JABO.. get some fries with yer burger, free.

[AKDejaVu]

 

About films/jabo's. I've seen films of both, and historical facts are that there were 190's that were specialized for JABO. With LW being a major player, don't ya think it's odd that we have no real JABO planes, and the Americans have the P-38, DHOG, CHOG, 2*P-47 and P-51?

Actually... I would like to see more JABO planes for all sides.

The thing that I believe is being missed is that 1 bomb JABO was very real in WW2 for both sides.  I believe things are slightly flawed as far as bomb proximity/destruction of vehicles go.  On the other side of the coin, I also believe that people expect it to be very easy to kill a tank given a bomb.  I wonder how many multiple tank kills a single pilot had during a single sortie in WW2.  I think getting a tank would be an event in and of itself.

As far as why the American planes are modeled for JABO... they aren't.  The Americans had better multi-role capability than the Germans.  We introduced fighters that could also JABO.  I'd like to see JABO only aircraft too, but expect them to get slaughtered in the arena that is dominated by fighters.  Their only real role would be in scenarios.  It just doesn't seem to me that HTC is prioritizing these type of planes.  Basically, they are falling into the same category as early war aircraft.

It just seems that in WW2, people had to make due with what they had.  If their plane only carried one bomb, they made due with that bomb.  Here, people complain until they get a plane that makes things easier for them.  Basically, I'd like to see people use even the LW planes a little more historically too.

AKDejaVu

[Staga]

 

Originally posted by AKDejaVu:
Basically, I'd like to see people use even the LW planes a little more historically too.

AKDejaVu

Is the meaning of this you would like to LW use A-8 against 35k buffs or what? Use G-10 only against P-51D and P-47 because Spit IX was out of battle-use when G-10 came in and R.A.F don't have late war Spits yet? Maybe your point is we should use G-2 only against La-5 'cause its in Finnish markings and there were no P-51s or B-17s in Finnish front? Maybe you could be more specific next time?

[AKDejaVu]

The thread is about jabo staga.  No need to get defensive.

AKDejaVu

[Staga]

You got me wrong; I was offensive.
Are you telling you just throwed that up in the air but not gonna specify what you meant?
 
Still waiting that answer  

[StSanta]

AK, when I say JABO, I mean JagdBomber. I.e fighter-bomber. Aka a plane like the F/A-18 Hornet or F-16 Falcon that, after dropping eggs, is a very capable fighter.

I am not talking ground attack only aircraft. And what I'm saying is the ground capabilities of the yanks is incredible in this game. The commies have the worst (none) and even the Japs are better off than the Jerries.

So I am wondering if, given all these JABO capable planes for the US, asking for a LW one *before adding another allied JABO*, is too much to ask for. It seems HTC will now focus on perk planes, so a G8 is not likely for some time.

I'm not complaining because it is hard to bomb in the 190 - it ain't. I'm simply stating that nearly all US planes have extensive ground pounder capabilities whereas the Russkies and LW does not, and I'd like to see this imbalance corrected simply by adding *one* (1) plane to VVS and LW that can carry more than one egg.

Regarding rocket/bombs and tanks, I've read accounts from Wehrmacht tank crew that they feared the allied airpower much more than they feared allied armour - basically, allied pilots quickly gained skill in panzer plonking and got really good at it really quick. I still miss now and then, especially when diving after ostwinds that open up on me, so I think that part is well modelled. Your mileage may vary of course.

Hope this explains my position yet manages NOT to be a total whine; dinnae mean to be a baby.


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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

"I am the light at the end of your sorry little tunnel." - A. Eldricht

[AKDejaVu]

Staga, you need to work on that a bit.. your reply was as defensive as they get.  Once you start saying "what about...", that's defensive.

What I am refering to is the fact that there are LW planes right now that carry ordinance.  I just don't recal the last time I saw one try to bomb a tank.

Like I said, virtually all LW JABO footage I've seen has been from fighters with 1 egg.

St.Santa, I am not familiar with LW aircraft enough to have any idea what you are talking about with the variant you mentioned.  What kind of payload did it have?

