Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Kazaa on May 23, 2010, 02:20:38 PM
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... and having a single LWM arena over the weekend?
Week days = 2 LWM arenas;
Reset = Friday;
Weekend = large map, single arena = more fun ?
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i say there's already too many people playing on TT... putting it on a weekend would just add to the problem of too many players in an arena.
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No such thing as to many players in an arena! The more players in the more that get to try and shoot me down :)
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Is the problem of too many players really a problem though?
More people = more action + fun?
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More people = a social cess pool
Been there, done that.
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ROFL, you're so unsocial Skuzzy.
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The squad I'm in is most likely to start doing training on Tuesday in the DA or TA due to the cesspool :cheers:
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Keep in mind, I do not make the decisions around here and my comment could be struck down, with a mere keystroke, by the man who does make the decisions.
I am really not anti-social. I am anti-cess-pool.
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I wonder how much the numbers drop off on a TT. I know HT won't give up his numbers. Of course providing those that think that TT is the way to go with hard evidence that it isn't wouldn't work anyway. They'd only say that HT "fudged" the numbers :noid
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don't know about moving titanic tuesday would do,but doing away with caps would be nice.or at least rasing them to say 500.accross the board would be nice.
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this is like asking NBC in the mid 90's to move Seinfeld away from Thursday night.
too many of the old timers here are jaded...and there are other ways to appease them... (open a "Skilled Ace" Arena and cap it at 50)
titanic tuesday is a smash hit...there's no denying that.
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don't know about moving titanic tuesday would do,but doing away with caps would be nice.or at least rasing them to say 500.accross the board would be nice.
Because it's much more fun not getting into an arena with 500 people than it is not getting into an arena with 300 people.
:neener:
wrongway
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Can't the servers support much, much more than 500 players?
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Can't the servers support much, much more than 500 players?
Yes. It's never been a server issue. It's a cesspool issue.
wrongway
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It's a cesspool issue.
total cop out.
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this is like asking NBC in the mid 90's to move Seinfeld away from Thursday night.
too many of the old timers here are jaded...and there are other ways to appease them... (open a "Skilled Ace" Arena and cap it at 50)
titanic tuesday is a smash hit...there's no denying that.
No it is not. Total arena numbers are lower for TT than any other night of the week. It does exactly what we knew it would do and what we witnessed before we switched to the split arenas.
total cop out.
Nope. It is quantifiable. You can chose not to believe that, but that does not make any less of a truth. Do you really think we sit around here trying to find ways to piss off the customer base?
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IMO there is more lag, more glitching, more text buffer delay, more rubber bullets, more lost shots, more warping, more vox loss (across multiple arenas) when TT is running.
Somebody at HTC has said before that the CPU load isn't even close to being pegged, but SOMETHING somewhere (some cog in the system) cannot handle it well.
In my opinion TT doesn't work. It's not the cesspool (although that's a factor) that kills it. It's the fact that it cannot run as smoothly, even if you choose to fly/fight in a small secluded less-populated corner of the map you still suffer.
Moving away from a single LWA was a good move, because the rest of the week these things are scarce, but on Tuesdays it was so bad I stopped playing. I'd be ready to log in, remember it's Tuesday, and boot up Half-Life 2 or something else.
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We need a Snailman pie chart of Monday-Thursday numbers in the LW arena(s). :)
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We need a Snailman pie chart of Monday-Thursday numbers in the LW arena(s). :)
no we dont :bolt:
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IMO there is more lag, more glitching, more text buffer delay, more rubber bullets, more lost shots, more warping, more vox loss (across multiple arenas) when TT is running.
Somebody at HTC has said before that the CPU load isn't even close to being pegged, but SOMETHING somewhere (some cog in the system) cannot handle it well. <snip>
Not trying to take this out of context, but the "something" is usually the local ISP service or the local computer. or both. Now, it is more noticeable due to the fact you have more around you, which also could be suffering the same problems/issues as you.
We are just like everyone else. We are at the mercy of the Internet. All we can do is make sure the servers are not loaded down (they never are), and the local LAN is running smoothly (it always does). Once it hits the Internet, all bets are off. Some will always have it better than others.
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I acknowledge that fact that it might be near my end, and I have had some issues in the past, however the general concensus is that many people experience these effects on TT, not simply just me. People all over geographically, all using different ISPs, all experiencing issues with their gameplay quality.
It seems to affect a wide variety of people consistently.
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I never said it was just you Krusty. How many of those players are all traversing Level3's network? I can tell you there are many ISP's using them and I can assure you all those players could have problems.
That is just one example of a massive network, which is badly managed. They are cheap and that is why ISP's use them.
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Krusty, I'm playing from the UK here, zero hardware issues when I'm playing on TT. Runs smooth as silk for me.
cess-pool comments are making me lol btw. The bigger maps can support TT with ease.
I can't wait for H2H arenas to come back, I'm sure you'll all have fun playing 4v4.
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Most people will not have a problem. The ones that do, make a lot of noise. They really are a small percentage of the overall population. They just sound like a big number.
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Screw this, I'm moving to WarBirds III. :noid
Was a joke btw.
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As am I!!! With life on the line even, I will SAY NO to cesspool's!!!
I am anti-cess-pool.
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well....... I still think there's more people here on TT in that 24 hour period...but I'll leave it at that.
I also know there are a lot of players here who say they don't fly on TT...when the infact do.
I also know that there is a number.......a certain and specific number.......that most likely only HT knows. that number directly represents the amount of NEW members who have to sign-up each quarter to balance out the number of members who leave...before he starts having to cut back. I wont even venture a guess as to what the ratio is of free look -to- paying customers is. thus my desire to forward HT my ideas for getting new customers in here. I think those of you who live in the "smaller is better" mindset need to understand that. loss due to attrition is not anyone's friend.
however....my bigger point is..........and it was made clear today...... MANY people here are very frustrated......that when they find a little bit of spare time..and want to jump in and have some quick fun...the ONLY option is joining an arena with NINE other people in it. there HAS to be a solution for BOTH groups of members here...that much is obvious.
skuzzy..of course nobody thinks you cats sit around thinking up ways to piss people off...the game and the level of service is awesome. I..and hundreds more .. just don't like when we are sometimes in a hurry...and then signing on and seeing an arena capped and locked at 200...and offering us the opportunity to join another one with 11 people. that may be OK if we have big amounts of time...but not if we're trying to get in some fun with only 20 minutes to spare.
anywho......I posted about this three years ago.... I did it again today, because my thoughts have not changed on the matter. and now...I'll drop it.
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I have to say that is no point at all...... BLUE never has 9 people in it other than the morning on the east coast maybe... AND at that point in time, there is plenty of room in ORANGE.
however....my bigger point is..........and it was made clear today...... MANY people here are very frustrated......that when they find a little bit of spare time..and want to jump in and have some quick fun...the ONLY option is joining an arena with NINE other people in it. there HAS to be a solution for BOTH groups of members here...that much is obvious.
Everybody has their own unwavering opinion, but Skuzzy actually has already mentioned less people play on Tuesday's than other days of the week.
Until somebody wants to start tracking themselves (thinking somehow HTC is doing it wrong), this is a moot, not m00t, conversation.
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When I came over from fighter ace years ago, I was blown away by the huge arena. It was good fun and one of the reasons I came over. I think arena caps although theoretically a good idea, are poorly implemented. It's just not fun to have to wait to get into an arena where your squad mates are. I'm sure there's a creative way to get the best of both worlds, but I haven't a clue what it would be.
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You love them more than they love you? What's wrong with everybody moving over to BLUE?
where your squad mates are.
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The way I understand the cess-pool issue is that with so many players the ability to communicate is lost due to the text buffer being overwhelmed.
For those of you familiar with World of Warcraft, it would be akin to being forced to be tuned to the Trade channel at all times. All of your chat with your friends/raid/guild would be overwhelmed by the sheer number of messages coming over the Trade channel. Then you get a few obnoxious people who rile up some other people and the chat becomes dominated by a hostile argument. Trade channel in WoW is a cess-pool for those reasons.
That is how the country channel is in AH when the server populations get too high and it is the same reason most players in other MMOs don't keep global channels tuned unless they are the aforementioned provocateurs.
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The way I understand the cess-pool issue is that with so many players the ability to communicate is lost due to the text buffer being overwhelmed.
For those of you familiar with World of Warcraft, it would be akin to being forced to be tuned to the Trade channel at all times. All of your chat with your friends/raid/guild would be overwhelmed by the sheer number of messages coming over the Trade channel. Then you get a few obnoxious people who rile up some other people and the chat becomes dominated by a hostile argument. Trade channel in WoW is a cess-pool for those reasons.
That is how the country channel is in AH when the server populations get too high and it is the same reason most players in other MMOs don't keep global channels tuned unless they are the aforementioned provocateurs.
1 chan 200 Xmit = 1 perk. Ka Ching.
1 Country Xmit = .5 perk. Ka Ching.
Range, squad, private, mission Xmit = free.
Squeekers... 10 perks per Range Vox Xmit.
:noid,
Wab
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I'm all for the idea Kazaa had.
Seems like it would work, other than a little lag between all the chat.
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1 chan 200 Xmit = 1 perk. Ka Ching.
1 Country Xmit = .5 perk. Ka Ching.
Range, squad, private, mission Xmit = free.
Squeekers... 10 perks per Range Vox Xmit.
:noid,
Wab
And how do new players ask for help?
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I honestly dont care if my computer laggs and the text buffer is full, I just want to be able to climb 500 feet without being gangraped.
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And how do new players ask for help?
ALT F4
:bolt: :bolt:
<G>
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don't mind me boys........I walked into the original Hooters on their grand opening and told the 5 original owners "this will never work". something they remind me of every time I go in there and they see me.
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... and having a single LWM arena over the weekend?
Week days = 2 LWM arenas;
Reset = Friday;
Weekend = large map, single arena = more fun ?
:aok now if only it would happen :cry :cry :bolt:
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Ive always thought Titanic Tuesdays should be moved to Fridays-Sundays.
-BigBOBCH
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Do you really think we sit around here trying to find ways to piss off the customer base?
Not being able to fly with squaddies on squad nights because I can't get into an arena for hours does piss me off. Whether you thought it up or not.
