Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: mechanic on August 25, 2009, 11:19:52 PM
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something seems to have disbanded some of the squads in the dueling arena so just a note to say no one was kicked, just come and get someone to invite you.
:salute
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Don't really need em anyway :)
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its for the squad channel (4) that we use to know who is online for some dueling. very usefull to be able to .sr from lobby and find friends to duel
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its for the squad channel (4) that we use to know who is online for some dueling. very usefull to be able to .sr from lobby and find friends to duel
Or gange the crap outta the newbies....loada bollocks.
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:rofl
If we want to gang the crap out of the newbies we would go to the MA and find easier pickings, the DA furball lake is where real men go to furball nowadays. MA fairies run too fast..
This post is concerning only a few regular duelers who might be wondering what happened.
Perhaps a few of them will post here now lynx, you may feel sheepish about who you are insulting with your witch hunt paranoia.
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:rofl
If we want to gang the crap out of the newbies we would go to the MA and find easier pickings, the DA furball lake is where real men go to furball nowadays. MA fairies run too fast..
This post is concerning only a few regular duelers who might be wondering what happened.
Perhaps a few of them will post here now lynx, you may feel sheepish about who you are insulting with your witch hunt paranoia.
You know what? If I'd never been to DA furball lake for such things as setting up me stick or what ever. Your underlying sentiment may actually have an ounce of substance. I'm not rolling out the ducking board being as I have been and, bore whiteness to some of these DA squads ganging.
You can excuse yourself as much as you like with your "dot SR" but furball lake is nothing less than a microcosm of the MA. I don't know who's plonker your trying pull. It's certainly not mine and I'm not likely to feel any sheep or "real men" for that matter.
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The Rowdy Ones will be going rowdy over this.
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DA squads = WHY?
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you people obviously don't know batty very well. He plays this game for the fun of the fights. The DA squad just helps him find out where his buddies are.
If you are completely clueless about a subject, don't bother responding.
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So did all the DA squad's get disbanded, or did one of us go overboard with the squad name? :o
Lynx, I generally despise furball lake except early morning NYC time. Then you can get some good fights. I'll agree it is a mini MA, though, with the difference being you only need to chase a guy for 5 miles to his ack/friends instead of 25 :D
The regular dueling that we all set up is good fun though. Very informal (often just grab whatever plane you like and see how it goes against the set), very fast, and some very good sticks available to clean my clock. What more could I ask for? :)
You should pop in some time. That fight we had in the MA was one of the best all campaign, and I'd like to fight you more often :salute
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the DA furball lake is where real men go to furball nowadays.
Thanks.
Needed the laugh.
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something seems to have disbanded some of the squads in the dueling arena
"Something" could be the CO disbanding it himself, getting his account locked, quitting the game, etc. Maybe the CO really cheesed-off someone at HTC and got whacked.
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you people obviously don't know batty very well. He plays this game for the fun of the fights. The DA squad just helps him find out where his buddies are.
If you are completely clueless about a subject, don't bother responding.
How very gallant. If you care to read the posts your stepping up to a plate that's neither there or needs defending. You most certainly have fallen short of your own advice.
To clarify. Ponder these words...err that's think about these words.
something seems to have disbanded some of the squads
Had Batts said, "my squad" or "our squad" or "the squad" as in the singular, then your perception of an attack on Batty per se`would be founded....that's another word for ....correct.
Being as he (Batty) used the word "SOME" as in the plural ...that's more than one. Then your perception of an attack has floundered. That's another way of saying, using the boards vernacular, ...... FAIL.
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The DA's furball lake isn't a microcosm of the MA....its worse!
In the DA every other plane you see would normally be a perk ride.
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If you are completely clueless about a subject, don't bother responding.
+1 :D
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DA squads = WHY?
So they can share stories about their latest ho/ram?
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So did all the DA squad's get disbanded, or did one of us go overboard with the squad name? :o
I think it was all DA squads, or certainly not just our little dueling group.
Lynx, if you have a point, make it. If you just want to transfer your displeasure at in entire DA community onto a few care free duelers you would be better off coming in and challenging one of us to a a fun fight than jumping all over something you have no clue about. No offence intended, and i fully support your right to voice these nonsense accusations.
S!
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Lynx's apparent ease with linguistics makes for some interesting reads :)
No pun intended.
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DA squads = WHY?
As others have said, we use it for red text and .sr
Others use it for whatever reason, but what's it matter, anyway?
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something seems to have disbanded some of the squads in the dueling arena so just a note to say no one was kicked, just come and get someone to invite you.
:salute
What game is that, LOL!!!???
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I think it was all DA squads, or certainly not just our little dueling group.
Lynx, if you have a point, make it. If you just want to transfer your displeasure at in entire DA community onto a few care free duelers you would be better off coming in and challenging one of us to a a fun fight than jumping all over something you have no clue about. No offence intended, and i fully support your right to voice these nonsense accusations.
S!
Think I already made my point
Or gang the crap outta the newbies
I'm not rolling out the ducking board being as I have been and, bore whiteness to some of these DA squads ganging.
furball lake is nothing less than a microcosm of the MA
To me a spade isn't a chrome plated excavation utility.....it's a bleedin spade man. I understand that some folk, yourself included, go to the DA for the experience it was intended for. As for furball lake who are your kiddin. Being as there are DA squads that are "winging" or a profuse amount of individuals that jump in where their not wanted. I'm honestly bewildered by your jolly hockey sticks attitude to defend duelling within "furball" lake area.
If you and your squad or small group of "real men" conduct yourselves chivalrously then all power to you but it's my experience that the majority within the furball lake area do not duel. Infact I'll go as far as to say it's an impatient lazy mans MA without the added expense of loosing perkies.
Chill out batts I'm sure some of those other DA squads will be relieved they can still "dot SR" to.
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If you and your squad or small group of "real men" conduct yourselves chivalrously then all power to you but it's my experience that the majority within the furball lake area do not duel. Infact I'll go as far as to say it's an impatient lazy mans MA without the added expense of loosing perkies.
I've been having lazy reading problems lately, but I didn't see where someone mentioned dueling in the furball lake area? That place is more for the following:
1. Practice 3+v1's and see how long you can last
2. See what a plane can really do on the deck
3. Kill time while waiting for a friend to show up so you can have regular duels
4. Keep your kids occupied during the summer
Accept it for what it is and it's ok, expect it to be anything else and tear your hair out.
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<< Has DA squad, same guys in MA and FSO squad. Furball lake is a cesspool, we used to frequent it often, now you will find us on the outlying fields, when we re not in MA
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the cess pool is just more of a challenge than most are willing to take on. No one forces you to listen to people whine. Would you rather a furball lake filled with AI drones?
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Da squads disbanded :eek: How am I to organize the ganging of newbs in 15v1s? I guess all I can do now there is master the art of the ho shot in my free perk plane.
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I'm not sure how Lynx's comments about the furball lake got misconstrued into some sort of attack on batfinkv, but I tend to agree with Lynx's general discontent with the lake. The fights worth fighting in the DA are on the side maps with guys like batfink, vudak, dodger, seraider, tonyjoey, skyrock and many others. Furball lake is what it is, a very low skilled constant furball with quite a bit of low skilled high alt chogs and tempests taking passes at furballers, extending 4k and then repeating. It's not entirely different from a MA furball but the overall skill levels are very low on the pecking order. It does serve its purposes though if you want to practice some winging techniques and get some very quick action, but I could never imagine flying there regularly.
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The fights worth fighting in the DA are on the side maps with guys like batfink, vudak, dodger, seraider, tonyjoey, skyrock and many others.
I would include you, Grizz in this group of gentlemen. :salute
I would like to add Dedalos, Krupnsky, Bighorn (especially him), Darth2. :salute all of you'ts
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i did not take it as an attack, more a little bait that was worth chomping on. Lynx doesnt fish too often so no sniffing at the chance eh.
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Lake or no lake, squad or no squad, it doesn't matter.
There are still many GFs available in the DA, all you need to do is ask. :salute
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Troll
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Some of the best fights I've ever seen are started (and won) by battfink in the DA. It's been too long. When do you guys fly in there?
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Just popped in, all the major squads have been re-built, including the extra wing of the Rowdys.......If ya want to hack off Lake people, wipe their scores----most pay VERY close attention to score %, totals, etc, and they get furious when something transpires to restart them
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Ok
The Rowdy Ones
The Rowdy Ones S.O.A.R.
LOL
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Some of the best fights I've ever seen are started (and won) by battfink in the DA. It's been too long. When do you guys fly in there?
Generally in the mid to late U.S. evenings historically, though it's all here and there. Find one of us, ask us to go in and for us to bring friends. It's not hard to convince us :)
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Da squads disbanded :eek: How am I to organize the ganging of newbs in 15v1s? I guess all I can do now there is master the art of the ho shot in my free perk plane.
lol ardy, sounds like a plan
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Lynx, i ask you to join our DA dueling 'squad' for 2 weeks and see if it brings you any fun?
can you step up to that offer?
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Batfinkv lets go with:
BREW in the cannons or
4v4
historical matchups
1v1
free for all
nahhh nevermind that doesn't sound like any fun, but if it dose come try your luck. (you might even have a blast)
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I simply never understood DA squads. I mean if there is a MA squad that goes to the DA I can see that. Pure DA squads??? Makes no sense at all.
BRB have to check on my blender..........
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When do I get a blender shuff?
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When do I get a blender shuff?
Real men drink Margarita's on the rocks w/salt :)
Women use a blender like sitting to P.
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I need it to grind up glass for halloween
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Hi Texastc, S!
If you don't minf me stating, sir, use a concrete mixer to break up the glass. That way the cement gets in the wound and causes dermatitus and other nasties.
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Sweet! Good tip.
Shuff, I need a cement mixer in my 38
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See Rule #11
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ello mate :)
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I've been having lazy reading problems lately, but I didn't see where someone mentioned dueling in the furball lake area? That place is more for the following:
1. Practice 3+v1's and see how long you can last
2. See what a plane can really do on the deck
3. Kill time while waiting for a friend to show up so you can have regular duels
4. Keep your kids occupied during the summer
Accept it for what it is and it's ok, expect it to be anything else and tear your hair out.
yes your correct. Excuse my cross pollonisation of furball duel within the lake. However even in the less populated area of the lake and even when requested individuals still jump in. I've seen folk trying to de-ack, bombing the radar :rolleyes: vulching the runway. Infact you name any trick pulled off in the MA and it's there in the DA lack except there's alot more of it in a compact area and mostly by perk rides. Now bear this in mind. I've only been there a dozen or so times to sort stick related issues and these antics are common place.
I was also surprised to learn there are DA squads. Not MA squads popping in there for practise but actual DA squads. I was even requested to join one so's we could get the other squad :lol
As for the side rooms for actual duelling I have no problem with it and if folk go there then fair play to em.
Lynx, i ask you to join our DA dueling 'squad' for 2 weeks and see if it brings you any fun?
can you step up to that offer?
Firstly there's nothing for me to step up to or adversely, down to. I'm not at all interested much like driving from Lands End to John O'Groats. It's there, I can do it if a choose to but I see it as unnecessary. Contextually speaking it's far removed from the multi player strategic play that I signed up for.
As for unfriendly challenges related to matters of "Honour" :rolleyes: It's a good few years since I've accepted some gobshites (not referring to you) challenge to the DA. After cleaning their clock did they stop being gobshites....NO. Did I spend a futher unnecessary 15 min with complete tossers.....YES. Did cleaning their clock enhance my game play...NO. Was I satisfied..about as satisfied as beating up a kid in the play ground....something I grew out of 35 years ago.
So... I decline the offer.
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The squad getting broke up was no accident the CIA was behind it, David Icke told me this would happen!!!
:no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id
ps LYNX is also working for the CIA its obvious hes also a reptile creature of some sort!!
:no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id
:no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id :no id
...Leave my mate Dave outta this. Just cause I'm booked in on the same shuttle in 2012. Worse than a reptilian mate a semi retired (fine weather) long haired, bearded biker dude.
However and this is true I have had a low key dealing with MI5. Possibly saved the UK from a terrorist attack. So I'm in with these boys......watch ya self :devil
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ello mate :)
Alrighty right hows things chum? I was expecting to get censored.... the CIA obviously got to Skuzzy!! :noid
Lynx dude you'd have more fun than you'd expect in that little group Bat put together I was in it for a few years and had great fights and made some good friends :aok
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...Leave my mate Dave outta this. Just cause I'm booked in on the same shuttle in 2012. Worse than a reptilian mate a semi retired (fine weather) long haired, bearded biker dude.
:rofl :rofl
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Always a pleasure to see posters dismantled in the King's English.
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Firstly there's nothing for me to step up to or adversely, down to. I'm not at all interested much like driving from Lands End to John O'Groats. It's there, I can do it if a choose to but I see it as unnecessary. Contextually speaking it's far removed from the multi player strategic play that I signed up for.
As for unfriendly challenges related to matters of "Honour" :rolleyes: It's a good few years since I've accepted some gobsoupes (not referring to you) challenge to the DA. After cleaning their clock did they stop being gobsoupes....NO. Did I spend a futher unnecessary 15 min with complete tossers.....YES. Did cleaning their clock enhance my game play...NO. Was I satisfied..about as satisfied as beating up a kid in the play ground....something I grew out of 35 years ago.
So... I decline the offer.
So firstly, it is your opinion that the DA serves no purpose for yourself. You could do some duels but you don't want to. That much i understand. That is your choice.
What you did was cast judgement over some people who do enjoy doing said activity and do not enjoy the activity you suggested they did. What I offer was the chance to witness the actions of those individuals you think you know so well.
As for your one single example, you just went to the DA with the wrong person, clearly. So you write off the whole DA experience from a viewpoint of tunnel vision.
Now, the matter is closed on neutral ground. You have expressed no desire to learn about what you judge so keenly. I have expressed no desire to force you. That is the meaning of an 'offer'.
anything i missed?
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So firstly, it is your opinion that the DA serves no purpose for yourself. You could do some duels but you don't want to. That much i understand. That is your choice.
What you did was cast judgement over some people who do enjoy doing said activity and do not enjoy the activity you suggested they did. What I offer was the chance to witness the actions of those individuals you think you know so well.
As for your one single example, you just went to the DA with the wrong person, clearly. So you write off the whole DA experience from a viewpoint of tunnel vision.
Now, the matter is closed on neutral ground. You have expressed no desire to learn about what you judge so keenly. I have expressed no desire to force you. That is the meaning of an 'offer'.
anything i missed?
Other than the fact that there are DA squads, read non MA squads ganging in furball lake.....no. Matter closed.
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Always a pleasure to see posters dismantled in the King's English.
We currently have a Queen so it's the Queens English up until Charlie takes over. Then it's the Kings English :aok
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Other than the fact that there are DA squads, read non MA squads ganging in furball lake.....no. Matter closed.
When I returned to a AH a year or so ago after a month or 3 off with no computer, I found said lake to be more fun than the MA's, to the extent that I never logged into MA's. Alas, slowly but surely, human nature intervened (For instance, there are currently THREE wings of the Rowdys in there) People (most of them, anyway) want kills any way they can get them, don't really want a fight, don't see any value in having one. They also see nothing wrong in flying around in a 15 plane horde beating up on 1 plane, and being damn proud of the kill they acquire of said lone plane. Folks won't change sides to even things up, in fact, many seem to check roster, and fly on largest country, for 'safety' purposes. I simply see no way of changing this mindset, it's rather akin to the hopelessly lost feeling the residents of former eastern-bloc countries had when their authoritarian governments perished amd they were forced to stand for themselves
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As for unfriendly challenges related to matters of "Honour" :rolleyes: It's a good few years since I've accepted some gobsoupes (not referring to you) challenge to the DA. After cleaning their clock did they stop being gobsoupes....NO. Did I spend a futher unnecessary 15 min with complete tossers.....YES. Did cleaning their clock enhance my game play...NO. Was I satisfied..about as satisfied as beating up a kid in the play ground....something I grew out of 35 years ago.
In all of the years I've dueled, I've had maybe 3 encounters like that, and yes, they did seem like giant wastes of time.
But I don't think Batfink was making an unfriendly challenge for "honor." He probably just figures (as do I) that you're a good stick that he hasn't fought much, and he'd like to change that situation. There are so many variations in how people approach a fight that every new person you duel is a fresh experience for learning and fun.
If you ever type .f Vudak and see me in there then by all means stop by if you feel like it. If you don't, then that's ok too. It's just an offer for fun, friendly fights on a night where the MA is driving you crazy. Same planes, different planes, same alt, different alt, it doesn't really matter. Throw up an idea and I'll probably go for it. Nothing on the line, and not fought for "bragging rights" or anything equally stupid.
:salute
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You miss understand. I did say I wasn't referring to Battie
It's a good few years since I've accepted some gobsoupes (not referring to you) challenge to the DA.
What I was trying to point was I have been challenged by complete spanners to duels and accepted said offers. Only to realise after the 20 min tired in the MA on 200 you are now alone with a complete spanner for a further 15 min. As much as you kick the spanners about the DA they are, were and remain spanners. Futile pointless exorcise in cartoon honour.
In hindsite it would have been best to have left that paragraph out in the previous post. Merely point out there's dueling with mates then there's dueling with adversaries.... spanners.
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Sorry, that lazy reading problem of mine again :)
Yeah, those situations are what gives going to the DA a bad name, unfortunately.
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First off I spoke with Skuzzy the first day the squads went down and the servers lost the DA and it only affected the DA. I'm the CO over the Rowdy Ones and yes we are basically a squad that only flys in the DA. We have some of the members that fly with the pigs in the MA as well. I see alot of clueless people in this forum in particular that doesn't even understand what a squad is really is for. Reguardless if you fly MA or DA it's all just a game and for some they want to test each other out to see how big there sack is, it's a game but what makes a squad is the friendships you build bottom line. I understand if your flying MA you want leaders to put together missions on taking over bases but when you get down to it, it's a game. After your in a squad for awhile you will understand this maybe? but after you exit the game what do you have? nothing unless friendships have been made! We are a very close squad having our own Social Network just for chatter to get to know each other better. Maybe if some of the young pups in here would lean towards this way we wouldn't have all this cursing and testing each others sacks out. I'll be the first I love a 1on1 better then anything but I'll also be the first to say I'm not the best pilot in here I learn everyday and the more 1on1's I have the better I will get. The DA has a record of being a gang tard lake???? We'll I've flown in the MA some myself and trust me if your alone and 5 red planes around what are they going to do???? This is such a stupid conversation in my book if you want a 1on1 they are plenty of fields for that in the DA. The lake is a furball lake meaning of furball is alot of planes condenced together in a close proximity. I'm sure I'll be responding again in the near future when some idiot responds to this post.
