Author Topic: Airline Pilots To Be Armed  (Read 1205 times)

Offline Borg

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« on: November 25, 2002, 10:29:18 AM »
:p

With the signing of the HomeLand Security Bill today, we are finally getting the requirement for all passenger airlines to allow their pilots to be armed on a voluntary basis.

This is a prime example of what can be accomplished by a dedicated grass-roots efforts of determined citizens.  I doubt whether this would have been accomplished without the resources of the internet and talk-radio.

For more information on this, go to: http://www.secure-skies.org/

Our thanks to all of you who have supported these efforts.


Lots of cool pix at: http://www.rogue-gryffons.com/gallery/
« Last Edit: November 29, 2002, 01:08:56 PM by Borg »

Offline popeye

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2002, 10:53:44 AM »
I guess it'll be dangerous to shoot chutes now.
KONG

Where is Major Kong?!?

Offline aac

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2002, 10:57:58 AM »
It is my opinion that if the pilots are responsible enough to have the care of a multi-millon dollar plane and the lives of the passenger in their hands, along with most being ex-military (or current military resserve) then they are responsible enough to be armed in the cockpit.

I have stated this in every open forum I have access to.  

N0, before you even ask I am not a pilot, but I have trained many pilots in handgun training for concealed carry permits and havent met one yet that I would not trust with a gun.

I do think there needs to be specific ammo requirements as in shot shells not solid bullets.

Offline Thrawn

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2002, 11:09:22 AM »
Shouldn't this be in the O'Club?

Offline miko2d

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2002, 12:01:28 PM »
Apparently the bill contains the word "passenger" in it. So the gun-control nuts are successfully trying to block the arming of cargo-plane pilots.

 Cargo-planes allegedly have very lax security arrangements.

 miko

Offline Zapata

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2002, 12:11:27 PM »
.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2002, 12:13:34 PM by Zapata »

Offline Zapata

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2002, 12:12:43 PM »
.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2002, 12:25:24 PM by Zapata »

Offline lazs2

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2002, 12:43:41 PM »
my reaction at the time of the 9/11 murders was to state on this board that we needed to get the sky marshall program reinstituted and we needed to arm and train airline pilots and crew.

I believe this goes along with mr Lott's view that more guns equal less crime.   We all seen what less guns equals... schoolyard slaughter.  
lazs

Offline popeye

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2002, 01:07:37 PM »
Beverage?  Headphones?  Handgun?  Pillow?
KONG

Where is Major Kong?!?

Offline lazs2

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« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2002, 01:09:25 PM »
yep pop.... at least then we would all have a vote on where we were going.
lazs

Offline Thrawn

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« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2002, 01:31:21 PM »
The pilot's job is to fly the plane, not to play Mr. Rainbow 6.

If you have some one on a plane with a gun, it should be a highly trained peace officer, not a pilot with a week-end course in how to take off safety on a pistol.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2002, 01:34:04 PM by Thrawn »

Offline gofaster

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2002, 01:32:30 PM »
I say arm the plane, not the pilot.  A shotgun with its barrel pointed at the cockpit door and fastened into the overhead console or mounted on the floor would be sufficient.  The pilot could arm and trigger it from the control column without having to pull it out of a holster and aim it manually.

Offline whgates3

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2002, 02:11:51 PM »
do this mean pilots of foreign airlines flying in the US will be able to carry weapons?

Offline Toad

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2002, 02:14:55 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Thrawn
The pilot's job is to fly the plane, not to play Mr. Rainbow 6.

If you have some one on a plane with a gun, it should be a highly trained peace officer, not a pilot with a week-end course in how to take off safety on a pistol.


Look before you leap, Thrawn.

First off, it wont be a "week-end course in how to take off safety on a pistol." It'll be much more detailed than that. From what I've heard so far, it'll be at the pilot's own time and expense as well. Volunteer, if you will. No one's being forced to participate.

Two, it is his job to fly the plane. Stop and think about it.

A. Even now, a year + later, there are very, very few "sky marshals". It's RARE when there is one on board. You're talking about a very limited number of guys that get vacations and days off just like the rest of us that have to cover literally tens of thousands of commercial flights every single day. So, if you depend solely on sky marshals, it'll be a rare day indeed when they are on your flight. OTOH, there will be at least two pilots on every single flight.

B. So, while these pilots are there, flying the plane, the odds are overwhelming that nobody in back will be a sky marshal trained to work in an aircraft environment or even any sort of armed Law Enforcement Officer at all.

And when the bad guys show up and start trying to force entry into the cockpit..... who's going to make sure the pilot still has a chance to do his job, to fly the plane?

I'll suggest the OTHER pilot. The adequately trained one that knows more about the aircraft and the environment it operates in than any sky marshal and has undergone a specific course to help him maintain control of his cockpit using a firearm if necessary.

But of course, it'll never happen again right?
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Thrawn

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Airline Pilots To Be Armed
« Reply #14 on: November 25, 2002, 02:52:34 PM »
I have a few questions that I hope you can answer.

Where is all the money from the security surcharges on airplane tickets going?

Is there any standardization on the firearms training?

Can the PIC tell the FO to leave the firearm off the plane?


I would be worried about the "can have" policy changing to a "must have".