Troops fire into crowd for thowing rocks...

[Pongo]

Well the pentagon will say what ever it has to say to get the best result they can from thier point of view. Truth is irrelivent. they are a war fighting orginization. Watching the comander in charge this AM they had a civy riot on thier hands and then several people with automatic weapons opened up.  The guys on the ground are not martys..they did what they had to do to defend thier postition.
Imagine the alternative of a dozen yanks being dragged arround the streets.

[Saurdaukar]

Very good advise Hortland - in the States, we'd call you a "Conservative."  This is a good thing - as evidenced by the Conservative occupation of the "Right" side of the political spectrum.

[Dowding]

And Dowding - I cant help to notice that its usually the Americans taking the prisoners - not the British - so lets not go pointing the humanitarian stick, mmmmkay?

Explain.

[muckmaw]

Originally posted by Syzygyone
If, as you suggest, the truth is somewhere in between, then you must be assuming that both sides are not telling the truth.  Why do you make the assumption that the military account is not accurate as stated?.  

While I am certainly not one to automatically take the government line as truth, I am curious why we always seem to assume that it's just not quite the truth, especially in this instance with the military vs Al-Jazeera.  Does anything Al Jazeera says have any, ANY, measure of validity to it?  Maybe if you are Wolf Blitzer, or Christianne Amanpour or Peter Arnett.

Just curious why you phrased it as you did?

What I am trying to say is, I simply don't take anything at face value. Of course, I would believe the US government account would be closer to the truth, if not true, than the AL-Jazeera report. But let's face it, both side have an agenda.

The pentagon is certainly not going to open up and say: "Hey, one of our soldiers got nervous, starting firing, and the others followed suit. We mowed down 17 people, mostly kids, holding crayons and coloring books." On the other hand. this is what AL-Jazeera would have you believe.

My point is, both sides have an agenda, and the true account lies some where in between.

Do I believe the US troops fired without provocation? No, but this is a gut instinct.

It's happened before. Who's to say it did not happen again?

I certainly hope it was not unprovoked, or if the troops used more force than necessary. If there were shots fired from the crowd, than the blood of the innocent dead is on the hands of the Iraqis who opened fire.

[NUKE]

Originally posted by GScholz
LOL! You did so in this very thread. You even started of with "If I were ...".

why don't you site an example from any thread where I claimed to know what was going on in Iraq or anywhere else.

While you are at it, you can look up all my "war-monger" posts for SirLoin and Dowding.

[Hortlund]

Originally posted by GScholz
Over here he'd be called a right-wing extremist or depending on the crowd perhaps even a fascist. I'd call him far right-wing, borderline to extremist/fascist.

Funny, because I'd just call you an a..*bites tounge*

Just out of curiosity, can you list the reasons why you feel I'm "borderline fascist" or "right-wing extremist" (wich is just a code word for neo-nazi in Sweden)?

[Syzygyone]

Originally posted by muckmaw
The pentagon is certainly not going to open up and say: "Hey, one of our soldiers got nervous, starting firing, and the others followed suit."  

My gut reaction to this is that is exactly what they would do.  I know they didn't do so at Kent State.  What you describe is exactly what happened at Kent State, as far as has been determined.  I've not seen proof that any order to fire was given.  Just some 18 year old NG soldier got nervous.  While I wasn't there, I am old enough to vividly remember the news reports and the many investigations of that debacle.  But, that was a long time ago in a country far far away.  I think now, with the media so incredibly omnipresent, any smart CO would do just that, fess up, and face the music.  Perhaps I ascribe too much honor  or am being too hopeful.

[Yeager]

Lessons learned:
Throw rocks at people armed with guns and you will get shot.

What is it about being Arab that so obviously seems to predispose one to being an idiot?

[Hortlund]

The message being "We're idiots"?

[Yeager]

Guns, germs and steel.

Read it and weep............

[Fishu]

Originally posted by Hortlund
If shooting starts, lay down. Do not try to run away from the bullets, they are faster than you.

If you fail these simple advice...YOU are to blame for whatever happens next.

One problem... the crowd running from the guns can kill you when they run over you in panic.

For an example, look at the latest panic in disco, caused by a pepper spray - the only casualties came from people running out in a panic, pity them who fell and couldn't get up.

or the early 20th century in Russia, when Czar decided to give free food for the starving russians - the crowds were so hungry they rushed over other people and alot of people died as the result of being run over by the crowd.

If you're in a crowd, which might suddenly start running headlessly, DO NOT lay prone.


Besides some soldiers might have a brain fart and they shoot at the people's legs to avoid death toll rising :>
(And guess which people will get worse hits when bullets are aimed towards ground)

[NUKE]

Originally posted by Hortlund
The message being "We're idiots"?

lol!

[NUKE]

Originally posted by GScholz
To some, but those are not the ones their trying to impress or influence.

Now you sound like you know their thinking and appear act like you know what's going on there. Isn't that what you wrongly accused me of doing?

reach deep into theirs minds and enlighten us all as to what they are thinking or who they are trying to influence.

[Dago]

Firing into a crowd of civilians to kill/supress a couple of gunmen kind of defeats the purpose.

Yeah, better the American soldiers should have just stood up and get killed, so the "innocent" civilians wouldn't be burned by the hot shell casings from the AK47s thier "innocent" fellow revelers were firing.

I am starting to believe you are even less intelligent and more biased than previous posts indicate.

dago

[SLO]

Children.....tst tst.

I really hope there where guns in the crowd.....

at least you can justify said action.....

but I heard that they did have guns among the gathered....

as usual there denying.....

denial....

ain't that a special AMERICAN word:D

now ya gave it to the Iraqis.....