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First off I spoke with Skuzzy the first day the squads went down and the servers lost the DA and it only affected the DA. I'm the CO over the Rowdy Ones and yes we are basically a squad that only flys in the DA. We have some of the members that fly with the pigs in the MA as well. I see alot of clueless people in this forum in particular that doesn't even understand what a squad is really is for. Reguardless if you fly MA or DA it's all just a game and for some they want to test each other out to see how big there sack is, it's a game but what makes a squad is the friendships you build bottom line. I understand if your flying MA you want leaders to put together missions on taking over bases but when you get down to it, it's a game. After your in a squad for awhile you will understand this maybe? but after you exit the game what do you have? nothing unless friendships have been made! We are a very close squad having our own Social Network just for chatter to get to know each other better. Maybe if some of the young pups in here would lean towards this way we wouldn't have all this cursing and testing each others sacks out. I'll be the first I love a 1on1 better then anything but I'll also be the first to say I'm not the best pilot in here I learn everyday and the more 1on1's I have the better I will get. The DA has a record of being a gang tard lake???? We'll I've flown in the MA some myself and trust me if your alone and 5 red planes around what are they going to do???? This is such a stupid conversation in my book if you want a 1on1 they are plenty of fields for that in the DA. The lake is a furball lake meaning of furball is alot of planes condenced together in a close proximity. I'm sure I'll be responding again in the near future when some idiot responds to this post.
You sure do a lot of name calling for someone who just stays in the DA.
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You sure do a lot of name calling for someone who just stays in the DA.
Shuffler,
Actually I didn't call anyone a name besides I see alot of the people in this forum are clueless but it is what it is. I fly MA also but I'm here for the fights and the friends so flying in the MA is pointless to me although I go every once in a while. I guess since everyone hates the DA you can put the word out that we are putting together squad matches so they can come pick on us DA guys.
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You sure do a lot of name calling for someone who just stays in the DA.
but I guess if I flew in the MA that gives me the right to name call? Laughing Shuffler that statement right there crawls under my skin. You are one of the people I said I would respond too, lol because in that statement you said "You sure do a lot of name calling for someone who just stays in the DA" does it make me a bigger better man if I fly in the MA you are such a child!
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but I guess if I flew in the MA that gives me the right to name call? Laughing Shuffler that statement right there crawls under my skin. You are one of the people I said I would respond too, lol because in that statement you said "You sure do a lot of name calling for someone who just stays in the DA" does it make me a bigger better man if I fly in the MA you are such a child!
Name calling has no place anywhere here unless done in jest.
To explain why folks find it funny about squads in the DA...
The DA is the "Dueling Arena". Folks can go there to duel.
The furball area is for furballing..... why do you need a squad to do that in a Dueling Arena? Makes no sense. I have no problem with it but I do find it funny.
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Name calling has no place anywhere here unless done in jest.
To explain why folks find it funny about squads in the DA...
The DA is the "Dueling Arena". Folks can go there to duel.
The furball area is for furballing..... why do you need a squad to do that in a Dueling Arena? Makes no sense. I have no problem with it but I do find it funny.
This would be a good question for you to ask TA's Aerofighters who I believe are one of the ORIGINAL squad's to frequent the DA.........
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Name calling has no place anywhere here unless done in jest.
To explain why folks find it funny about squads in the DA...
The DA is the "Dueling Arena". Folks can go there to duel.
The furball area is for furballing..... why do you need a squad to do that in a Dueling Arena? Makes no sense. I have no problem with it but I do find it funny.
Like I stated in a previous post our Squad is not for flying and managing a MA type atmosphere but rather for friendships reason why I built a Social Network where we all go daily. Our squad for the most part likes to get to fights quickly and do 1on1's rather then take over bases it's our preference. It's your opinion and you have that right. We have a squad #1 to honor the orginal flying Rowdy1 and secondly its a friendship atmosphere. Thats why we have our squad I hope that helps your understanding of a "just a DA squad".
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Like I stated in a previous post our Squad is not for flying and managing a MA type atmosphere but rather for friendships reason why I built a Social Network where we all go daily. Our squad for the most part likes to get to fights quickly and do 1on1's rather then take over bases it's our preference. It's your opinion and you have that right. We have a squad #1 to honor the orginal flying Rowdy1 and secondly its a friendship atmosphere. Thats why we have our squad I hope that helps your understanding of a "just a DA squad".
I've NEVER encountered any of "The Rowdy Ones" in a 1 vs 1, let alone have any one of your kids take me up on ANY "let's move to a different field and have some fights". So to even say this in your post is far from factual. You DO name call and regardless of your "spin", you do it and cannot even admit to it. Your idea of a "fight" is a 5 on 1. Anytime I have managed to seperate any of you or your squaddies, you are on borrowed time.
You should reference my post in Rod's "Why do some people lie on 200?" After reading my post, try and apply it to your everyday doings.
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Name calling has no place anywhere here unless done in jest.
To explain why folks find it funny about squads in the DA...
The DA is the "Dueling Arena". Folks can go there to duel.
The furball area is for furballing..... why do you need a squad to do that in a Dueling Arena? Makes no sense. I have no problem with it but I do find it funny.
The weak are safer "in numbers". That's why.
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First off I spoke with Skuzzy the first day the squads went down and the servers lost the DA and it only affected the DA. I'm the CO over the Rowdy Ones and yes we are basically a squad that only flys in the DA. We have some of the members that fly with the pigs in the MA as well. I see alot of clueless people in this forum in particular that doesn't even understand what a squad is really is for. Reguardless if you fly MA or DA it's all just a game and for some they want to test each other out to see how big there sack is, it's a game but what makes a squad is the friendships you build bottom line. I understand if your flying MA you want leaders to put together missions on taking over bases but when you get down to it, it's a game. After your in a squad for awhile you will understand this maybe? but after you exit the game what do you have? nothing unless friendships have been made! We are a very close squad having our own Social Network just for chatter to get to know each other better. Maybe if some of the young pups in here would lean towards this way we wouldn't have all this cursing and testing each others sacks out. I'll be the first I love a 1on1 better then anything but I'll also be the first to say I'm not the best pilot in here I learn everyday and the more 1on1's I have the better I will get. The DA has a record of being a gang tard lake???? We'll I've flown in the MA some myself and trust me if your alone and 5 red planes around what are they going to do???? This is such a stupid conversation in my book if you want a 1on1 they are plenty of fields for that in the DA. The lake is a furball lake meaning of furball is alot of planes condenced together in a close proximity. I'm sure I'll be responding again in the near future when some idiot responds to this post.
If you ever see me in the DA ... please ... please ... stay away from my "sack" ... :rolleyes:
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Like I stated in a previous post our Squad is not for flying and managing a MA type atmosphere but rather for friendships reason why I built a Social Network where we all go daily. Our squad for the most part likes to get to fights quickly and do 1on1's rather then take over bases it's our preference. It's your opinion and you have that right. We have a squad #1 to honor the orginal flying Rowdy1 and secondly its a friendship atmosphere. Thats why we have our squad I hope that helps your understanding of a "just a DA squad".
My Squad does not take over bases. We are a 38 squad and we furball.
I have friends in this game that are not in our Squad and on all teams. Squads are not necessary for friendships.
If yall prefer 1 vs 1, I wondered why you needed to team up.
Answers to questions like that might stop these type threads from spouting all the time. :lol
Of course your not required to answer anything regarding how you or anyone else might play, but like I said it might stop these threads if folks have a better understanding. <S>
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I've NEVER encountered any of "The Rowdy Ones" in a 1 vs 1, let alone have any one of your kids take me up on ANY "let's move to a different field and have some fights". So to even say this in your post is far from factual. You DO name call and regardless of your "spin", you do it and cannot even admit to it. Your idea of a "fight" is a 5 on 1. Anytime I have managed to seperate any of you or your squaddies, you are on borrowed time.
You should reference my post in Rod's "Why do some people lie on 200?" After reading my post, try and apply it to your everyday doings.
Masherbrum, I've flown over 10,000 sorties in the DA and I've never seen your name so first off I think your knowledge on this topic is far from adequate, on the topic of you knowing anything about the Rowdy's. On my second finger I do 1on1's any chance I get and do it quite frequently actually. We got some great pilots and I'll set up some one on ones for you if you would like??? I don't talk much slang but you referencing to spin on me lying is a bogus statement so I'll just leave that one alone but talking about name calling I could care less what people think about the DA my opinion is stay in the MA. I never once called out a name but speaking in general about the MA flyers posting in here about the DA. You'll are making statements about an arena you don't even fly in possibly because your insecure about your home life maybe? I don't know but why not keep your mouth closed and fly in the MA and don't worry about it. Spend your time wisely on accomplishing something other then speaking on a topic you have no answers on. Thats the reason why I posted here to begin with, to give knowledge of why the DA has a squad/squad's speaking on behalf of the Rowdy's. Bottom Line think what you want of the DA and our Squad if you want one on ones I would be glad to set you some up. God Bless
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My Squad does not take over bases. We are a 38 squad and we furball.
I have friends in this game that are not in our Squad and on all teams. Squads are not necessary for friendships.
If yall prefer 1 vs 1, I wondered why you needed to team up.
Answers to questions like that might stop these type threads from spouting all the time. :lol
Of course your not required to answer anything regarding how you or anyone else might play, but like I said it might stop these threads if folks have a better understanding. <S>
I appreciate your comment Shuffler and I Salute you back <S>! There are different levels of friendships and I'll be honest with you I think a lot of the guys I fly with and myself included when we first started AHII there is an inadequate source of information reguarding web 2.0 technologies that help a person to become familiar with the MA. My opinion there needs to be a set of videos using a desktop software that allows a person not to half to read to learn everything about AHII. But on the topic of friendships do you speak with the guys you fly with over the telephone on a weekly basis or even have there email address. Do you meet with them any if they leave near? I hope this helps and I would be happy to answer any questions anyone has, have a great week Shuffler <S>!
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Masherbrum, I've flown over 10,000 sorties in the DA and I've never seen your name so first off I think your knowledge on this topic is far from adequate, on the topic of you knowing anything about the Rowdy's. On my second finger I do 1on1's any chance I get and do it quite frequently actually. We got some great pilots and I'll set up some one on ones for you if you would like??? I don't talk much slang but you referencing to spin on me lying is a bogus statement so I'll just leave that one alone but talking about name calling I could care less what people think about the DA my opinion is stay in the MA. I never once called out a name but speaking in general about the MA flyers posting in here about the DA. You'll are making statements about an arena you don't even fly in possibly because your insecure about your home life maybe? I don't know but why not keep your mouth closed and fly in the MA and don't worry about it. Spend your time wisely on accomplishing something other then speaking on a topic you have no answers on. Thats the reason why I posted here to begin with, to give knowledge of why the DA has a squad/squad's speaking on behalf of the Rowdy's. Bottom Line think what you want of the DA and our Squad if you want one on ones I would be glad to set you some up. God Bless
I've been in there many of times. I've asked YOU and any of your squaddies many times. I get the same "excuse laden" responses from you all. The only reason you're typing that is to save face on the BBS.
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I am in a da squad because i prefer dueling and furballing. Da squads are set up for like minded folks that have a real desire to learn to fly at peak. I am not into base taking, bombing or gv's nor do i want to spend a bunch of time flying sectors to get into a good fight. Their are some lamers of course but i have met some great folks there. We all appreciate Aces High for the same reasons fun fun fun. I guess it boils down to preference and i prefer to hang with my squad/friends, rather than going to ma and play with armchair generals.
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I appreciate your comment Shuffler and I Salute you back <S>! There are different levels of friendships and I'll be honest with you I think a lot of the guys I fly with and myself included when we first started AHII there is an inadequate source of information reguarding web 2.0 technologies that help a person to become familiar with the MA. My opinion there needs to be a set of videos using a desktop software that allows a person not to half to read to learn everything about AHII. But on the topic of friendships do you speak with the guys you fly with over the telephone on a weekly basis or even have there email address. Do you meet with them any if they leave near? I hope this helps and I would be happy to answer any questions anyone has, have a great week Shuffler <S>!
There are a TON of videos out there to learn how to fly and fight in AcesHigh. There is a HUGE amount of resources to a player willing to learn how to fly and fight. I will add that there is nothing wrong with having to read to learn something. What are you like 12? You argument doesn't hold water.
I for one speak to players I fly with and against quite often on the phone. Matter of fact I am meeting a 3-4 of 'em this next week for some beers. One squaddie, WMSol, is gonna take me up in his acrobatic stunt plane to see if he can make me pass out from the G forces.
(http://users.skynet.be/spotterfreak/images/Edge540HannesArch.JPG)
IIRC his is the 540 T two seater version. The Edge is one of 2-3 planes that you see in the Redbull air races. It is gonna be awesome!
I've been in there many of times. I've asked YOU and any of your squaddies many times. I get the same "excuse laden" responses from you all. The only reason you're typing that is to save face on the BBS.
TnDep, weren't you the guy that was talking a ton of smack to me one night in the DA who refused to duel me spouting off a ton of lame excuses? I was in there training a player and someone with like 10,000 kills wussed out of dueling me after going on an on about how their score proved they were a much better pilot. The FUNNY bit was they had something like 9,000 deaths (I don't think they even had a 1.0 k/d average) and that just made it REALLY pathetic because they were talking smack about a sub-par score.
Karaya, what makes the whole "talke smack and refuse to duel" even more pathetic is that we were IN the dueling arena. You know... the arena HTC has provided us to DUEL each other in. There IS no excuse to not fight at that point.
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Score in the Dueling arena don't matter! We land kills in there because that is our community and friends. We just like to rub it in a little lol.
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Karaya, what makes the whole "talke smack and refuse to duel" even more pathetic is that we were IN the dueling arena. You know... the arena HTC has provided us to DUEL each other in. There IS no excuse to not fight at that point.
Thank God someone FINALLY posts when they were there. Yes, they ALL refused either one of us, because they know what the outcome was going to be. They bully the new people who haven't a clue, but their tune changes at the first sign of "losing".
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Score in the Dueling arena don't matter! We land kills in there because that is our community and friends. We just like to rub it in a little lol.
Rub what in? Because if you think people are impressed it's long been a backfire on that attempt.
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We land kills in there because that is our community and friends. Are you missing something? Do you brag to your friends or rub it in if you win at something? There is the point we land kills for that reason. If some of you ma folks would come to the da to have fun instead of trying to bully, you might actually have fun instead of bashing folks. lol.
Do you land kills in the ma? thats just bad. lol
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We land kills in there because that is our community and friends. Are you missing something? Do you brag to your friends or rub it in if you win at something? There is the point we land kills for that reason. If some of you ma folks would come to the da to have fun instead of trying to bully, you might actually have fun instead of bashing folks. lol.
Do you land kills in the ma? thats just bad. lol
Excuse me princess, I bully no one. Landing kills in the DA is pointless and serves no purpose, other than to "gloat". I've only uttered "I told you so!" one time in my lifetime (36 now). Bragging is for people who have nothing to begin with.
How am I "bashing"? I told the truth on what happens when someone comes on here and "tells a different story". Lute was there when it happened. You couldn't hang in the MA.
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(http://dasmuppets.com/public/moot/0d/ahss84.png)
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(http://dasmuppets.com/public/moot/0d/ahss84.png)
That is EXACTLY what I was talking about too. Sup Moot! :rock
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I spent a lot of time in the ma.. it was not worth my time. I am 36 also and i would never talk like you. It is what it is FUN. The da is not what it used to be, This placed spawned into a HUGE community of folks that like to furball. I guess they need to change the name to something else and move the da. I will brag, look at Moots picture i survive in that mess no ammo left killed 5 or more. Brag city baby! lol
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We land kills in there because that is our community and friends. Are you missing something? Do you brag to your friends or rub it in if you win at something? There is the point we land kills for that reason. If some of you ma folks would come to the da to have fun instead of trying to bully, you might actually have fun instead of bashing folks. lol.
Do you land kills in the ma? thats just bad. lol
Every time I have been to the DA I never land. When fight is over I auger.
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There is a difference between private duels and furball area. People in this forum just don't understand. You land kills in your arena and i will land them in mine. enough said! Da is not the same, GET OVER IT.
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There is a difference between private duels and furball area. People in this forum just don't understand. You land kills in your arena and i will land them in mine. enough said! Da is not the same, GET OVER IT.
We know... it is, or was supposed to be a dueling arena.
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untill they added a furball zone, now it has both! :rock
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There is a difference between private duels and furball area. People in this forum just don't understand. You land kills in your arena and i will land them in mine. enough said! Da is not the same, GET OVER IT.
Now we're making some progress. I lay claim to no arena. But the above statement is beyond disturbing.
BTW, I don't expect everyone to like the truth. People like you would rather point the finger at someone else, rather than tell the truth. I also auger. I've had 10+ kills often at that lake and don't land them, I auger em.
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Karaya, you are a great pilot-I've fought with you and against you- and I've beaten and been beaten by you...not sure why the heat with TnDep, but we all play the game in a manner that is enjoyable to us, so I am not sure what the big deal is if someone plays the game in a way that is fun for them. If fun for them is in a DA squad full of friends, so what? If someone thinks that is a lame way to play and prefers the MA or dueling, so what? I am in the Rowdy Ones- I have developed relationships with the guys in the squad, and that is as important as anything for me in the game. I have been on the ganging side and on the receiving end of a solid ganging-I accept it as a part of the DA. Personally, being surrounded by 5-15 planes and distinguishing friend from foe and who is chasing who is the most fun for me-more fun than 1v1-but that's jsut my preference. Why do we feel compelled to bash other peoples' preferences?
<S> Clonk
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Imo, Furball Lake is fun or frustrating depending on how much people are flying. I really enjoy going there late at night when there's a dozen or so people on. I had some wonderful fights just the other night and plan on going back again.
I do however try to avoid the lake during prime time. I think it's just a bit too small of an area to squeeze 50+ people in and expect to have hoard free fights.