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I know if I forget its Titanic Tuesday and log in to find TT in the list I usually just ALT-f4 and go play with the wife. If I don't forget then I never even get near the computer.
For some reason in Aces High the more players in an arena, the harder it is to find a fight (between airplanes).
I can't be bothered with searching huge maps for what turns out to be a CV parked next to some base as the only furball in an arena the size of a galaxy.
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If you want 1v1's, go into the DA and find yourself a sparing partner.
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If you want 1v1's, go into the DA and find yourself a sparing partner.
It isn't about 1v1s or many vs many. It is about a toxic social environment driving away potential subscribers. It is the chat buffer.
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Not being able to fly with squaddies on squad nights because I can't get into an arena for hours does piss me off. Whether you thought it up or not.
Oh come now. It doesn't take hours to get into the full arena where all the bestest and coolestests poeple fly and sit in the hanger swapping recipes.
Persistence. Ten minutes tops.
wrongway
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I wonder how much the numbers drop off on a TT.
TT is the day one I always make plans to PLAY.
The toxic social environment isn't because of TT... it's because of Ch. 200 and maybe these forums.
Cav
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Oh come now. It doesn't take hours to get into the full arena where all the bestest and coolestests poeple fly and sit in the hanger swapping recipes.
Persistence. Ten minutes tops.
wrongway
I documented a 4 hour wait and sent it to Hitech. I've had no reply to date. This happens more often than you'd imagine. I can open and close AH repeatedly trying to find a point where I can get in and the arena where you guys are will range in anything from the exact cap to 50 over the cap. It is not isolated. I got discoed yesterday and then gave up trying to get back in when the same thing happened for 20 minutes.
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Most people will not have a problem. The ones that do, make a lot of noise. They really are a small percentage of the overall population. They just sound like a big number.
hehe.
I've made that exact same argument on a number of issues over the years.
Alot of people refuse to buy it no matter how true it is. ;)
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ALT F4
:bolt: :bolt:
<G>
LOL you arent part of the game unless you've fallen for it.
I've even seen a couple of vets fall for it.
I always liked the "ha ha, very funny" response they type out when they realize they've been duped come back in.
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I documented a 4 hour wait and sent it to Hitech. I've had no reply to date. This happens more often than you'd imagine. I can open and close AH repeatedly trying to find a point where I can get in and the arena where you guys are will range in anything from the exact cap to 50 over the cap. It is not isolated. I got discoed yesterday and then gave up trying to get back in when the same thing happened for 20 minutes.
Try entering and exiting a different arena instead of closing AH
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I can open and close AH repeatedly trying to find a point where I can get in
It is better to log into the smaller arena, wait a min-2 and then log back out to check if the #'s change.
By doing so you help change the arena numbers.
Is my squad the only one that will change arenas en mass to fly with a squaddie that can't get into a full arena?
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Try entering and exiting a different arena instead of closing AH
Done that. Doesn't work either.
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No Lute its not, but I don't believe that good squadrons like that are all that common either.
Personally I don't ever fly TT, for all the reasons listed, including the cess pool.
I think the answer is to cap the mains at 250, and if it reaches that, lock that arena and open another one with a different map.
So on a busy knight you could have 3,4, or perhaps 5 Late wars.
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Is my squad the only one that will change arenas en mass to fly with a squaddie that can't get into a full arena?
I wouldn't ask mine to do that. I'm not that selfish. Thing is they would if I asked, but me not being able to get into an arena is my problem not theirs.
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TT is the day one I always make plans to PLAY.
The toxic social environment isn't because of TT... it's because of Ch. 200 and maybe these forums.
Cav
Has nothing to do with 200 and nothing to do with the forums. Once country numbers reach a certain point, you cannot communicate due to chat buffer updating speed simply due to the country channel. It doesn't help that you inevitably get a few morons who think it is a good idea to share their "wisdom" about whatever their cause de jour is. That sets off an argument and presto, Country Channel is the same as 200, except it can't be detuned.
While that may be fine for us long time players who are here for the fights, it does dissuade new players on their trials from forking over money to keep playing. You can't just tell them to suck it up and deal either, that just doesn't work.
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More people = a social cess pool
Been there, done that.
Interesting, so is it HTC's intention on starting a 3rd LW arena once the customer base grows? According to the powers that be the major reason we have caps with split arenas is the customer base was not growing.....
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Interesting, so is it HTC's intention on starting a 3rd LW arena once the customer base grows? According to the powers that be the major reason we have caps with split arenas is the customer base was not growing.....
Yes if needed.
HiTec
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Yes if needed.
HiTec
Name change? Just remember you have to keep it for 30 days :aok
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Interesting, so is it HTC's intention on starting a 3rd LW arena once the customer base grows? According to the powers that be the major reason we have caps with split arenas is the customer base was not growing.....
Yes if needed.
HiTec
on a personal note HiTech i think you're to that point, although i cannot see your numbers i can see its effect and i may be off base but is it be time to add another large map rotation with the same exact maps as orange? whenever i log in the cap is to the brink in one arena and the blue arena is very unpopular most times... yes we can fly in Blue but almost NO one wants the easier way out therefore we get the whining about the LW arena caps, so why not add a second large map rotation?
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Name change? Just remember you have to keep it for 30 days :aok
What is your "target" number of max players per arena then? I would say that arena cap should be dictated by the size of the map as well. Why have a 100 player cap on the larger maps.
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No it is not. Total arena numbers are lower for TT than any other night of the week. It does exactly what we knew it would do and what we witnessed before we switched to the split arenas.
Nope. It is quantifiable. You can chose not to believe that, but that does not make any less of a truth. Do you really think we sit around here trying to find ways to piss off the customer base?
the numbers are down because its on a TUESDAY. dont think u sit around finding ways to piss people off, i do think you're good at building a great game BUT also dont think u guys are skilled in expansion either. Considering you've been around for over a decade, been in the business for nearly 2 and still have a relatively small following.
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I have a feeling tw9 that HTC wants it that way, but I could be wrong
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I have a feeling tw9 that HTC wants it that way, but I could be wrong
they've said that in the past, but if that were the case and taking away arena caps does what they say it does then there would be no caps.
seems inconsistent.
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It isn't about 1v1s or many vs many. It is about a toxic social environment driving away potential subscribers. It is the chat buffer.
You can't be serious? This is the most rediculous thing I've ever read posted on this forum.
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You can't be serious? This is the most rediculous thing I've ever read posted on this forum.
Thats how it has been explained Kazaa...
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:rofl So now the chat buffer is the reason.
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Just imagine if there were 6 LW arenas with a max cap of 200 in each........
How pissed off would everybody be? I think that might be too bad actually. Easy to find your friends without a headache and because of the 200 limit, you should always find a fight!
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I don't pay my Aces High subscription fee to chin wag over 200 or read the endless list of "WTG <Insert base number here>" in country channel.
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This wish seems counter intuitive to me. If more players play on the weekends, then it would seem more logical to have two arenas open on Fri-Sun. 2 full arenas = more fun for all. During the weekdays (less players), have one arena.
Sry Kazaa, I think you got it backwards but I like where your head's at. :aok
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the numbers are down because its on a TUESDAY. dont think u sit around finding ways to piss people off, i do think you're good at building a great game BUT also dont think u guys are skilled in expansion either. Considering you've been around for over a decade, been in the business for nearly 2 and still have a relatively small following.
You need to understand that the mmo flight combat sim genre is a niche market. According to an article I read last month, it's total market share when compaired to other mmo games is around 2%.
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This wish seems counter intuitive to me. If more players play on the weekends, then it would seem more logical to have two arenas open on Fri-Sun. 2 full arenas = more fun for all. During the weekdays (less players), have one arena.
Sry Kazaa, I think you got it backwards but I like where your head's at. :aok
That's a really good point Grizz, I'll settle for having TT from Mon to Fri. :D
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That's a really good point Grizz, I'll settle for having TT from Mon to Fri. :D
Mon-Thurs but yeah, it would be nice :)
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:rofl So now the chat buffer is the reason.
You say that as though it is something new. It isn't new. It is the reason HTC has given the whole time. I was being more specific in example that HTC ever is though.
HTC has said that new player retention basically ceases once arena population reaches a certain point. They have said that arena populations of 500, 600 or even 800 are toxic. Why would you think those things are?
I will admit that I could be wrong, but I can't imagine anything else that would be stopping growth. New players log in and see a bunch of love muffines screaming at each other about politics or collisions or what needs to be done to win the war or having killed the only good fight and the chat buff moving too fast to get help, or even effectively put help given to use and it turns them off the game, makes it more frustrating that it already is. Lets face it, brand new players have an uphill struggle as it is with them basically being cannon fodder, confronting them with a hostile environment, not just gamewise, but socially as well can't do anything good for encouraging people to subscribe.
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You need to understand that the mmo flight combat sim genre is a niche market. According to an article I read last month, it's total market share when compaired to other mmo games is around 2%.
yes compared to games that have been around half as long :aok
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yes compared to games that have been around half as long :aok
Yes, but those other games appeal to the mass majority. AH and other games in the flight sim genre are more of an acquired taste.
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Yes, but those other games appeal to the mass majority. AH and other games in the flight sim genre are more of an acquired taste.
Hense the You need to understand that the mmo flight combat sim genre is a niche market.
like you said.
How many MMO's are there out there? How many flight combat MMO's are there? What percentage of that 2% do you think Aces High 2 accounts for?
wrongway
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u sure that was 2% or .02%? Considering the entire AH player base combined (active or inactive) wouldnt amount to 2% of entire MMO players currently online playing their respective games.
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I documented a 4 hour wait and sent it to Hitech. I've had no reply to date. This happens more often than you'd imagine. I can open and close AH repeatedly trying to find a point where I can get in and the arena where you guys are will range in anything from the exact cap to 50 over the cap. It is not isolated. I got discoed yesterday and then gave up trying to get back in when the same thing happened for 20 minutes.
In all my years of dying in AH, I've never not been able to get into an arena. If the squaddies are that important, maybe they'll move for you.
Conversation on squad usually goes something like this.
"Hows the fight in Blue? It's looking kinda poor in Orange"
"Got a good fight between two fields here. Come on over."
Next thing you know, I've got wingmen.
If you are sitting around for 4 hours waiting to get into a particular arena, I'd suggest the problem lies with you and not HTC.
