in P55?!?!? mean that you log on to find some muppet ruining a good dogfight by zipping in and out in his jet, on top of that there is the stupid inflight AWACS which is a real turn off. By contrast IL-2 is very enjoyable multiplayer if you wish to have a quick dogfight. Admitedley Ubisoft's onlien gaming system does'nt compare well with MS's built in system that runs very well but you can download a free online game finding program called Hyperlobby which the majority of the community use to set up and play online. Once in a game it's smooth and problem free.

If I had to recommend one of them to you I'd have to recommend you get IL-2 and then download the latest patches. CFS III is good but there are too many niggling problems to be able to recommend it over the likes of IL-2.

Purzel · « **Reply #3 on:** November 20, 2002, 07:29:55 AM »

What my 2 pre-writers said.

What I like about Il-2 the most is the damag-model and the flight-dynamics.

The gfx are better, but Il-2 doesnt have the problems that come with MMP. So you cannot compare that.

The other 2 attributes I mentioned are not in this class.

It was theoretically possible to take the same models for AH. If HTC or their customers wanted todo so is, err, questionable.

This is not for the FM. This seems to be very good and seemingly better than AH's.

But the DM is not as dichitomically as AH's. This means that you have to hit plenty with guns and cannons to bring someone down. I cannot say this is closer to RL, but it is the direction RL goes apparently. I believe to have often read that AH's DM is too strong. Meaning the Cannons hit too hard. 5 .50 hits rip off a wing quite often. I know it is possible for this to happen, but VERY unlikely.

But if you are trying to look somewhere else, and if it can be a SP or MP-Game with little playerbase, take a look at Il-2. In this genre most probably the best out there today. By far.

OK, have fun then!

AvidMC · « **Reply #4 on:** November 20, 2002, 07:47:25 AM »

Speaking of CFSIII does it seam to anyone else like the force feedback is backwards?? Seams like when I should be getting back presure I am getting forward pressure. It also seems like I am getting random jerks here and there for no reason.

Avid

Mark Luper · « **Reply #5 on:** November 20, 2002, 08:03:26 AM »

The title of your post said other sims, not necessarily combat air sims so I will tell you what I like for grins and giggles when not playing AH.

I like MS FlightSimulator 2002. I own the pro version and find hours of enjoyment flying "realisticaly". In other words, having full control of the engine management and flying VORs and NDBs to get somewhere. There are also thousands of aircraft available for download and you can enhance your experience flying just about anything. The FM is totaly dependent on who designed it. If you don't care for a particular one you can edit it to suit your taste. Most of the good ones are really good, a lot are mediocre and some are just downright fantasy. It also comes with (the pro version) a program that would allow you to design and build your own plane. It also has a virtual cockpit mode that feels very much like flying AH.

The other sim I like a lot and spend a lot of time in is Motor City Online. A car sim. Physics of driving are pretty good though the damage model is a bit arcadish. It allows you to build up a car using all kinds of parts. Engine parts are numerous as are the the parts to make up the car. You have to earn money to buy these parts with and you do that by racing your favorite rod. The time frame for these cars is 1932 to 1973 with a large selection in between. More info can be had at http://motorcityonline.com .

As far as WWII flight sims are concerened though, AH pretty much fills the bill for me.

aztec · « **Reply #6 on:** November 20, 2002, 08:31:08 AM »

Have been thinking about buying IL-2 for awhile now . How is off line play with it, ie: are there campaigns and such that would make it worth the purchase strictly as an offline pursuit?

phaetn · « **Reply #7 on:** November 20, 2002, 08:57:03 AM »

Indeed, there are, Aztec. But if I were you, I'd wait until February when Forgotten Battles will be released. It's now going to be a stand-alone product (not just an expansion) with 2 CDs. You'll get all the value of the original, plus all the new stuff (including front lines, better campaign, etc.).

If you've waited this long, hang tight for a few more months.

Cheers,
phaetn

muckmaw · « **Reply #8 on:** November 20, 2002, 08:59:11 AM »

According to many people who inhabit this board, AH is NOT A WWII SIMULATION. It's not even a simulation. It's an Air Combat GAME using WWII Era Aircraft.

Please note, these are not my words, but the more I read this board, the more exasperated I get.

If and when a true WWII simulation comes along that has the playability of AH, I'm gone. Hopefully, AH will live up to what WWIIOL failed to achieve, but rest assured, from what I've read here, there are many who would not be happy. Will the Mission Arena be the savior? According to some it will be nothing more than a glorified CT.