(http://i547.photobucket.com/albums/hh473/cactuskooler/DA_Gang.jpg)
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What are you like 12?
I for one speak to players I fly with and against quite often on the phone. Matter of fact I am meeting a 3-4 of 'em this next week for some beers. One squaddie, WMSol, is gonna take me up in his acrobatic stunt plane to see if he can make me pass out from the G forces.
(http://users.skynet.be/spotterfreak/images/Edge540HannesArch.JPG)
IIRC his is the 540 T two seater version. The Edge is one of 2-3 planes that you see in the Redbull air races. It is gonna be awesome!
TnDep, weren't you the guy that was talking a ton of smack to me one night in the DA who refused to duel me spouting off a ton of lame excuses? I was in there training a player and someone with like 10,000 kills wussed out of dueling me after going on an on about how their score proved they were a much better pilot. The FUNNY bit was they had something like 9,000 deaths (I don't think they even had a 1.0 k/d average) and that just made it REALLY pathetic because they were talking smack about a sub-par score.
Karaya, what makes the whole "talke smack and refuse to duel" even more pathetic is that we were IN the dueling arena. You know... the arena HTC has provided us to DUEL each other in. There IS no excuse to not fight at that point.
WMLute,
No sir, I don't get into arguments with anyone. I refuse to argue with anyone, its a game and I keep my integrity. And I'm 28 by the way and that sounds like fun I hope you have a great time flying, I'm sure it will be a rush. If everything works out I'll be flying myself on thursday not in a stunt plane but over Tims Ford Lake just for a scenic view.
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I've been in there many of times. I've asked YOU and any of your squaddies many times. I get the same "excuse laden" responses from you all. The only reason you're typing that is to save face on the BBS.
Masherbrum,
I've never once seen you and you've never asked me for a 1on1. Like I said before I'll be happy to set some 1on1's up for you Sir.
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Every now and then I'll land kills in the DA when I'm in something like the Ki-61, P-40, P-39, Yak-9T and have 6-7+ kills. Why? I dunno, but it looks kind of cool between "2 kills in a Temptest" and "2 kills in a F4U-1C." :D
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Masherbrum,
I've never once seen you and you've never asked me for a 1on1. Like I said before I'll be happy to set some 1on1's up for you Sir.
I have and you must be blind not to notice my in game name. I have MANY TIMES listened to you and your ilk bully folks, only to knock it off when leaned on slightly. Am I saying it happens all of the time? Nope. You ARE one of the quieter ones in the "RO's" But being silent and allowing your squaddies look like fools when they know they aren't "safe" in a 1 on 1, is funny.
I'm not "bashing". Merely wondering why people "bark" and don't wanna bite, when the opportunity is called upon them?
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:rofl the rowdy ones? them there boys be aces :rock
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giggle.
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I have and you must be blind not to notice my in game name. I have MANY TIMES listened to you and your ilk bully folks, only to knock it off when leaned on slightly. Am I saying it happens all of the time? Nope. You ARE one of the quieter ones in the "RO's" But being silent and allowing your squaddies look like fools when they know they aren't "safe" in a 1 on 1, is funny.
I'm not "bashing". Merely wondering why people "bark" and don't wanna bite, when the opportunity is called upon them?
Masherbrum would you like some 1on1's I'll set some up and see how you fair? I've not seen you and I've not talked to you before. I'm far from silent my friend but I know your lying when you say you've asked me for a 1on1. I've fought alot of guys 1on1 Spacy,Klipper,SAJ,Strip,Klauss,Nrshida,WGSizzle tonight, ect. ect. No need to talk anymore lets set some 1on1s up and I'll be first come find me in the DA I'll go. It's funny is I've told you on 3 or 4 different posts I'll set up some 1on1s and you've not stepped up to the plate yet. Are you just talking or do you want some 1on1's. I'll set you up with the best we have in our "Just a DA squad"
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Masherbrum would you like some 1on1's I'll set some up and see how you fair? I've not seen you and I've not talked to you before. I'm far from silent my friend but I know your lying when you say you've asked me for a 1on1. I've fought alot of guys 1on1 Spacy,Klipper,SAJ,Strip,Klauss,Nrshida,WGSizzle tonight, ect. ect. No need to talk anymore lets set some 1on1s up and I'll be first come find me in the DA I'll go. It's funny is I've told you on 3 or 4 different posts I'll set up some 1on1s and you've not stepped up to the plate yet. Are you just talking or do you want some 1on1's. I'll set you up with the best we have in our "Just a DA squad"
I am "Karaya" as it says in my Sig. Don't try and spin the "1 vs 1 thing" around. For over 6 months this has gone on. Klauss was a shades who left after I figured out who it was.
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Klauss was a shades who left after I figured out who it was.
Who was that timid patty cake? I actually put myself on auto-pilot in one round of a'duel' with him and died from boredom.
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I am "Karaya" as it says in my Sig. Don't try and spin the "1 vs 1 thing" around. For over 6 months this has gone on. Klauss was a shades who left after I figured out who it was.
I still don't recognize the name Karaya and I'm not trying to spin anything around about 1on1's. You called me out and my squad for not fighting 1on1's and that were on borrowed time when you do get is on our on. All I'm saying is do you want 1on1's or why post? Thats it!
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I still don't recognize the name Karaya and I'm not trying to spin anything around about 1on1's. You called me out and my squad for not fighting 1on1's and that were on borrowed time when you do get is on our on. All I'm saying is do you want 1on1's or why post? Thats it!
I said, IF I manage to get a one on one (brief too) over the lake, I make quick work. You ARE "spinning it around". If you're not honest with yourself and able to admit it, why try to be pious about it?
Also, stop hijacking the thread with this. Take this to PM's if you wish to continue. :salute
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I've NEVER encountered any of "The Rowdy Ones" in a 1 vs 1, let alone have any one of your kids take me up on ANY "let's move to a different field and have some fights". Anytime I have managed to seperate any of you or your squaddies, you are on borrowed time.
Enough said there you go, I didnt say it you did! Lets move to a different field
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Wasn't the rowdy ones disbanded. Have not heard anything of them in awhile.
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Wasn't the rowdy ones disbanded. Have not heard anything of them in awhile.
Nope we're still here Shuffler
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I have to say I am surprised at the hubbub over the DA. I have been flying for about 9 months (original name) and initially ended up in the DA when the instructor, who was more patient than Methuselah, spent an hour teaching me very basic flight. After bugging him, he suggested that IF I MUST GO TO DIE, which I insisted on, (its my 16 bucks per month right?) he sent me over to the DA with me having NO IDEA how difficult and brutal the learning process would be.
I was there for 1 hour and 8 guys helped me out. I came there nightly (I have to fly in the evenings because I have a family and a job and do not have the time or inclination to read the gargantuan volumes of tactical flight information that is available on the internet....if someone does have that kind of time, they are either a kid or someone who thinks this game is somehow important enough to distract them from their family or job....lol, I have heard this game referred to as "Divorce in a box") TO DIE....DIE EARLY, DIE HARD, AND DIE OFTEN and again, many people, witnessing my slow, painful, agonizing, REPEATED deaths spent their THEIR TIME to show me things: Rowdy1, Krupnski, MugZ, Flood, vegas, Dodger, Hombre, TA57x, Daveski, Bentnail, Havoc, Waystin2, etc. So it IS about relationships.
The DA is appealing to me for these reasons: 1) I like the guys I fly with; 2) It doesn't take 20 minutes of climbing to only find some BnZer who is higher than you are; 3) It takes much less time to get back in the fight 4) Even your enemies will help you with your flight skills; 5)and to try new planes and maneuvers under duress. Almost all of us change sides at one time or another....regardless of what some may say. The gangbanging, well, folks, that comes with the compressed area that the DA Lake is and every single country in there has their daily advantages in numbers..if you don't like getting banged, don't fly in there until it evens out and it evens out believe me...each and every few hours.
On another note: 1 v 1: I am truly lucky to have both my grandfathers still in this world and both were pilots during WW II. One was a B-25 driver and the other was a Texan trainer at Luke Field in AZ and then went on to the P-51B and both have laughed at the 1 v 1's we conduct. "Aerial Gunnery" was the term used at the time for both marksmanship and ACM and all pilots were "rated" in that single category with numerical grades, of which, my instructor grandfather still has his "grades". He watched me 1 v 1 xxxJCxxx and started screaming at the top of his old lungs to "fights-off" the fight because JC didn't knife edge pass me on the merge (they also chuckle at the HO rule and both agree....you wanna live or you wanna die?). Apparently, the rule was and still is, initial merge is a knife edge pass (canopy to canopy) so that neither a/c has an advantage. Some of you Im sure have heard of this but I have yet to see one person conduct a 1 v 1 in this manner. Ofcourse it really doesn't matter much because its a game but as I have learned over the past 9 months the winner of the 1 v 1 in here is virtually ALWAYS the pilot that gets position BEFORE the merge. I lay no claim to being any good at all at 1 v 1 but I believe them both and the rate at which I die in 1 v 1's is certainly a function of lack of experience in obtaining the advantage prior to the merge, NOT my lack of sack because that has been tested outside this game where it actually means something. Living or dying in this this great game doesn't add up to a hill of crap and anyone who measures their "manhood" by their skills in this game is distracted....be it chemically or physically.
I won't and haven't turned down a 1 v 1 for one simple reason...it means nothing..win or lose, lol.
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The DA is appealing to me for these reasons: 1) I like the guys I fly with; 2) It doesn't take 20 minutes of climbing to only find some BnZer who is higher than you are; 3) It takes much less time to get back in the fight 4) Even your enemies will help you with your flight skills; 5)and to try new planes and maneuvers under duress.
Seems that knowing only the present DA makes it really hard to imagine the old DA. In the "old" DA:
1) You had the same guys basically, except with less non-purist players.
2) You spent about the same amount of time to find a fight. Since there was no, or next to no, race to altitude/demeasured positional advantage, the fights were pretty much at airfield altitude and down. Also, killshooter hadn't been disabled yet, so you could FFA furball right off a field. One of the usual patterns was everyone off the top left fields where you could spawn southwards, turn the plane around, and just drop off the top of the airfield to the furball that was right below that cliff edge.
3) See above. No need to grab. The only thing you needed to do was look for a lone dot.. Because back then most everyone followed the common courtesy rule of chk6-ing before engaging.
4) I doubt this didn't happen more back then. Almost no one was so busy landing kills and making squads to get kills against a threat (in the technical sense) of ganging that didn't exist, no one was trying to prove anything by landing kills when they could instead put up a real fight. Effectively, all the players at the lake were one big informal squad. Nowadays there's zero discernment between a tempest doing the pure BnZ pick thru a low and slow furball or picking the RTBs or the AFKs that don't even know the Tempest is there, and the plane that actually beat a gaggle of 5+ on his own. Someone might say this is elitist, but it's not. It's simple statment of fact, nothing to read between the lines.
5) No difference. You wanted duress, you just set it up with someone else.. Say announce that you were in X plane and would like to have Y plane(s) against you.. No doubt someone would've consented.
So... The gangbanging, well, folks, that comes with the compressed area that the DA Lake is and every single country in there has their daily advantages in numbers..if you don't like getting banged, don't fly in there until it evens out and it evens out believe me...each and every few hours.
This is self-fulfilling, circular.
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Thank you for the response. You are correct in that I never had the chance to fly in the old DA but it sounds good.
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Everybody,
I just want to share how I fly the DA.
I fly it as combat practice. In the DA you will find similar conditions to the MA - gangers, vulchers (though there are far less vulchers than MA), pickers, HOers etc. The difference to me is that you waste far less time getting down to it.
Instead of about 10-15 minutes of climbout/transit to approximately the same conditions, I just fly about 2 minutes straight into the main furball. This lets me accumulate combat experience far more quickly than in the MA. If I get ganged, I practice surviving for as long as possible (though I don't relish the experience). I DO take landing kills as a sign that I am getting better, as they measure several things including
1) Ability to get in and get the kill (this assuming you don't just vulch/AFK kill).
2) Ability to survive a complex multi-aircraft engagement (requires SA and good evasive flying).
3) Proper judgment on when it's time to disengage.
Of course it is NOT the DA of old (after my original 2 weeks was up, I flew H2H which sounds similar to old DA). However you can still find 1v1s if you ask for them, though you generally take them to a side field. Perhaps "Dueling Arena" is a misnomer - better would be compressed MA-esque furball with special fields available for dueling.
What the current version gives up in terms of 1v1 fighting I'd say it makes up for in furball practice.
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Yall should try your "experience" in the MAs. Might be interesting. You'll find quick fights most all the time.
I used to Host H2H rooms all the time and did terrains for them. When AH2 came out I transitioned to the MAs.
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Didn't I see a thread like this a month ago? Or is this the same thread?
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Hey Changeup :aok
Was good to meet you in there.
moot. I have no idea what the "old DA was like. I'm no combat purist and am still learning when it comes to ACM's. I've not been at this long enough to remember a courtesy Check Six before busting my plane. The nearest I came to flying before I found this fantastic game, was a bucket and spade holiday to Spain.
Some have posted on this thread about the ganging up and messy "low skill" furballs. Guys getting flamed while RTB and AFK.
That happens in the MA's especially the late war. Maybe I'm wrong but furballing while AFK is a clueless pastime.
The guys in the DA land thier kills "if" they can. I personally find it incredibly hard work just getting kills let alone landing them.
Most of the fights are at 5-6k down to the deck, sure you get the odd screamer coming down from 20k and ploughing through the pile of Red. It's usually me in my Jug-D 11.
As for messy "low skill" furballs. I was in Titanic Tuesday earlier and flying out of A1. Total carnage.
Didn't see much skill in there. lancs coming in 1.5k above the deck and planes hitting walls and auguring while shooting ords and barracks.
The DA, for all it's detractors has an edge when it comes to finding a fight quickly and against some very good sticks.
As Changeup stated. The fight is condensed to a small area and gets busy sometimes. Guys change side frequently and the numbers tend to even out eventually. Also the learning curve for survival in there is steep.
All due respect to those who've been at this game long enough to remember the old ways.
This thread has turned into a flame baiting word and honour war, when all the original post asked was "What happenned to the squads?"
<S>
KlunK
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Great post Onan, makes me proud to be English! Sadly you're wasting your time because most of these people will never be happy. The old DA was empty and barren waste land with the occasional killshooter dueling. Then killshooter was added and it was close to empty untill they added the furball zone and now it is a thriving sub-community and those who aer jealous of your fun are not going to listen to your good sense.
S!
batfink
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Nothing to do with jealousy.
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Condescension is less forgivable as your motive, you should run with the jealousy theme. Surely you don't pity them. It cannot be hatred either, not in a game. You cannot be acting 'in their best interests' because they are already having ten times the fun you have in the game right now.
Nope, it's either condescention or jealousy.
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Nothing condescending or jealous or pitying or hateful about it. It's plain fact. And the most fun I have nowadays is teaching what I know and it's as fun as I've ever had in the game - in fact I was about to quit because I had no reason to keep playing (no challenge and not as rewarding as studying and partying) and this changed everything for me as far as the game goes.
You cannot be acting 'in their best interests' because they are already having ten times the fun you have in the game right now.
This speaks for itself though. You don't speak for me or the rest of the trainers, so please take care what you say on my behalf or other trainers'.
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The DA is appealing to me for these reasons: 1) I like the guys I fly with; 2) It doesn't take 20 minutes of climbing to only find some BnZer who is higher than you are; 3) It takes much less time to get back in the fight 4) Even your enemies will help you with your flight skills; 5)and to try new planes and maneuvers under duress. Almost all of us change sides at one time or another....regardless of what some may say. The gangbanging.....
Up until the ganging part, and the attempt to justify it, this reminds me of how the AvA was. AND we added history to the mix.
The ganging, to me, would be intolerable. But the other qualities are things that people should strive to preserve in any arena.
- oldman
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I'm curious what the reasoning is for defending 6 planes chasing after one, instead of 4 or 5 of them letting 1 or 2 get to that one con, and themselves finding another target(s) which would inarguably put up a better fight. Win win for everyone involved.
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Nothing condescending or jealous or pitying or hateful about it. It's plain fact. And the most fun I have nowadays is teaching what I know and it's as fun as I've ever had in the game - in fact I was about to quit because I had no reason to keep playing (no challenge and not as rewarding as studying and partying) and this changed everything for me as far as the game goes.
You dont need a trainer badge to help people moot, some of us have been enjoying the game like that for years 'freelance'. Infact its rather sad that you think a badge means anything to anyone. You could have helped people just as much before. Many do.
I'm basing it on your recent comments regarding your lack of enjoyment.
After a 5am-8pm day of non stop studying (I'm skipping first two weeks of class to get ahead so I have an extra 2 weeks at end of semester to prepare finals), being forced to play a game just doesn't happen. I can't do it. I can't make myself give up hours of sleep that I absolutely need to be fresh the next day, so I can play a game that I'm not even having any fun with. That might sound rude but that's exactly what it is. The kinda thing that the harder you force someone to do, the least he's gonna want to do it.
You don't speak for me or the rest of the trainers, so please take care what you say on my behalf or other trainers'.
I have no idea what you mean, im not even talking about any other trainers. I never even directly commented at you.
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I'm curious what the reasoning is for defending 6 planes chasing after one, instead of 4 or 5 of them letting 1 or 2 get to that one con, and themselves finding another target(s) which would inarguably put up a better fight. Win win for everyone involved.
This does happen but really the one plane is at fault for putting his self in that position, but it happens alot less in there as most of the guys in there are 6+ months at AHII. The Rooks, Bish, and Knights are really working together to make this a great place and I'm telling you what I've had the most fun ever this last week. I've had some amazing fights lasting several minutes each and I :salute the DA for all the bases working together these last few weeks.
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I like flying in the DA, not good at it but it is fun, what I wish though is that they would turn kill shooter off. I have been chasing planes with no one else around and being patient waiting for my shot and a friendly comes barreling in right through my shot and damages me. Just my opinion I am probably wrong.
