Author Topic: US flag (Read 1966 times)

Ripsnort · « **Reply #15 on:** March 04, 2003, 08:39:28 PM »

On the 4th of March, 1789, the day which had been fixed for commencing the operations of Government under the new Constitution, it had been ratified by the conventions chosen in each State to consider it, as follows: Delaware, December 7, 1787; Pennsylvania, December 12, 1787; New Jersey, December 18, 1787; Georgia, January 2, 1788; Connecticut, January 9, 1788; Massachusetts, February 6, 1788; Maryland, April 28, 1788; South Carolina, May 23, 1788; New Hampshire, June 21, 1788; Virginia, June 25, 1788; and New York, July 26, 1788.

loser · « **Reply #16 on:** March 04, 2003, 10:15:54 PM »

Americans are so cute.

Who the fediddle cares if you burn a flag.

Pledging allegiance to a piece of cloth like you would a human being doesnt make sense to me.

I dont want to insult any of my southern neighbours. But it is a flag.

Pledge allegiance to yourself, your friends, and family. (in reverse order.)

CavemanJ · « **Reply #17 on:** March 04, 2003, 11:00:17 PM »

Maybe I'm just an oddball here...

but to me the flag is a symbol of the ideas behind America.

You know.. those same ideas that had the FD/PD folks climbing stairs while everyone else was descending them on 9/11. The same ones that brought folks out to ground zero with food and drinks for the people who were digging through the rubble. The same ones summed up in the words "Let's roll" in an airliner over PA.

Yeah... our flag is just some strips of red, white, and blue cloth sewn together, with white thread used to stitch the stars. But 'fore ya go knockin it, pause a few seconds to think about everything those bits of cloth represent. Mayhap that's why some folks get so bent out of shape when someone decides to burn it, or when others say "It's just a flag."

Toad · « **Reply #18 on:** March 04, 2003, 11:28:25 PM »

CNN - Lawmakers blast Pledge ruling

Quote

The 9th Circuit is the most overturned appeals court in the country and is considered by legal scholars to be the most liberal.

Don't know about this one, but would be interesting to research. Have heard similar comments on the various "news" infotainment shows.

RE: Update on Pledge

Quote

The problem is the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals, the most
controversial and most overturned court in the nation, indeed in all
of our history. 1 of the two judges on this panel who made this bad
ruling has had >>5<< of his cases reviewed by the SCOTUS just this
year, 4 of them overturned, 2 of those by a unanimous court!

Considering the number of cases the court hears per year is about 80,
and that there are over 45 judges just on the 9th Circuit ALONE, to
have that many decisions by one judge reviewed, and overturned, like
that, is a real sign that there is a problem in this court. His cases
alone make up for 20% of the reviewed cases from the 9th district this
year.

The entire court's track record is bad, going back many years.

Well, it'll probablyl make the SC. That's what it's there for. Not a life and death issue.. we got plenty of time.

hawk220 · « **Reply #19 on:** March 05, 2003, 12:27:18 AM »

A quick note, while burning the flag is repugnant on one side, please consider that the freedom to burn a US flag is part of what makes this country great.

Most of the people who think flag burning should be illegal don't seem to have a great grasp on how important it is that liberty apply to everyone, not just the people you agree with.

well said, Chairboy

lord dolf vader · « **Reply #20 on:** March 05, 2003, 10:38:01 AM »

AKIron · « **Reply #21 on:** March 05, 2003, 10:48:49 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Chairboy
A quick note, while burning the flag is repugnant on one side, please consider that the freedom to burn a US flag is part of what makes this country great.

Most of the people who think flag burning should be illegal don't seem to have a great grasp on how important it is that liberty apply to everyone, not just the people you agree with.

I really can't understand why burning a flag is such a great freedom. Is it really necessary for everyone to have the freedom to express their utter contempt for their nation?

I really don't have strong feelings on the subject but I'd like to hear an explanation on why this particular freedom is so important to anyone. I'm not talking about the freedom to dissent in general, just the flag burning.

AKIron · « **Reply #22 on:** March 05, 2003, 10:54:15 AM »

FWIW I think burning the American flag should be viewed as an expression of denouncing and renouncing one's citizenship. Doesn't that seem appropriate?

AKIron · « **Reply #23 on:** March 05, 2003, 11:04:22 AM »

I'm pretty sure I know why many do it. That wasn't my question though. And I disagree that the flag isn't a symbol for the nation.

AKIron · « **Reply #24 on:** March 05, 2003, 11:15:43 AM »

Not to belabor the point Oedipus, but why? Perhaps you already answered with your response regarding defiance of the govt and I missed it?

Frogm4n · « **Reply #25 on:** March 05, 2003, 11:22:12 AM »

our country was founded on decent, burning your own country's flag is a sign that you are really pissed off at its current policy's. Sure there are other ways to do it, but this simple act has far more meaning then anything i could say in words. If i were to go out into the street and burn a flag alot more people would stop and pay attention then if i went onto the street and started whineing on a loud speaker. Because the flag stands for so much is the reason we should have the ability to do what we want with it. It is a tangable piece of american society that we all should have a little piece of.

and in soviet russia flag burns you!

AKIron · « **Reply #26 on:** March 05, 2003, 11:29:00 AM »

Well, one problem I see with your approach to expressing your pissed offedness is that by burning the flag rather than "say in words" that which grieves you, you piss off a lot of other people for reasons you didn't intend.

Better to express yourself clearly, not only if you hope to gain support for your perceived wrong, but to avoid creating animosity against your cause you didn't intend.

Quote

Originally posted by Frogm4n
our country was founded on decent, burning your own country's flag is a sign that you are really pissed off at its current policy's. Sure there are other ways to do it, but this simple act has far more meaning then anything i could say in words. If i were to go out into the street and burn a flag alot more people would stop and pay attention then if i went onto the street and started whineing on a loud speaker. Because the flag stands for so much is the reason we should have the ability to do what we want with it. It is a tangable piece of american society that we all should have a little piece of.

and in soviet russia flag burns you!

Frogm4n · « **Reply #27 on:** March 05, 2003, 11:31:13 AM »

your right akiron, but its a right i would fight to the death to not have taken away. Just like alot of people would with having guns taken away from them. The founders of this country faught and died for us to be able to have these rights, it would be a same if we started passing laws revokeing them.

Ripsnort · « **Reply #28 on:** March 05, 2003, 11:34:06 AM »

Oedipus, I just thought that the ruling, if done yesterday, was ironic in relation to the date the Constitution was ratified in 1789. Coincidence? I think not.

AKIron · « **Reply #29 on:** March 05, 2003, 11:37:21 AM »

Frogman, I too would fight to the death for freedom, generally speaking. But not just any freedom, I'm not interested in using women's restrooms at theaters for example. The right to voice my dissent against my government is an important one. I can do this without burning my flag which I feel stands for more than just my government.