Author Topic: It's getting Nasty here  (Read 1424 times)

Offline Midnight

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It's getting Nasty here
« on: December 04, 2002, 11:28:04 AM »
Looking through all the current threads and posts there is a very bad trend forming.

The number of negative posts about AH and gameable scoring and rank calculations and poor damage model and lack of good maps and over simplified strategy elements and no-good contests are really piling up.

I hope there is something in the works to reverse the trend and let people get back to talking about how cool this game was/could be again.

The unfortunate part in all of this is that AH has the potential to become the ultimate combat sim, but the real-world implication of becoming more of a sim and less of a game is the financial impact of lost revenues. It's the common denominator of the easily distracted and short attention spans of the majority in the public domain that force the gaming industry to put more effort into point and click fun rather than developing something that can engage the thinking mind.

If you think about it, it really doesn't make a lot of sense.

When you get a boxed game, do you send the most time playing in the H2H arenas, or playing the off-line campaign or story?

When you got Half-Life, how many countless hours (continuous) did you spend trying to work your way through all the levels and get to the end? Eventually, you probably tried the H2H arenas and had some fun there too.

About how long did it take for you to get bored of the constant re-spawning and killing and being killed by the same guys over and over again? Probably a lot less time than it took to get bored of playing the off-line campaign.

Why? Because in the off-line campaign, there was a goal. There was something to work for and things that had to be learned in order to win. You had to try new strategies and tactics and work to find the best means of survival.

Once you played H2H for an hour, how much fun was it? You always ended up in the same basic map with no need to figure out a strategy to win, just go out, find the enemy and shoot him.

The AH main arena is getting like that. Strategy is all but useless because it has not real effect on anything. Trying to use tactics to gain the upper hand is pointless because the enemy never runs out of supplies to fight back.

It seems like the only way to win a battle in AH is by over-whelming numbers. Eventually, one of the combatants gets bored and gives up and either logs off in frustration, or goes somewhere else to make a new fight.

It would be nice if winning the war was something that was accomplished with strategy and planning, rather than a constant rolling pig-pile on the country with the fewest players.

Offline Grizzly

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2002, 12:06:18 PM »
I really don't know where you are coming from Midnight. The fact of the matter is that a massive online multiplayer game, like AcesHigh, has far greater sustaining power than any boxed game.

The reason is that the players can set the goal, the rules and the tactics. A boxed game has but one personality that players can soon grow weary of. A game like AcesHigh can have as many personalities as the players' imagination can contrive.

The fact that massive assaults are so prevalent in AcesHigh is because of the defined goal of arena capture. This requires capturing as many bases as fast as you can using the best tactics to accomplish this. Fighting over a base only delays its capture. A massive assault that can't be blocked, especially against a poorly defended base, or a sneak attack on a city are the quickest ways to grab agriculture.

That's fine for some, but not all players have to play that game. Players can gather in a seperate area and play whatever way they like. For example, there are many fierce battles going on in different areas over just a couple bases, which can go on for hours. There the objective can be to fight each other until a base is captured or destroyed, and then move on, or just dogfight... maybe in certain types of planes. Since there is no race to see who can get the most territory, fighting each other is acceptable. (It's also better for meeting new people on all sides.)

Don't be a mindless drone running on the arena hampster wheel. When you tire of that, grab some friends and go off to the side to play the type of game you enjoy. Then you are taking full advantage of a massive online multiplayer game, where you can fight other people instead of a computer.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2002, 12:10:16 PM by Grizzly »

Offline Yeager

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2002, 12:09:13 PM »
I just grab a plane (or a tank, whatever) and go around looking for some cheap fun....it is afterall only $14.95

I used to have grand visions of AH being something it isnt and probably never would successfully be anyways.......who knows.

One things fer sure, I would not pay $29.95 for what AH is today.
Just too crowded, way too many dorks.

Im still hoping the mission arena becomes something.  What I dont know, but still....hope is good.
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline Ripsnort

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2002, 12:11:45 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yeager
I just grab a plane (or a tank, whatever) and go around looking for some cheap fun....it is afterall only $14.95

I used to have grand visions of AH being something it isnt and probably never would successfully be anyways.......who knows.

One things fer sure, I would not pay $29.95 for what AH is today.
Just too crowded, way too many dorks.

Im still hoping the mission arena becomes something.  What I dont know, but still....hope is good.


I couldn't add anything to this...other than DITTO!

Offline Grizzly

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2002, 12:15:12 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yeager

One things fer sure, I would not pay $29.95 for what AH is today.
Just too crowded, way too many dorks.