Flushed
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With all due respect Moot, as a trainer, and by proxy a leader in this community, I find it curious that you take "sides" on this discussion. Both the MA and DA have the same, but different things to offer to new and senior pilots alike and I would think, and Im just spitballing here, that you would take that track when maintaining a form of "moderator" in this discussion. Please don't say your not moderating it because your position here at HTC defaults that to you. It seems odd to me that you don't perpetuate the benefits of both arenas and choose to sow those benefits among your potential students in a positive discourse. That is just my observation sir and that is not a representation of any other trainer. :salute
In truth, because of where someone chooses to fly makes them no better a pilot and I have been ganged, as has everyone here, in both places. Furthermore, it's curious to me that if the people that do not like the DA and claim they care nothing for their scores why be concerned with the gangbanging? If you care nothing of your score or landing victories, a horde presents more targets of opportunity for them and getting victories should be easier for the better pilots. For instance tonight I watched 1 pilot take out 6 pilots that I believe to be very good sticks...internet superpilot award winners? Probably not but good sticks....and at one point he was runnin. It was some of the best flying I have ever seen in here.
Maybe "score" should be changed to ego...which I would understand more than someone saying they ignore their "scores".
:salute KlunK
:salute Batfink
:salute Flushed
PS - Oldman, I wasn't justifying the ganging, I was simply saying it exists...in both arenas. In my mind that is as much a part of this game as sand traps are to golf...if you can't or don't want to hit out of sand traps, don't hit the ball in the sand. Its risk/reward my friend. :salute
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You know what. Every post by you to me is the same. Everything I say is meant at face value. If you don't like that, talk to Skuzzy about it.
That bold in the quote from my post is out of context. It refered to specifically the duel with you, in the context of a long day when I might have fun playing the game but not sitting in front of a computer monitor as playing the game requires.
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PS - Oldman, I wasn't justifying the ganging, I was simply saying it exists...in both arenas. In my mind that is as much a part of this game as sand traps are to golf...if you can't or don't want to hit out of sand traps, don't hit the ball in the sand. Its risk/reward my friend. :salute
At times it is almost literally impossible in both arenas to avoid being a part of either a Many v. one or a One v. many. The happy medium between the two is a hell of a lot harder to find than the fairway!!!
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With all due respect Moot, as a trainer, and by proxy a leader in this community, I find it curious that you take "sides" on this discussion. Both the MA and DA have the same, but different things to offer to new and senior pilots alike and I would think, and Im just spitballing here, that you would take that track when maintaining a form of "moderator" in this discussion. Please don't say your not moderating it because your position here at HTC defaults that to you. It seems odd to me that you don't perpetuate the benefits of both arenas and choose to sow those benefits among your potential students in a positive discourse. That is just my observation sir and that is not a representation of any other trainer. :salute
In truth, because of where someone chooses to fly makes them no better a pilot and I have been ganged, as has everyone here, in both places. Furthermore, it's curious to me that if the people that do not like the DA and claim they care nothing for their scores why be concerned with the gangbanging? If you care nothing of your score or landing victories, a horde presents more targets of opportunity for them and getting victories should be easier for the better pilots. For instance tonight I watched 1 pilot take out 6 pilots that I believe to be very good sticks...internet superpilot award winners? Probably not but good sticks....and at one point he was runnin. It was some of the best flying I have ever seen in here.
Maybe "score" should be changed to ego...which I would understand more than someone saying they ignore their "scores".
:salute KlunK
:salute Batfink
:salute Flushed
PS - Oldman, I wasn't justifying the ganging, I was simply saying it exists...in both arenas. In my mind that is as much a part of this game as sand traps are to golf...if you can't or don't want to hit out of sand traps, don't hit the ball in the sand. Its risk/reward my friend. :salute
You're reading too much into it. I'm not taking sides for the DA or MA. Both have their good and bad, and I point out both in both. That's not bias, on the contrary. Pretty much every student I've had, I directed to the DA when what he needed most was trigger time. No doubt about that. If you understand my posts as I mean them, and I'm fairly sure they're clear, the main fault with the DA that stops it from being as good as it could be with a small effort, is the neglect for fair fights. Specifically, running after a single con (I said this above but I'll repeat it) when it's outnumbered 3+ to 1, and there's more cons coming elsewhere if one had the patience to fly in that other direction for at most 1 minute.
If you get anything like Batfink is insisting is between the lines of my posts, you're reading way too much into it. If you don't believe me, look up any of my posts on this in the dozens of discussions we've had in 10 years on this forum. You'll find the same argument, and not just from me.
Also, ganging in the MA can somewhat be justified by the strategic framing of the arena. In the DA there's no such thing. The point of the DA which you and others imply, is the fight. The quality of fights. Which ganging, when you could just let a 2:1 alone instead of piling on to make it a 5:1, doesn't help. Like I said above, letting a 1:1 or 2:1 go on till there was room in it for you would be a win win for everyone.
And I'm not moderating anything here. If anything I try to help catalyze good discussion that goes straight to the bottom of disagreements. The reason I flash my badge is because Batfink is looking to stir things up. It's what he's been doing for a while and I'm just not going to get into that because to back it up I'd have to quote PMs of his and that's against the rules.
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That bold in the quote from my post is out of context. It refered to specifically the duel with you, in the context of a long day when I might have fun playing the game but not sitting in front of a computer monitor as playing the game requires.
I dont even understand what that means, moot. You would make a good politician.
You did not see your own wise message the first time i quoted you, i hoped you would. I will bold it out for you so you may find a hidden message as to why the more you try to be in control of how people fly the less it will happen the way you wish.
...[snip] I can't make myself give up hours of sleep that I absolutely need to be fresh the next day, so I can play a game that I'm not even having any fun with. That might sound rude but that's exactly what it is. The kinda thing that the harder you force someone to do, the least he's gonna want to do it.
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Again saying stuff I never said nor even think. I don't want to be in control of anyone. But you keep saying it.
This is going nowhere quick.
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So what exactly is your point then? If you dont want to control how people fly in the furball arena why are you typing historical references like this:
Seems that knowing only the present DA makes it really hard to imagine the old DA. In the "old" DA:
1) You had the same guys basically, except with less non-purist players.
2) You spent about the same amount of time to find a fight. Since there was no, or next to no, race to altitude/demeasured positional advantage, the fights were pretty much at airfield altitude and down. Also, killshooter hadn't been disabled yet, so you could FFA furball right off a field. One of the usual patterns was everyone off the top left fields where you could spawn southwards, turn the plane around, and just drop off the top of the airfield to the furball that was right below that cliff edge.
3) See above. No need to grab. The only thing you needed to do was look for a lone dot.. Because back then most everyone followed the common courtesy rule of chk6-ing before engaging.
4) I doubt this didn't happen more back then. Almost no one was so busy landing kills and making squads to get kills against a threat (in the technical sense) of ganging that didn't exist, no one was trying to prove anything by landing kills when they could instead put up a real fight. Effectively, all the players at the lake were one big informal squad. Nowadays there's zero discernment between a tempest doing the pure BnZ pick thru a low and slow furball or picking the RTBs or the AFKs that don't even know the Tempest is there, and the plane that actually beat a gaggle of 5+ on his own. Someone might say this is elitist, but it's not. It's simple statment of fact, nothing to read between the lines.
5) No difference. You wanted duress, you just set it up with someone else.. Say announce that you were in X plane and would like to have Y plane(s) against you.. No doubt someone would've consented.
The only thing that has changed is killshooter was disabled. The furballing zone has zero impact on the dueling fields. I was in the 'old DA' 4 nights a week for a long time before it changed. I can honestly say this map has more to offer. The only thing that is different is the killshooter. That is a small price to pay to add a furball zone. If you keep ducking questions one has to draw one's own conclusions.
Question for anyone, not just moot, alot of people seem to be on the DA furballer's backs right now.
If not control, what is your point to being so concerned about people and how they have fun in the furball zone?
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So what exactly is your point then? If you dont want to control how people fly in the furball arena why are you typing historical references like this:
Maybe moot just wants to reminisce. Not EVERYTHING has an ulterior motive. From my reading of this, moot has been far less judgmental than some others. A lot of conversations I have could be interpreted to be highly adversarial arguments, but if you know me, you'd know that most of these conversations are actually very logical point/counter-point affairs where both sides are open minded and trying to figure something out. Knowing this, I give moot the benefit of the doubt when he tells us that everything he says is at face value.
Honestly mechanic, I don't know why you are being so defensive. Keep in mind, I fly in the DA too. What do you care what others think of how you fly? I will justify something if I believe there is a solid reason for it, but I do so simply to inform not to defend myself. For an oversimplified example, when others complain about picking, I explain that I find picking legitimate b/c wing tactics are just organized picking. That's simply how some fighters were meant to be flown. If someone doesn't buy into that, then they probably won't listen to reason so I don't bother arguing anymore. I just ignore them.
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You're reading too much into it. I'm not taking sides for the DA or MA. Both have their good and bad, and I point out both in both. That's not bias, on the contrary. Pretty much every student I've had, I directed to the DA when what he needed most was trigger time. No doubt about that. If you understand my posts as I mean them, and I'm fairly sure they're clear, the main fault with the DA that stops it from being as good as it could be with a small effort, is the neglect for fair fights. Specifically, running after a single con (I said this above but I'll repeat it) when it's outnumbered 3+ to 1, and there's more cons coming elsewhere if one had the patience to fly in that other direction for at most 1 minute.
If you get anything like Batfink is insisting is between the lines of my posts, you're reading way too much into it. If you don't believe me, look up any of my posts on this in the dozens of discussions we've had in 10 years on this forum. You'll find the same argument, and not just from me.
Also, ganging in the MA can somewhat be justified by the strategic framing of the arena. In the DA there's no such thing. The point of the DA which you and others imply, is the fight. The quality of fights. Which ganging, when you could just let a 2:1 alone instead of piling on to make it a 5:1, doesn't help. Like I said above, letting a 1:1 or 2:1 go on till there was room in it for you would be a win win for everyone.
And I'm not moderating anything here. If anything I try to help catalyze good discussion that goes straight to the bottom of disagreements. The reason I flash my badge is because Batfink is looking to stir things up. It's what he's been doing for a while and I'm just not going to get into that because to back it up I'd have to quote PMs of his and that's against the rules.
Moot, I know you have quite a bit going on in the forum and some conversations with several people but I need more understanding of what you mean by this and why's ganging is justified in the MA.
My thing is you have this in the MA and if the MA was as condensed as the DA it would just be awful. In the MA almost every fight I get in people Ho. Most of the fights in the DA all the good pilots cold merge and we have an amazing time. I guess the MA pilots are always going to talk smack about the DA like it's a black or white thing but it is what it is. We try to provide knowledge of why the DA is for us and we get nothing from slander from some. Moot this is not tended to be statements towards you just needing understanding on the bolded area of what you mean about that. Thanks
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BnZ :salute Sir!!
The happy medium on the fairway is a percentage shot with a club that won't get you trouble but advances the ball! LOL :O
The happy medium in avoiding gangbanging (in my limited experience) is, as the movie Top Gun points out so vividly, "Nose hard-0ver, select zone 5 (after-burner) and escape....live to fight another day....Maverick, you made a poor decision"..LMAO!! Works for me....
But then you have those hard working killers who dive into a horde for the sake of diving into a horde!! You have to love those guys...
xxxJCxxx, Hombre, Dodger, Vegas.....watching those guys work is something to see
Anyway, thank you for the conversations...they have been enlightening.
Changeup :salute
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I am fairly new to this game. I came from a far simpler flight Sim game, but grew dissatisfied with the quality of flight and fights. I happened upon AHII by chance, but have been loving it since I joined. I pretty much stick to the DA. I am in a squad, which I am grateful for being admitted. I am here to have fun.......... How I have fun is really only my business isn't it????. The DA has allowed me to have that fun as well as gain experience and fly with/against people who are of the same mindset.
I guess the question I have to ask those who wonder about squads in the DA is..... What is more fun? Going to a football game with friends...... or by yourself? How about the bar or club? More fun alone or with a big group of people??? We have squads for the same reason as those in the MA... for the fun and enjoyment of friends.
I think one of the great things about the DA, (from a newbies perspective) is that I am able to fly many different types of Fighter/Attack planes.(perk and non perk). Find out how they handle. Find out which plane fits me best. All without the pressure of losing a base or watching your CV sink. Its pretty low pressure, and a newbie (raw) has his hands full just keeping head on straight at first. :rolleyes: It allows a newer pilot to get in many sorties, to gain confidence then have that confidence taken away by a really good stick or some plunker diving in from 15000 ft. Either way you know that in four or five minutes you will get your chance to make amends.
Fun is fun people. But complining about how others have theirs seems really petty.
As a Squaddie and friend says "It is.....what it is.
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What I'm saying is that at time it seems ALL you see are big globs of green with red guy in the middle or big globs of red with oneself in the middle.
It seems that tactics are mostly inapplicable. Begins an angles fight with a P-51D and a HurrIIC comes in. Try to extend away from a Zeke and a Dora dives in. Have something hanging at the end of the rope and higher bandits are diving in to pick you at the top. Put a bandit in a vulnerable position without other bandits around, you pick up lots of green "help" shooting over your shoulder. Begin a fight with a bandit in anyway whatsoever and 3 more take the opportunity to try and saddle. And this is the lake AND the MA.
BnZ :salute Sir!!
The happy medium on the fairway is a percentage shot with a club that won't get you trouble but advances the ball! LOL :O
The happy medium in avoiding gangbanging (in my limited experience) is, as the movie Top Gun points out so vividly, "Nose hard-0ver, select zone 5 (after-burner) and escape....live to fight another day....Maverick, you made a poor decision"..LMAO!! Works for me....
But then you have those hard working killers who dive into a horde for the sake of diving into a horde!! You have to love those guys...
xxxJCxxx, Hombre, Dodger, Vegas.....watching those guys work is something to see
Anyway, thank you for the conversations...they have been enlightening.
Changeup :salute
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If you are all having fun what's the problem ??
It's a game we play for fun and we each get our fun in different ways.
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I guess it would be easier to understand if the DA furball area had one base and not different sides.
A true DA furball arena would be all against all. As it stands it is the AVA with mixed plane sets.
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I guess it would be easier to understand if the DA furball area had one base and not different sides.
A true DA furball arena would be all against all. As it stands it is the AVA with mixed plane sets.
Bingo! Someone else "gets it".
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Moot, I know you have quite a bit going on in the forum and some conversations with several people but I need more understanding of what you mean by this and why's ganging is justified in the MA.
I don't speak for moot, but my guess is:
Every kill helps the strategic environment in the MA whether it's a gang kill or not. It eliminates a threat and allows the strategic game to progress closer to its end goal of taking bases. Whether you get a kill or not or if you get a good fight is immaterial so long as it "helps the team".
In the DA, the end goal is not to take any bases, therefore there is no real justification for ganging (beyond a somewhat reasonable 2:1 or 3:1). The goal is to fly in there, have a fight and get a kill. If you gang, then only one person is going to get the kill, and most of the gang will not be getting a fight.
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Bingo! Someone else "gets it".
but why does that matter? If those regulars are having fun doing it, why should anyone complain?
Maybe moot just wants to reminisce. Not EVERYTHING has an ulterior motive. From my reading of this, moot has been far less judgmental than some others. A lot of conversations I have could be interpreted to be highly adversarial arguments, but if you know me, you'd know that most of these conversations are actually very logical point/counter-point affairs where both sides are open minded and trying to figure something out. Knowing this, I give moot the benefit of the doubt when he tells us that everything he says is at face value.
Honestly mechanic, I don't know why you are being so defensive. Keep in mind, I fly in the DA too. What do you care what others think of how you fly? I will justify something if I believe there is a solid reason for it, but I do so simply to inform not to defend myself. For an oversimplified example, when others complain about picking, I explain that I find picking legitimate b/c wing tactics are just organized picking. That's simply how some fighters were meant to be flown. If someone doesn't buy into that, then they probably won't listen to reason so I don't bother arguing anymore. I just ignore them.
I duly note what youre saying boomerlu, my original contribution to the thread was not directed at anyone specificaly, just the group of people who are complaining how the furball arena is used. Moot took on the argument and thus I directed my comments towards himself in reply to his comments. All I started out saying was i agree with Onan's post.
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I don't speak for moot, but my guess is:
Every kill helps the strategic environment in the MA whether it's a gang kill or not. It eliminates a threat and allows the strategic game to progress closer to its end goal of taking bases. Whether you get a kill or not or if you get a good fight is immaterial so long as it "helps the team".
In the DA, the end goal is not to take any bases, therefore there is no real justification for ganging (beyond a somewhat reasonable 2:1 or 3:1). The goal is to fly in there, have a fight and get a kill. If you gang, then only one person is going to get the kill, and most of the gang will not be getting a fight.
Excellent observation, yet many of those posting in this thread seem to prefer it as such....how much fun CAN one have flying about in an insular blob of 8-10 planes cornering 1 plane ata time and ganging it into the water before moving onto the next :rolleyes:
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I don't speak for moot, but my guess is:
Every kill helps the strategic environment in the MA whether it's a gang kill or not. It eliminates a threat and allows the strategic game to progress closer to its end goal of taking bases. Whether you get a kill or not or if you get a good fight is immaterial so long as it "helps the team".
In the DA, the end goal is not to take any bases, therefore there is no real justification for ganging (beyond a somewhat reasonable 2:1 or 3:1). The goal is to fly in there, have a fight and get a kill. If you gang, then only one person is going to get the kill, and most of the gang will not be getting a fight.
Thank You for explaining boomerlu and that totally makes sense.
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Lynx, if ever, someone was suffering from a very raw case of Diaper Rash it would be you. If we of the DA r so offensive to you, why don't u either put up or shut up!!!!!!! In other words 'come on by n' fly' if ya think ya can take havin' yer head handed to ya over 'n, over n' over n', etc., etc., etc., :P
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Wow, someone's brave given Lynx has left the game.
Personally, I never understood why there were squads in the DA - that said, I'm really not bothered if there are or not. On the few occasions I've flown in furball lake, its been fun, and good practise for a multi plane engagement in the MA. Basically, it is what it is, no one single person is going to change it.
Wurzel
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Excellent observation, yet many of those posting in this thread seem to prefer it as such....how much fun CAN one have flying about in an insular blob of 8-10 planes cornering 1 plane ata time and ganging it into the water before moving onto the next :rolleyes:
I know this goes on and all 3 bases are very good at this. I've been on the recieving end alot lol.... but when I go out to the lake and you look at the map you normally see a stragler out there that you can go fight 1on1. Especially when theres alot on if you search you will find that 1on1, but at the same time if you don't keep your eyes out you get picked everytime :aok
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The ganging and hording is just as bad in furball lake as the main arena. The only difference is the average skill and knowledge of the players doing it.
