P-47

[SFRT - Frenchy]

Originally posted by Wilbus


P47 accelerates like the devil

I'd take a Jug over a niki or spit or LA7 any day.

You sure as heck don't have a clue of what you are talking about:o  the rest, I agree. Except the D30 will not outturn the A5.

[Hap]

hate to let the secrets of the jug out, but they've been touched on already.  here's some load-out ideas that work for me.


maybe "don'ts" will be useful . . . 1) don't take 8 50's with 427 (or what ever it is) per gun.  1a) try the 6 50's w/267's rounds per gun.  if after several sorties, you find yourself bingo ammo & still in good shape wishing you had more ammo, move up to the 4 50's w/267.  if you've turned into a killing machine, then opt for the 6 50's with 427 rounds per gun.  IF you've become the juginator, then the 8 50's with 426 rounds is your ticket.  mostly, i opt for the 2 smallest gun packages.  

2) don't take 100% fuel.  2a) try 50% with dt.  it's just a smidge less than 75% fuel.  3) don't loadout 2-1,000 lbs bombs, 10 rkts, AND the 500lb bomb.  3a) if you're a divebombing pro try for the 3-500lb'ers.  if you dive bomb poorly, grab 10 rkts.  if you're a "tweener" w/dive bomb skill, 10 rkts, 1-500 lb bomb, 3-50's w/267 per gun 50% fuel.  

last idea which some may HATE.  if you like the idea of flying the jug on fiter sorties, take 50% fuel & a dt, 4-50's 267 rounds per gun then on take-off empty 1/2 your ammo load.  yes, it will fubar your hits average.  but if you don't care, you'll find the jug gets can get amazingly agile.

flaps are your friend in a jug.  1 notch is usu enough to help turn nose down & around in a low yo-yo.

i agree with kweassa

[_Schadenfreude_]

Originally posted by Urchin
Whew, I thought it was just me that thought the P-47 in IL2:FB was modelled kinda like a flying brick.

Yeah if it ain't Sov it probably sucks...

[Red Tail 444]

Originally posted by Stegahorse
For all the advice, no one seems to understand. The P-47D-11 was able to EAT the FW-190A series for Breakfast. It is not reflected in Any arena save one that I've been in and it was an offline game. Nothing out dove it, yet in AH everything Does. The P-47 M was what the 358th Fighter Wing Got when they demanded to keep the T-bolt.  The F4u was first flown by the Brits , and first launched of Carriers by Brits. They Proved that the corsair could not compete with the German Aircraft. They admired the Thunderbolt so much, that they ordered 500 of the P-47N models when the war was moved to the Pacific. The War was over before any could be delivered. The F4u fights so well and the P-47 fights SO POOR   BS!
And I meet and had a very interesting convesation with the man that winged Gabby, R Johnson, Zemke and most every other T-bolt ace in Europe.    His Exacy words"Nothing could beat a Thunerbolt above 27,000 ft."
When we going to see that?

You'll begin to see this when people actually FIGHT at 27K and not dive out when they see a co alt con at that alt. Furthermore, I suggest you read barret Tillman's "Corsair," book. He openly talks about messing with Jug pilots at 15-20k, then giving the 47 pilots the bitd, and rolling away when the Jug pilots hold up their oxygen masks, and gesture to climb out.

And I have to agree with other statements. Plane ability is only as good as pilot knowledge. any skilled pilot can win with a substandard ride, but an inexperienced pilot cannot be trusted even when flyig the finest aircraft in the sky. Just sitting in some rides, especially the Corsair and Jug, will not make you an Ace.

Regards,
Gainsie

[Red Tail 444]

Originally posted by Stegahorse
 "The F4u was first flown by the Brits , and first launched of Carriers by Brits. They Proved that the corsair could not compete with the German Aircraft. "

What the Brits proved is they didnt know how to fly Corsairs

Gainsie

[RightF00T]

If you think taking 2 less guns in the Jug is gonna help you any, you're already doing something wrong...

