Just an idea for Fighter score.

[Innominate]

Originally posted by Samiam
My understanding is the ENY values skirt the subjective "which plane is more uber" issue by simply being a mechanism for evening out plane usage.

Factoring plane type into score *would* force subjective ranking of each planes relative worth and would be the subject of endless ranting in this forum.

I prefer a score weighting based on the rank of the players you kill in that category, but even that is mostly a luck factor since the good players are rarely bested - rather they knowingly put themselves into a jam and some lucky shmoe gets to capitalize on it.

The idea of taking the plane into account is merely an extension of the perk system.  It is the same thing, provide an additional incentive to fly the earlier war planes.

A few planes have ENY that doesn't seem right, and it seems to have been a long time since any habe been updated. (Most notably the P40)  ENY numbers should be based entirely on usage, and regularly(i.e. at the end of every tour, maybe more often at first) updated.

Basing scoring on the pilots ranking doesn't really change anything.  The whole purpose (of this thread) is to have scoring take into account the planes you fly.

[Samiam]

Originally posted by Innominate
The idea of taking the plane into account is merely an extension of the perk system.  It is the same thing, provide an additional incentive to fly the earlier war planes.
 

Perks are used to limit over use of certain planes in the MA, and to a lesser extent promote/reward the use of so-called early-war planes.

Score is a way to measure one's expertise at playing the game. The two aren't really related.

I can accumulate a lot of perk points by repeatedly furballing against odds in a Hurricane, getting one or two kills before dying. I'm not sure if this should also jack my ranking up, just because I was in a Hurricane.

What's so wrong with score being about flying a better plane smarter? (Where "better" is up to the interpretation of the pilot - it may be faster, or better armed, or better turning).

If Fester can maintain a 100-1 K/D ratio in an ME-262, I think he should have a higher score than someone with a 2-1 ratio in an F4F (even though a 2-1 K/D in an F4F may be an admirable feet).

[Innominate]

Originally posted by Samiam
Perks are used to limit over use of certain planes in the MA, and to a lesser extent promote/reward the use of so-called early-war planes.

Score is a way to measure one's expertise at playing the game. The two aren't really related.

Perks are hardly a significant factor on who flies what.  Most players who've been playing for any length of time have thousands of them.

It takes more skill to do well in a p40 than it does a la7.  Flying a p40 instead of the la7 will guarentee your score drops.  The best way to get a high score is to be a dweeb.  A 10 to 1 k/d ratio in a p40B is worth a HELL of a lot more than the samae in an la7.

[Turbot]

Originally posted by Urchin
I think it would be a really good idea if what kind of fighter you flew counted for your score.  The only obvious way (to me, anyway) is to make higher ENY planes get more 'points' for killing a lower ENY plane, just like they get perk points.

Say a Zero shoots down a 262 - I think that fellow deserves a bonus?  They are already doing it for perks - can't  think of any reason not to do just the same with scores.  Have to think would be simple a pie to code?

I would add an additional suggestion (without having read the whole thread in case already suggested).   Rather than, or in addition to being based on plane type - how about consider fighter rank as well?   Say the #2000 ranked fighter pilot shoots down the #1 stick - I think that fellow deserves a bonus as well

[Dead Man Flying]

Originally posted by Innominate
It takes more skill to do well in a p40 than it does a la7.  Flying a p40 instead of the la7 will guarentee your score drops.  The best way to get a high score is to be a dweeb.  A 10 to 1 k/d ratio in a p40B is worth a HELL of a lot more than the samae in an la7.

Nonsense.  If the P-40 pilot only vulches, cherry picks, or attacks with better odds than an La7 pilot who is willing to mix it up and furball against bad odds... how can you possibly suggest that the P-40 pilot demonstrated more skill by achieving a higher K/D ratio?  Or that the La7 somehow requires less skill if his K/D perchance is higher?

This is why we should always take AH stats with a grain of salt -- they don't reflect flying style.  It really is comparing apples to oranges unless you know that two players fly roughly the same way.

If you were to argue that the same pilot in an La7 would have a higher K/D ratio than in a P-40, I'd agree with you if only because of ammo load and lethality differences.

-- Todd/Leviathn

[popeye]

Don't forget the Horde Multiplier...E/F.  Number of Enemy fighters within icon range, divided by the number of Friendly fighters within icon range.

A 1 v 4 kill gets you 16 times the score as a 4 v 1 kill.

Not that I care about score....

[AKS\/\/ulfe]

Originally posted by WldThing
Well yeah, but you have to look at the power of the guns, and the ammo load for each plane.. Monsters like some of the LW that have 550 cannons (A5) would eat up most of the mustangs, and their ENY is above 21....  So to "even" it out some of us fly D's.

The A5 is also significantly slower, and less manueverable than the P51B.

If you don't spray 'n pray, you can get atleast 5 kills a flight in the 51B.

The D model is leaps and bounds beyond the "monster" A5, and even better then the A8.