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The ganging and hording is just as bad in furball lake as the main arena. The only difference is the average skill and knowledge of the players doing it.
Which arena are you saying has the higher skill level?
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Which arena are you saying has the higher skill level?
My personal opinion is that their are great sticks in both arenas. If your talking about the totality of the players I would say the MA because they have the vest majority of the numbers. But if you pick the top 10 from both arenas I think it would become a much closer match.
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If not control, what is your point to being so concerned about people and how they have fun in the furball zone?
My concern is self-centered.
I want to go to that area and have the same "respect" for the fight as it was back in the old day when killshooter was off. I use to spend a fair amount of time in the "old" DA due to the "respect" mindset ... that is definitely not today's mindset ... hence I very rarely spend time in the DA now.
In the past, I could take off from a field ... get up to fighting speed ... and then look for the "fight". People buzzing around the field would "respect" when you were on climb-out and not blow you out of the sky ... not the case now ... there is no waiting for someone to get into a "fair" position for a good "fair" fight ... case in point ... they now will de-ack fields and vulch if given the chance.
People would also "respect" an active engagement ... and then wait their turn to take on the "winner". I was in the DA the other day a flew the edge of the lake hoping that if someone did engage and someone else happened by ... they would "respect" the fight seeing as the "fight" was not really in the center (furball zone) ... not the case ... I was engaged and the fight was on, but others who happened by could not "respect" the fight that was already in progress and felt the need to jump right in ... this happened to me twice and the guy that killed me was never the one the I was initially engaged with.
In both of those cases, the fight started with a 1 v 1, then it became a 1 v 2 (ok ... I can handle that) ... then a quickly became a 3 v 1 ... not good, in the midst of handling the 2 v 1 I have lost my position, speed and E for a 3 v 1, but still in a relatively good position with the 2 initial guys I was fighting, so adding the 3rd target things really start to go bad quickly ... then number 4 decides to join the fray ... at this point I am pure defense, 200ft AGL, just above stall speed ... yet all 4 feel the need to keep coming back any firing at my flopping plane at any angle they can get a guns solutions on ... just so they can get the kill ... I don't get it.
Yeah ... that was a lot of fun for me ... NOT.
What should have happened ...
The second, third and fourth guys on the scene should have circled and watched the fight(s) and if the outcome was me winning ... wait until I get some speed back and then engage ... that type of mindset is a win win situation for all.
Personally, and from my observations, the mindset in the DA is kill at all cost so I can "land" the kills ... and this is what fuels the "ganging" and why you will see 5 v 1 like the picture that moot posted. I just don't understand what type of self-gratification that one could get from participating in a 5 v 1 and scoring the kill ... you surely proved nothing to your adversary and what did you prove to yourself ? ... can you be proud of that kill ? ... I think not.
On the other hand, if I do fly right into the middle of the "furball" in the center of the lake ... ALL BETS ARE OFF ... everyone and anyone that is red is a fair target ... regardless if engaged or not. But ... I have seen guys dive out of the furball ... possibly to get back up to speed or one guy is really attached to his 6 ... and watched 4-5 others dive down with him and chase him until he has to re-engage. Again, why ? ... where is the satisfaction in that ? ... are there not enough targets in the live furball to take on ... I think the mindset is ... "there is an easy kill that I can add to my belt".
As far as squads ... You can take on one guy from a squad and spank him badly or he gets upset that he lost to you ... so the next time he comes back ... he has squaddies in hand and they all swarm you for "revenge" ... lots of fun and the guy that got beat ... he just learned a boatload.
Rather than message you and ask to get in another fight and see if he can fair better or just plain ask ... "How did you do that ? ... I need to know" ... nope ... not the case ... you need to die at all costs.
To me, the DA is a place to learn ... engaging in 5 v 1 ... ganging ... picking planes off that are already engaged (away from the furball) is not "learning" and detracts from what that place is supposed to be about.
So ... my self-centered concern is the lack of "respect" and I would like to see it become the norm in that arena and not a fleeting notion that one sees on occasion.
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My personal opinion is that their are great sticks in both arenas. If your talking about the totality of the players I would say the MA because they have the vest majority of the numbers. But if you pick the top 10 from both arenas I think it would become a much closer match.
Wouldn't even be close.
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Wouldn't even be close.
Amen to that Lute! You and Karaya are two of the best sticks in the game, yet you're the most gracious & respectful people who are always ready to help someone improve their flying, regardless of country. :salute
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Which arena are you saying has the higher skill level?
Do you have to ask? Furball lake is like baby seal clubbing.
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Slappy, nice post. I have a couple of points to discuss on it but right now i'm short on time. All I will say now is that the old DA didnt have a furball zone. What you speak of still happens at the dueling fields. The furball zone is, to me, a different kettle of fish all together. Good post though, i hope some people will see your motives and understand how they benifit everyone in the long term.
:salute
edit: actualy i dont think i do have any other points :lol
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In the past, I could take off from a field ... get up to fighting speed ... and then look for the "fight". People buzzing around the field would "respect" when you were on climb-out and not blow you out of the sky ... not the case now ... there is no waiting for someone to get into a "fair" position for a good "fair" fight ... case in point ... they now will de-ack fields and vulch if given the chance.
A few things. I see where you are coming from with this post and I understand it. I'd like to point a few things out.
1) De-ack and vulch? I don't think I've seen a de-ack in the past few weeks. It probably happens on occasion, usually by one side getting pissed as a group. Time to leave the DA and wait for it to chill out if it happens.
Vulchers? Typically the people vulching in DA are pretty bad. They are easy to evade and not even worth batting an eyelash over beyond making one break turn to avoid them. Sure I see your point, but I find it a waste of energy getting PO'd at something that doesn't bother me in any practical sense. Every time I have died to a vulcher (maybe 1% of my flights), it was because I was stupid and actually tried to engage him. 50% of the time I see a vulching Temp over my base, I fly straight into the furball and he doesn't even bother me. The other 49% of the time I dodge one (very bad) attack and then proceed to fly straight into the furball.
These types aren't worth bothering with. They also don't represent the majority of the DA.
2) Respect for a fair fight? Please please please just ask for a 1v1 and take it to a side field and agree on rules. I see where you're coming from - code of honor etc etc, but really in the furball portion (even on the sides) rarely will you find a fair fight even if it's a 1v1 that no one interrupts. When I really want a fair fight I take it to a side field, agree on rules, and mirror-match planes or at least both people agree on the particular dissimilar rides to take.
There are so many variables here - plane matchup, E-state, initial positional advantage/disadvantage, awareness (or lack thereof) of the enemy. Seriously, if fairness is a big concern, then you don't leave it up to chance.
3) Respect for the fight whether it was fair to begin with or not, especially one that's away from the main furball area. Yeah I agree with you on this one. I hate it when I'm in a good fight in the outskirts of the lake (over the dry land portion usually) and it gets interrupted.
Still, if there are no players like you to get mad at the 1v1 pickers etc, then it will never change. There's no arena message, and even if there were I'm not sure how many would read it. I used to be kind of clueless too, then I saw the value of leaving some fights alone, or at least asking before engaging - this was mostly after one or two people actually got angry at me and then later I had some good fights interrupted.
My personal mindset is usually "just-ask" but after flying a while, I understand some people can't get around to responding while in the middle of the fight. This is why I agree with you on respect for the fight, at least in a DA type environment - because sometimes asking isn't enough.
4) 1vMany. When I fight in the furball, I typically fly fast BnZ planes and pick (I will up an E fighter and knife fight if there are not enough people to sustain a good furball). Often times I will get a huge gaggle attached to my arse. I then proceed to dive to the deck (they follow), then I drag them to my friends who all have a huge E advantage and they make short work of the dumb horde. Or if my friends don't have a huge E-advantage, they all meet and have a nice great furball and I can re-engage. And by friends I don't mean squad - just my country mates who are more than happy to clear me. The level of team work I see in the DA furball is more consistent than that I see in MA. Sometimes MA teamwork does amaze me - I typically fly great sorties when this happens, but generally we are all too scattered.
Anyways, back on point. We should see more "1vMany drags" as opposed to "1vMany I'm going down in a blaze of glory." The former promotes wider fights and furballs whereas the latter promotes whining about getting ganged. Sure you sometimes can't do anything about the latter, but I still see many gangs where the guy should have just bugged out ages ago.
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:rofl
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A few things. I see where you are coming from with this post and I understand it. I'd like to point a few things out.
1) De-ack and vulch? I don't think I've seen a de-ack in the past few weeks. It probably happens on occasion, usually by one side getting pissed as a group. Time to leave the DA and wait for it to chill out if it happens.
The fact that is does happen at all is WRONG. This arena is supposed to be about the "fight" ... your supposed to fight and learn something and as a 7 year vet ... you won't learn crap unless you die ... many many times. In this arena, your not supposed to get "pissed" and the ruin the experience for others. Why the hell should I or anyone have to leave an arena cause some choose to be fools. The reasons people like me participate in these types of threads it to try and educate and hopefully instill a particular "mindset" into as many as will listen and hopefull that "mindset" will be passed on ... if 90% of those why do and want to fly in the DA would embrace this type of mindset and come down on those that don't ... those that don't will either embrace it eventually or they will be shamed out of the arena.
Vulchers? Typically the people vulching in DA are pretty bad. They are easy to evade and not even worth batting an eyelash over beyond making one break turn to avoid them. Sure I see your point, but I find it a waste of energy getting PO'd at something that doesn't bother me in any practical sense. Every time I have died to a vulcher (maybe 1% of my flights), it was because I was stupid and actually tried to engage him. 50% of the time I see a vulching Temp over my base, I fly straight into the furball and he doesn't even bother me. The other 49% of the time I dodge one (very bad) attack and then proceed to fly straight into the furball.
These types aren't worth bothering with. They also don't represent the majority of the DA.
Again ... the fact that they are there is a testament to what is allowed by the other majority.
2) Respect for a fair fight? Please please please just ask for a 1v1 and take it to a side field and agree on rules. I see where you're coming from - code of honor etc etc, but really in the furball portion (even on the sides) rarely will you find a fair fight even if it's a 1v1 that no one interrupts. When I really want a fair fight I take it to a side field, agree on rules, and mirror-match planes or at least both people agree on the particular dissimilar rides to take.
There are so many variables here - plane matchup, E-state, initial positional advantage/disadvantage, awareness (or lack thereof) of the enemy. Seriously, if fairness is a big concern, then you don't leave it up to chance.
I suck at dueling ... but I can "fight" with the best of them. Conversely ... I have know some "dueling" masters, but they couldn't find their arse with both hands in the MA ... funny how that goes.
I like not being at the same alt ... in the same plane ... heading directly at each other. I like the complete randomness of a fight as it starts when you first see the enemy. I like to see how I can do when I have the alt ... I like to see what I can do when I don't have alt ... I like to see what I can do when I have superior/inferior speed. I like to see what I can do in my FM2 against superior planes. I like to see how I can do when my enemy is at all the various "o'clock" positions and starts an attack (not just starting from my 11 to 1 o'clock position). To me, "dueling" takes out a lot of variables that you can use to your advantage. Believe it or not, but what you may perceive as an advantage over me (alt and speed) at engagement, I see as an advantage for me.
3) Respect for the fight whether it was fair to begin with or not, especially one that's away from the main furball area. Yeah I agree with you on this one. I hate it when I'm in a good fight in the outskirts of the lake (over the dry land portion usually) and it gets interrupted.
Still, if there are no players like you to get mad at the 1v1 pickers etc, then it will never change. There's no arena message, and even if there were I'm not sure how many would read it. I used to be kind of clueless too, then I saw the value of leaving some fights alone, or at least asking before engaging - this was mostly after one or two people actually got angry at me and then later I had some good fights interrupted.
My personal mindset is usually "just-ask" but after flying a while, I understand some people can't get around to responding while in the middle of the fight. This is why I agree with you on respect for the fight, at least in a DA type environment - because sometimes asking isn't enough.
Cool !!!
4) 1vMany. When I fight in the furball, I typically fly fast BnZ planes and pick (I will up an E fighter and knife fight if there are not enough people to sustain a good furball). Often times I will get a huge gaggle attached to my arse. I then proceed to dive to the deck (they follow), then I drag them to my friends who all have a huge E advantage and they make short work of the dumb horde. Or if my friends don't have a huge E-advantage, they all meet and have a nice great furball and I can re-engage. And by friends I don't mean squad - just my country mates who are more than happy to clear me. The level of team work I see in the DA furball is more consistent than that I see in MA. Sometimes MA teamwork does amaze me - I typically fly great sorties when this happens, but generally we are all too scattered.
The intent of a "furball" to tax or over-tax one's SA ... the better you get at SA ... the longer you survive ... the more kills you get. You never go into a furball with the intent of living ... it's "how long will you survive and how many will you take with you".
BnZing a furball does nothing but piss off the furballer's. Here they are engaged in the middle of all that mess trying their best to maintain their SA to survive against all the others who have jumped in feet first and some goober comes swooping down and picks you ... or worst yet, picks the guy you just worked your arse off getting into position for a guns solution all the while dodging 3 other guys (who are in the furball) tyring to get on your 6.
If your BnZing a furball ... you are a "griefer" and should never consider yourself a "furballer" ... it takes less skill to BnZ a furball and get kills than it takes to win an HO. I have more respect for people that HO than I do for those who sit high on their safety perch in a Tempest and pick a furball and then power zoom back up to safety. At least the HOer did take a chance at possibly dieing.
Anyways, back on point. We should see more "1vMany drags" as opposed to "1vMany I'm going down in a blaze of glory." The former promotes wider fights and furballs whereas the latter promotes whining about getting ganged. Sure you sometimes can't do anything about the latter, but I still see many gangs where the guy should have just bugged out ages ago.
I am not going to disagree with you on this point ... what I will say is that we should never really see 1 v 6 ... totally uncalled for.
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The fact that is does happen at all is WRONG.
Yeah ok conceptually it's "wrong" to do such a thing in the DA. Again, I've seen it happen once, and I'm not even sure the country de-acked the field. And quite frankly the reason it stopped was probably because it was "shameful".
People do try to shame other players into flying a certain way - especially against vulchers. I see no point in it, people will fly the way they want to. With no written rules and no coded rules, how are you going to prevent it? For some people the shame of being derided as a vulcher in the DA is probably better than the shame of dying all the time.
This is not something you can control. I'm starting to agree with mechanic here. Stop trying to control everything - you simply can't. You can give your reasons and we can all look and agree they're legitimate, and then we can try and do something about it, but in the end people will fly however they want to, shame or no shame.
From what you've said here, it seems like you want a "perfect" environment tailored to suit your idea of a good fight. Not gonna happen unless you have power of administrator. Me? I acknowledge that the environment is less than perfect and just deal with it.
I like not being at the same alt ... in the same plane ... heading directly at each other. I like the complete randomness of a fight as it starts when you first see the enemy. I like to see how I can do when I have the alt ... I like to see what I can do when I don't have alt ... I like to see what I can do when I have superior/inferior speed. I like to see what I can do in my FM2 against superior planes. I like to see how I can do when my enemy is at all the various "o'clock" positions and starts an attack (not just starting from my 11 to 1 o'clock position). To me, "dueling" takes out a lot of variables that you can use to your advantage. Believe it or not, but what you may perceive as an advantage over me (alt and speed) at engagement, I see as an advantage for me.
Sure, I see where you're coming from. But then, it isn't at all fair then is it? Why make any pretense about respecting a fair fight? I'm not saying you are trying to get undue advantages - even if it's unfair against you when it comes to planes position/alt, it's still UNFAIR. If you enjoy having the "advantage" of the other person having alt/speed over you, then how could you not enjoy turning the tables on the vulcher who tries to kill you during your initial climbout?
You don't really make sense on this bud.
The intent of a "furball" to tax or over-tax one's SA ... the better you get at SA ... the longer you survive ... the more kills you get. You never go into a furball with the intent of living ... it's "how long will you survive and how many will you take with you".
BnZing a furball does nothing but piss off the furballer's. Here they are engaged in the middle of all that mess trying their best to maintain their SA to survive against all the others who have jumped in feet first and some goober comes swooping down and picks you ... or worst yet, picks the guy you just worked your arse off getting into position for a guns solution all the while dodging 3 other guys (who are in the furball) tyring to get on your 6.
If your BnZing a furball ... you are a "griefer" and should never consider yourself a "furballer" ... it takes less skill to BnZ a furball and get kills than it takes to win an HO. I have more respect for people that HO than I do for those who sit high on their safety perch in a Tempest and pick a furball and then power zoom back up to safety. At least the HOer did take a chance at possibly dieing.
Before I address the argument and topic you bring up...
Once again there you are trying to shame everybody else to conform to your definition of what somebody should or should not do. Convincing? No. Good psychological warfare? Maybe - if it works, we all fight the way YOU like. Taunting RunStang is the same principle. But this is exactly why the people in this thread have reacted so negatively to you and others who do the same. You are trying to enforce a code of conduct mostly by shame. Again, I will fly how I want to simply because I want to. Particularly, I fly the 190D9 (not a Tempest) and I do not ever try to stay completely safe by regaining all my altitude/E after every pass. Instead I try to keep enough energy to gain reasonable closure on whatever targets I want to in the furball. Any more than that is a disadvantage. Because of this, I am at as much risk of getting picked as anybody else (because of the constant supply of new threats in the DA). So while my SA is not taxed to the breaking point, I'm not exactly "safe" either. Now, all of this about "how I fly" is just information. I'm not concerned with your respect, but I am concerned with you having an accurate image of what I do before making your judgment. No sense in having hostility based on miscommunication or errant assumptions.
On the topic:
1) The intent of a furball is whatever each pilot makes of it. To say the purpose of a furball is to "tax SA" is simply your opinion. Lots of guys furball to get kills and land them. You thinking that this is completely ridiculous is again simply your opinion. In the end, everybody is just there to have fun. Whether you want to see how many you take with you before you go down or you want to hone your dogfighting skills or you want to get kills and land, it's however you have fun.
2) Pissing off the furballers by BnZing - depends. The way I've seen my country fly, we typically try to work as a team in the furball (if you're talking about FFA furball, that's a completely different story). We watch each others' backs, give each other check six', and clear each others' tails if we get into a bind.