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In all my years of dying in AH, I've never not been able to get into an arena. If the squaddies are that important, maybe they'll move for you.
Conversation on squad usually goes something like this.
"Hows the fight in Blue? It's looking kinda poor in Orange"
"Got a good fight between two fields here. Come on over."
Next thing you know, I've got wingmen.
If you are sitting around for 4 hours waiting to get into a particular arena, I'd suggest the problem lies with you and not HTC.
I used to have this stance also Corky, except when I tried to play mid day and realized that when the caps initiate, there are problems when the masses don't fill up Blue like good lemmings should.
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u sure that was 2% or .02%? Considering the entire AH player base combined (active or inactive) wouldnt amount to 2% of entire MMO players currently online playing their respective games.
I doubt AH could survive with much less than 0.2% of WoW's subscriber base, putting WoW at 11,000,000 and I know WoW is more than 10% of the MMO market.
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u sure that was 2% or .02%? Considering the entire AH player base combined (active or inactive) wouldnt amount to 2% of entire MMO players currently online playing their respective games.
I'm talking about the whole "mmo combat flight sim genre" and not just AH. It could have been 0.2%, I'll need to recheck. But it's a pretty bloody low %.
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Done that. Doesn't work either.
Works for me. Usually in no more then 3-4 tries.
Must be a conspiracy against you then ;)
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I documented a 4 hour wait and sent it to Hitech. I've had no reply to date. This happens more often than you'd imagine. I can open and close AH repeatedly trying to find a point where I can get in and the arena where you guys are will range in anything from the exact cap to 50 over the cap. It is not isolated. I got discoed yesterday and then gave up trying to get back in when the same thing happened for 20 minutes.
Have you ever thought that HTC just doesn't like you. :neener:
I've never waited for more than 10 minutes to get into the most populated arena. And If I can't get to my "squaddies" on "squad night" they usually switch arenas like good "squaddies" and friends would do.....
just saying
#S#
Banshee7
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I have searched for an explanation for the arena caps in the forums but it says I am not allowed to see that.
I know on tuesdays you run just 1 LW Arena and it works fine for me. I was just wondering why the arena caps. I logged on about 1300 CDT today and in Orange around 265 people with it capped at 100. Blue had like 50 people and a cap of 150. This week I like the map in orange a little better because I have become addicted to shooting tanks and it offers a better spot for GV battles. Just curious as to the arena caps and can't find the explanation in another thread or don't know the correct words to use to search. I typed arena caps and it said the thread had been removed or I wasn't allowed to see it.
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Works for me. Usually in no more then 3-4 tries.
Must be a conspiracy against you then ;)
I'm not suggesting it is and it doesn't happen very often, maybe once a month, but it's usually that day I've gotten up at 3am to join a squadnite. It's really frustrating to sit there dutifully bouncing in and out of arenas then opening and shutting AH only to see the caps get worse.
It. Still. Pisses. Me. Off.
Banshee - don't be a knob. You know 71 Sqn are good guys. As I said earlier I don't see why I should drag them out of an arena that has decent fights going into an under-populated one that might have a fight going somewhere if the 20 other people in it don't all log because their milk running is now threatened. It's my issue not 10-30 other guy's problem.
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I used to have this stance also Corky, except when I tried to play mid day and realized that when the caps initiate, there are problems when the masses don't fill up Blue like good lemmings should.
Hard reset at cap change.
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In regards to the whole cesspool thing... Are there significantly more mutings and reports on Tuesday than other days?
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When I came over from fighter ace years ago, I was blown away by the huge arena. It was good fun and one of the reasons I came over. I think arena caps although theoretically a good idea, are poorly implemented. It's just not fun to have to wait to get into an arena where your squad mates are. I'm sure there's a creative way to get the best of both worlds, but I haven't a clue what it would be.
+1 :aok
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I find this to be an intriguing question... But then again, who really uses Report other than to screw over people's chat privs?
In regards to the whole cesspool thing... Are there significantly more mutings and reports on Tuesday than other days?
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boys...boys...boys...
I have solved this issue already....no need to tear apart the fabric that makes this board...and this game..what it is.
WHEREAS, on this 24th day of May, 2010, it has been agreed that there will be two NEW Full-Time operational Arena's:
(i) A "Skilled-Aces" Arena capped at 50. (for the purists and jaded game vets)
and..
(iii) A "Crush-Kill-Destroy" Arena capped at 800. (for those of us that love the mayhem on Tuesday's....but now require that we get it whenever we want it)
This issue is now solved.......please move on.
I'M Here To Help.
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what if theres more than 50 "skilled Aces" that want access? as far as the giant arena with the 800 cap, no thanks you play there,the hordes would ruin that in no time
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what if theres more than 50 "skilled Aces" that want access?
we have files.........and it is a WELL KNOWN FACT that there are only 38 skilled aces here. 50 is sufficient...and it will not be modified now...the voting is already over.
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as far as the giant arena with the 800 cap, no thanks you play there,the hordes would ruin that in no time
................my plaaaaaaan is working perfectly.
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we have files.........and it is a WELL KNOWN FACT that there are only 38 skilled aces here. 50 is sufficient...and it will not be modified now...the voting is already over.
:lol What about limited to koth winners and wabbits only that'll boost the koth events :rock
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:lol What about limited to koth winners and wabbits only that'll boost the koth events :rock
GREAT NEWS...I just got off the phone with the other members of the AH Player Advisory Board...and we have agreed to capping the "Skilled Aces Arena" at 60.
I give because I love.
you're welcome.
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No it is not. Total arena numbers are lower for TT than any other night of the week. It does exactly what we knew it would do and what we witnessed before we switched to the split arenas.
Nope. It is quantifiable. You can chose not to believe that, but that does not make any less of a truth. Do you really think we sit around here trying to find ways to piss off the customer base?
There are a lot of TT whiners, and I don't understand them because:
1) I believe there are no server isues, lag issues, because you've explain the sever speed thing a hundred times and it makes perfect sense.
2) On a big map on TT there is action at maybe 20% (up from the usual 5% of the fields. Seems like there's plenty of room to avoid being horded, ganged etc.
Why don't the folks that hate crouds, move to the 80% of the big map that has no one on it. Why do they go where the huge Dar bars are and then complain it too crouded? (I got horded, I got gang-targted, blah, blah).
Skuzzy,
Can you explain what you mean by cespool? And how TT is a more of a cesspool than split MA days? As above, behavioral differences, backed by the stats, would be appreciated. I've heard a thousand 'opinions', and am not looking for another one of those.
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Another question:
What is the ratio of rotating maps created before and after the arena split?
It seems like a few of them were designed with one thing in mind, and forced to exist in a very different environment.
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You say that as though it is something new. It isn't new. It is the reason HTC has given the whole time. I was being more specific in example that HTC ever is though.
HTC has said that new player retention basically ceases once arena population reaches a certain point. They have said that arena populations of 500, 600 or even 800 are toxic. Why would you think those things are?
I will admit that I could be wrong, but I can't imagine anything else that would be stopping growth. New players log in and see a bunch of love muffines screaming at each other about politics or collisions or what needs to be done to win the war or having killed the only good fight and the chat buff moving too fast to get help, or even effectively put help given to use and it turns them off the game, makes it more frustrating that it already is. Lets face it, brand new players have an uphill struggle as it is with them basically being cannon fodder, confronting them with a hostile environment, not just gamewise, but socially as well can't do anything good for encouraging people to subscribe.
I believe I have heard this reason before.
I'll again make the suggestion to have a 'New Player' arena. Where new players can learn how to fly the play and use there view system and get the feel for the things the have to master against other new players. The training arena and offline practice arena do not provide what new players want. Excitement. In a Single MA, noobs will go where the action is, they will be overwhelmed and quit.
In a new player arena they will learn against other players who are learning as well. This is key because they will be able to have early success, which in turn will keep them interested and motivated to stay with the game and get better. They can still use the training arena, etc to learn from the experts and develop their skill. Also, Trainers and others who sign up could have access to provide, experience players to the mix in a constructive way. Once the new players reach a certain rank or number of hours in the New Player arena, that unlocks the MA. Since I'm all for liberty and freedom, and don't believe anyone should be kept from the MA, they can unlock it by reading and checking a waver page that explains the MA's tough environment and that it should be attempted by only when a certain skill level is reached (in the New Player) , but let the guy in if he so chooses. Once there, if he's getting pounded, and learned the error of his ways, he might go back and earn his wings in the "New Player" Arena.
the MMO's and many online games make use of 'Levelling up' as a very effective marketing tool. I think new players would strongly relate to the concept. Also, the success new players would have would get them hooked, and the idea that there was bigger more deadly arena waiting for them would feed their interest. Most popular titles are like that. First board is get your feet wet, learn some of the tools and learn/improve as you go by being exposed to an evermore complex and difficult game.
The MA is harsh. All the weapons, all the tactics, all the skill level of players with years under their belts, the trashtalking, squads, missions, etc. It's overwhelming, and new players get it all at once which is why retention of new players is low.
HTC's solution seems to be to dilute the actions so new players have a chance, but the side effects are obvious. And is it really working? How is new player retention?
I submit a strategy change may be in order. There are 4 arenas with extremely low usage (one of the WWI, EW, MW, AvA). Perhaps one could be converted to 'New Player" arena. If it's true HTC discouraes large arena's becaue it drives noobs out of the game. This might be a better alternative.
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and to avoid some dweeb wanting to prove something goes in there and kills everybody and demands to be known as a king, maybe once you reach a certain "level" of skill then you wont be allowed in there, unless you are a trainer.
semp
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and to avoid some dweeb wanting to prove something goes in there and kills everybody and demands to be known as a king, maybe once you reach a certain "level" of skill then you wont be allowed in there, unless you are a trainer.
semp
AW had a newbie arena and everyone was allowed to fly in there but to keep the veteran players from using it as their own clubbing ground, as soon as you hit 10k points all of your weapons became disabled. It kept the arena clear for the most part of veterans using it to club the baby seals.
ack-ack
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I believe I have heard this reason before.
I'll again make the suggestion to have a 'New Player' arena. Where new players can learn how to fly the play and use there view system and get the feel for the things the have to master against other new players. The training arena and offline practice arena do not provide what new players want. Excitement. In a Single MA, noobs will go where the action is, they will be overwhelmed and quit.
