Author Topic: Aces High and IL2 (Read 763 times)

eskimo2 · « **Reply #15 on:** January 08, 2002, 09:59:00 AM »

I have never played IL-2, but it sounds like an incredible sim, certainly better than AH offline.
However, 200+ player online action of AH makes the flight sim experience so much more fun. CVs, GVs, boats and field guns add quite a bit as well.

eskimo

AKSWulfe · « **Reply #16 on:** January 08, 2002, 10:10:00 AM »

You have no data to prove it's a more accurate 109, but you assume.

That, and AH models a pilot pulling on the stick- Il-2 models just the stick so you aren't limited by how much a human can realistically pull the stick at any speed.

The gunnery isn't hard, and if you hit a plane in the same spot- it's going down. Just like AH. I've gotten to get single cannon shell kills by hitting planes in the wingroot.

It's all about perspective.
-SW

Wlfgng · « **Reply #17 on:** January 08, 2002, 12:04:00 PM »

what Swulfe said.

It's all about what you get used to IMO.
Having flown AH first, I had trouble with the gunnery in IL2 at first.

No doubt, if I'd started with IL2 I might think AH was 'off'.

lemur · « **Reply #18 on:** January 08, 2002, 04:13:00 PM »

Being currently 'addicted' to IL2 I'll throw my additional dos pesos in.

IL2 models engine management better than AH. When your engine is damaged in AH it just keeps working at 100% until it suddenly dies (i.e. Keep full power going if you lose oil in AH.) In IL2 the engine starts to overheat, makes nasty grinding noises, and sometimes you can limp home at reduced throttle.

IL2's terrain is insanely gorgeous. Definitely wins over AH.

I think IL2's gunnery is somehow off. A 2 second burst at convergence range should tear a fighter apart (it does in AH) in IL2 you might damage him enough to make him crash. Might.

Wmaker · « **Reply #19 on:** January 08, 2002, 06:28:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by SWulfe:
You have no data to prove it's a more accurate 109, but you assume.

That, and AH models a pilot pulling on the stick- Il-2 models just the stick so you aren't limited by how much a human can realistically pull the stick at any speed.

That simply isn't true. In Il-2, if you slam your stick fully back in a 109G-6 at 600 km/h and then at 200km/h you'll notice that isn't true.

What comes to the 109 rollrate in AH vs Il-2...I'm quite sure it's too high at low speeds in Il-2. In AH G-2 seems to have it pretty close what I would expect OTOH G-6 has it a tad low. In finnish flight tests with G-2 4-5 second full roll (360 degree)time was achieved at 400-450 km/h. I think pretty much same time should apply to the G6. I don't have a stop watch at hand so what I said above about these two sims are just my assumptions.

--------------

1Wmaker1

Wotan · « **Reply #20 on:** January 08, 2002, 08:07:00 PM »

the 109s in il2 are easy to fly and the vvs aircraft are even easier.

Gunnery is just different and you have to adapt to rules.....

It takes more 20mm to kill a plane in il2 (seems like too much at times) on average then AH but I've killed planes with 1 to 3 hits before.

30mm is strange at times but normally 1 = death

The damage model is more detailed so getting your hits in the right spot is more important then just gettin pings.

Theres very little compression if at all that i have noticed the only time I notice any change in stick reponse is when im out of trim.

As fer eng management I have cowl/radiator flaps and prop pitch mapped to my hotas its just a matter of hitting a couple of buttons to keep eng running well. I should also say I fly with everything in fullreal and have all on screen text turned off so I fly by instruments. If you keep an eye on things you can manage your eng much better then waitin for the hub msg saying "Engine Overheating"

For a boxed sim its the best one. But for all the "realism" I fly much more AH because I prefer to fight a bunch of real folks then wait around in the clumsy game portals hoping to get 1 good fight out of an hour and a half of looking.

I dont see ah's 109s being clumsy. I would describe wwiiol fm as clumsy.

After a month when il2 is sitting in the cd rack with janes eaw sdoe and falcon 4 i'll still be flying AH or wb3. I just prefer "online" games to boxed ones.

