Yet another reason to love the French.

[bounder]

Originally posted by batdog
Where the hell did you come up w/this? The US used its overhead surv/Satellites to give quite abit of intel to the Brits. We hardly helped the Argentines.  Reagan was a staunch supporter of the Brits. Hell, the USA/nation as a whole where pretty much in favor
of the British.

[/b]
Sure, didn't say otherwise. British request for AWACS was politely declined however. It's no biggie. I was hopefully trying to illustrate that allies are not necessarily going to drop everything just because a situation escalates somewhere else. Britains allies all had their own nation self interest to consider too. The US and France being no exception

Election time ploy..wtf? The economy was booming..people where fat and happy... he was a shoe in as where his cronies.

No. I didn't even mention the election. But Gen Galtieri enjoyed good relations with USA, and (in my mind, maybe not yours, but perhaps we can agree to differ) this was due in no small part to Galtieri's oppostion to Communism chimed well with the US antipathy towards marxist militias in South America.

As far as giving AWACS..we weren't in a direct conflict w/the Argentines. The Brits had their own radar system in place... and it gave them ample warning.. as you yourself stated.

I didn't suggest that the US should have given AWACS capability to UK. Why should they? US plane, US secrets, US not at war with Argentina etc. The British shipboard EW systems were actually pretty antiquated, which is why the request for an AWACS umbrella was made. Sheffield could defend herself given enough warning so that the valves in the Anti-missile defence system could warm up.

I fail to see how this incident could be even be remotely tied to the US.

[/b]It's not. Just pulled USA as example to Habu, that because allies don't assist in every way possible, even counter to their own national interest, doesn't mean they are dishonorable or any of the other silly thing she is suggesting. USA were very helpful to UK during falklands war, the provision of the very latest all aspect sidewinder proved to be a decisive factor in British air superiority.

Sounds like more anti US rethoric to me.

xBAT

nah xBAT, It's not anti US rhetoric. Anti-US rhetoric sounds like this.(if I'm not mistaken)

The USA is disseminating its cancerous culture of greed, death and stupidity throughout the globe, its economic and military tentacles choking anything that does not conform to the blinkered provincial outlook of its unkowing citizens.

But I would never express an opinion like that because I am not anti-US (whatever that is, it's a bit like being anti-mountain range or something).

[sourkraut]

I was in the US Navy at the time. We provided material assistance for the British during the Falklands War, including spares and fuel. We also provided shipyard repairs in Norfolk for one of the damaged ships (God, why can't I remember which ship?). I know this because my ship escorted the damaged ship to port.

By the way, the British submarine that sank the Cruiser "General DelGado (I think that was the name), it fired a US manufactured Mk48 Torpedo.

Sour

[batdog]

Yo Bounder...its all cool. Thanks for the explanations.


xBAT

Yea... the election portion was from Beetle's post... all ran togather in my head.

[hawk220]

I think it was the Belgrano or something

[Habu]

Originally posted by straffo
You want me to believe that the Argentinian army was not involved in any way in the fact they stayed here ... and that they were free to come back to France ?

Your case is closed you're definitly a complete idiot.

So now you want us to believe that the French technicians were all under arrest and prevented from travelling during the war?

So where was the diplomatic outcry from the French government? I am sure if a number of French civilians were being held against their will the French government would have had much to say about the matter.

You argument (like you mind) is weak.

 

[bounder]

Habu, are you, as you seem to be, in full possession of the facts?

Please could you illuminate us as to the exact circumstances surrounding the issue of the Dassault engineers.

If you need to go to sources, can you provide another one, besides the document you quoted at the top of this thread.

It won't change my opinion on the french but I am genuinely interested in the story, even now 20 years later.

[bounder]

Originally posted by sourkraut
I was in the US Navy at the time. We provided material assistance for the British during the Falklands War, including spares and fuel. We also provided shipyard repairs in Norfolk for one of the damaged ships (God, why can't I remember which ship?). I know this because my ship escorted the damaged ship to port.