In a new player arena they will learn against other players who are learning as well. This is key because they will be able to have early success, which in turn will keep them interested and motivated to stay with the game and get better. They can still use the training arena, etc to learn from the experts and develop their skill. Also, Trainers and others who sign up could have access to provide, experience players to the mix in a constructive way. Once the new players reach a certain rank or number of hours in the New Player arena, that unlocks the MA. Since I'm all for liberty and freedom, and don't believe anyone should be kept from the MA, they can unlock it by reading and checking a waver page that explains the MA's tough environment and that it should be attempted by only when a certain skill level is reached (in the New Player) , but let the guy in if he so chooses. Once there, if he's getting pounded, and learned the error of his ways, he might go back and earn his wings in the "New Player" Arena.
the MMO's and many online games make use of 'Levelling up' as a very effective marketing tool. I think new players would strongly relate to the concept. Also, the success new players would have would get them hooked, and the idea that there was bigger more deadly arena waiting for them would feed their interest. Most popular titles are like that. First board is get your feet wet, learn some of the tools and learn/improve as you go by being exposed to an evermore complex and difficult game.
The MA is harsh. All the weapons, all the tactics, all the skill level of players with years under their belts, the trashtalking, squads, missions, etc. It's overwhelming, and new players get it all at once which is why retention of new players is low.
HTC's solution seems to be to dilute the actions so new players have a chance, but the side effects are obvious. And is it really working? How is new player retention?
I submit a strategy change may be in order. There are 4 arenas with extremely low usage (one of the WWI, EW, MW, AvA). Perhaps one could be converted to 'New Player" arena. If it's true HTC discouraes large arena's becaue it drives noobs out of the game. This might be a better alternative.
People with new ideas like this always seem to miss the key issue,ignore our posts and why we do things, and then try shove what they want off on someone else. The dynamics you miss are staggering.
1. The new player arena would be much smaller and would barely effect the none free arena.
Your rpg example would prevent new and low level players from playing together. This is typicly not done in RPG leveling games.
Having a new player arena would pretty much eliminate help from other players on how things work, hence nobody would know anything in that arena.
It would instantly put a bad taste in new players mouths in that the marketing would say free play, but was limited only to a "Lessor" arena.
this is only a start on the new player arena.
The other issues you ignore.
You have still hit a glass ceiling in the main, if you do not understand that there is a point at which how many players are in one arena starts making the game play less fun.
If you do not agree with this premise, then why would you wish to have a new player arena in the first place. So what you saying is the new player has fun in the new player arena, but once he subscribes he now goes into the same overcrowded arena and then quits for the same reason, HE WAS NOT HAVING FUN IN AN OVER CROWDED ARENA!
So now you have lost more people do to the issue of new people only arena and people not helping them.
You have lost more people do to having to make new friends and learn a new game play methodology again after just subscribing.
You have not solved the fundamental problem of over crowding in the arena, hence less fun, and hence less subscription.
HiTech
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People with new ideas like this always seem to miss the key issue,ignore our posts and why we do things, and then try shove what they want off on someone else. The dynamics you miss are staggering.
1. The new player arena would be much smaller and would barely effect the none free arena.
Your rpg example would prevent new and low level players from playing together. This is typicly not done in RPG leveling games.
Having a new player arena would pretty much eliminate help from other players on how things work, hence nobody would know anything in that arena.
It would instantly put a bad taste in new players mouths in that the marketing would say free play, but was limited only to a "Lessor" arena.
this is only a start on the new player arena.
The other issues you ignore.
You have still hit a glass ceiling in the main, if you do not understand that there is a point at which how many players are in one arena starts making the game play less fun.
If you do not agree with this premise, then why would you wish to have a new player arena in the first place. So what you saying is the new player has fun in the new player arena, but once he subscribes he now goes into the same overcrowded arena and then quits for the same reason, HE WAS NOT HAVING FUN IN AN OVER CROWDED ARENA!
So now you have lost more people do to the issue of new people only arena and people not helping them.
You have lost more people do to having to make new friends and learn a new game play methodology again after just subscribing.
You have not solved the fundamental problem of over crowding in the arena, hence less fun, and hence less subscription.
HiTech
You owned him very nice
WTG Hitech <S> ow
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Dale,
first, thanks for the response. Let me clarify by answering your points.
1. The new player arena would be much smaller and would barely effect the none free arena.
Is this a typo, I have no idea what a 'none free Arena" is.
Your rpg example would prevent new and low level players from playing together. This is typicly not done in RPG leveling games.
How so? It precisely means new and low level players would play together.
Having a new player arena would pretty much eliminate help from other players on how things work, hence nobody would know anything in that arena.
Perhaps. it depends on how many of the trainers, registered experts would go over to that arena to lend expertise. (ilo of flaming)
It would instantly put a bad taste in new players mouths in that the marketing would say free play, but was limited only to a "Lessor" arena.
it's not limited. The guy could read and click the waiver....or maybe you skipped that part of my post.
You have still hit a glass ceiling in the main, if you do not understand that there is a point at which how many players are in one arena starts making the game play less fun.
Many of your customers don't agree with you, which is the reason this and many threads like it keep the boards busy.
...then why would you wish to have a new player arena in the first place. So what you saying is the new player has fun in the new player arena, but once he subscribes he now goes into the same overcrowded arena and then quits for the same reason, HE WAS NOT HAVING FUN IN AN OVER CROWDED ARENA!
I'm suggesting that they aren't quitting because it's crowded, but that they aren't yet ready to handle a crowd of ace pilots.
So now you have lost more people do to the issue of new people only arena and people not helping them.
this is where I'd have my trainers and volunteers, with a specific goal of being in the arena for instruction, not kill scoring.
You have lost more people do to having to make new friends and learn a new game play methodology again after just subscribing.
Of course you make friends with the new people in the new player arena, and the MA should you choose to go straight there.
You have not solved the fundamental problem of over crowding in the arena, hence less fun, and hence less subscription.
I wasn't trying to. I think crowds are great. I think I was solving the problem of retaining new players because it was suggested that you implemented the split MA policy because of the environment that crowds have on new players. If you are saying that crowds just plain ruin game play, it has not been explained, by you, why that is.
Vinkman
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and to avoid some dweeb wanting to prove something goes in there and kills everybody and demands to be known as a king, maybe once you reach a certain "level" of skill then you wont be allowed in there, unless you are a trainer.
semp
that's the idea Semp :aok
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this is the one that's disturbing to me....
"You have still hit a glass ceiling in the main, if you do not understand that there is a point at which how many players are in one arena starts making the game play less fun."
at least I understand where it's coming from now. I'll respectfully disagree with it..and drop it.
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See Rule #4
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Vink wrote:
I wasn't trying to. I think crowds are great. I think I was solving the problem of retaining new players because it was suggested that you implemented the split MA policy because of the environment that crowds have on new players. If you are saying that crowds just plain ruin game play, it has not been explained, by you, why that is.
we have explained it many many times, go do some research because even if we explain it again you still will not believe the simple facts.
More people have fun, HTC makes more money.
When I have a choice of creating more fun or not, what do you believe I will always choose.
Is it possible I put my money where my mouth is when I do research on arena changes and the effect of that arena change along with all other things we do?
HiTech
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there is a point at which how many players are in one arena starts making the game play less fun.
HiTech, can we agree that this *point* in which the game play starts to decline varies based on map size? If we can agree on that, then shouldn't there be an emphasis placed on which maps are in play? When there are two giant maps in each orange and blue where each has more bases than players, game play "fun factor" has not hit the minimum in either arena.
I've said this before (Along with many others) and I'll say it again, the simplest thing, which puzzles me why it hasn't been implemented yet, is always having a 'small' map in blue. Not only does this give players the choice of if they want to play on a small map or a large one, it also allows Blue to achieve a fun atmosphere without a very large player demand.
If I am incorrect in this assessment and am missing a key point, I am all ears, but have yet to hear a reason why this would be a bad idea.
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HiTech, can we agree that this *point* in which the game play starts to decline varies based on map size? If we can agree on that, then shouldn't there be an emphasis placed on which maps are in play? When there are two giant maps in each orange and blue where each has more bases than players, game play "fun factor" has not hit the minimum in either arena.
I've said this before (Along with many others) and I'll say it again, the simplest thing, which puzzles me why it hasn't been implemented yet, is always having a 'small' map in blue. Not only does this give players the choice of if they want to play on a small map or a large one, it also allows Blue to achieve a fun atmosphere without a very large player demand.
If I am incorrect in this assessment and am missing a key point, I am all ears, but have yet to hear a reason why this would be a bad idea.
No it does not always make a difference on bigger maps. Past a certain point making maps bigger does not allow for more players.
First, we used to play only small maps, players asked to also have the bigger maps included,so now there is a mixture.
2nd it does not change the problem of people not being able to get into a full arena.
3d When 1 arena is a large map and the other is a small one (this currently happens) has it changed the issue in any way?
And multiple arenas is here to stay, the only issue is different ways to split the populations reasonably equaly. I may try just simple multiple arenas all at 150.
HiTech
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No it does not always make a difference on bigger maps. Past a certain point making maps bigger does not allow for more players.
I agree, however, it takes more players on the large maps, i.e., Ozkansas, trinity, compello(i believe), for there to be enough players to sustain a fun level of gameplay.
2nd it does not change the problem of people not being able to get into a full arena.
No it does not. I think the Cap system you guys have developed is pretty good. The pros outweigh the cons but there will always be whines. I've suggested 3 things in the past and I will type them up again.
1) A note on the startup screen next to the arenas that says something to the extent of "What are arena caps"? Clicking on it will give the player a detailed explanation on the system so there is a better understanding. That would cut the whines to a fraction right there.
2) Caps times need to vary based on the time of week. Week day cap initiation times should not be the same as weekend initiation times. I can't say the exact times because I don't have the hard statistics, but generally speaking, weekday cap times should start a few hours later than they do currently, and weekend should start either slightly earlier or stay where they are at.
3) Blue needs to be a small map. The minimum number of players needed to sustain healthy play is always a small number on smaller maps, because the players won't be spread out as much. It will be easier to find action. If you combine this with more efficient cap times based on the time of week, you will have the blue arena fill up quicker AND to the point of 'minimum sustainability' that much quicker, hence minimizing the problem.