Again if you're talking about an FFA furball (which btw does NOT EXIST in the DA - you'll have to complain to HTC about this one, the players have no direct control over killshooter), I can certainly see what you're saying about "Trying to take as many of 'em down before I go down". Since everybody's your enemy, there's no point in even trying to escape and there's no point in picking either, other than making yourself feel better as you aren't really benefiting a "team".
As it is, I prefer the team furball (I flew a few FFA furballs way back in the day). It allows you to not fly only the turn-fighters. It allows the BnZ planes to have some type of purpose other than to piss everybody off and/or run when the Spit gets angles on you. It lets you work on teamwork. It serves somewhat as a vague simulation of the MA.
FFA furball has its purpose and I wouldn't mind seeing it reinstated, but given a choice between the two, I'd have to say I like team furball better.
3) Less skill to BnZ than HO? Are you kidding me? Have you ever tried to BnZ? I'm not disputing that there's less risk of dying, but simply because a tactic carries less risk does not mean it takes less skill. By your reasoning, flying straight into the ground takes the most skill because it carries with it 100% chance of dying.
Let's look at everything you have to account for in a BnZ pass. By assumption the BnZer has a good overhead of E over the average in the furball but not so much that he is unreachable -
a) Trying to reduce angle off tail so your shot isn't otherwise terribly hard.
b) Wildly maneuvering unpredictable targets
c) Trying to find a crossing shot point on said wildly maneuvering unpredictable target
d) Actually judging lead/deflection etc during the shot attempt
e) Managing your energy/position so that you don't lawndart during your pass
f) Managing your energy so you can climb far enough out of the furball that you can regain your SA and perhaps come back for another pass
g) Managing new incoming threats and dodging them.
h) Evading any threats that do happen to lodge themselves on your tail.
Let's look at everything you need to think about for a HO pass. By assumption the two planes are already on a merge course.
a) Pointing your nose at a target accurately.
b) Pulling the trigger.
Now which one looks more difficult to you?
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Wouldn't even be close.
Maybe, Maybe not. I could set up top 5 DA to fight your top 5 MA if your interrested I'm sure we could make it happen, of course what does this prove if anything, I would more think of it as fun. Best 3 out 5 runs same plane, winners or losers could pick next plane, up to u on how to do it.
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My personal opinion is that their are great sticks in both arenas. If your talking about the totality of the players I would say the MA because they have the vest majority of the numbers. But if you pick the top 10 from both arenas I think it would become a much closer match.
I find this comparison between top sticks in both arenas to be VERY VERY odd and it doesn't make sense at all.
It's like comparing apples and oranges, except some of the oranges are a hybrid breed so they're really both apple AND orange and the comparison you're running is only based on which of them has more of a single type of vitamin.
In other words, some of the top sticks in the MA also occasionally fly DA. Also, what's your definition of "top"? Statistics can be misleading and dueling is only a way to find out who is better at dueling - it doesn't really tell you anything else about pilot skill.
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The fact that is does happen at all is WRONG. This arena is supposed to be about the "fight" ... your supposed to fight and learn something and as a 7 year vet ... you won't learn crap unless you die ... many many times. In this arena, your not supposed to get "pissed" and the ruin the experience for others. Why the hell should I or anyone have to leave an arena cause some choose to be fools. The reasons people like me participate in these types of threads it to try and educate and hopefully instill a particular "mindset" into as many as will listen and hopefull that "mindset" will be passed on ... if 90% of those why do and want to fly in the DA would embrace this type of mindset and come down on those that don't ... those that don't will either embrace it eventually or they will be shamed out of the arena.
Again ... the fact that they are there is a testament to what is allowed by the other majority.
I suck at dueling ... but I can "fight" with the best of them. Conversely ... I have know some "dueling" masters, but they couldn't find their arse with both hands in the MA ... funny how that goes.
I like not being at the same alt ... in the same plane ... heading directly at each other. I like the complete randomness of a fight as it starts when you first see the enemy. I like to see how I can do when I have the alt ... I like to see what I can do when I don't have alt ... I like to see what I can do when I have superior/inferior speed. I like to see what I can do in my FM2 against superior planes. I like to see how I can do when my enemy is at all the various "o'clock" positions and starts an attack (not just starting from my 11 to 1 o'clock position). To me, "dueling" takes out a lot of variables that you can use to your advantage. Believe it or not, but what you may perceive as an advantage over me (alt and speed) at engagement, I see as an advantage for me.
Cool !!!
The intent of a "furball" to tax or over-tax one's SA ... the better you get at SA ... the longer you survive ... the more kills you get. You never go into a furball with the intent of living ... it's "how long will you survive and how many will you take with you".
BnZing a furball does nothing but piss off the furballer's. Here they are engaged in the middle of all that mess trying their best to maintain their SA to survive against all the others who have jumped in feet first and some goober comes swooping down and picks you ... or worst yet, picks the guy you just worked your arse off getting into position for a guns solution all the while dodging 3 other guys (who are in the furball) tyring to get on your 6.
If your BnZing a furball ... you are a "griefer" and should never consider yourself a "furballer" ... it takes less skill to BnZ a furball and get kills than it takes to win an HO. I have more respect for people that HO than I do for those who sit high on their safety perch in a Tempest and pick a furball and then power zoom back up to safety. At least the HOer did take a chance at possibly dieing.
I am not going to disagree with you on this point ... what I will say is that we should never really see 1 v 6 ... totally uncalled for.
Stated far better than I ever could :aok
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I find this comparison between top sticks in both arenas to be VERY VERY odd and it doesn't make sense at all.
It's like comparing apples and oranges, except some of the oranges are a hybrid breed so they're really both apple AND orange and the comparison you're running is only based on which of them has more of a single type of vitamin.
In other words, some of the top sticks in the MA also occasionally fly DA. Also, what's your definition of "top"? Statistics can be misleading and dueling is only a way to find out who is better at dueling - it doesn't really tell you anything else about pilot skill.
I already talked to one of the TA's about this and explained this to the Rowdy's and we were going to get together on a vox and write down a list of the top fighters by opinion and narrow that list by duels only way to do it your right about that. BOLD - true but for the most part if they spend time in the furball lake there ours since we have 50 players to the MA's 400. Besides it will be a fun test and since I'm not in the top 5 LOL I can't wait to watch if WMLute wants to make this happen. But until I get a response from WMLute its at a stand still, because it will take about a week just to get with the CO's make a list and create the duels to have a proper top 5. I just hope no one gets bent out of shape over this but just to have fun with it. If we could do it in the SEA arenas and have CM Eye mode that would be sweet! :rock
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I already talked to one of the TA's about this and explained this to the Rowdy's and we were going to get together on a vox and write down a list of the top fighters by opinion and narrow that list by duels only way to do it your right about that. BOLD - true but for the most part if they spend time in the furball lake there ours since we have 50 players to the MA's 400. Besides it will be a fun test and since I'm not in the top 5 LOL I can't wait to watch if WMLute wants to make this happen. But until I get a response from WMLute its at a stand still, because it will take about a week just to get with the CO's make a list and create the duels to have a proper top 5. I just hope no one gets bent out of shape over this but just to have fun with it. If we could do it in the SEA arenas and have CM Eye mode that would be sweet! :rock
I'm out of town for the next week so take all that time that ya' want.
FYI I don't consider myself one of the "top" sticks in the MA so I will recuse myself here.
I also agree that this might be a bit tough to figure out.
I personally imaginded this being 5 pilots that only fly in the DA vs. 5 pilots that mostly fly in the MA. I say "mostly" because any pilot that would be considered a MA top fighter also spends a lot of time in the DA. Granted, they are using the DA as it should be and mostly dueling other pilots, but they are in there a lot.
This begs the question... Who would be consider some of the "top" fighters in the MA?
I think m00t and Batfink have proven they should be on that list after the recent dueling ladder. I would give a nod to Tony Joey as I think that kid has earned a spot on most players "top" lists. SunsFan did well in the duel ladder so prob. put him on the list as well. Who for the 5th... hmmm.... So many excellent sticks to pick from...
I can shoot off a list of who I think should be considered. Heck, most all of the Trainers are excellent sticks so there you get Badboy, TC, Murdr, WideWing etc, etc, etc... Then off the top of my head I think of a dozen or more pilots that I love fighting against in the MA who always give me a good fight.
Now is when I wish I was still active in the King of the Hill tourneys as that was an excellent indicator of who who could fight. Looking at the list of recent KOTH round winners I see the following names come up a bunch; Bosco, Lazer, AKDogg, Grizz, B4Buster. (I won the Fri. Sept KOTH but we all know i'm not one of the "best" by any stretch) Any of 'em would be a great pick for the 5th slot.
So many of the fighters I consider "great" have taken leaves of absences of the game or rarely fly much anymore. "Back in the day" you could take a Drex, Levi, WildThing, ManeTMP, Fester (I could go on an on here) and put them up against anybody anytime and I would lay odds the "other" team doesn't even win a round.
These days I don't see as many who are "world beaters" as I once did, but that could be because we have more players and that the attitude in the MA has shifted from Aerial Combat to "Win da' War!" but I digress.
I would be curious who everybody thinks would be in the MA "top 5" for a duel like this.
My list of whom I would wanna see on the MA side in no particular order.
m00t
Batfink
TonyJoey
SunsFan
Murdr
Tc
BadBoy
WideWing
AKDogg
Bosco
Lazer
B4Buster
Griz
WMSol (he's gotten pretty durn good in the past past few months. Heck, most WM's can hold their own vs. most anybody)
(my apologies to any who deserve to be on the above list that I forgot to add. There really are probably another 10-20 that I probably should have up there but i'm a bit slammed right now getting ready for a road trip)
(edit: no reason not to do this in the DA as CM eye mode is enabled there. anybody else see irony in a DA squad asking to use the SEA for a Duel?)
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Bout the only thing I'm certain of is, I aint one of them either (see sig for details)
;)
Wurzel
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I personally imaginded this being 5 pilots that only fly in the DA vs. 5 pilots that mostly fly in the MA. I say "mostly" because any pilot that would be considered a MA top fighter also spends a lot of time in the DA. Granted, they are using the DA as it should be and mostly dueling other pilots, but they are in there a lot.
This begs the question... Who would be consider some of the "top" fighters in the MA?
I think m00t and Batfink have proven they should be on that list after the recent dueling ladder. I would give a nod to Tony Joey as I think that kid has earned a spot on most players "top" lists. SunsFan did well in the duel ladder so prob. put him on the list as well. Who for the 5th... hmmm.... So many excellent sticks to pick from...
Now is when I wish I was still active in the King of the Hill tourneys as that was an excellent indicator of who who could fight. Looking at the list of recent KOTH round winners I see the following names come up a bunch; Bosco, Lazer, AKDogg, Grizz, B4Buster. (I won the Fri. Sept KOTH but we all know i'm not one of the "best" by any stretch) Any of 'em would be a great pick for the 5th slot.
So many of the fighters I consider "great" have taken leaves of absences of the game or rarely fly much anymore. "Back in the day" you could take a Drex, Levi, WildThing, ManeTMP, Fester (I could go on an on here) and put them up against anybody anytime and I would lay odds the "other" team doesn't even win a round.
These days I don't see as many who are "world beaters" as I once did, but that could be because we have more players and that the attitude in the MA has shifted from Aerial Combat to "Win da' War!" but I digress.
I would be curious who everybody thinks would be in the MA "top 5" for a duel like this.
My list of whom I would wanna see on the MA side in no particular order.
m00t
Batfink
TonyJoey
SunsFan
Murdr
Tc
BadBoy
WideWing
AKDogg
Bosco
Lazer
B4Buster
Griz
WMSol (he's gotten pretty durn good in the past past few months. Heck, most WM's can hold their own vs. most anybody)
(my apologies to any who deserve to be on the above list that I forgot to add. There really are probably another 10-20 that I probably should have up there but i'm a bit slammed right now getting ready for a road trip)
(edit: no reason not to do this in the DA as CM eye mode is enabled there. anybody else see irony in a DA squad asking to use the SEA for a Duel?)
DA fine never tried to use CM in the DA so didn't know if it was enabled, that will be fine. Also what a great list you have there I've fought over half those guys and they are great sticks.
Just off the top of my head and the people I was going to mention to the COs in the DA
jmtf01
Spacy
Klipper
SAJ
Clonk
EAce
Creton
JC
Wing
Macdaddy
Nrshida
Gunny
WhtBuffalo(haven't seen him in a while so don't know if he's still active)
Mind is slipping on me right now but a guy that flys a 47 like no other I'll half to think about his name.
I agree most of these guys spend time in the MA Lute but rather if they spend 50% of the time in the furball lake which is all on my list that I be aloud to have them because of our numbers.
and theres alot more I haven't mentioned that I've had some great fights with so it looks like were going to make this happen so I'll start working on it.
I think it will be fun match have a great trip WMLute and when you get back we'll talk. :salute
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:lol this thread...
Give me 4 beers and a k4 and I'll beat both of those lists while representing the SEA2 arena... :mad:
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:lol this thread...
Give me 4 beers and a k4 and I'll beat both of those lists while representing the SEA2 arena... :mad:
:lol at Scotch you the man! :rofl Creton is unbelieveable in the k4 if you want some good 1on1's.
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Why are the top european sticks always left out of these “who are the best” lists? My bet is pure ignorance.
P.S: MA vs the best of the DA bottom feeders, don't make me laugh.
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This would be fun to watch :D
I would sit in cm eye mode and watch the duelers auger!
I don't think a positive outcome would happen here. Win or lose the main arena would peeps still won't like da peeps. lol I guess it is an " Old School " thing. They want the dueling arena back to what it used to be.
My list of the best da pilots are:
Macdaddy
Spacy
Txcycler
Tbagger
MerlinVI
eace+
nrshida
creton+
Hombre
Klipper
There are a lot of good pilots, to many to name all. There are a lot of good pilots that i can't name, because they are also ma pilots. This would be a ma vs da thing lol. There are 2 with stars next to their name, not sure if they are ma pilots.
by the way, I have never seen Kazaa in the da lol. I do remember him from years ago in the ma. Good pilot :aok
I do think we should set something up though. It might actually be fun and make new friendships.
Scotch can't play unless sober lol
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dueling is only a way to find out who is better at dueling - it doesn't really tell you anything else about pilot skill.
Boomer, if you take those D9s, and duel with a good flyer in them for a few hours on end, when you go back into the multi-bandit environs you will fly so much better slow/on the edge that you will kill turny-burny planes in ways you never thought possible.
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This would be fun to watch :D
I don't think a positive outcome would happen here. Win or lose the main arena would peeps still won't like da peeps. lol I guess it is an " Old School " thing. They want the dueling arena back to what it used to be.
Scotch can't play unless sober lol
I agree with you cowboy about the outcome but maybe just maybe some interaction with some of the guys would be a great thing. There are so many great people in the DA just to talk to and have a good time. I fly with the rooks and bish sometimes just to chat with them all. Reguardless of the outcome I'm going to have fun with this duel.
And I agree about Scotch needing to be sober :D
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Boomer, if you take those D9s, and duel with a good flyer in them for a few hours on end, when you go back into the multi-bandit environs you will fly so much better slow/on the edge that you will kill turny-burny planes in ways you never thought possible.
Will try it. Good tip.
My point is that it's not a good comparison between pilots though. As SlapShot mentioned, it's possible to be a bad duelist but a good fighter and vice versa. While I disagree with him on a lot of stuff, I agree with him on this point, and that was my intention.
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Will try it. Good tip.
My point is that it's not a good comparison between pilots though. As SlapShot mentioned, it's possible to be a bad duelist but a good fighter
I disagree.
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I disagree.
Then explain.
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random question: am I the only one here who reads lynx's posts........and hears his voice/accent saying it while I read?
You know what? If I'd never been to DA furball lake for such things as setting up me stick or what ever. Your underlying sentiment may actually have an ounce of substance. I'm not rolling out the ducking board being as I have been and, bore whiteness to some of these DA squads ganging.
You can excuse yourself as much as you like with your "dot SR" but furball lake is nothing less than a microcosm of the MA. I don't know who's plonker your trying pull. It's certainly not mine and I'm not likely to feel any sheep or "real men" for that matter.
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is it just me that is let down that lynx wont assault any sheep? :confused:
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I disagree.
You'd be one of the few that would.
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Then explain.
1v1 with similar planes is the problem with the fewest variables. It is the basics. You can't do calculus before you learn arithmetic.
The part that muddies the water is that in a massively multi-player arena it is possible to get kills without any air combat maneuvering whatsoever.
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I agree with BnZ :aok.
There are a few different disciplines of ACM going in this game and in my opinion, the best pilots are exceptional at all ACM (BnZ, Turnfighting) but pilots that are great at only one of these disciplines end up in parts when they encounter the other. If you are putting together "lists" in the DA, you cannot exclude:
HavocVI
JnyBravo
Because in my estimation, these two are pretty darn good at both.
Changeup
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The part that muddies the water is that in a massively multi-player arena it is possible to get kills without any air combat maneuvering whatsoever.
That's my point. It is all in how you define "best". The guy with the best K/D ratio could simply BnZ all day long being EXTREMELY conservative in his flight style and basically never die. Does that make him good at ACM/dueling?
Conversely, a duelist can be very good at ACM, but if he does not pick his fights in the arena intelligently his score will suffer.
So the above is my point, below this is just discussion. It's not meant to dispute whether or not dueling demonstrates pilot skill.
As far as "doing calculus before arithmetic", a few people have mentioned they can fight better than they can duel (you'd be surprised as for actual calculus and arithmetic; at my school students commonly complain that they are doing "MATH WITHOUT NUMBERS"). It's less variables, but may actually be a harder problem to solve because you don't have any aircraft advantages to use. E.g., when I fight 109K4 vs a P51D, I think to myself... ok... the longer I push this fight the more advantage I will have - my options are shallow spiral climb if he's behind me or aggressive maneuvering to stay on his tail if he's in front of me. In any case, once I have the positional advantage, I will not relinquish it.
Now, let's say it's K4 vs K4. Erm... I have no advantages! Hmm... what do I do? Well, in that case it all depends on what my opponent wants to do! It's more of a chess match because you have no dominant strategy you can use. If he turns very tight for angles, I can outclimb him and turn this into an energy contest - go up and stay out of reach of his guns. If he goes for a big climb for energy, I can pull just slightly more tight than he does and go for guns - it's a gamble.
