Author Topic: Healthcare  (Read 1259 times)

Offline beet1e

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« Reply #30 on: May 26, 2003, 05:34:45 PM »
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Originally posted by SOB
The mere fact that Beetle is against it makes me even more sure that it's a great idea!  :p


SOB
LOL

Offline Dowding

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« Reply #31 on: May 26, 2003, 05:48:23 PM »
There's a guy in that thread claiming £300 a month National Insurance deductions is 'average'. Oh my. That would make the average Briton a £75,000 per year earner. Hardly a worthy example of couter-argument to the NHS. As usual, Nashwan provides a voice of reason in that thread and bats any of the usual nonsence for six.

The NHS has its problems. But while the conservatives would rather cut funding and hope they went away, Labour has made committments and is trying to get a handle on the problem. It has its strengths too. I wouldn't trust any profit making organisation with healthcare - their record with pensions is excellent however - the French system sounds marginally better though.

Having said that, these days most big companies provide health cover for their employees. I do have BUPA private insurance as part of my job and belong to a contributory health scheme for dental and opticians costs.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2003, 05:53:33 PM by Dowding »
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Offline SOB

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« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2003, 06:21:22 PM »
I somehow got lucky and won the "find a part time job" lottery.  I managed to get one that pays well, fits with my school schedule, AND gives health benefits to part time employees.


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Offline lord dolf vader

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« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2003, 08:01:04 PM »
a part time job with health care ?

part time doctor ?

Offline straffo

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« Reply #34 on: May 27, 2003, 01:47:25 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dowding
The NHS has its problems. But while the conservatives would rather cut funding and hope they went away, Labour has made committments and is trying to get a handle on the problem. It has its strengths too. I wouldn't trust any profit making organisation with healthcare - their record with pensions is excellent however - the French system sounds marginally better though.

how ?

Seriously I've heard horrible stories about british  health system stories I've never heard of french system.

Practicaly anyone can have immediat full medical help independantly of the money they have.

Offline NUKE

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« Reply #35 on: May 27, 2003, 02:00:56 AM »
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Originally posted by straffo
how ?

Seriously I've heard horrible stories about british  health system stories I've never heard of french system.

Practicaly anyone can have immediat full medical help independantly of the money they have.


Straffo, that sounds like the same as in the USA, yet we have no national healthcare .


Even illegal imigrants get free heathcare here.

Offline straffo

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« Reply #36 on: May 27, 2003, 02:11:30 AM »
So why are they arguing in this thread ?
(I'm to lazy to read the whole thread)


Seriously mixing of healthcare and economic is a no go for me, healthcare cost will allways increase whatever the politic/strategie  used ...

In fact a healthcare system as an immediat benefit : the lifes saved each day.
We can't say the same of the army.

Offline lord dolf vader

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« Reply #37 on: May 27, 2003, 03:59:46 AM »
rich folks either dont care or dont see people limpin thru life wishing they could go to the doctor. got me i see people just about every day. work with them. hell was one. the fact is the arguments against nation health are the same as rich biased  tax cuts in a recession, just plane stupid.

Offline Toad

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« Reply #38 on: May 27, 2003, 06:08:27 AM »
Yeah, it IS a mystery.

They cut taxes and people that never pay any taxes still get a little money.

People that pay a little tax get  more money  back than that.

People that pay the most tax get the most money back.

I'm so confused. How is it that the people that pay the most tax get the most back when they cut the tax rates? Man, what a deep, deep mystery.:confused:
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Corwin

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« Reply #39 on: May 27, 2003, 08:24:50 AM »
I truly believe we will see nationalized healthcare within the next 20 years and the population curve will drive it there.  The projected budget deficits may hasten the onset.  The fact remains, people get sick as they get older.  We have swelling ranks of boomers lining up for medicare and there aren't going to be enough folks paying into the system in the near term to cover the cost of their entitlement.  The drug benefit is nothing but pandering for the 2004 election to the AARP and we really can't afford it.

How did we get here?  The govt, that's how.  The original medicare and medicaid plans paid whatever they were billed.  This created gross inefficiencies in the sysytem. As the feds woke up and began to see that they were getting taken to the cleaners with rapidly increasing public healthcare funding costs they began to crank down on providers.  As the providers saw their tit drying up they cost-shifted their bloated budgets to the private sector payors (insurance co).  Shortly thereafter the private sector got wise and began cranking down on all sides of the equation (hospital, MD,  you).

It's a zero sum game folks.  Couple that we the fact that there is a clear distinction between what is profitable and what is moral and you have an interesting mix.  I don't like it but I do think it's coming.:(

Offline lord dolf vader

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« Reply #40 on: May 27, 2003, 01:26:45 PM »
like in every other industrialized county on earth from what i can google.


toad you guy is writing checks on a empty account we are gonna have to borrow the money to pay your "tax refund" and your all for that ?

 logic screams balance the buget first then give away the extra right? but there is never any extra with republican presidents. odd that huh?

its just reagans style of spend spend spend on the rich to help the poor suposedly. that you believe that is amazing.

Offline mietla

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« Reply #41 on: May 27, 2003, 02:03:35 PM »
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Originally posted by lord dolf vader

 logic screams balance the buget first then give away the extra right?  


That's easy, stop the insane spending.

Offline Fuzzy

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« Reply #42 on: May 27, 2003, 05:21:10 PM »
In our current state of healthcare, socialized medicine would further tax an already over-burdened healthcare system. How long do you wait to get into your local Emergency Room? How about your private Physician's office? Better yet a specialist? Make it free and watch it get infinitely worse. Imagine not being able to select your doctor or surgeon. Think HMO on a grand scale. Quality care would take a back seat to assembly-line medical care. Doctor's and Nurse's salaries would fall  to even lower levels, causing a greater shortage of competent healthcare professionals. I am in no way saying the current system is adequate, however, socialization is NOT the way to proceed.

Offline Corwin

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« Reply #43 on: May 27, 2003, 05:27:03 PM »
Agreed Fuzzy.  The only two solutions I see are huge entitlement cuts to medicare and medicaid.  Medicare won't be touched as the AARP will eviscerate the pol who sponsors it.  Medicaid probably can't do enough given the pandering the admin is doing with the drug benefit.  The only other way to sustain the present system is to tax the crud out of everyone else while and squeezing the last nickel from providers.

It won't be pretty either way and the sad damn thing is no one in DC is talking about it.