I may try just simple multiple arenas all at 150.
HiTech
Please don't.
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HT I really Don't want to search through 8 pages, but what would be wrong with Kaz's idea for one arena over the weekend?
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There is a "New Player Arena". It's Fighter Town Lake in the DA.
You can tell FT graduates when they come into the MA's. Their best move is to HO and HO often. Pick and Pick often. Fly in packs and help make hoards. With time they assimilate into the MA culture and find a squad. But, the FT graduates do learn all the mechanics they need to function in the MA's. In FT everyone is good about answering questions along with developing their ch200 attitiude for the MA's. It's not the TA but, it's closer to the idea of AW's relaxed realism arena then you would think.
By hosting a forum so subscribers can whine or toss around game ideas HiTech is showing he's not blind to subscriber input and wants to keep abreast of the communities feelings. It's sad sometimes seeing that he and the HTC staff have to wear Mecha Armor and carry a power prod just to have civillised conversations with some of us.
We are very good at telling HiTech what he should do to make us happy campers. In most cases he would go broke if he tryed to COAD every whim that each of us can come up with. Especially with so many of us knowing how to A thru Z run a company and produce a product like his. Eventualy to impliment all of our whims he would have to put up as many arenas as there are players. How many of you really enjoyed playing in those hacked HtH free 8 man arenas run by sqweeker meglomaniacs? It's probably a good thing the arenas he makes available to us are the current product of his best work over the last 20 years.
Some of you spend so much time being unhappy with HiTech's work. Then there are players like Grizz who make lemonade with lemons then find players with Vodka to party. How many of you have ever asked HiTech "how can we help make this easier for you?"
HiTech common put up a 16 color arena with 2D terrain and permenant stall limiter. It's hard for these numpties to appreciate where they are if they have never experienced where it all came from...... :aok
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If the majority of players are heading to the more populated arena does it not seem like thats what the most players want. More players and not less to fly around with. They have a choice now to go to the less populated arenas and they do not.
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HT I really Don't want to search through 8 pages, but what would be wrong with Kaz's idea for one arena over the weekend?
This wish seems counter intuitive to me. If more players play on the weekends, then it would seem more logical to have two arenas open on Fri-Sun. 2 full arenas = more fun for all. During the weekdays (less players), have one arena.
Sry Kazaa, I think you got it backwards but I like where your head's at. :aok
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Hitech I was serious about a hard reset when caps change.
No more whines about 250/100.
Though whines about the daily boot will commence. :devil
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If the majority of players are heading to the more populated arena does it not seem like thats what the most players want. More players and not less to fly around with. They have a choice now to go to the less populated arenas and they do not.
It's amazing to me that Hitech and company even take the time to reply. It's been explained a thousand times. They've done their research, been at this business far longer then any of the players, folks keep trying to tell them they have the wrong answer.
Just because sheep follow the flock off the cliff doesn't mean the shepherd should drive them towards the cliff.
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Given that greater mass communication in large arenas = greater tendency to cesspool
why not create a max range for channels like 200 such that it can be set under arena properties. Then from a coms (cesspool tendancy) point of view a single large arena (always accessable to all) is split into smaller zones of mass communication with lower cesspool tendency.
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I suppose it could go either way. More people in 1 arena could be more fun...usually more people means more squaddies on, and problems getting into the arena during the 'best' time to play, with squad members.
But I see the other way...more people, two arenas, less people, one arena.
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It's amazing to me that Hitech and company even take the time to reply. It's been explained a thousand times. They've done their research, been at this business far longer then any of the players, folks keep trying to tell them they have the wrong answer.
Just because sheep follow the flock off the cliff doesn't mean the shepherd should drive them towards the cliff.
I haven't told them how they should do anything just pointing something out. If they don't change the arenas it wont bother me.
It could be explained a million times it does not hurt to bring it up as a topic of discussion on a forum for general discussion.
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I love TT just the way it is now its the one day of the week I make shore I can play its also my squads, squad night. being a dedicated GVer I can almost always find a good fight during TT other days of the week not so much.
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I agree, however, it takes more players on the large maps, i.e., Ozkansas, trinity, compello(i believe), for there to be enough players to sustain a fun level of gameplay.
No it does not. I think the Cap system you guys have developed is pretty good. The pros outweigh the cons but there will always be whines. I've suggested 3 things in the past and I will type them up again.
1) A note on the startup screen next to the arenas that says something to the extent of "What are arena caps"? Clicking on it will give the player a detailed explanation on the system so there is a better understanding. That would cut the whines to a fraction right there.
2) Caps times need to vary based on the time of week. Week day cap initiation times should not be the same as weekend initiation times. I can't say the exact times because I don't have the hard statistics, but generally speaking, weekday cap times should start a few hours later than they do currently, and weekend should start either slightly earlier or stay where they are at.
3) Blue needs to be a small map. The minimum number of players needed to sustain healthy play is always a small number on smaller maps, because the players won't be spread out as much. It will be easier to find action. If you combine this with more efficient cap times based on the time of week, you will have the blue arena fill up quicker AND to the point of 'minimum sustainability' that much quicker, hence minimizing the problem.
Please don't.
+1. Items 1 and 2 I agree with and support as an improvement to my situation and the other players I regularly play with. Item 3 I support but would like to argue that: a) Compared to the number of available/current large and medium-large maps in rotation, there are very few small or medium-small maps in the roation. More smaller maps in the rotation I feel means more small maps will be randomly hosted instead of the larger variety we see more often. b) If smaller maps are actually in the rotation as much as the larger maps, then I'm (and many others) are not seeing it. This either because they are hosted and then defeated/rotated very quickly or we just have bad luck. If they are being hosted 1 for 1 with the larger maps, then I wholey agree that one arena should constantly host small maps so that way everyone has a chance to participate in them when they can.
Lastly, I want it stressed here as it has been brought up but I don't think everyone has let it sink in: The "debate" on arena caps is more of a debate on "how many players is too many". This varies from one players opinion to another, in addition to radicaly varying as we take into account map sizes and time of the day. It's most likely an argument with no certain agreeable end, so if you can't think and contribute positively then please don't.
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Vink wrote:
we have explained it many many times, go do some research because even if we explain it again you still will not believe the simple facts.
Not sure where you got your impression of me, but I will understand and believe something if you tell it to me. My bad for not researching your previous explanations on tipping points.
I still think you might be missing an opportunity on retention of new players. But since this is really a thread about having a single Large MA, and since I think you're saying the decision on split arena's has nothing to do with new player retention, I'll end this discussion in this thread.
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I still think you might be missing an opportunity on retention of new players. But since this is really a thread about having a single Large MA, and since I think you're saying the decision on split arena's has nothing to do with new player retention, I'll end this discussion in this thread.
I see once again you do not wish to find the answer to your question by doing a few searches. And you have it completely backward we retain more players with a split arena, this is not debatable but a proven fact.
HiTech
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this is not debatable but a proven fact.
proven by what? you're numbers? or what we can see with our own eyes? because honestly the 2 dont agree. If AH was doing any good with retention the numbers on avg would be much better than what they are now. Ive went on hiatus a few times with 1 to 2 year gaps. Each time there would be an influx of new players with quite a few of the old missing. Each time more and more of those players dont play. Now I barely recognize anyone including most of the current top sticks. And the avg peak time is only slightly more than it was say 5 years ago. So where exactly is the retention? and how is it any different than pre-split?
think the growth you contribute to split arena's is quite overrated and is probably contributed to something else. IE cheaper top of the line PC's now a days compared to back when the split started. I know i wasnt the only player that needed a new pc when AH2 came out. I spent 1k on my 1st post ah2 box and 3k on the next. The one i use now cost me a tad over 500 shipped. Thats just 1 idea. Theres probably a few more that would contribute much more than watering down your game play would.
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at the risk of beating a dead horse....perhaps a customer email survey would be a good idea.
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proven by what? you're numbers? or what we can see with our own eyes?
What kind of foolishness is this? Of course it is proven out by his numbers -- you know, the ones that count: paid subscriptions. No other proof is needed. As long as people pay for their subscription, all is well. (And, no, I am not advocating anyone quit).
Not to mention that recollection of what the numbers were like before and after the split are very different from yours. I generally only fly weekends, and the combined flyers of all the arenas far outnumber what I remember a typical Saturday night before the split.
Look -- some people are clearly annoyed by an arena cap -- but business is about numbers. If a change makes it so 3 subscriptions are added while 1 current subscriber gets annoyed enough to quit -- it is still a good business decision. And if someone is ready to quit over something as minor as these arena caps, I would wager they have much bigger problems with the game (i.e. burnout), and the caps are just the convenient excuse.
my $0.02
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What kind of foolishness is this? Of course it is proven out by his numbers -- you know, the ones that count: paid subscriptions. No other proof is needed. As long as people pay for their subscription, all is well. (And, no, I am not advocating anyone quit).
Not to mention that recollection of what the numbers were like before and after the split are very different from yours. I generally only fly weekends, and the combined flyers of all the arenas far outnumber what I remember a typical Saturday night before the split.
There has been growth but is hasnt been drastic. 50-100 on avg over a 5+ year span. and this (slight) growth is directly contributed to arena's caps? whatever foolishness u speak of is not coming from this direction.
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There has been growth but is hasnt been drastic. 50-100 on avg over a 5+ year span. and this (slight) growth is directly contributed to arena's caps? whatever foolishness u speak of is not coming from this direction.
Are you saying you have access to HiTech's subscription list, and that you know for a fact it has grown by only 100 in 5 years? :lol
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See Rule #4
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To Hitech
Player Rentention:
You say that having split arena's help keep players in I'll agree with that. But I'll also agree with what Grizz says about the blue arena being less fun.
Orange-primary arena - only because it's always the one that is capped
Blue-secondary arena - most always has the lesser numbers
Orange- is always a lot of fun because of the player base and some great furballs, gv battles at times, all around is a great place to play.
Blue- normally boring and when orange is capped and the only place to play I normally go to the lake and mess around with 30mm's
On any given night we normally have about 400 or so people on. TT normally alittle more. I believe with alittle changes and marketing it would grow very quickly and exceed 5,000 players with ease.