That said, how many of the F4u variants had large ammounts of external stores?  How many of the P-47 had the same?  The truth is that the US fighters modeled had better JABO modeling regardless of variant (well.. F4u-1C is a notable exception).  Basically, HTC did not model American JABO craft.  They modeled American planes.  Who's fault is it that they were more versatile than their LW counterparts

It seems you want to pick a specific variant to meet the LW needs.  I don't have a problem with that at all... I'm all for giving the LW pilots something to do.  You guys were left in the cv dust trail.  Time to get you back in the fight

AKDejaVu

[Staga]

I didn't see that "What about" in my post but if that makes you happy...

Why would anyone use LW iron to destroy a tank with 1 quite small bomb (No error marginal)and useless guns when you can take a C-Hog with 2*1000lb which kills if tank is close hit point. After that you still have lots of Hispano-rounds to "share" with another panzers, osties and planes.

How's that ?

[AKDejaVu]

Staga, your whole post pointed out other a-historical aspects of the sim.  That's, in effect, saying "what about...".  Of course, those were all fighter and bomber examples in a jabo thread.

 

Why would anyone use LW iron to destroy a tank with 1 quite small bomb (No error marginal)and useless guns when you can take a C-Hog with 2*1000lb which kills if tank is close hit point. After that you still have lots of Hispano-rounds to "share" with another panzers, osties and planes.

Because they like to fly LW planes exclusively?  If that's not the case, then why would you even bother to post in regards to LW JABO?  I know I'm not currently flying the best JABO plane available because I'm more commited to a specific plane.  I have flown the P-47 on a couple planned-missions, but that is about the extent of it.

I've noticed that alot of the flyers from Finland have an attraction to LW aircraft.  The question is wether or not they are commited enough to stick to their planes through thick and thin, or are simply all talk

AKDejaVu

[StSanta]

Yah deja, you've got my sentiment exactly right; the LW and VVS have been left behind and it could to some extent be solved by introducing easy-to-model variants of existing fighters.

I mean, two 1k eggs, lots of panzer piercing 20mm ammo,  4-10 rockets. Compared to non piercing 20mm, 1 250/500kg bomb. Would be nice to carry more than one egg.

I hope that future maps will not have such a heavy focus on naval warfare and that it rather be relegated to an equal status with land war. Personal preference, but as worthy as anyone elses who pay $30 a month  .



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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

"I am the light at the end of your sorry little tunnel." - A. Eldricht

[AKSeaWulfe]

190A5,A8, all 109 models can carry a centerline bomb more than capable of destroying a tank if you hit it directly.

This is just another feeble luftwhine attempt. <BFG>
-SW

[Staga]

Dejavu I'm not flying in Luftwaffe but in Knightland.
If needed to intercept I'll pick G-10, to tankbusting C-Hog, to dogfight Zero, To bomb what ever looks it could handle the job etc.

Yeah, Talking is cheap  

[Staga]

btw Deja, As you can see I'm from Finland but I cant see how it should affect the plane I choose to fly if what you typed was for me?

Guess I'm just too dumb to see it ?

[Jochen]

 

I've noticed that alot of the flyers from Finland have an attraction to LW aircraft. The question is wether or not they are commited enough to stick to their planes through thick and thin, or are simply all talk

I am from Finland and I only fly Luftwaffe planes... Me and Staga are in same squad but staga can and will fly whatever he likes, it's only me who is obsessed with Lufwaffe planes  

As for commitment... I dont know, it just suits me to only fly planes of specific nationality. Different things for different folks I guess?

I know Fw 190F-8 was not a plane built in big numbers but it had huge meaning for Lufwaffe in eastern front. With Panzerblitz rockets and underwing bomb racks it would be nice plane here also and get some use too. And I know we will get it, someday  

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jochen Gefechtsverband Kuhlmey I/SG 5

Sieg oder bolsevismus!

[StSanta]

Wulfe, my point is that a single chog can take out at least three ostwinds without using its cannons. ANY LW plane can take out maximum one.

It's frustrating when you're striking targets and everyone in the squad hit with their eggs, first vh, then any ostwinds, and still we're one egg short.

Unlike the Hispanos equipped planes, we cannot make some dangeous gun runs and expect success.

You try taking yer whole squad and loading only one egg every time ya try to capture a base and you'll see what I mean  .



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StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

"I am the light at the end of your sorry little tunnel." - A. Eldricht

[funked]

Santa, once again you are revising history.  The Luftwaffe used the term Jabo for ANY single-engined fighter carrying a bomb.  To say that AH has no German Jabos is false.

We still need an Fw 190F-8 though.  

[This message has been edited by funked (edited 01-17-2001).]