[rshubert]

Originally posted by -ammo-
Because I want to log in and fly what I want, when I want.  The P-47 is my ride of choice, however I do fly other AC. All the P-47's in our planeset were introduced into theatre 1944 or later.  

I am a full time father, husband, USAF member, and college student.  I dont have alot of time to spare.

Oh. ok.  I didn't see that side of the discussion, before.  Thanks.

shubie

[frank3]

damn this thread is long!

[gofaster]

What about the Ki-44 Shoki? If it were introduced, would it match the P-47 and Corsair in terms of speed and altitude?

[gofaster]

Originally posted by Steve
A well flown 47 is one of the toughest planes to shoot down, IMHO.  I'd love to learn the evasives those guys use...Fantastic flops and barrel rolls.  If I get someone to teach me, I'll  fly that thing full time!

I don't use evasives in a P-47 other than the deflection-shot dodge.  You know the one - the LA7 or SpitIX dweeb is climbing up to you, so you show him your wing tip to lure him closer ("Here dweeby, dweeby, dweeby.") and go into a climbing turn so he'll pull on his stick and bleed more energy.  Then, as he finally reaches up to you and starts to wallow from his lack of speed, you pop a notch of flaps, go into a nose-low turn, and cap his plane with eight .50cals chattering away.  I've tried the same maneuver in a P-51B with mixed results.  It works better in a -47. The worst that's happened to me in a P-47-D30 is I'll lose a gun if the guy actually manages to land a shot or two into my wing.  Even so, seven .50cals are sufficient to get the job done.

Everything else is pretty much the same as the -51, except the -47 has a better chance of surviving the HO merge.

And my MudFlapGirl-gunsightv3 really helps my aiming in the -47.

[gofaster]

Originally posted by RightF00T
If you think taking 2 less guns in the Jug is gonna help you any, you're already doing something wrong...

I agree.  I always carry all the guns, with max rounds per gun.  If I want to do any weight adjusting, I'll do it with fuel load-out.

[joeblogs]

I read somwehere that Republic had already destroyed all the tooling for the plane so they couldn't supply parts.  The P-51 was used instead even though it was not as good a fighter bomber.

-Blogs

Originally posted by davidpt40
Heres a kind of strange question- Why didn't the Air Force use F4Us and P47s instead of the A1D skyraiders in Vietnam?

[Stegahorse]

A Composite of Numbers for the P-47 Thunderbolt in WWII

Year                                 1942                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  
Month                             Jan          Feb          Mar          Apr          May          Jun          Jul         Aug          Sep          Oct          Nov          Dec
Delivered                1              -                 -              5               10              26            38            61             67             66           116          142
Planes on hand                  1        1        1        3        3           5          30        59      177      226       326      442
Planes overseas        -        -        -        -        -        -       -        -        -        -         30      104
Difference         1             1                1             1                 1                5             30           59            177          226            296          338
In Europe        -        -                -       -        -       -       -        -       -        -        -        88  


Year                                1943      
Delivered     170     151            232          244             307            307          382        434            496          496            549          660                                                                                                                                                                                              
Planes on hand                 378     528     678     913    1118    1272    1716    1975    2381    2796    3235    3765    
Planes overseas     187     199     235     325      307      478      653      951    1197    1543    1910    2147
Difference     189     329     443     588      811      794    1063    1024    1184    1253    1325    1618
In Eurpoe     120     176     203     263      307      341      421      653      811     1005    1261    1215  
Pac. Island Hopping         -               -               -             250               -                59          114        107            149           235           367           391
In Med. Theater                 -               -               -                -                 -                -               -             -                -               79           119          299
Far East                              -                -               -                -                 -                 -               -            -                -               60             74            83


