The truth is coming out...

[lord dolf vader]

most of these guys knew he was a deserter years ago. you skipped the fact that it happed exactly when cocaine testing in the military started in his unit! fun guy

[Dago]

Dont' take my word for it... there's a book out.

Now that is the funniest statement I have read in a long time.  If someone put it in a book, it must be true!!  

A gentleman I worked with once told me that Holocaust was a Zionist lie, that the Germans didn't really exterminate  6 million Jews in WW2.  He told me it was a Zionist lie to get sympathy, that the Germans didn't exterminate any Jews.  

Guess what?????   He had a BOOK that said this!!!    So, since it was written in a BOOK,  I guess it is true, the Germans in WW2 didnt really exterminate any Jews in the concentration camps?   Is that what you think DmdNexus?  Its in a book!

Heck, I would think those on the left would be happy to hear that Bush is or might be considered a liar, it would make him more like their beloved Clinton.  


dago

[Toad]

Originally posted by DmdNexus

Yes, Bush lied about serving in the Texas Air National Guard.

He signed up... but he never showed up!

Originally posted by DmdNexus
Add something to refute what I've presented to you...

 1-year gap in Bush's Guard duty

...Those who trained and flew with Bush, until he gave up flying in April 1972, said he was among the best pilots in the 111th Fighter-Interceptor Squadron. In the 22-month period between the end of his flight training and his move to Alabama, Bush logged numerous hours of duty, well above the minimum requirements for so-called ''weekend warriors.''....

...Retired Colonel Maurice H. Udell, Bush's instructor in the F-102, said he was impressed with Bush's talent and his attitude. ''He had his boots shined, his uniform pressed, his hair cut and he said, `Yes, sir' and `No, sir,''' the instructor recalled.

Said Udell, ''I would rank him in the top 5 percent of pilots I knew. And in the thinking department, he was in the top 1 percent. He was very capable and tough as a boot.''

..

Gee, he musta showed up sometime, eh?

And, as always, you foamers bump up against the fact that he got an Honorable Discharge. The FACT that he got an Honorable Discharge which, as a matter of FACT, is not given to AWOL personnel.

So, foam on, dude.

You're sorta the "Old Faithful" of BS. You regularly spout off, spewing this BS and, in the end.. you're just covering yourself in it.

[Thrawn]

I consider this thread a fair time contribution, in light of JBA's recent pro-Bush spam fest.

[DmdNexus]

Toad... directly from your source...

"Officially, the period between May 1972 and May 1973 remains unaccounted for. In November 1973, responding to a request from the headquarters of the Air National Guard for Bush's annual evaluation for that year, Martin, the Ellington administrative officer, wrote, ''Report for this period not available for administrative reasons.''

Even Bush's own spin doctors can not account for his gap in duty.
Sure they have antecdotes... and possibilities... but the facts are the same... he's was AWOL for a year.

As to your comments of getting an honoralbe discharge...
From your source...

"Many states, Texas among them, had a record during the Vietnam War of providing a haven in the Guard for the sons of the well-connected, and a tendency to excuse shirking by those with political connections."

Many Veitnam shirkers got honorable discharges.

How about we talk about Bush's lies... I have many facts to back that up...

How about his arrest record.

When he was first asked about it he said "No he'd never been arrested."

Not "yes."

But "no."

he said "No."

He was arrested for drunk driving. so that would mean that his answer was a lie.

How could he forget that? He ran off the road into a hedge row, and had to have his car towed!!

Have anything to refute that?

Or do you want to call me more names because you can't support your point of view with out tearing the other person down personally?

Have you been programmed by the conservative media just like the rest of the right wing zealots on this board?

Wave the flag... He's our president... he's got to be right...

I don't think so... I think the facts are coming out how much this President is a fraud.

He has his secret service men take protesters to a "protest" area far away from the event, out of sight of the media. Guess what! That's unconstitutional! And guess what the courts say so...
Guess what! The secret service has lost several court cases already and they are being sue to cease and desist this activity..

What is Bush afraid of... why are the conservatives afraid of oppositional discourse in this country?  

Why are they afraid of freedom of speach?

Why aren't 9/11 detainees allowed due process?
What is the Bush Administration afraid of?

Perhaps some of the people being detained... are innocent and had nothing to do with 9/11?

Why prosecute an innocent person? What purpose does that serve other than pollitical "look we have traitors among us... to arms!"

[rabbidrabbit]

I don't think anyone is afraid of anything you wrote dmd.  It's just lame, overbaked , petty.  Please go rant, delude, foam at the mouth somewhere else.  Partisan attack dogs do little for their cause, less for the public as a whole and nothing for the betterment of humanity.  Go hug Al Franken and get over yourself.

[Toad]

Look, Old Faithful, there's NO RECORD of any disciplinary action against Bush. Not even the lowest form of administrative punishment, an Ariticle 15, for his supposed "AWOL".

You'll also note that during that one year period.. which is in the link title I posted... that he was assigned to the Alabama Guard, not the Texas Guard.

He sought permission to do ''equivalent training'' at a Guard unit in Alabama, where he planned to work for several months on the Republican Senate campaign of Winton Blount, a friend of Bush's father. The proposed move took Bush off flight status, since no Alabama Guard unit had the F-102 he was trained to fly.

Alabama would have written up any AWOL charges. BUT THEY DID NOT. Not even an Article 15, the absolute lowest form of administrative punishment.


