Root event that created the Universe...

[BNM]

Yup.

[GRUNHERZ]

But under any of those you would likely go to hell... How dooo you choose?

[mrfish]

Originally posted by K98k
like saying websters dictionary could have been created by an explosion in a print shop.

where do you people get this drivel? it's nowhere near like that. imagine the level of dyssemetry it would take for an explosion to produce a bound, spellchecked, margined dictionary- the asymmetric nature of the early hot dense universe that allowed for the creation of matter was nowhere near that off, it was very subtle- oh well i guess folksy crap like that goes over well at parties, provided no one there actually knows what they're talking about.

this whole conversation is just more of the 'we must be special' philosophy again. if the initial conditions weren't just the way they were then we wouldn't have 3 spatial dimensions and time to live in so why do you think we popped out of some place like that? what are the chances.....you talk about the place our universe sprang from like it's a place we can imagine or be familiar with, like it's a place with physics just like here except black and empty- that's very inprobable and for the time being completely unknowable.

the "it's complex, so god surely did it" thing is a riot and makes me wish i was born 500 years from now when you people are just a paragraph in a historical trivia book instead of now when your fairey tales are still holding peoples attention somehow.

i guess i can't blame you though- i'm on vacation in oklahoma right now and there are churches on every corner, inspirational supply stores, nonstop tv and radio church crap,  church notices on a crawler during the news, bilboards with giant pictures of jesus and some sappy saying, tee shirts...etc etc etc i guess if they advertise it enough they can sell anything.

why not focus on what we can understand and go from there instead of demanding to be fed one giant bite that you can swallow all at once? it's the quest for immediate easy answers that has cause so many myths and untruths to be floating around. what's the rush?

[Holden McGroin]

Originally posted by K98k
like saying websters dictionary could have been created by an explosion in a print shop.

The anthropomorphic model says that if the structure of the universe was any different from the way it turned out to be, then we would not be here to ponder it.

And there is a definite probability, however infinitesimal, that Webster's dictionary could be could be ballistically printed, however the principle of increasing entropy says that it probably will not.

[Furious]

Modern physics, including the special and general theory of reletivity and quantum mechanics, are for the lay person who chooses to except them a kind of faith system, not terribly unlike religion.

Maybe 1000 people understand the math enough to be truly convinced of the of the veracity of these sciences and their conclusions.

But just because I don't understand the math does not mean I am willing to assign a fictional charactor creationistic powers.


F.

what the hell i a 2 spin particle anyway?

[whgates3]

the math behind special relativity is quite simple (it is taught to 2nd year undergrads). general relativity is much more complex & is taught to 1st year grad students.  QM, AFAIK, has little to do with cosmology

[CyranoAH]

Originally posted by whgates3
the math behind special relativity is quite simple (it is taught to 2nd year undergrads). general relativity is much more complex & is taught to 1st year grad students.  QM, AFAIK, has little to do with cosmology

Well "au contraire" my friend... my fiancée is a grad student getting her PhD in Cosmology, concretely in Gravitational Waves. QM has its saying in all the big bang story, beginning with the initial Quantum Foam that explains that the void has itself some kind of potential energy and that matter can actually appear from void.

I wish she would agree to write in this forum, but she won't so you'll have to do with the reduced version

Daniel

[Steve]

Interestingly enough.. many scientists claim their observations indicate that the universe is  now past middle age and actually collapsing back upon itself..one day the whole place will be a very small incalculably dense mass. Oh, and who the hell goes on vacation to Oklahoma?  lol

[Innominate]

If you were to go back 1000 years and try and explain what we know about the universe now, you'd be treated as if you were a madman.

Imagine what another thousand years could bring.

For all we know today, we could be producing our own custom-made universes by then.

Originally posted by Steve
one day the whole place will be a very small incalculably dense mass.

Well at least this is something we can examine today.  There are more than enough religious literalists around who's brains we could study.  

[Holden McGroin]

Originally posted by Steve
Interestingly enough.. many scientists claim their observations indicate that the universe is  now past middle age and actually collapsing back upon itself..one day the whole place will be a very small incalculably dense mass. Oh, and who the hell goes on vacation to Oklahoma?  lol

Quite recently, observations have been made that may indicate that stars are accellerating away from us, meaning that the Hubble Constant is getting greater.  This would tend to indicate some sort of inflationary cosmological period, and some unknown force counteracting gravity's tendency to slow the universe's expansion.  This could mean that the "Big Crunch" may not happen at all....  The end of the universe may come with a thermodynamic heat death, when the temperature of the cosmos becomes homogeneous.*1  Isn't the anticipation exiting? I am on pins and needles....    




*1 Probably something to do with SUV's and US foreign policy.

[whgates3]

Originally posted by CyranoAH
Well "au contraire" my friend... my fiancée is a grad student getting her PhD in Cosmology, concretely in Gravitational Waves. QM has its saying in all the big bang story, beginning with the initial Quantum Foam that explains that the void has itself some kind of potential energy and that matter can actually appear from void.

I wish she would agree to write in this forum, but she won't so you'll have to do with the reduced version

Daniel

ja, the interactions between photons & atoms are a big deal too, and certianly governed by QM, but gravity seems to be the key player in cosmology after 'the 1st 300000 seconds'...ask your lady friend if gravitons exist, & if so how do you figure their mean free path length

[mrfish]

Originally posted by Steve
Oh, and who the hell goes on vacation to Oklahoma?  lol

people who can't afford to go to arkansas obviously.

[hardcase]

Virtual Paticles abound in vacumn. All you have to do is input enought energy to  overcome the Uncertainy Principle of DeltaE*DeltaT=>Hbar add enought energy and the Time they can exist increases to the point they can be detected.

HC

[NUKE]

Originally posted by hardcase
Virtual Paticles abound in vacumn. All you have to do is input enought energy to  overcome the Uncertainy Principle of DeltaE*DeltaT=>Hbar add enought energy and the Time they can exist increases to the point they can be detected.

HC

Most of these theories require matter/heat/energy combo to work......

How can you have heat or energy without matter?

I wonder what created all the matter in the first place. And if there was once a time when no matter existed, how could  energy or heat be created?

Obviously matter is here, so it must have been created somehow..... or maybe it always existed, which is amazing to try to comprehend.

[AKS\/\/ulfe]

Everything we know today was created by humans.

Everything made by humans has a percentage of human error..


There's a good chance everything we know is completely wrong by the universe's standards.

There's also a good chance that SOB is indeed God.... but for now, he's just a God to me.

Screw Kuulax, he's had it out for me since day 1!
-SW