See how this is already far more complex than an asymmetrical 1v1? In disimilar combat, you have well defined advantages and disadvantages, winning is simply a matter of flying to your advantages and avoiding your disadvantages.
Interestingly enough, that analysis may even further your case that dueling is a good measure of pilot skill. On the other hand... how do you measure pilot skill? Is it in how he strategizes in a duel? Or is it how he flies the aircraft to its advantages in disimilar combat?
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1v1 with similar planes is the problem with the fewest variables. It is the basics. You can't do calculus before you learn arithmetic.
The part that muddies the water is that in a massively multi-player arena it is possible to get kills without any air combat maneuvering whatsoever.
And that IS the rule of the day in the DA Lake, it's the score that matters :aok But over time, in the MA at least, EVERYone knows who the good sticks are, although there often is no quantifiable way of measuring it
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And that IS the rule of the day in the DA Lake, it's the score that matters :aok But over time, in the MA at least, EVERYone knows who the good sticks are, although there often is no quantifiable way of measuring it
Yep.
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That's my point. It is all in how you define "best". The guy with the best K/D ratio could simply BnZ all day long being EXTREMELY conservative in his flight style and basically never die. Does that make him good at ACM/dueling?
Shooting down an bandit in the arenas without ACM means either the victim is AFK or distracted by someone *else* actually attempting to fight him. Yo-yos, ropes, and other maneuvers of of "bnz" ARE ACM. Strictly speaking, even shooting someone doing anything besides flying straight and level involves at least a small piece of ACM, so dueling practice will help even the purest "picking" style imaginable.
Conversely, a duelist can be very good at ACM, but if he does not pick his fights in the arena intelligently his score will suffer.
I'm going to let you in on a little secret: *Everyone* who can sit upright and operate a keyboard and mouse is smart enough to realize that getting into a prolonged dogfight with another bandit under a cloud of red Spits is not the best way to get home. They are usually just deficient enough in "give a damn" they'd rather take the risk so they get to do abit of fighting and maybe even see who wins before one guy gets picked.
It's less variables, but may actually be a harder problem to solve because you don't have any aircraft advantages to use. E.g., when I fight 109K4 vs a P51D, I think to myself... ok... the longer I push this fight the more advantage I will have - my options are shallow spiral climb if he's behind me or aggressive maneuvering to stay on his tail if he's in front of me. In any case, once I have the positional advantage, I will not relinquish it.
Now, let's say it's K4 vs K4. Erm... I have no advantages! Hmm... what do I do? Well, in that case it all depends on what my opponent wants to do! It's more of a chess match because you have no dominant strategy you can use. If he turns very tight for angles, I can outclimb him and turn this into an energy contest - go up and stay out of reach of his guns. If he goes for a big climb for energy, I can pull just slightly more tight than he does and go for guns - it's a gamble.
See how this is already far more complex than an asymmetrical 1v1? In disimilar combat, you have well defined advantages and disadvantages, winning is simply a matter of flying to your advantages and avoiding your disadvantages.
Interestingly enough, that analysis may even further your case that dueling is a good measure of pilot skill. On the other hand... how do you measure pilot skill? Is it in how he strategizes in a duel? Or is it how he flies the aircraft to its advantages in disimilar combat?
Astute observation, that even an identical plane duel can see the duelists filling the roles of "E-fighter/Angles-fighter" as the situation develops. If you can use E-fighting well enough to gain a definitive edge against another K-4 starting from a Co-E merge and milking a subtle E advantage the opponent gives your through a harder turn, or like example, then you sure the hell can rope a Jug. If you can make another Corsair overshoot you in a duel, you can probably make a 500mph Pony overshoot...if you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a plane. :devil
Judging and using the subtle differences in E state and position that can be taken advantage of in a "duel" makes a fine foundation for jusdging less subtle opportunities in dissimilar plane matches. Make sense?
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Not sure I would consieder Creton a "DA" pilot.
Bear in mind that I have know an flown with/against Creton for what now.... 5 years? 6 maybe?
Actually, there were 2-3 on the list of potential DA pilots that I know I fight all the time in the LW's.
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In my 38 I don't mind running into co-alt or lower cons...... the best fun is running into higher cons and working from there. It takes all kinds. I just can't understand the need for squads in a Dueling Arena.
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In my 38 I don't mind running into co-alt or lower cons...... the best fun is running into higher cons and working from there. It takes all kinds. I just can't understand the need for squads in a Dueling Arena.
They stick out like a sore thumb in the Late War Arenas. Sat. Night they were by A30 and you'd see them all on a lone Con's 6. 5-6 of them at times. Watching them flail, spray, etc my 38J was comedic at times.
Some of that "squads members" were upset with what I said earlier in this thread, only because the truth stared them in the face. Personally, I don't care to understand their "mob mentality in the DA". It isn't necessary and if they really want to set up a duel between DA/MA, I'm in.
Maybe, Maybe not. I could set up top 5 DA to fight your top 5 MA if your interrested I'm sure we could make it happen, of course what does this prove if anything, I would more think of it as fun. Best 3 out 5 runs same plane, winners or losers could pick next plane, up to u on how to do it.
Top 5,10...IDGAF. You're on. I'll take an "MA" spot. You wanted it, you got it.
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Can't believe I just took the time to read all this :)
To clarify it all from a low flying 38G driver's perspective.
In an ideal AH, the DA would be a place where the allegiance is to the fight, not to a squad. It would be point's less and landing kills messages would not exist. To me this does away with the boom and zoom Tempests and others only worried about kills and attaboys for landing what in the end are unearned kills. If that's what you want, to to the MA, spend the perks and have at it.
The goal would be improving ACM.
As others have mentioned. Furball lake would be just that. A place to furball. Those engaged in said furball would also be smart enough to ask those engaged in a fight if they needed or wanted help before entering. There is nothing better then a nice even numbered furball. Living and landing is never the goal, but seeing how long you can last and how many you can take with you is.
The goal would be fun and learning, not trying to convince everyone that your small joystick is bigger then it really is.
Sadly it isn't anywhere near this.
I understand this is wishful thinking, and I don't expect it to change.
So I'll just continue wandering below the fight, hoping the baduns will come down and play with my 38G :)
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Not sure I would consieder Creton a "DA" pilot.
Bear in mind that I have know an flown with/against Creton for what now.... 5 years? 6 maybe?
Actually, there were 2-3 on the list of potential DA pilots that I know I fight all the time in the LW's.
Yeah it's a problem we have that most all of our guys also fly MA. I just named alot of guys I see that I've fought against just off the top of my head that I see in the DA quite a bit. I would say 80% of the guys in the DA also fly MA they just spend more time in the DA. To be honest I don't think we have but just a few that are just DA pilots. Almost every guy on my list flys MA alittle. I'll leave it up to Creton no big deal if he don't want to, but I'll ask him if he thinks he flys DA 50% of the time.
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They stick out like a sore thumb in the Late War Arenas. Sat. Night they were by A30 and you'd see them all on a lone Con's 6. 5-6 of them at times. Watching them flail, spray, etc my 38J was comedic at times.
Some of that "squads members" were upset with what I said earlier in this thread, only because the truth stared them in the face. Personally, I don't care to understand their "mob mentality in the DA". It isn't necessary and if they really want to set up a duel between DA/MA, I'm in.
Top 5,10...IDGAF. You're on. I'll take an "MA" spot. You wanted it, you got it.
:lol
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Can't believe I just took the time to read all this :)
To clarify it all from a low flying 38G driver's perspective.
In an ideal AH, the DA would be a place where the allegiance is to the fight, not to a squad. It would be point's less and landing kills messages would not exist. To me this does away with the boom and zoom Tempests and others only worried about kills and attaboys for landing what in the end are unearned kills. If that's what you want, to to the MA, spend the perks and have at it.
The goal would be improving ACM.
As others have mentioned. Furball lake would be just that. A place to furball. Those engaged in said furball would also be smart enough to ask those engaged in a fight if they needed or wanted help before entering. There is nothing better then a nice even numbered furball. Living and landing is never the goal, but seeing how long you can last and how many you can take with you is.
The goal would be fun and learning, not trying to convince everyone that your small joystick is bigger then it really is.
Sadly it isn't anywhere near this.
I understand this is wishful thinking, and I don't expect it to change.
So I'll just continue wandering below the fight, hoping the baduns will come down and play with my 38G :)
Well said and I appreciate your honesty and hospitality of keeping your message professional.
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Now, let's say it's K4 vs K4. Erm... I have no advantages! Hmm... what do I do? Well, in that case it all depends on what my opponent wants to do! It's more of a chess match because you have no dominant strategy you can use....
I can't stand to see my favorite board game used as an analogy for symmetry. In chess, from the very first move, White attacks and Black defends. There is nothing symmetrical about it.
Air combat can be compared to Chess in so far as there are good and bad moves. Seeing someone split-S on the merge is comparable to someone who opens with their rook's pawn. Skilled opponents are going to go very far into their ACM/chess match where the moves they make have been made many, many times previously before they begin to improvise.
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Yeah it's a problem we have that most all of our guys also fly MA. I just named alot of guys I see that I've fought against just off the top of my head that I see in the DA quite a bit. I would say 80% of the guys in the DA also fly MA they just spend more time in the DA. To be honest I don't think we have but just a few that are just DA pilots. Almost every guy on my list flys MA alittle. I'll leave it up to Creton no big deal if he don't want to, but I'll ask him if he thinks he flys DA 50% of the time.
I personally have not seen any of those in MAs except creton. Doesn't mean they don't fly in there though.
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I was just in DA and only a half dozen were on from The rowdyone and the aerofighters, and i killed them all with ease. Then they quit upping. They were being outflown in their twisty-turny planes. Granted they're are killers when 3 or four dive on you. But 1 on 1 they're seemed like easy fights. They showed no ACM but fly in a tight circle when i got saddled up. And I didn't even make it to the 2nd round of the dueling competition we just had. :rofl
I tryed being polite and saluted them all but never once even so much as got a reply from this crowd :lol
Sad part is someone has told them that flying f4u4s, spits and tempests in a pack is the way to go.
Trust in your own abilities DA squads. :salute
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:lol
I take it you now realize you wouldn't stand a chance right? Because if you did, you would've accepted correct? It's amazing how some fold like a card table when gently leaned on.
<no gay smilie needed>
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I was just in DA and only a half dozen were on from The rowdyone and the aerofighters, and i killed them all with ease. Then they quit upping. They were being outflown in their twisty-turny planes. Granted they're are killers when 3 or four dive on you. But 1 on 1 they're seemed like easy fights. They showed no ACM but fly in a tight circle when i got saddled up. And I didn't even make it to the 2nd round of the dueling competition we just had. :rofl
I tryed being polite and saluted them all but never once even so much as got a reply from this crowd :lol
Sad part is someone has told them that flying f4u4s, spits and tempests in a pack is the way to go.
Trust in your own abilities DA squads. :salute
See? Someone else is witnessing it. It is actually funny at times to loiter above those clowns and watch 6 of them take 1 or 2 minutes to get the con.
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Shane and I used to get sick of them ganging everyone so we'd circle over their field and rack up 20kills each as they all tried to climb up to us. We'd only quit after they'd conceded to stop ganging.
Was boring as hell. :D
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Shane and I used to get sick of them ganging everyone so we'd circle over their field and rack up 20kills each as they all tried to climb up to us. We'd only quit after they'd conceded to stop ganging.
Was boring as hell. :D
So when you call out someone for how they are flying at any particular time how do you know they are not doing the same as you and shane?
Thats where the hypocracy starts to creep in to the whole argument.
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Nope.
http://www.local.co.uk/uk/Psychiatrists
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you must be very unhappy to keep posting that link to me scotch, wish i could help you. :(
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Shane and I used to get sick of them ganging everyone so we'd circle over their field and rack up 20kills each as they all tried to climb up to us. We'd only quit after they'd conceded to stop ganging.
Was boring as hell. :D
The ones I laugh at are the ones that come in and try and vulch at furball lake.
ack-ack
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I was just in DA and only a half dozen were on from The rowdyone and the aerofighters, and i killed them all with ease.
The TAS guys tried to go the MW arena awhile back and left after a tour. They kept on getting smacked around so they finally upped and went back to the DA. One of the more sad pilots in TAS was a guy named Spacey, I've never seen a player that could be consistently out turned in an A6M5.
ack-ack
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I might have missed a 2 week period over the last 9 or 10 months but I have never seen a "Scotch" or "Shane" keep the entire DA at bay unless it was during daylight hours in which I WORK FOR A LIVING....in fact, I've never seen either in the DA in the evenings. I dont want to speak out of turn so I will talk with some of the bish and rooks and see if I missed something.
Scotch, is that your flying name as well as your forum name? Just curious
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I take it you now realize you wouldn't stand a chance right? Because if you did, you would've accepted correct? It's amazing how some fold like a card table when gently leaned on.
<no gay smilie needed>
I'll leave this for you ;) and you can go back and read my other forums to you!
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I might have missed a 2 week period over the last 9 or 10 months but I have never seen a "Scotch" or "Shane" keep the entire DA at bay unless it was during daylight hours in which I WORK FOR A LIVING....in fact, I've never seen either in the DA in the evenings. I dont want to speak out of turn so I will talk with some of the bish and rooks and see if I missed something.
Scotch, is that your flying name as well as your forum name? Just curious
I've never seen them in there as well Change, o well guess since we fly in there all the time we should know right?
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you must be very unhappy to keep posting that link to me scotch, wish i could help you. :(
:lol
I haven't flown in about four months, but believe me, there are more impressive things to lie about if that was my intention.<g>
We were mostly picking on Spacy and Tr1gg's 'skwadz'.
I've never seen them in there as well Change, o well guess since we fly in there all the time we should know right?
I fought you and Klaus back to back to back for an hour or two at a side field in 38's. Also a few months ago.
::yawn::
Don't worry schweeties, I'll be back again when work permits.
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The ones I laugh at are the ones that come in and try and vulch at furball lake.
ack-ack
Charger does it. He'll dive from you and try to make a bee line to the field to Vultch.
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I'll leave this for you ;) and you can go back and read my other forums to you!
Set it up then. Quit huffing and puffing.
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Charger does it. He'll dive from you and try to make a bee line to the field to Vultch.
Yep everyone hates Charger and a few others for that
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I fought you and Klaus back to back to back for an hour or two at a side field in 38's. Also a few months ago.
I believe I remember that 38 not my thing but you flew it very well, my wife tells all the time about my memory slipping lol. Also fought hlbly and someone else in 38's on the side good sticks. Look forward to you getting back Scotch Half to do some duels.
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Set it up then. Quit huffing and puffing.
I'm not doing either lol Masherbrum your a trip man. I'll be around tomorrow online come talk to me about it. Going to workout in the morning and then I half to cut the yard I say I'll be on about 12 or 1 cst. Flying MA tomorrow if your on.
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I might have missed a 2 week period over the last 9 or 10 months but I have never seen a "Scotch" or "Shane" keep the entire DA at bay unless it was during daylight hours in which I WORK FOR A LIVING....in fact, I've never seen either in the DA in the evenings. I dont want to speak out of turn so I will talk with some of the bish and rooks and see if I missed something.
Scotch, is that your flying name as well as your forum name? Just curious
I've seen 1 or 2 guys keep the DA at bay.... It's fairly easy to do.... And becomes increasingly amusing.... :lol
Also, people work for a living during all hours of the day/night... You are not unique.... :)
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Yep everyone hates Charger and a few others for that
Is he brain dead or something? I've watched him up his heavy F4U-4 5 or 6 times in a row to pork and die. He never reacts to the other players. It's almost as if we aren't there, except for when he's done porking and wants to vulch before the AAA kills him.
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Charger? :rofl I happened to look over as he blew by me one day, and he had a propeller beenie on and a lollypop stuck to his chin.
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Charger and Adog31st are the kings of skyhighanddie.....if your going to pick on charger, you have to throw ADog in there too and I haven't seen two guys keep the whole DA at bay yet. Just my observation...they get pulled down or run home just as in the MA, lol.
Anodizer, I wasn't establishing uniqueness....just a reality for me :salute but it sure seems like some of the good pilots spend more time in here than elsewhere. I need xxxJCxxx's old job....he played AT work!
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The game would be so boring if everyone flew the same way.
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The game would be so boring if everyone flew the same way.
true
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The game would be so boring if everyone flew the same way.
If they all landed like the 80th there would be many more parts strowed along the runways and in the hangars.
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:lol
we all aspire to the greatness of 80th landings, but most of us can only dream
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Charger? :rofl I happened to look over as he blew by me one day, and he had a propeller beenie on and a lollypop stuck to his chin.
Funny, need some clarification on if the lollypop was stuck on his chin due to it being sticky or was his superman speed holding it there?
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109k4 just fooling about in furball lake.
this is the DA that everyone is crying out for, it does exist.
http://www.freeroleentertainment.com/k4_dweebery.ahf
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Half to do some duels.
Going to workout in the morning and then I half to cut the yard I say I'll be on about 12 or 1 cst.
Have! Have! Have! As in, “I have to use the frikking word ‘have.’
Sorry for outburst. I half to calm down.
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Yeah it's a problem we have that most all of our guys also fly MA. I just named alot of guys I see that I've fought against just off the top of my head that I see in the DA quite a bit. I would say 80% of the guys in the DA also fly MA they just spend more time in the DA. To be honest I don't think we have but just a few that are just DA pilots. Almost every guy on my list flys MA alittle. I'll leave it up to Creton no big deal if he don't want to, but I'll ask him if he thinks he flys DA 50% of the time.
I've seen you guys (Rowdy's) fly in MA...easy to spot, large blob of Nits orbiting their own base at cloud level :aok
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Now BJ, you and I have tangled up in there before and you know that's not true. That red blob of knits moves to the center every now and then!! :devil
PS - I wish we were at cloud level.....I wouldn't die so often and so fast! :salute
V/r
Changeup
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I've seen you guys (Rowdy's) fly in MA...easy to spot, large blob of Nits orbiting their own base at cloud level :aok
********Have to agree with Changeup I die awhole lot more then I kill, high alt monkey I'm not!
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Have! Have! Have! As in, “I have to use the frikking word ‘have.’
Sorry for outburst. I half to calm down.
Please calm down, I never will be an english major or a major in any topic to be specific but I'll try to use the work have more often :aok
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Reminds me of joke....new student at Ivy League school....he asks a lady at administration office "where's the library at?"
