Wingless; Again

[Hangtime]

(hang is standing in front of the Bish Procurement Officers desk; at attention... eyes locked front)
"Sooooo tell me; bonehead; where in hell are the wings off ...lets see.. (shuffles AC readiness reports) 356 of MY gawdamn P51's???"

(hang starts to reply; but BPO starts hollering again)

SHADDAP; dammit! I DON'T WANNA HEAR about the cottin picken BBQ'd Mustang parts competition!! Yes! We know the wings are weak; YES! we know you've been makin BBQ's outta the fuselage remanants! What I wanna know MISTER; is where are the WINGS right NOW?

(hang replies) "Sir... ahhh; I suspect the missing components in question are spread fairly evenly between rook and knit land; repectively. Sir. "

"... and just WHAT in hell are they doing there; may I ask MISTER??"

(hang looks around; looks back at spot on wall above BPO's head) Sir; I left em there... I, unnnh, well I figured I'd use 'em like bread crumbs...""

WHAAAAT! BREADCRUMBS??? You freakin moron... yah GOT a COMPASS; dickhead! Cantcha find yer way back here with a COMPASS???"

"...well; nosir; um, I mean yessir; I could use the compass; but well, see, it's like this; the damn joystick wuz spiking; and every time it would twitch above 450 IAS the bleedin wings would peel right off.... and since I wuz usually on the way home with half the damn OPFOR fighter cap chasin my tired bellybutton home.. well; ya see sir??" (hang looks imploringly at the BPO)

"NO; DAMMIT, I DON'T see! Whats the control system have to do with BREADCRUMBS?"

"Well; sir, it's like this.. I figure whoever bolted the wings on the damn Mustang was half crocked or utterly mindless.. the frakin things just fall off at the MOST inopportune moments. I figure if I loose enuff of the damn things; well; pretty soon, when the dolts at the factory decide ta come see for themselves whats wrong with 'em; well; they can just WALK to rookworld or knitland on an uniterupted string of high quality North American Avaition Aircraft aluminum. And Sir; once there, I'm SURE the rooks and knits will be glad ta pin medals on them fer bein so damn cooperative in THEIR war effort; all without even gettin their feet messed up with HT's precious sheep sh_t. Sir."

"DISMISSED!" (hang about-faces, starts for the door) "...and incedentally; that reconstituted Mustang BBQ you sent over to my ex-wifes quarters yesterday??.. well; the legs fell off. Trashed her dates uniform. See that its fixed. Properly. Before the weekend. Clear?"

"Yessir. Would third degree burns next time be acceptable??"

(the BPO smiles) "I see we understand each other. Carry on"

"Sir!" (hang whips up a crisp salute and heads back to the war)

[wizzer]

LOL Hang, I feel your pain.

I had to pay extra, but HT sent me a new bolt kit for my pony. They look like they may have been removed from a oil tanker in the North Sea. To date the wings have stayed on. But those 2" dia bolts are way to long and stick out the bottom causing severe drag. Can't get her over 400 ias.

You might want to investigate the HT bolt kit yourself, but see if he has got the shorter ones.  

wizzer

[Hangtime]

Yah.. the upgrades came in.. worked fine fer a few months; and now we back to poppin wings.

Inspection reveals metric thread components mixed with SAE. Exposed treads are stripped. Studs extend into aileron linkage hoods, jamming ailerons at high G's and air speeds.

*sigh*

Reworking controls so it flys like a Bus.. don't help. Altho I do make a lot more stops per sortie now.

 

[Rude]

In the words of my my man Eric Clapton..."It's in the way that you use it..."  

Been missin ya online Hang...cyas up soon I hope...got power in the old hascienda now  

Later

------------------
 

[This message has been edited by Rude (edited 08-10-2000).]

[Karnak]

Mustangs did have a problem with losing wings.  I don't have my info with me, but I recall a story that went as follows:

A USAAF P-51D pilot was talking to a North American representative who had been sent to Europe to investigate the pilot claims of wing failures.  The North American guy was telling the pilot that it couldn't happen and that they were mistaking the situations in which it happened when a loud BANG-THUMP was heard coming from the far side of the building.  The North American guy asked what that noise was, expecting it be be a German bomb or some such, and the pilot told him that another P-51 had just lost its wings.  They ran around and there was a smashed burning fuselage and two wings which were still tumbling out of the sky.  The P-51 had lost its wings doing a simple fly-by, no Gs to speak of at all.  The horrible thing is that the pilot knew what had happened based on nothing more than the sound of the P-51 losing its wings, he'd heard it enough to know what it was.  That and the fact that the pilot of the P-51 died there.  North American rep went back with some new info and they tried to fix it.  I don't know how successful they were, but I seem to recall that they did fix it.