I really liked eaw online more then il2 dunno why i just did.

capt. apathy · « **Reply #21 on:** January 08, 2002, 10:12:00 PM »

both games are great,
and i agree with most of the assesments above, except engine managment. i prefer the il2 wep, each planes have different amount of time on wep depending on conditions (engine temp when wep is engaged, radiator open/closed, ect.) but in an emergency you can choose wether or not you turn off wep or let it eat your motor. i've always thought AH ought to have that option instead of the wep that automaticly turns it self off when you redline the temp.(did real planes wep auto shut down or did the pilot have to pay attention to the wear and stress he was inflicting on his engine?)

Wotan · « **Reply #22 on:** January 09, 2002, 04:14:00 AM »

Pyro posted a while bac that (if I remeber correctly) that running at full military power and I believe he said wep as well reduced the number of hours of "life" a particular eng had not that it would "blow up" or be ruined be running all out in a single flight.

I have no real trouble with the eng managemnt in il2 but as wilbuz posted

Quote

Swulfe, haven't noticed the flap dammage effetc, downloaded latest version and could still deploy flaps in 700Km/h while max speed acording to manual was 350. Will see again never had em dammaged though. What Janjan says about WEP is allso right, WEP in IL2 Sucks, all planes seem to have as long, specially bad when in LW fighters considering most, if not all had a wep time of 10 minutes thanks to the water methanol injection, they then had to cool the engine for 5 minutes before they could use WEP for another 10 minutes. 190 had a total WEP time of about 50 minutes with 5 min brakes between each 10 minutes.

You just cant run 190s like that in il2.

imho the "eng management" is over done in il2.

prop pitch and cowl radiator flaps pose no real concern to again they are just a couple of more button pushed. Ils doesnt even touch fuel mixture.

Hristo · « **Reply #23 on:** January 09, 2002, 07:07:00 AM »

You can drrop flaps at high speds in Il-2, but you risk jamming them. Happened to me quite a lot.

As for damage model, I started to believe in it when I sawed horizontal stab of La 5Fn with the propeller of my Fw 190A-5.

MANDOBLE · « **Reply #24 on:** January 09, 2002, 07:48:00 AM »

Agree, damage model is impressive. Yesterday I emptied my ammo into an IL2, it was literally full of holes everywhere but still not going down. Then the IL2 tried a very smooth evasive maneouver and its ailerons went away. It entered in a sallow and uncontroled dive and was loosing parts all the way til the ground.

Heater · « **Reply #25 on:** January 09, 2002, 03:12:00 PM »

I like IL-2's damage model

funkedup · « **Reply #26 on:** January 09, 2002, 05:38:00 PM »

Engine model is strange in Il-2. No constant speed props on planes that had them. Just manual prop pitch control and an autopitch control that behaves nothing like a real constant speed prop. Weird that they would model cowl flaps and all those other details but screw up the CS prop.

You can sustain an almost vertical climb in a 109 with gear and flaps down.

Stall speeds for some planes are about half of real life stall speeds.

FM still has a nice "feel" and some speed tests show that performance is definitely "in the ballpark".

Il-2 is good but the claims that it (or any other sim) has the best FM are silly.

[ 01-09-2002: Message edited by: funkedup ]

Zigrat · « **Reply #27 on:** January 09, 2002, 10:08:00 PM »

i agree with funkedup, the performance is "in the ballpark" to the point where i dont care about the little bits

the prop modelling is certainly strange, but then again aces high enbgine modelling isnt stellar either

one thing about il2 is the graphics. after playing il2, aces high looks like a the 20th century sim that it is.. its looks really havent changed THAT much from 2 years ago (apart from the newer developed plane modekls looking much better)

i am having alot of fun in il2, especially with the full misiosn builder. you can make mini scenarios then go find guinea piga on hyperlobby to play them

MANDOBLE · « **Reply #28 on:** January 10, 2002, 05:39:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by funkedup:
Stall speeds for some planes are about half of real life stall speeds.[ 01-09-2002: Message edited by: funkedup ]

First time I though they were weird until realized IL2 uses metrical system.

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: MANDOBLE ]

Udie · « **Reply #29 on:** January 10, 2002, 07:10:00 AM »

I played IL2 for about a month. I loved it! Great graphics, great FM and DM (visualy stunning DM) but all the little flaws the game has ruined it for me. I didn't have any "show stopper bugs" just annoying crap that takes away from the suspension of reality thingy. Online play can be fun, but it left me wanting and waiting (alot).

The best thing to me about IL2 is that it got me over my AH burnout and I've been flying AH everday for 2 weeks now

Thanks Oleg!!!