Have you ever read the book Think and Grow Rich by Napolean Hill, if not I recommend it. One of my favorite books of all times not for the wealth part but for the one thing that has stood the test of time for growth of any business - mastermind group and 13 principles.
I'm not telling you how to do your business only offering suggestions for growth as I'm sure you could use some more money without much work.
The fastest growing companies for the most part on the nyse are MLM companies. Why because they use 1v1 sales - person to person marketing
Is there anything wrong with a 30 sec commecial- no but what's your retention when those people sign up my guess is around 5%
Suggestions:
Write a book on your preivous experience with the games you've created- your experience in the field of aircraft- your future goals in the industry ect. publish the book have AH website address of course. That's uses your time 1 time and lasts forever. I've done that in the past and I'm a published author myself. After you have that accomplished use AH players to set-up Radio Interviews for you. These radio shows look for experienced people to have interviews with to fulfill theres slots. These slots are normally 30 mins. long. and cost you nothing but your time to be on the show. Some of these radio shows have several 100,000's listeners and it's a person to person sale. Your retention will be a whole lot greater with these types of sales. They will have 30 mins. of knowledge vs 30 sec. of being intrigued.
If your interrested at all in these types of 1v1 sales I'll share some more thoughts with you.
:salute Thanks for a great game.
P.S.
You know more then me about this game and the things associated with the cap system but theres no deneying the fact that orange is funner then blue because of the bigger player base in that arena. In Blue with only 50-150 players you normally can't find a fight with 5 cons at a base. That's what Grizz is saying that a smaller map would shrink and condense the players in tighter where the fights would be there. He's got a point.
P.S.S
I know you have an affiliate program but that's not the type of sales I'm talking about. Read Paul J. Meyers story he grow up in a garage, didnt own a new peice of clothing until he was 14 but he's worth over 500 million dollars now why person to person sales and created
http://www.success-motivation.com/newSMI/smi_flash/
I know you can be quite harsh with people offering suggestions so take it easy on me :D
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
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I see once again you do not wish to find the answer to your question by doing a few searches. And you have it completely backward we retain more players with a split arena, this is not debatable but a proven fact.
HiTech
I see once again you think I have a question, when what I had was a suggestion.
[other explanations omitted until I research all available information]
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We understand what ht says about caps, just that some don't like it. but it is really his call.
Semp
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We are very good at telling HiTech what he should do to make us happy campers. In most cases he would go broke if he tryed to COAD every whim that each of us can come up with. Especially with so many of us knowing how to A thru Z run a company and produce a product like his. Eventualy to impliment all of our whims he would have to put up as many arenas as there are players. How many of you really enjoyed playing in those hacked HtH free 8 man arenas run by sqweeker meglomaniacs? It's probably a good thing the arenas he makes available to us are the current product of his best work over the last 20 years.
Respectfully, i disagree. I always had lots of fun the the 8 player arenas and im sure MerlinVI and TA57 wouldnt appreciate you calling them hacking squeaker meglomaniacs. I learned to fly in 8 player, and i learned actual ACMs versus picking, HOing, and hording in the DA. Honestly I didnt notice any hacking in the DA, but I took HTC's that it was there. H2H was a good learning enviroment for new players and it wasnt a "cess pool" as someone said earlier.
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at the risk of beating a dead horse....perhaps a customer email survey would be a good idea.
+10000000000 :aok
But that wouldnt even matter..... Let me ask you this, if HTC could have 10,000 paid subscriptions and NO ONE EVER logged on or 5,000 paid subscriptions and EVERY player was on EVERY day....... Which would he pick?
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+10000000000 :aok
But that wouldnt even matter..... Let me ask you this, if HTC could have 10,000 paid subscriptions and NO ONE EVER logged on or 5,000 paid subscriptions and EVERY player was on EVERY day....... Which would he pick?
According on if your talking from a business stand point or a player's the answer would be different according on which side of the fence you stood on and it's opinion oriented. From my perspective of course I want to play against more players :P A.5,000 and to answer your question it would be according on the retention of those 10,000 if retention drops he would also choose the 5,000 that played everyday.
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I love TT...
Sorry that it gets folks so riled up to have *one* day a week where we merge everyone into a huge arena, but that day I find to be the most fun for me.
I've heard others like it as well, and yeah...I've seen people who swear they log off on that day land kills on TT, lol! The thing that really makes me log off in frustration is the 'normal' days where the arena my squad/friends fly in is sitting at 225/100 while the other arena is 42/200. That's the time when I go play BF-BC or do something somewhat productive.
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at the risk of beating a dead horse....perhaps a customer email survey would be a good idea.
That will never happen. I will fight that to my dieing day to make sure that never happens. This is how companies get labeled as SPAMMERS. We already have a problem with several ISP's and free email services due to people complaining about getting emails from us. You know the emails about billing warnings, answers to support questions and stuff.
You have no idea how many actually get the email, read the email, or answer the email due to the problems associated with SPAM control.
A survey is not going to tell HiTech anything that is not already known about this situation.
As a matter of fact, this very thread shows how the customer would run us out of business to get what they want. We cannot sustain growth with a single large format arena. It cannot be done. Anything that could be done to try and sustain it was tried. Still, even after years of explaining it, over and over again, we still have people coming in here lamenting about it.
Persoanlly, I spend more time on this topic than anything else I do. Yes, I know people allow themselves to get frustrated by it. People also stubbornly cling to the idea that the only arena to have fun in is where the biggest numbers are. That is a paradigm I wish I could change. It would make all of this moot.
If you want to help, come up with a better way to implement the split arenas. Keeping in mind the goal is to make sure they are all populated with enough players to make those arenas fun to play in. Also keep in mind, HiTech has already tried numerous methods before settling on the current one.
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Deleted. Upon reflection, it wasn't a good suggestion.
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in that case, skuzzy........as much as it has nothing to do with my original goal of one big arena...and as that won't be happening.... I will say that after reading what most of the long term vets are saying....my idea of a "Skilled Aces Arena" sounds like a pretty damn good idea.
it appeases ego....
it directly offers a dedicated arena where the best sticks here know they can go at it in
for obvious reasons...hacks will stay out of it...
if what I'm reading is true...in that we have lost a good number of vets because they are sick of the dealing with "all types" in the arenas....this is certainly a solution that will make losing more vets for the same reasons, much less likely.
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For the reasons HiTech already listed, your idea will not work. I will go further to add, when a returning player signs back up he is going to be stuck in the newbie arena and will promptly come to the board to complain about it.
You instantly create a hostile 'us' versus 'them' environment where the so-called 'pros' will complain about the 'newbies' entering the 'pro' arena. This board would get really ugly.
Then add to the fact the new player will still not be getting any help, along with the fact they will be lunch meat for the so-called 'pros' when they are booted from the newbie arena to the 'expert' arena, they will quit.
Newbies do not know any better. As an simple example, they will HO. They will get lambasted for it. Most players will not offer to help them, as they do not see why they should waste their time. To a point, they are correct. However, that point means we lose a potential customer, not because the player does not want to get better. They are just ignorant as to how to get better and the arena where they want to play is full of players who are there to play, not teach.
You cannot do something that drives a wedge into the community without having severe negative consequences. We already have that, to a degree, from players who are country-centric thinkers. We do not need to promote more cliques.
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If all the arenas are capped at 150, you will 2 players right away, me and my bro. Not everyone likes small crowds in the arenas. The only thing that made me want to quit when i first started is the attitude of some of the players on the game, just downright rude and dont yu dare ask for ANY kinda help when youyr new, all u get is ALT-F4 anwsers. Not threating just saying. And what exactly is the limit when things start to turn into a "cesspool"? 300? 400?
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For the reasons HiTech already listed, your idea will not work. I will go further to add, when a returning player signs back up he is going to be stuck in the newbie arena and will promptly come to the board to complain about it.
You instantly create a hostile 'us' versus 'them' environment where the so-called 'pros' will complain about the 'newbies' entering the 'pro' arena. This board would get really ugly.
Then add to the fact the new player will still not be getting any help, along with the fact they will be lunch meat for the so-called 'pros' when they are booted from the newbie arena to the 'expert' arena, they will quit.
Newbies do not know any better. As an simple example, they will HO. They will get lambasted for it. Most players will not offer to help them, as they do not see why they should waste their time. To a point, they are correct. However, that point means we lose a potential customer, not because the player does not want to get better. They are just ignorant as to how to get better and the arena where they want to play is full of players who are there to play, not teach.
You cannot do something that drives a wedge into the community without having severe negative consequences. We already have that, to a degree, from players who are country-centric thinkers. We do not need to promote more cliques.
duly noted. that does make good sense.
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We are still talking to ourselves I see.........
No, that's not a Bash towards HTC...... That is a Bash towards all of us. Or at least, the thicker people.
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I do Love TT.....I probably have been one of the biggest detractors of limited areanas, and the "eny" limiter.....But maybe its time for me to grow up, and understand how very little I actually know about this game. THIS IS ONE HELL OF A GREAT GAME AND COMMUNITY!. I appreciate all of Hitech's efforts to develop this game and his restraint in not listening to villaige idiotts like mself.
999000 <S>
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Write a book on your preivous experience with the games you've created- your experience in the field of aircraft- your future goals in the industry ect. publish the book have AH website address of course. That's uses your time 1 time and lasts forever. I've done that in the past and I'm a published author myself. After you have that accomplished use AH players to set-up Radio Interviews for you. These radio shows look for experienced people to have interviews with to fulfill theres slots. These slots are normally 30 mins. long. and cost you nothing but your time to be on the show. Some of these radio shows have several 100,000's listeners and it's a person to person sale. Your retention will be a whole lot greater with these types of sales. They will have 30 mins. of knowledge vs 30 sec. of being intrigued.
This seems like a very, very, very good idea.
Just try not to break the bank on the editor :D :bolt:
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Unfortunately, the only thing I can see as a "help" to the caps, while keeping 2 arenas growing is a "hidden" cap system, allowing for squads/matchmaking.
What I basically mean is... instead of allowing the customer to choose one of 2 arenas (and getting angry they can never get in), the system go through a logic process to determine which arena to put the customer in...