Life has too many dorks, it's just that they feel more free to act up in cyber space than when confronted with real people. I fear it's something we have to put up with... there's no refuge.

Offline Apache

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2002, 12:19:02 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yeager
I just grab a plane (or a tank, whatever) and go around looking for some cheap fun....it is afterall only $14.95

I used to have grand visions of AH being something it isnt and probably never would successfully be anyways.......who knows.

One things fer sure, I would not pay $29.95 for what AH is today.
Just too crowded, way too many dorks.

Im still hoping the mission arena becomes something.  What I dont know, but still....hope is good.


May just be me, but it didn't seem as "dorky" back a year, year and a half ago, maybe even as far as 2 years, as it does now.


Offline Yeager

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2002, 12:22:43 PM »
Beta was a blast.  Best time I ever had on a computer bar none.

AW closing down and everyone crowding in here was great and all, but the game became harder for me to enjoy.

Still fun tho........
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Offline Midnight

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2002, 12:41:42 PM »
I'm not saying I like boxed games any better. I haven't played one since Half-Life Opposing Force.

My point is that there was a strategy involved to win.

I am frustrated with the AH gaming because strategy doesn't mean anything. Supplies are endless and lifes are unlimited. There is nothing that can control the speed at which land can be captured and give the feeling of a war being fought by thinking about how to win and what could be done to have the most effect on the enemy.

Mission planning is pointless in the MA becuase of this. If you spend 15 minutes planning a strike on the enemy, the target you palnned on hitting may already be destroyed, or the base you planned on using as a start point could be captured by the enemy.

The infinite supply system allows a single base to capture 10 and those 10 to capture 20, all without having to stop and resupply or think about the best means to advance or produce some sort of supply line to keep the offense moving forward.

As I said before, and as Grizzly responded, a fight just slows the war down. Get a big enough pig pile and just keep on pushing to win the reset. It would be nice if resources wore thin and there was some type of supply system that meant something other than for LANCs to drop a single 4K bomb on to bolster their rank.

Offline easymo

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2002, 12:51:08 PM »
Beta was a blast. Best time I ever had on a computer bar none.

Yep. Me too.

Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2002, 12:52:03 PM »
Well... strategy and the ability to quickly over run the enemy with a well-implemented strategical plan exists...

To date, I haven't seen anyone actually implement it because it takes organisation and time.

I'm just saying... it's up to the players to play the game how they see fit, and apparently they see it as a 24/7 quakeball with the ability to capture fields.
-SW

Offline Eagler

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2002, 12:53:19 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Yeager
One things fer sure, I would not pay $29.95 for what AH is today.
Just too crowded, way too many dorks.


at least 50% of the dorks would disappear if the price went up 100%
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Offline ccvi

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2002, 01:03:44 PM »
In doom i didn't even finish the single player mode. Since then can't remember a game where multiplayer wasn't the reason to play it.
Before doom, there weren't many multiplayer capable games.

Offline Halo

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2002, 01:07:21 PM »
Right on, Yeager, although I don't worry too much about crowding and dorks, mostly because sometimes I'm part of a crowd and one person's hero is another person's dork, and vice versa.

Aces High has to be the world's greatest entertainment bargain.  I particularly value the freedom it allows to select whatever kind of engagement I'm in the mood for.

I usually do not play Aces High to become part of someone else's grand strategy to conquer the world.  I favor fringe fights up close and personal.  That's why the oft maligned pizza map is one of my favorites, and why the Combat Arena is often more fun and challenging.  

It may be impossible to please all the people all the time, but I think Aces High does a great job of trying and coming as close to succeeding as anything can given the high expectations of cyber surfers on the cutting edge.
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Offline aac

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2002, 01:35:01 PM »
AT LEAST 50 % OF THE DORKS WOULD LEAVE IF THE PRICE WENT UP 100%

And at least 50% of those that aren't dorks that would sure make a lot of CENTS (pun intended) to HTC

Offline 28sweep

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It's getting Nasty here
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2002, 01:36:45 PM »
The differences  between Boxed sims and MMP's are as follows:

1) Boxed: Usually mission based with AI opposing you.  You suck until you find out the weakness of the AI and exploit it to the fullest and then dominant...becomes boring and you throw it away......

2) MMP-Humans instead of AI means strengths and weakness
are infinite.  You never know if the guy you bounce is great/good/bad etc...MUCH MUCH more intertwining than AI.  Nobody would disagree.  I think where I have a problem is the tactics necessary to win the game are very-very-very simple and unrealistic.  The Human element has kept this game entertaining eventhough it's framed in a very-very-very unrealistic-primitive setting.  Bombing Hangers year after year is quite a bore.