Sisu
-Karnak

[Bluefish]

While I don't question the accuracy of Karnak's post, this may be carrying historical realism a bit TOO far!  My last four deaths in 'stangs have all involved the wings ripping off, and it hasn't happened once in any other aircraft type.

[Karnak]

I have no problem if my post is questioned for accuracy.  

I don't think that P-51s should randomly lose wings in AH, but its G tolerence might be correct while being lower than desirable.  

Sisu
-Karnak

[Hangtime]

Pyro has indicated in another thread that he will be looking at the pony, and among other things, checking the g stress limit/failure mode on the pony's wings.

The original post above was done back last December I think.. and is reposted above to merely jiggle his arm in this regard. I lost 4 sets of pony wings last night; in circumstances that I can only describe as laughable.. they should not have popped so damn easy.

As far as a historical prececdent for fraigle pony wings.. I'm surprised. I had read no reports even remotely resembling karnaks observation.. and was under the impression that the D model pony had a pretty solid airframe as far as flight stresses were concerned. In same platform comparisions; the D model had more gripes against it than the P51B model did.. my info has it the the late B model stangs were very rugged indeed... with the early D having some issues with the fin strength; and the addition of the dorsal improved lateral stabilty and fin strength.

karnak.. I do remeber reading a report like that on the Sabre, but not the pony. Any chance you could find the refrence?

Which brings up another topic... when we gonna get a B model pony??  

Hang

[Maverick]

To all especially Hangtime,

I posted a thread on this very subject in the Bug thread section of the bbs. I had the wings rip off of my last pony at under 300mph in less than 2 g climb. The last thing I did was press the trigger. As soon as the guns fired the wings went away. No excess speed, no excess G's, No externall ordinance or tanks on the plane, no damage to the plane and between 30% and 50% fuel TOTAL in the plane all internal. I guess the lethality of the 50's is worse to the firing aircraft than anything they can do to the target!

I have not flown a pony since that date. I have severely restricted my flying in the MA as I have a VERY sour taste in my mouth about this issue. I have spent time in TA lately having MUCH more fun doing nothing but stupid TnB with others who don't care about anything but having a good time.

PLEASE, all who feel there is a problem with wing rips, post on the bug thread "P51 Wings need revisiting" and lets get some attention dedicated to this. If it is only limited to myself and on or two others Pyro and HTC can hardly be faulted for assuming it is a stick or setup problem on the computer of the FEW who experianvce this. I do not think this is a small item that should be ignored. I think this is a real bug that needs attention. Please help.

--> Mav13 gets cardboard and magic marker to make a sign. "Will fly for stronger wings"

Even though I put a couple "funnies" in this post I am dead serious about it. There IS a problem and it needs attention.


------------------
 
No Mercy Asked, None Given, Just pass the ammo

[This message has been edited by Maverick (edited 08-10-2000).]

[Ripsnort]

Witnessed by squaddies, I'm in a dive, doing 350 kts..pulling 2 G's, A/C starts violently shaking nose up nose down in little tiny increments, then wings rip off....in a F4U-1C.  When I log off and re-boot, everything is back to normal.

I have 17 deaths this tour, and 10 of them were due to the anomoly above.

[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 08-10-2000).]

[Cobra]

Ahhh...the voodoo -1C doll that I've been sticking pins into is finally working!  

[easymo]

 Ive tore the wings off a spit at 280ias. Was in a spinning dive. did not pulll up at all. Never got the chance.

 The thing that has always bothered me about it, was the lack of warning. There is no over speed sound. And most times they pop off before you here a grone.

 This is like the "dont move the stick to fast" message problem we use to have. What ever triggers the wings comming off, needs to be toned down a little.

[Duckwing6]

LOL Hang your "whines" are the best read of all of them !  

DW6

Note: the use of the word whine above is in no way being meant as inflamatory, insulting or disapproving, it is rather meant that the said whines of other people should be carried out more like the above example!

[RAM]

This makes me remember my problem with fw190A8 2 tours ago...

To say it short:I had 2 weeks in wich every time I went faster than 450mph (and many many times at 350-400) my wings went to take beers leaving the rest of the plane alone  

It was frightening pissing, to go up to 18K in an A8 to dive on a spit and see my wings going away...

After 1.03 I had no more problems with the 190's wings. Broke them once, yes, in a compressed dive at 550 mph when trimmed up in desperation...when the plane discompressed, the wings broke   (as the trimming pulled the nose up at an incredible speed...I must have nearly trespassed the low end of the plane because the G forces       )

So when Pyro looks at it and finds the bug I'm sure he will fix it  

[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 08-10-2000).]

[Voss]

So! Exactly how many 51 pilots are standing down at the moment?