So you chum are merely a ... what's the word you routinely use... oh, yeah... a liar.

[10Bears]

Urm.. Toad..

Up for a $45 wager he can't show his discharge papers? Or his evalatuon reports?..


Wes Clark just released his.

Muck wants proof Bush lied, he can go back and read the transcripts of the dozens of appearences at fundraisers, State of the Union speech etc.

Went from present tense.. "has".. to past-tense "Had".. mighty quick.  From actual weapons to .. weapons programs.. to intent to have weapons programs..

Went from "all our intellengence services agree".. to "our boys in the office of special plans agree".. to.. "we got our info from the British"..

Okey.. consider this.. If Bush was square with the world.. why is it we are not serving in country with Italian, Spanish, French and German troops?.. Could it be these countries don't like being lied to? Could it be the U.S. are not playing fair with the oil contracts?..

Just asking.

BTW Toad, it's been six months.. Thought you were going to be avocating impeachment if they didn't turn up any weapons?.. What happened with that.

Oh yeah, BTW Toad.. but this is a subject to another thread.. I know the perfect way to get us out of this mess.. With our honor largely intact.. It ain't pretty and it has to be suggested by a Republican.. If you'd like to hear it I'd be happy to discuss it with you.

[Eagler]

get over it (and your bush hating selves) ... he'll be the POTUS for another 5 years

[Martlet]

Originally posted by DmdNexus
 Waaaaah, your candidate beat my candidate.
 

[Toad]

Maybe.

What proof will you accept? I don't have his original discharge papers, so you? I doubt the Prez will send me or you a certified copy of same, so what will you accept as proof?

WMD? Kay's not done yet. Said he needs 6-9 months more. There's stuff in his unclassified report that seems to show that WMD research was ongoing. Do you ever wonder what was in the classified report? I bet you don't. We'll see.

As for the six months, I sent a letter to Bush stating my position as per Nash's interpretation of the wager. It's available to Nash if he wants it.

As for calling for impeachment, if WMD are not found, I'd call for his resignation. If he didn't resign under pressure from Congress and/or the public, I'd then research impeachment.

You see, unlike the foamers, even if WMD are NOT found, I'd be of the opinion that he made an extremely bad decision on bad information. In that case, I'd still want him out.

However, that is entirely different from knowing the truth and lying about it. THAT hasn't been proven at all as yet. Except to those blind to anything except their hatred of Bush.

I mean, it's not proven that he looked straight into the camera, wagged his finger at all of us and outright lied.

Yet.

[AKIron]

Originally posted by DmdNexus
>>He was flying that Delta Dart

Going through training and showing up for duty.

Are two different things.

No, they aren't. Where you ever in the military? Your credibility is in need of repair.

[DmdNexus]

Toad,

"Alabama would have written up any AWOL charges. BUT THEY DID NOT. Not even an Article 15, the absolute lowest form of administrative punishment."

Even the source you cite has his commanders and supperior officers saying they didnt' know where he was...

NO ONE KNEW WHERE BUSH WAS.... EVEN BUSH CAN'T EXPLAIN WHERE HE WAS....

He's a question that is begging to be answered...

Why didnt' they find out? Why didn't his supperiors find out where he was?

I know when I was in the service, when someone didnt' show up for role call, questions were asked.

Could it be because the Air National Guard was sympathic to providing a haven to Vietnam shirkers... and those questions just were not asked back then?

You know that's a documented fact that this happened.

By today's standards, no one would get away with being AWOL - And that's what you are basing your arguement on - which is BS.

Because, during those times, back then in our glorious patriotic history, AWOL was practiced regularly by the ANG and the well-connected.

So what's you're point? You haven't refuted anything by saying "could of would of should of"

Even your own citation argues against your point of view.

The fact is he was AWOL... starting the very same year the ANG started testing for Cocaine and illegal substances.

Motive? Yes... he did not want to get caught using drugs.

Come on... refute the fact that Bush just 3 years ago lied about his arrest record. Or was that a slip of the tongue?

What about the secret service stomping all over the constitution?
here's a link for you....
http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/news/2505290/detail.html
http://www.newsday.com/news/politics/wire/sns-ap-protest-lawsuit,0,7114058.story?coll=sns-ap-politics-headlines
http://www.voiceoffreedom.com/archives/joearticles/usfarrestdismissed.html

Did the secret service not sequester these anti-Bush protestors... or is that more libral media BS?

Toad... let's talk about US citizens denied the right to due process.
How American is that?
US born citizens in jail since 9/11, not allowed to see a lawyer, not allowed contact their families, not allowed to know why they are being held, not allowed to see the evidence against them....

Why is that?

Is this America or KGB Russia?
Is this Cuba?
Is this Iraq?
Is this China?

Is there a Constitution with a Bill of Rights?

Why isn't this President upholding his oath to protect the constitution?

it's ok to hold people for years... with out any formal charges... with out due process right?

Because we know they are quilty... is that the thinking?

Why? Because they have a rag on their head?

Remember shortly after 9/11... Rumsfeild wanted to start a national database of "suspecious" activity... he wanted a 1-800 number so that neigbhors could report rumors about neighbors... so hopefully... he could find a pattern that would identify terrorists... drug users... criminals.. and any one opposed to the current administration...

Eeek! Sounds like how the KGB worked in the USSR during the cold war.

That idea didn't fly for very long... yet he susgested it and was serious...

Kind of scary!

[Skuzzy]

The fire is out and there is no more dry wood.