For instance - Customer signs in, clicks "Late War Main"
All logic is based on the assumtion that minimum max arena size = 150... (so if 150 is > (125% Arena#, the max is still 150)
This also goes under the logic that NO ARENAS show current and max #s, or at least only show current #s of all arenas combined (for instance, if Arena 1 had 250 and Arena 2 had 222, it would show "LWA 472")
Is customer in a squad?
Yes. - Which Arena is Majority of Squad in? 1 or 2?
1 - Is Arena 1 > 125% of Arena 2? Y/N?
Y - Join Arena 2 - Is ENY of Country attempting to be joined in Arena 2 > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Inform user of ENY restriction, prompt if wish stay with country, or change country for ENY balance (and show ENY information).
N - Join Arena 2 Standard Country. (message: Sorry, Arena 1 Full, please try again later. Assigning Arena 2)
N - Is ENY of Country attempting to be joined > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Is majority of squad in a different country? Y/N?
Y - Prompt if customer wants stay with country, or change to squad country (i.e. choose stay with country, or stay with squad)
N - Inform user of ENY restriction, prompt if wish stay with squad, or change country for ENY balance (and show ENY information).
N - Assign customer to Arena 1, their standard Country.
2 - Is Arena 2 > 125% of Arena 1? Y/N?
Y - Is ENY of Country attempting to be joined in Arena 1 > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Inform user of ENY restriction, prompt if wish stay with country, or change country for ENY balance (and show ENY information).
N - Join Arena 2 Standard Country. (message: Sorry, Arena 2 Full, please try again later. Assigning Arena 1)
N - Is ENY of Country attempting to be joined > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Is majority of squad in a different country? Y/N?
Y - Prompt if customer wants stay with country, or change to squad country (i.e. choose stay with country, or stay with squad)
N - Inform user of ENY restriction, prompt if wish stay with squad, or change country for ENY balance (and show ENY information).
N - Assign customer to Arena 1, their standard Country.
No. - Is Arena 1 > 125% of Arena 2? Y/N?
Y - Is ENY of country attempting to be joined in Arena 2 > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Prompt if customer wants stay with country, or change to another country (i.e. choose stay with country, or lower ENY)
N - Assign customer to Arena 2, standard Country
N - Is ENY of Country attempting to be joined > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Prompt if customer wants stay with country, or change to another country (i.e. choose stay with country, or lower ENY)
N - Assign customer to Arena 1, standard Country
This system would not only make sure the arenas grow evenly, but also give options to help with ENY, and choices to stick with squad or not. It also would stop waving those "max arena" numbers in people's faces making them obsessively click on an arena, then quit, then arenas, then quit looking for that right moment when the caps change. These caps ALSO would be much more "organic" in growth, without the harsh 50-100 person max cap limits that happen now.
Not saying it's a great system, just a different one. It satisfies the need for split arenas, gets all customers in game, and even prepares people for possible ENY cap restrictions. This is a very "barebones" system and I have a much more complicated one in my head with this as the baseline (the one in my head allows flexibility in the max cap based on ENY needs), but I wanted to at least get the concept out there for discussion.
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Since the split arena is here to stay and so are the caps then can we at least have a few new maps that are designed for lower number arenas? Blue currently has some of the MW maps in its rotation which I think is a great idea. If one arena was dedicated to these smaller maps and the other larger ones you may get players willing to populate them both.
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That will never happen. I will fight that to my dieing day to make sure that never happens. This is how companies get labeled as SPAMMERS. We already have a problem with several ISP's and free email services due to people complaining about getting emails from us. You know the emails about billing warnings, answers to support questions and stuff.
You have no idea how many actually get the email, read the email, or answer the email due to the problems associated with SPAM control.
A survey is not going to tell HiTech anything that is not already known about this situation.
I agree, however if you were to use a double opt-in list this would take care of that problem although this doesn't take away the fact it's another time consumer.
I would suggest if you were to do anything to further take the player/ownership/management staff of Aces High to the next level by limiting a lot of this nonsense in the forums and it would take some work off your back as well Skuzzy.
* Create a player advisory board of 10 players (mastermind group)
This group would consist of players with 1-10+ years in the game. You need a variety of different opinions for the collection of great ideas.
This group would be responsible for collecting ideas from all the players on the forums on the main topics to improving AH. The advisory board then would sort through the ideas making changes if needed and once per month would bring the best ideas back to AH through a private forum-player advisory board.
The player advisory board would need to be daily forum checker and continue to discuss different opinions in there private forum. Once per month before the final list gets taken back to AH a meeting would commence in the TA on vox. Each advisory board member would have 3 min. to discuss the main topics in the private forum out loud. By the point of this meeting it will probably already have gone through all the logistics in the forum but the meeting will be for any last minute remarks before posting back to AH.
* I'm sure you guys Skuzzy have a meeting every morning at AH already discussing things in the works and where the progress is going. Just one day a month you could throw this player advisory board list into you guys meeting. The player advisory list would be premium recommendations of the players and forward progress this game hopefully for the better. As always you guys make the final discussion. This would take away all of your responses to these forums but once per month where you would put the player advisory board suggestions along with a response of AH to these recommendations.
Oh and Vudak I done a spell check this time thanks :D
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Oh and Vudak I done a spell check this time thanks :D
That was a rib at "HiTec," not at you hehe :P
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If you want to help, come up with a better way to implement the split arenas. Keeping in mind the goal is to make sure they are all populated with enough players to make those arenas fun to play in.
Split into zones at same arena/map instead splitting into several arenas. Each zone could be capped the same way the arenas are now. After each sortie one could see if there is room at a particular zone where his buddies are. Limit the cesspool communication by allowing public comms only to the neighboring zones. If/when the chat is the problem, fix it. If the player numbers and massive fights are the problem, limit take-offs per time per airbase e.g. with dynamic fuel consumption from an airbase's reserves. Every plane taking off takes some of its fuel and it regenerates at some rate. I am sure there are still several approaches that have never been tried ;)
The problem with split arenas has always been wondering where one's buddies are and during more quiet hours, wondering where a decent fight might be. A large map with less than 100 players often offers far too many sight-seeing patrol flights.
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That was a rib at "HiTec," not at you hehe :P
oh I see sorry :uhoh
Blauk- That's thinking outside of the box and your onto something there. Something like this has potential :aok
The overall picture I see with your idea looks promising. You would still be able to talk to your squaddie's reguardless what zone you are in and be able to check the caps of each zone without having to exit an arena. Htc this needs looking at - great idea Blauk :salute
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Well now that I no why we have caps I think we should do 180 player set cap that wont fluctuate... Well maybe that will not work either because the eny could get out of control really fast...Unless there was a way to no before u log into the arena what country's were open..
Blue Arena.
bISH 60
Rooks 60
Nits 55
I am sure there are plenty of problems with that idea..
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If all the arenas are capped at 150, you will 2 players right away, me and my bro. Not everyone likes small crowds in the arenas. The only thing that made me want to quit when i first started is the attitude of some of the players on the game, just downright rude and dont yu dare ask for ANY kinda help when youyr new, all u get is ALT-F4 anwsers. Not threating just saying. And what exactly is the limit when things start to turn into a "cesspool"? 300? 400?
And this is why I would never run a poll on these type of topics.
The only thing that made me want to quit when i first started is the attitude of some of the players on the game, just downright rude and dont yu dare ask for ANY kinda help when youyr new, all u get is ALT-F4 anwsers.
What if larger arena's promote more of this type behavior. We have a man who will leave even though he does not see that the larger arena is creating the reason he is leaving.
The key to this is give people what they want, not what they ask for, because most often they are 2 very different things.
HiTech
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The key to this is give people what they want, not what they ask for, because most often they are 2 very different things.
This is the genius of Hitech.
Also, I like the idea of hiding the fact that there is a late war arena split. Automatically choosing which arena the player goes in and never showing him two arenas to choose from would end most of the rancor over this issue.
The biggest drawback to this idea is splitting squads up willy-nilly but there are ways around that.
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This is the genius of Hitech.
Also, I like the idea of hiding the fact that there is a late war arena split. Automatically choosing which arena the player goes in and never showing him two arenas to choose from would end most of the rancor over this issue.
The biggest drawback to this idea is splitting squads up willy-nilly but there are ways around that.
Actually, if you read my logic path, it would avoid splitting up squads, as the first thing the "logic" would check for is which arena your squad is in, even before figuring out if you can be fit in that arena.
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Kite nice write up btw.
HiTech
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Knite man. Thats the most intricate and well thought up setup written so far :lol
no wonder why HiTech said good write up...
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I agree Knite nice write-up and thought out :aok
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Actually, if you read my logic path, it would avoid splitting up squads, as the first thing the "logic" would check for is which arena your squad is in, even before figuring out if you can be fit in that arena.
I wasn't specifically commenting on your method of solving the issue splitting squadrons up. It appears to be a good solution. Basically I was just showing my agreement with your proposal for disguising the existence of split late war main arenas from the players.
The squadron issue would have to be addressed but only HTC can comment on the feasibility of any particular method of accomplishing that. I have no clue if the structure you propose is technically achievable in AH so I declined to comment. It wasn't a slight against you.
Hitech himself appears to like your writeup. It would be great if he took it and implemented it in two weeks. :)
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For the reasons HiTech already listed, your idea will not work. I will go further to add, when a returning player signs back up he is going to be stuck in the newbie arena and will promptly come to the board to complain about it.
You instantly create a hostile 'us' versus 'them' environment where the so-called 'pros' will complain about the 'newbies' entering the 'pro' arena. This board would get really ugly.
Then add to the fact the new player will still not be getting any help, along with the fact they will be lunch meat for the so-called 'pros' when they are booted from the newbie arena to the 'expert' arena, they will quit.
Newbies do not know any better. As an simple example, they will HO. They will get lambasted for it. Most players will not offer to help them, as they do not see why they should waste their time. To a point, they are correct. However, that point means we lose a potential customer, not because the player does not want to get better. They are just ignorant as to how to get better and the arena where they want to play is full of players who are there to play, not teach.
You cannot do something that drives a wedge into the community without having severe negative consequences. We already have that, to a degree, from players who are country-centric thinkers. We do not need to promote more cliques.