<haughtly Harvardish lady>: "Here at HARvard, WE don't END OUR sentences with prepositions," she fairly spat out at him. <insert 'hmpff>
<new student>: "Well excuse my ignorance...Where is the library at, bi#@th"? :D
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Reminds me of joke....new student at Ivy League school....he asks a lady at administration office "where's the library at?"
<haughtly Harvardish lady>: "Here at HARvard, WE don't END OUR sentences with prepositions," she fairly spat out at him. <insert 'hmpff>
<new student>: "Well excuse my ignorance...Where is the library at, bi#@th"? :D
:rofl :rofl
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To me it is kind of sad , that there are people who refuse to look at both sides . There is alot of enjoyment to be had playing in MA, that you will never find in DA . The reverse is also true . The skill levels seem to be split like this . The DA level of skill is higher across the board . There is less difference between the top and the bottom . That being said . The truly elite players (mostly) never come into the DA . Where the DA has the MA beat hands down is in people who think they are elite or uber sticks and are far from it . It seems to be tied to score in MA . Most<not all> consistently high ranked players in MA are not that good . In the da there not being that yard stick , lets alot of people think they are better then they are . I used to fly almost exclusively in the DA but the place has changed alot in the year I have been playing . Not for the better either . Way to many horde fliers . One side never leaves their base sector , anymore . Some guys will pick you HO you then brag like heII about how good he is . I have alot of friends in both places both sides in this are some right ,and some wrong . One last thing I would like to say is there is alot of this "it is what it is" saying going around . No gents it is what we make of it .
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To me it is kind of sad , that there are people who refuse to look at both sides .
:aok good to c u the other day bud sorry I had to get off. Talk to you later.
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Fly which ever you want to fly.I fly lots of DA,I like 1v1's against people who are considered to be the best or near best at their favorite a/c. I do fly the main arenas some but really don't care for it,seems to be a lack of actual engagements and more about
preserving one's score.Theyre are a few exceptions of course,but generally you'll find large groups of players and pickers bragging about how their greatness.I always laugh when I see some idiot type out "well it took 5 of you to get me". You used to could pick up some good 1v1's,but that was way back when.
To qoute a friend of mine when he said " I fly to learn and feel something as close as I can to the golden age of aerial combat"
Each arena has it pixil heros' and theyre are good at what they do. I really don't know if the level of skill has come up or gone down,depends on who you talk to,but you will find very few who can be equally deadly in any a/c that theyre in.
CRETON
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Fly for fun! In my humble opinion, it does not matter which arena your in, FUN FUN FUN isnt this the reason we play? I have had the pleasure of flying with many of the people listed in this thread, If you are so fear full that someone is ruining your fun take a BREAK from the game! Then come back and have fun when you realize that the game has changed and adapt to it.
I have fought the hordes and won, then again i have lost also. It is how you deal with it.
<S> to Creton for flying with me the other day. Great time sir!
A fun suggestion for the furball lake would be daily flight set up, like f4u's one day, or spits or 109's. Just pick a plane set and set a alt cap. I think this would be fun :aok
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Fly which ever you want to fly.I fly lots of DA,I like 1v1's against people who are considered to be the best or near best at their favorite a/c. I do fly the main arenas some but really don't care for it,seems to be a lack of actual engagements and more about
preserving one's score.Theyre are a few exceptions of course,but generally you'll find large groups of players and pickers bragging about how their greatness.I always laugh when I see some idiot type out "well it took 5 of you to get me". You used to could pick up some good 1v1's,but that was way back when.
To qoute a friend of mine when he said " I fly to learn and feel something as close as I can to the golden age of aerial combat"
Each arena has it pixil heros' and theyre are good at what they do. I really don't know if the level of skill has come up or gone down,depends on who you talk to,but you will find very few who can be equally deadly in any a/c that theyre in.
CRETON
I've heard the same quote from 1 person on the game and I agree. I'm not going to call out any names but he is dedicated to flying a plane at it's peek without any stalling. He's a great stick and I see him at being one of the best sticks in the game because of his dedication to the TA. I tell you one thing Creton your deadly in your K4 :salute
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Fly for fun! In my humble opinion, it does not matter which arena your in, FUN FUN FUN isnt this the reason we play? I have had the pleasure of flying with many of the people listed in this thread, If you are so fear full that someone is ruining your fun take a BREAK from the game! Then come back and have fun when you realize that the game has changed and adapt to it.
I have fought the hordes and won, then again i have lost also. It is how you deal with it.
<S> to Creton for flying with me the other day. Great time sir!
A fun suggestion for the furball lake would be daily flight set up, like f4u's one day, or spits or 109's. Just pick a plane set and set a alt cap. I think this would be fun :aok
Aces High can you make this happen? I always have said the Furball would be alot more fun if everyone was in the same plane and we have on occasion when only a few is on done a tbm furball. You would definently become a better 1on1 fighter that way. You could set A1 A2 and A3 up to only fly 109's this week and f4u's the next week ect. ect. I'm all 4 it. I'll even start a Petition with the majority of the flyers if thats what it takes. Great idea Cowboy :salute Also alt cap would be extremely nice say 10k cap that would pretty much stop the base vulching.
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And that IS the rule of the day in the DA Lake, it's the score that matters :aok But over time, in the MA at least, EVERYone knows who the good sticks are, although there often is no quantifiable way of measuring it
There is no score in the DA . No ranking . It would seem you don't understand the DA that well . I fly and enjoy both . I have noticed a few things about score though . Some people in MA think it really marks the better pilots , not in my experience . The lack of it makes some uber picker Tempest guys , or guys that fly the brew with help nearby think they are good . Few of either type will duel for any reason .
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There is no score in the DA . No ranking . It would seem you don't understand the DA that well . I fly and enjoy both . I have noticed a few things about score though . Some people in MA think it really marks the better pilots , not in my experience . The lack of it makes some uber picker Tempest guys , or guys that fly the brew with help nearby think they are good . Few of either type will duel for any reason .
BS--ALL those guys religiously go to 'roster' and right-click to see their stats, (and then brag about them) and they are ALL pizzed off when they lose their precious 'kills' when HT resets it every few months
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In all fairness to the regular DA guys, there are a few really good flyers in there. As for the rest, they're just trying to get some kills. I can't down them for that. Although I have in the past.
I've came to the conclusion that it's up to me to keep my head on a swivel, shoot fast and shoot true because I may only get one chance at the bandit before 3 or 4 spits, 4hogs or tempests swoop down on me. I think that it keeps me on my toes and better prepared for about anything the MA can throw at me.
I can work on 20 or 30 overshoots in the DA where it might take me several hours to get that much practice in in the main arena. Just my .02 cents. :salute
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With all due respect bj, those score lookers are almost always fairly new pilots (and therefore socially inept with regard to what one should and shouldn't talk about over the text box)...its the rookies and they get their fair share of grief from the DA regulars who couldn't care less about their scores. I know you have plenty of experience in there but that statement is over the top. In my everyday experience in there, the REGULAR guys care that they get picked on their way home carrying victories and complain about that....but they couldn't care less about their overall score. :salute
V/r
Changeup
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Ahh this topic has come up again... sheesh. Typically I try to land any sorties I get with multiple kills, especially if the fight is going downhill (i.e., if either side is hording). If there's good fights to be had, I usually stay in until bingo ammo/fuel or I die. It's kind of a symbolic gesture along the lines of "this is what I would do if I were in the MA", good practice for area-wide SA.
That said, I don't really care about my DA score. I kept track at first to kind of measure my progress, finally breaking 1.0 KD ratio as a huge sign I was getting better. This was useful and important to me for a time, but again mainly as a measure of progress. I never bragged about it, nor did I see any reason to.
Once I got and maintained 1.0 KD easily (90+% with UnPerked planes) and once I actually fought a few bonafide duels in the DA, I started caring about score a lot less. In those duels, you die a lot. You also bail and reup quite often. I've also bailed to save time when nothing was at stake (wanted to get into a fight w/o first landing a plane, etc).
All these things skew the score, which is why I no longer care about it. It no longer measures my progress, and having flown a lot more MA with JG11, I can say that DA score isn't really a good proxy for MA score even without the aforementioned skewing factors. Not saying one is better than the other, the environment is just different.
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My question..... how many kills did you get that were the other guy augering or someone augering around you because he was out of ammo or fuel. That used to be standard procedure in the DA. Your K/D means nothing simply because of that in the DA.
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In all fairness to the regular DA guys, there are a few really good flyers in there. As for the rest, they're just trying to get some kills. I can't down them for that. Although I have in the past.
I've came to the conclusion that it's up to me to keep my head on a swivel, shoot fast and shoot true because I may only get one chance at the bandit before 3 or 4 spits, 4hogs or tempests swoop down on me. I think that it keeps me on my toes and better prepared for about anything the MA can throw at me.
I can work on 20 or 30 overshoots in the DA where it might take me several hours to get that much practice in in the main arena. Just my .02 cents. :salute
Good point, it does keep you on your toes.
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My question..... how many kills did you get that were the other guy augering or someone augering around you because he was out of ammo or fuel. That used to be standard procedure in the DA.
Good question Shuff, geuss the answer by ommision was 'not many'.
Proving without question that score in the DA is a total waste of time.
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My question..... how many kills did you get that were the other guy augering or someone augering around you because he was out of ammo or fuel. That used to be standard procedure in the DA. Your K/D means nothing simply because of that in the DA.
It's no longer standard procedure. I'd guess less than 1% of my kills were from intentional augers. I'd guess about 5% of my kills were from proxies.
All in all, K/D or score's importance is only in the eye of the beholder. In other words, it means whatever someone looking at it wants it to mean. After all, we are only playing a game. The biggest tangible reward for having a high K/D or score is your name on the front page of the HTC site...
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BS--ALL those guys religiously go to 'roster' and right-click to see their stats, (and then brag about them) and they are ALL pizzed off when they lose their precious 'kills' when HT resets it every few months
Search the threads they asked to have the scores reset , mostly to track improvement in accuracy of shooting http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,254067.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,254067.0.html) theres the link . Show me where they are crying about reset .
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It's no longer standard procedure. I'd guess less than 1% of my kills were from intentional augers. I'd guess about 5% of my kills were from proxies.
All in all, K/D or score's importance is only in the eye of the beholder. In other words, it means whatever someone looking at it wants it to mean. After all, we are only playing a game. The biggest tangible reward for having a high K/D or score is your name on the front page of the HTC site...
It is no longer dueling... the class is gone.
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The biggest tangible reward for having a high K/D or score is your name on the front page of the HTC site...
High K/D doesn't bring you to the front page, only score. The more once concentrates on getting his K/D as high as possible, the less likely it is to find his name on front page.
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It is no longer dueling... the class is gone.
Well, none of us ever tried to maintain the pretense that it was an arena purely for dueling.
In fact, if you have ever stopped by once in the last few months and taken a few minutes to look around, you'd see that the biggest attraction is the huge furball.
There's still dueling, but it's at side fields. Donno how many actually duel, but if I'm in the DA, I'm usually open for a duel. And even in those cases, there's no auger for fuel/ammo. Just bail out and get a new plane after each duel so the fuel situation is fair.
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High K/D doesn't bring you to the front page, only score. The more once concentrates on getting his K/D as high as possible, the less likely it is to find his name on front page.
That's really just a nitpick. I also said "K/D or score" in my original post.
Point remains - this is a game. K/D, score, and whatever other measures of skill don't mean anything unless somebody cares. And that goes for ANY arena, not just the DA. The biggest tangible thing you get for being good is your name on the front page.
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Search the threads they asked to have the scores reset , mostly to track improvement in accuracy of shooting http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,254067.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,254067.0.html) theres the link . Show me where they are crying about reset .
Can't speak to bbs aspect, I just know I hear it at the lake (which has nada to do with REST of DA, of course)
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Search the threads they asked to have the scores reset , mostly to track improvement in accuracy of shooting http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,254067.0.html (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,254067.0.html) theres the link . Show me where they are crying about reset .
Wow. We're just repeating the same arguments.
"The DA should be for dueling. I remember when you had ROE in the furball lake. <Insert some kind of romanticization of having nice polite rules>"
"Great, but that's not how it is anymore. We like to cut short our time out of battle... <Insert defense of why the current furball lake is legit>"
Why is this such a persistent argument? What's the draw of having ROE in the lake when you could easily establish rules in the dueling fields? Am I the only one that thinks this argument is silly?
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It's just that if one brings score and rank in the DA it kind of smacks of 'couldnt get ranked in the MA so made a new rank table'.
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Good point. I don't even know if rank exists in DA. :lol I only kept track of K/D for self-improvement purposes.
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Indeed, but there again you see that a high k/d does not equal improvement in flying ability if the first thing on the player's mind is getting as many kills as possible. You see how the cycle all leads back to the same conclusion? Getting twenty tempest kills would indicate a larger improvement than earning one decent kill vs a good opponent which clearly is inaccurate.
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Of course, it all depends on your mindset. And once again, the significane of any type of measurement is in the eye of the beholder. I'm not really arguing this point, we actually agree here. I'm just giving my own viewpoint as to how I treated my K/D.
My mindset towards using K/D as a measurement: I flew to emulate MA conditions mostly. Very rarely did I take out the perked rides. I picked (defined as in killing an opponent who's engaged) but also fought when necessary or favorable. Once I had that above 1.0 and maintained it consistently landing 2-4 kill sorties in 190D9 and 109K4, I stopped caring and focused more on getting into fights and testing the limits.
Surprisingly, my K/D is still above 1.0 there.
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Thats your individual case which you show to not have a negative effect on gameplay for others. The overall picture though is that everyone wants a high K/D at the same time, which is impossible, simple math there. It is possible for everyone to have 'good fights' win or lose. It is impossible for everyone to maintain a decent K/d. Flying like a fool and giving some new guy an easy kills is commendable in the DA furball. Give some, you get some. Just voicing my opinion, not really at you i see, boomer, just using your posts to build a point that, as usual, won't make a tiny difference to anything anywhere :D
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Getting twenty tempest kills would indicate a larger improvement than earning one decent kill vs a good opponent which clearly is inaccurate.
There are days when I honestly feel like managing a large furball is alot frickin' harder than killing some guy who has been flying for 5 years 1v1...
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True enough batfink.
It IS however possible for everybody to have lower than 1.0 K/D :D. I checked once, the average in MAs was 0.93 when I looked.
Edit: yes, I've also flown like an idiot as well. It can be fun.
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The average does not mean everyone gets .93 though!
BnZS that is a very good point. The problem that many describe (not me, i would like to point out, as i have no real problems with the game) is due to the arms race from spitfire mkI at 2k to tempest at 25k.
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Of course not everybody gets 0.93. I was just cracking a joke that a lot of us auger :D
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That's really just a nitpick. I also said "K/D or score" in my original post.
Point remains - this is a game. K/D, score, and whatever other measures of skill don't mean anything unless somebody cares. And that goes for ANY arena, not just the DA. The biggest tangible thing you get for being good is your name on the front page.
Someone is keeping a score? Mine can't be good then.
Flushed
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Well, none of us ever tried to maintain the pretense that it was an arena purely for dueling.
In fact, if you have ever stopped by once in the last few months and taken a few minutes to look around, you'd see that the biggest attraction is the huge furball.
There's still dueling, but it's at side fields. Donno how many actually duel, but if I'm in the DA, I'm usually open for a duel. And even in those cases, there's no auger for fuel/ammo. Just bail out and get a new plane after each duel so the fuel situation is fair.
I have been there. In fact I was there the other day at a field far away from the lake.... DUELING.
You'd think an arena called DUELing arena would be for ... DUELing.
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I have been there. In fact I was there the other day at a field far away from the lake.... DUELING.
You'd think an arena called DUELing arena would be for ... DUELing.
Dueling Arena = 9 fields I believe low mid and high alt fights 2 bases at each field
Canyon fights = 5 fields I believe not at home so I can't look 3 bases at each field which is basically a canyon furball multiple fighters engaged.
Furball Lake = Furball means according to the dictionary "A large dog fight between groups of fighter aircraft"
Tank Town - 3 bases 4 corners I believe
Boat Fights - same here I believe
Dueling Arena is made up of more then just 1on1 fights. Dueling is a bad word to use for the Arena anyway, I think of it as more of a variation arena or diversity arena.
:salute
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Dueling is a bad word to use for the Arena anyway, I think of it as more of a variation arena or diversity arena.
It's the Dueling Arena. When you click on the Clipboard Selections, "Dueling Arena" is selected. We can try "to justify ourselves and our actions" all we want. But the NAME of the ARENA remains unchanged.
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Dueling Arena is made up of more then just 1on1 fights. Dueling is a bad word to use for the Arena anyway, I think of it as more of a variation arena or diversity arena.
Then you agree.....
...oh and I've been here a few years and know how the arena was when it was actually for dueling.
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See Rule #4
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See Rule #4
Ownt.
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It's the Dueling Arena. When you click on the Clipboard Selections, "Dueling Arena" is selected. We can try "to justify ourselves and our actions" all we want. But the NAME of the ARENA remains unchanged.
If the Da was strictly a Dueling Arena I would obsolutely love it but it's not. Justifing ourselves or actions means nothing but an incoherent statement since in my statement just stated the fields and the meanings behind the fields, nor did I voice a opinion on anything besides a variation/diversity arena. And I agree the name of the arena remains the same in text but variations through coherent thought. :salute
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Then you agree.....
...oh and I've been here a few years and know how the arena was when it was actually for dueling.
Yes, I absolutely agree and needing a dueling arena only would be a great thing for AH most fighters would enjoy. The way I see it being is that the dueling arena we have now needs to be split, one being a furball arena and the next being a dueling arena only. And I totally understand that some people sees no point in having a furball arena since you have the MA but you have about 50 players that would rather do that then fly in the MA, that amounts to about 10,000 dollars a year in revenue for AH so splitting the two is the only way it can be done. :salute Shuffler
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If the Da was strictly a Dueling Arena I would obsolutely love it but it's not. Justifing ourselves or actions means nothing but an incoherent statement since in my statement just stated the fields and the meanings behind the fields, nor did I voice a opinion on anything besides a variation/diversity arena. And I agree the name of the arena remains the same in text but variations through coherent thought. :salute
It is the Dueling Arena. Keep playing the semantics game.
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^ what Karaya said
:salute