If you get eaten up by A5s in a 51, you did something wrong.
-SW

[Samiam]

Originally posted by Innominate
Perks are hardly a significant factor on who flies what.  Most players who've been playing for any length of time have thousands of them.

It takes more skill to do well in a p40 than it does a la7.  Flying a p40 instead of the la7 will guarentee your score drops.  The best way to get a high score is to be a dweeb.  A 10 to 1 k/d ratio in a p40B is worth a HELL of a lot more than the samae in an la7.

While it's true that many players manage to accumulate enough perks to freely choose any ride, perk points certainly *are* a significant factor in what gets flown in the MA. Witness the elimination of C-Hog dominance by simply perking it 10 points. If perks are hardly a factor, then why is there constant push on to perk the LA7, N1K, etc.?

Skill is in the eye of the beholder. I say there is skill in putting yourself in a position to select you're opportunities, then managing to captialize on them. This is how 95% of WWII aces won victories - not by purposefully jumping into situations so that they could demonstarte their manuevering prowess.

13th TAS is an example of a squad that typically executes this type of skill using tactics and ACM common to that used in WWII. Why should they pay  score penalty just because they fly P51D's?

If your skill is flying a Spit V into furballs and racking up a decent K/D and K/T, that's good too. But don't reward the huricane pilot who goes 1-1 hours on end with a gigantic score just because of the plane he flys - let him be satisfied with a lot of perk points.

[AKcurly]

To respond to Urchin's original idea, yes, I think something like that would work, but it would require some modifications.

1.  The current scoring system allocates scoring points based on what kind of plane you killed.   Additionally, the scoring system should subtract points based on the type of plane that killed you!  

For example, if you are in a P51D and you let a Zeke sneak up on you, it should subtract a large number of points.  If you are in a P51D and a 262 or Tempest comes roaring through and nails you, it should not cost too many points.

2.   I don't know the point of HTC's pilot contest, but if many take it seriously, it will have an impact on high-risk encounters (furballs).  

Therefore, I suggest HTC should further modify the scoring system so it takes distance from the nearest enemy base into account.  If the nearest enemy base is close by, you don't get many points for the kill.  NOTE: This does two things.  1) It doesn't give many points for vulch kills and 2) It would give a maximum number of points for base defense kills. (If you are defending your base, you are at a maximum distance from the nearest enemy field ... max points awarded.)

In the same vein as 2), I would suggest a third score modifier.  Award more points for high altitude kills than low altitude kills.

Something like the following comes to mind:

N1 = enemy value of my plane
N2 = enemy value of my opponent's plane
Dist = distance to nearest enemy field
Alt = altitude of opponent when killed.

S1 = cumulative score from achieving kills
S2 = cumulative score from losing a fight

S1 = Sum [(N1/N2)*(Dist/15)*(alt/20000)]] over each fight you win.
S2 is calculated exactly as S1 is calculated, but it's the score from losing a fight.  It's the cumulative S1 from those planes that killed you.

Fighter Rank = S1/(S2+1)

Notice the following:

a) furball kills occur near the deck.  Therefore S1 would be decreased if you get too many furball kills.  A decrease in S1 would lower your rank.

b) base capture kills occur near the deck and at a minimum distance from the nearest enemy field.  if you spend too much time capturing bases, it's going to hurt your score.

c) base defense kills will help your score somewhat because they are at a maximum distance from the nearest enemy field  --- but, they are low altitude kills.

d) The best kill would be base defense and kill of high altitude jabos or buffs.

e) If you get killed during base capture, it's really going to hurt, especially if a zeke or FM2 nails you.  You have committed the cardinal sins: Low altitude, close to an enemy base and killed by a high enemy value plane.

curly

[AtmkRstr]

I like Eskimo's formula.

Squaring the plane's K/D might be a bit extreeme though.

[Innominate]

it might also be nice to divide the points earned(perks and score points) by the number of people who landed hits on that person.

i.e. three other people land hits on someone, and you get the kill for them.  That kill would be worth 25% of the points itd be worth if you alone hit it.

It would help to reduce the rewards from gangbanging and kill stealing.

[AtmkRstr]

Originally posted by Samiam
While it's true that many players manage to accumulate enough perks to freely choose any ride, perk points certainly *are* a significant factor in what gets flown in the MA. Witness the elimination of C-Hog dominance by simply perking it 10 points. If perks are hardly a factor, then why is there constant push on to perk the LA7, N1K, etc.?

Perking a plane has an effect, but obviously the ENY of a plane has little effect.  If it had an effect, we'd have a veriety in the MA rather than the ussual La7/N1K2/Spit/190D9/P51Ds.  It's a shame that HTC made such a large veriety of planes but most people stick to a handfull of planes.

[eskimo2]

Originally posted by AtmkRstr
I like Eskimo's formula.

Squaring the plane's K/D might be a bit extreeme though.

Agreed, it is too extreem.  Something between squared and face value of planes K/D would be fair, IMO.

eskimo