No offense, but you , like HiTech didn't read my post competely or correctly. <sigh>
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No offense, but you , like HiTech didn't read my post competely or correctly. <sigh>
The only way a "New Players Arena" could possibly help new players would be if it made the training arena redundant.
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As an additional idea to Knite's idea, when arena caps are being approached, say 20-40 below cap, always put squadless people like myself in the lower population arena in order to increase the chance that spots for squad members to play with their friends are available.
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As an additional idea to Knite's idea, when arena caps are being approached, say 20-40 below cap, always put squadless people like myself in the lower population arena in order to increase the chance that spots for squad members to play with their friends are available.
Ah, I see what you're sayin Karnak. Instead of the current system where it always puts people in Arena 1 as long as the "max cap" hasn't been reached, after the squad check, do a LOWER #s check, not just a max # check.
As in change this section :
Is customer in a squad?
No. - Is Arena 1 > 125% of Arena 2? Y/N?
Y - Is ENY of country attempting to be joined in Arena 2 > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Prompt if customer wants stay with country, or change to another country (i.e. choose stay with country, or lower ENY)
N - Assign customer to Arena 2, standard Country
N - Is ENY of Country attempting to be joined > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Prompt if customer wants stay with country, or change to another country (i.e. choose stay with country, or lower ENY)
N - Assign customer to Arena 1, standard Country
To
Is customer in a squad?
No. - Choose lower populated arena
Is ENY of Country attempting to be joined > 5.0? Y/N?
Y - Prompt if customer wants stay with country, or change to another country (i.e. choose stay with country, or lower ENY)
N - Assign customer to Arena 1, standard Country
?
P.S. Thanks for the kind words on my thought. Sorry Dawger, was just trying to be sure if I was or wasn't being clear. =)
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No offense, but you , like HiTech didn't read my post competely or correctly. <sigh>
My response you quoted was to ZetaNine.
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Horse to water............... :salute
My response you quoted was to ZetaNine.
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My response you quoted was to ZetaNine.
Sorry Skuzzy, couldn't tell because it wasn't quoted.
But I would like to point out that I was correct! Your reply made no sense in response to my post. :D
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And this is why I would never run a poll on these type of topics.
What if larger arena's promote more of this type behavior. We have a man who will leave even though he does not see that the larger arena is creating the reason he is leaving.
The key to this is give people what they want, not what they ask for, because most often they are 2 very different things.
HiTech
It made me WANT to quit WHEN I FIRST STARTED. Just because its not as large of an arena dosen't mean there wont be a wise guys in there anyway. Dosent bother me anymore, just frustraing when ur a noob. Only thing that would make me quit is not being able to find a fight when a large map is capped at 150. Oh, and i didnt ask for anything, just commented on your cap idea. Guess you can run your poll..... :aok
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HiTech, this may be a silly and a completely infeasible idea but have you ever thought about setting maps up to have bases and zones that can be 'deactivated' or 'off limits' if the numbers in the arena aren't adequate, therefore condensing the action into a smaller region? Once the numbers get past the 'breaking point' more zones/bases are unlocked for use. Would help when the caps initiate in the small numbered arena (usually blue). Just a thought.
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HiTech, this may be a silly and a completely infeasible idea but have you ever thought about setting maps up to have bases and zones that can be 'deactivated' or 'off limits' if the numbers in the arena aren't adequate, therefore condensing the action into a smaller region? Once the numbers get past the 'breaking point' more zones/bases are unlocked for use. Would help when the caps initiate in the small numbered arena (usually blue). Just a thought.
Woooot linked base capture system :aok :aok :aok :aok.
:noid
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The only way a "New Players Arena" could possibly help new players would be if it made the training arena redundant.
The newbie arena would be different because there real action and competition in it, the training arena doesn't.
[Disclamer] My suggestion adresses only my thoughts on New player retention. Not all retention of all players. It is not related or in conflict, or a counterpoint to split arenas.
This game is very very difficult to play. Having some measure of success at playing it is a big motivating factor, and at some point required for the person to stay on. The key question is whether they will get frustrated before they get good. I'm suggesting that throwing them in with the experts may increase the rate at which they learn [good thing], but it may increase the rate at which they get frustrated much faster[bad thing].
In the training arena there's no plane damage, no score and no combat unless you arrange it with someone. It's great for Training, but that's not the same a plying so it's less fun. The success is missing.
In the Da you're back in with experts wiping the floor with you. Agian no success.
In a nubie arena is real combat like the MA but with new pilots, so when I guy gets on your six...guess what he might miss and you might live long enough to figure out how to turn the tables....where of course you will miss, at least for a while. :aok
As for it being only Nubie...not so. There are plenty or great folks in the AH community that teach as well as they fly. As a first cut I'd set it up like this....
Three air fields [Knit, Bish, Rook] in a small triangle like WWI
Admission would be based on the following criteria
1) flight time in hours
2) K/D
3) hit percentage
4) total kills
5) sorties landed
6) crashes that are not due to plane damage
7) damage points.
These criteria would be added up to a total score. There would be two score criteria, one based on MA scores that you would be required to be below to get in to the newbie arena, and One based on Newbie arena scores that would get you locked out. [limits to be determined by analysis of current and future new player data.]
Once you qualify out of the Newbie arena, there's no going back.
If you haven't qualified out, and your score is low enough in the MA you can get access until you qualify out.
Anyone can fly in the MA anytime they want.
Veteran players intersted in flying in the Newbie arena for the purpose of mentoring and adding experience to the mix could sign up for access. Their access would be granted and monitored based on behavior. There's hundreds of folks I reccommend. Sorry, Kazaa you and your Tempy of death are not allowed. Nor would I [swear to much, especially when the newbs started killing me in big numbers] But the folks that run the scenarios, Delirium, Dedalos, Betty, and many many others that always fly with no drama, and are quick to lend advice and helping hand would be the model.
Access to Newbie arena controlled by score criteria, and special access as described above.
If I recall Snailmans data properly, a 1.0 K/d is top 25%. That indicates a very right shifted success distribution. The bottom 25% was marked by a K/D of [aprox] 0.1 or something very low. An analysis of the kills/sortie, points/sortie, etc versus retention and subscription length would reveal if folks were quitting because they were getting hammered. In other words Time-to-frustration < Time-to-success. I don't have access to that data so I can't know if this a problem.
From my experience, I think it might be. If so I think an arena where you have a chance at success while learning would help in "new" player retention.
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It made me WANT to quit WHEN I FIRST STARTED. Just because its not as large of an arena dosen't mean there wont be a wise guys in there anyway. Dosent bother me anymore, just frustraing when ur a noob. Only thing that would make me quit is not being able to find a fight when a large map is capped at 150. Oh, and i didnt ask for anything, just commented on your cap idea. Guess you can run your poll..... :aok
I rest my case about not running a poll.
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These criteria would be added up to a total score. There would be two score criteria, one based on MA scores that you would be required to be below to get in to the newbie arena, and One based on Newbie arena scores that would get you locked out. [limits to be determined by analysis of current and future new player data.]
Veteran players intersted in flying in the Newbie arena for the purpose of mentoring and adding experience to the mix could sign up for access. Their access would be granted and monitored based on behavior. There's hundreds of folks I reccommend. Sorry, Kazaa you and your Tempy of death are not allowed. Nor would I [swear to much, especially when the newbs started killing me in big numbers] But the folks that run the scenarios, Delirium, Dedalos, Betty, and many many others that always fly with no drama, and are quick to lend advice and helping hand would be the model.
From my experience, I think it might be. If so I think an arena where you have a chance at success while learning would help in "new" player retention.
I do this now in the MA's. If someone has a question, I try my best to provide an answer, but another Arena is redundant.
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Like the idea! Take it one step further and have smaller maps with less bases. Let the battle begin!
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I do this now in the MA's. If someone has a question, I try my best to provide an answer, but another Arena is redundant.
No it isn't. Read the whole post.
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No it isn't. Read the whole post.
Honestly, another Arena with more "Score" is not needed. Get rid of all scores.
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Wouldn't hurt my feelings at all to see TT abolished and thrown into the abyss where it belongs :devil
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Honestly, another Arena with more "Score" is not needed. Get rid of all scores.
I see your point on scores, but I think they're here to stay so I thought they would be the easiest [there may be better ways] way to gate access for the newbie arena. :salute
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Like your Idea about the New guy arena first off. I started playing AH when I was 15 offline loved it, sucked at it, but wanted to learn. But unlike most of the kids who jump in the MA they dint know a B-17 from a 757. and the fact that they are usually decimated all the time, dosent help either. I got killed all the time but unlike the kids growing up today i had and still have an unusual amount of patience. even teaching two grown guys living with me here in the Barracks I told them to be ready for frustration before they got good/better. and now they are more than less decent pilots who will play for a while to come. Why not take one of the arenas not being used heavily right now like one of the ww1's? I like teaching the new guys when I get a chance and when they can sit still long enough to listen :D. Kids and sayin that I still am a kid at only 20, now a days kids arent brought up how they used to be and in order to keep up someone will have to adapt a plan to hang with them in order to retain as many as you can.
I do this now in the MA's. If someone has a question, I try my best to provide an answer, but another Arena is redundant.
Even Halo playing online before you can actually get into the serious online play your forced through a "Basic Training" until youve done well enough to be kicked out into the real fighting. Now Call of Duty has too picked this up. now its not without issues such as old dogs slipping in with new names or inviting older players to their matches and that will have to be monitored with to score system of course and it gives kids a goal to shoot for. Drives them I need to get better I need to get my score I want in the MA where the real game is played. I was lucky to grown ina house surrounded by books and models of a/c from all over so started the game with a great base knowledge but your average player is sorely lacking in this department and needs a bit of help. And you have a large pool of good and experienced players to choose from to fill this roll I myself would love to do this when time permits for me.
On the original topic for this TT is ok but not the best for me due to the map most of the time.but during the week being deployed in Germany, and Im sure the rest of the Europen players run into this wanting to get into a big fight then forced to chase down 20 guys in an arena built for many many more folks. and not only are you stuck in this arena with a few people but you may be their for a while then oh darn back to work. (playing over lunch). anyhow theres my two cents I now i dint see what goes on but here's what Im seein on my end thanks and yall have a nice day. :airplane:
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Baumer had a good idea. Don't ask me how to make it work. But looks good on paper.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,288469.15.html