 
Year                               1944
Delivered                          651          633           648           623            601            600          600        600            594          494            377          644
Planes on hand    4349    4687    5041    5297    5446    5317    5483    5375    5413    5353    5047    5100          
Planes overseas     2646    2989    3451    3665    4033    3878    4050    3982    3889    3961    3702    3454    
Difference                       1703    1698    1590    1632    1413    1439    1433    1393    1524    1392    1345    1646  
In Europe    1348    1630    1920    1985    1870    1632    1706    1768    1840    1942    1890    1735
Pac. Island Hopping       522          534            741          941          1043          1133        1116      1129          1089        1020            961          865  
In Med Theater               348          379            368          350            371            544          649        697            618          535            545          509
Far East                              97          111            178          224            235            265          254        236            232          240            236          211
 

Year                               1945
Delivered                          480          544            539          591            528            415          305        157
Planes on hand            5011    5133    5306    5346    5595    5595    5408    5308                                                                      
Planes overseas    3329    3318    3628    3621    3696    3521    3372    3111                                                                          
Difference    1682    1815    1678    1725    1899    2074    2036    2197
In Europe    1735    1959    1931    2053    2012    1942    1789    1749  
Pac. island Hopping       811          757            887          932          1047          1094        1226      1329
In Med. Theater              550          360            352          298            280            241            40         -    
Far East                            205          181             330          428           562            553            40         19


Notes:
 Delivered is the number of planes the USAAF accepted
On hand is the number of planes USAAF has in total.
Overseas is number that have been shipped out.
Difference is the estimated number of planes still in USA or in transit.
4 theaters are described by USAAF record plus the 20th AF.
The 20th AF numbers in individual plane types is neglible to the total numbers.Not forgotten.

Notes on other Planes.
P-40 in Europe. USAAF reports 15 on hand in Feb. and March of 1943. USAAF had no others in Europe at any time.
P-40 was in Med. to Aug 44, in Pac. Far East, Burma and China through Aug 45
Production of P-40 stopped in Nov 1944.
P-38 does not appear in China and Burma until Jul 43
P-51 numbers in Europe did not exceed P-47 until after Aug 1945.
P-51 Numbers on hand did not exceed P-47 until May 1945.
RE deliveries by Year 1941-1, 1942-516, 1943-3026, 1944-3901, 1945-1562 =9006 total
RA deliveries by year              1942-10, 1943-1131, 1944-3078, 1945-1997=6225 total
Curtis made 324 trainers.
P-38 was most expensive, P-47 then P-51 least expensive to USAAF of the 3
First OFFICIAL USAAF sorties in ETO was Aug42,Med-May42

Info From AFHRA: http://www.maxwell.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroot/aafsd/


            Wordpad document and does not fit in here well. Will email better copy if needed

[Stegahorse]

William M. Wheeler
Tuskegee Airman
332nd Fighter Group
302nd Fighter Squadron
Lo and behold, along came the Jug! Weighing in at 14,000 lbs., stripped, it outweighed the Warhawk by 3700 lbs., stood 4 feet taller and was faster by more than 100 MPH! What a monstrous fighter! I was assigned to the Jug at Walterboro Army Air Base, Walterboro, South Carolina, where I took advanced combat training. I adapted very quickly to this giant with its "built like a brick (out)-house" fuselage; massive, seemingly impervious construction; ultra-wide landing gear; and its huge Pratt & Whitney radial engine, which could generate 2525 "horses", twice that of my erstwhile love, the beautiful, suave P-40.

That plane took off with so much power and torque, I had to practically stand on the rudder to hold it straight. However, once in the air, it was smooth and responsive and provided so much stability and confidence that I felt invincible and challenged every plane I saw near me. I especially sought out the Vought-Corsairs flown by the marines stationed at nearby Parris Island. They could out-turn me -- but I could outmaneuver THEM. That's where I really learned combat tactics!

[Engine]

Originally posted by Stegahorse

Year                               1944
Delivered                          651          633           648           623            601            600          600        600            594          494            377          644

Just curious, do you know offhand why there was such a sharp production drop in October and November?