By the way, the British submarine that sank the Cruiser "General DelGado (I think that was the name), it fired a US manufactured Mk48 Torpedo.

Sour

And the Belgrano was a recommissioned US navy ship I believe. In fact the only thing missing from the Falklands war was materiel of Argentine origin.

[Habu]

Originally posted by bounder
Habu, are you, as you seem to be, in full possession of the facts?

Please could you illuminate us as to the exact circumstances surrounding the issue of the Dassault engineers.

If you need to go to sources, can you provide another one, besides the document you quoted at the top of this thread.

It won't change my opinion on the french but I am genuinely interested in the story, even now 20 years later.

That source that you seem not to put much faith in is the US Department of Defense Air and Space Power Journal. Probably one of the most credible sources for information on air power in the world.

The author is James S. Corum. Below is a bit of his Curriculum Vitae

 

JAMES STERLING CORUM  

Present Position  

Professor of Comparative Military Studies
School of Advanced Air and Space Studies  

Previous Academic Positions  

Instructor, Department of History, Queen's University
Teaching Assistant, Department of History, Queen’s University
Instructor, Liberal Arts Department, Mater Dei College
Instructor, Military Studies Department, St. Lawrence University
Tutor of German, History Faculty, Oxford University  

Academic Education  

Ph.D. (History) Queen's University, 1990
M.Litt. (History) Oxford University, 1984
M.A. (History) Brown University, 1976
Immatriculated at Heidelberg University, Germany
Sprachzertifikat, 1974 - 1975  

          Military Background  

Lt. Colonel, US Army Reserve
Military Intelligence Corps

Reserve Assignment- Currently on the Faculty of the Army War College, Carlisle PA

Professional Military Education  

Air War College
US Army Command and General Staff Course.
Air Command and Staff College
Army Ordnance Officer Advanced Course
S-2 Combat Operations Course            

Professional, Academic and Honorary Organizations  

United States Commission for Military History
Society for Military History
Phi Alpha Theta History Honor Society
German Studies Association
Akademische-Theologische Verbindung Wartburg, Germany
Oxford and Cambridge Universities Club, Pall Mall, London
Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association
Army Reserve Association            

PUBLISHING, LECTURING, and CONSULTING

Books

The Luftwaffe: Creating the Operational Air War 1918-1940, University Press of Kansas, 1997.

The Roots of Blitzkrieg: Hans von Seeckt and German Military Reform, University Press of Kansas, 1992.

The Luftwaffe's War of War: Luftwaffe Doctrine 1910-1945, Nautical and Aviation Press,  (With Richard Muller), 1998.

Airpower in Small Wars: Fighting Insurgents and Terrorists, University Press of Kansas, (with Wray Johnson), 2003.

Journal Articles

“Argentine Airpower in the Falklands War: An Operational View”, Air and Space Power Journal, Fall 2002.  Also Published in the Spanish and Portuguese editions of Air and space Power Journal.  

“Latin Americans and Airpower’s Role in the War on Terrorism”, WHINSEC Occasional Papers Series #1, Nov 2001  

“Evolution of US Army Doctrine and Current Trends: A Return to Doctrinal Roots”, New Zealand Army Journal, No. 23, July 2000  

“The Myth of Air Control: Reassessing the History”, Aerospace Power Journal, Winter 2000—reprinted in the Royal Air Force RAF Air Power Review, June 2001  

“The Air War in El Salvador”, Airpower Journal, Summer 1998—also published in the Spanish and Portuguese editions of Airpower Journal


 "Airpower in Peace Enforcement Operations,” Airpower Journal February/March 1997.  Reprinted in CALL Journal (Center for Army Lessons Learned, Ft. Leavenworth KS, Fall 2000

 

etc etc etc


If this source is not credible enough for you then please explain why? If you just want more information on the subject I have the titles of some books you can go to the library and read but I have to look them up as I don't have them at work here.