I certainly hope that's not the case, but we'll have to wait and see.

Wlfgng · « **Reply #9 on:** November 20, 2002, 09:11:19 AM »

sim, game, whatever ... I don't really care to recreate every bit of history.

IL2 rocks.. plain and simple. It is NOT mmog though and that's the big thing for most of us that prefer RL opponents to computer opponents.

In the end, the thing that makes this game/sim fun for me is competition. Competition with other RL people.

so what if this is a game or sim or whatever.. I am still competing, cooperating and interacting with real people from all over the world. That's what counts to me.

Kweassa · « **Reply #10 on:** November 20, 2002, 10:10:28 AM »

IL-2 is a game that deserves it's place as a classic of flight-sim games, a milestone of advancement in quality of flight sim games, and the best WWII flight sim game ever.

There are a few noticeable glitches: some aspects of the FM are weird, wild or exaggerated compared to AH.. and the IL-2 community is.. well.. I'm sorry to say generally full of dorks(since IL-2 was an unexpected success that drew a lot of attention from people that haven't been interested in flight sim games before, the topics and attitudes in IL-2 boards are just plain silly most of the times. While it's understandable, it's still boring...)

However, gunnery, while it is a bit excessively increased in difficulty due to wacky trim functions and super sensitivity towards stick configurations... as a whole, is the best I've seen. "Get in close, than get closer" is a word which really has some meaning in that sim.

The damage model is simular to AH, or any other kind of air combat sim for that matter... but the damage levels are gradual, and it is visually represented. Another important thing is IL-2 models the difference in the quality of the rounds fired hitting the target. A grazed hit and a direct hit differs greatly in the level of damage they do, and this goes for all the weapons, including 20mms and 30mms. While sometimes this method brings out quirky results(like 30mms doing almost no damage from time to time..), generally it is more convincing than the AH model.

The FM is also excellent. The planes handle very simularly as in AH, but however, my impression is that the E-loss is a bit high in maneuvering. Thus, planes with better engines and better turn capabilities tend to have a noticeable edge over planes that mainly engage in a cautious, E-wise manner. (The blasted Yaks and La-5FNs..) One problem is the high-alt FM is haywire, and the producers admitted it.

...

All in all, it is a must for people who enjoy WWII air combat games.

OIO · « **Reply #11 on:** November 20, 2002, 10:37:22 AM »

IMO..

Fighter Ace . Its pure arcade.

MSCFS. Same crapola as Fighter Ace, just prettier pictures.

IL-2 . Perhaps the one sim that rivals AH. I find many things in it that are...odd. One thing I will give IL-2 is that it gives a much more "feel" that you're really flying. Maybe AH could get this effect if they added head movement to follow the plane's movements (aka, you bank to one side you view of the cockpit tilts to the other side, pull up and your view slides downwards a bit.) I dont like their FM nor their gunnery model though. Damage model here is superior to AH.

WW2OL. If you like to open your canopy, it rules. Aside from that, its 1000X more arcade FM than the MS products first listed. Like IL-2, this sim does have more of a "feel" of flight, even though its arcadish to heck.

Red Baron: Its a classic. If you dont have it, you shouldnt be allowed to post here. You dweeb.

Jane's . Excellent for non-online playing. Very detailed in micromanagement of radar (F-15E, Longbow series), usually good graphics for their times. Downside is no replay value and even worse limited MP abilities. Its like flipping over the same porn mag issue for over a year. Ask St.Santa for more on this.

Warbirds/Air Warrior . They were great.. until AH came along. Nothing to see here, move along, show's over.. AH's daddy now.

Revvin · « **Reply #12 on:** November 20, 2002, 10:59:28 AM »

Nice to see another sim being discussed without turning into a flame

muckmaw · « **Reply #13 on:** November 20, 2002, 11:30:57 AM »

Would you be so kind as to elaborate on WWIIOL.

I'm tempted to try it, but I've never heard good things about it. I'm wondering if they have th bugs worked out, yet.

Sixpence · « **Reply #14 on:** November 20, 2002, 11:38:55 AM »

I used to fly "fighter ace", but the new version stunk, so I tried AH. It was very hard to get used to the flight model, but once I got used to it there was no comparing the two. AH is the best hands down. The rest of the squad from fighter ace stayed there because the flight model was to hard for them.