Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Wishlist => Topic started by: Saxman on February 28, 2010, 05:06:11 PM
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So I'm flying along in pursuit of a formation of B-26s last night. I'm in an F4U-4 and I check my airspeed, which is right about 350mph TAS and accelerating at level flight. The B-26s are PULLING AWAY. I'm at 350 TAS AND THEY'RE PULLING AWAY. He didn't lose one drone during his dive to run away from me. When I finally managed to catch him in a good attack position, he pulled nearly full vertical and didn't lose ONE DRONE DOING IT.
Can the drone leash PLEASE BE SHORTENED. It's getting absolutely ridiculous watching formations diving away from you at fighter speeds and performing advanced aerobatics without losing a drone in the process.
(And no, he did NOT shoot me down. I finally managed to kill one drone and smoke the engine on another before tiring of that BS and backing off to look for some less aggravating fighter kills).
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+1 saw alot of drone problems in the event on Saturday....The drone lags make me lag bad :salute
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I like to do immelmans with my formations in order to precisely reverse course. It's a piece of cake.
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(And no, he did NOT shoot me down. I finally managed to kill one drone and smoke the engine on another before tiring of that BS and backing off to look for some less aggravating fighter kills).
Sorry to hear that you had to work for your supper; must be awful that BUFFs don't just rollover and lay-down when your fighter enters icon range.
:bolt:
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nobody likes to see fiters do stuff out of the ordinary, stuff that couldnt be done in ww2. so why should the buffs be allowed to dive bomb and do immelmans? when it coldnt be done in ww2.
semp
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Sorry to hear that you had to work for your supper; must be awful that BUFFs don't just rollover and lay-down when your fighter enters icon range.
:bolt:
Thank you VERY much for missing my point.
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Guncrasher who says it couldn't be done?
As a general rule, for "safety" reasons it was not done in big formations. You'd lose more bombers to collisions than to enemy gunfire if they were free to manuver.
But a single set, prove it couldn't be done. Don't just make the accusation.
As far as I know there is no aircraft out there that can't do a simple low angle dive for speed, then immelman up & over.
Saxman what point? Its the same for all of us correct?
You didn't make a point, you made a complaint that the leash is too long.
Offered nothing to back it up.
Not that I want to get into a !@#$#$% match, but from where I'm sitting vonKrimm is right on the nose.
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Guncrasher who says it couldn't be done?
As a general rule, for "safety" reasons it was not done in big formations. You'd lose more bombers to collisions than to enemy gunfire if they were free to manuver.
But a single set, prove it couldn't be done. Don't just make the accusation.
As far as I know there is no aircraft out there that can't do a simple low angle dive for speed, then immelman up & over.
Saxman what point? Its the same for all of us correct?
You didn't make a point, you made a complaint that the leash is too long.
Offered nothing to back it up.
Not that I want to get into a !@#$#$% match, but from where I'm sitting vonKrimm is right on the nose.
Ive never seen the most advanced bombers of the miltary today do immelmens in formation......just sayin :salute
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Guncrasher who says it couldn't be done?
As a general rule, for "safety" reasons it was not done in big formations. You'd lose more bombers to collisions than to enemy gunfire if they were free to manuver.
But a single set, prove it couldn't be done. Don't just make the accusation.
As far as I know there is no aircraft out there that can't do a simple low angle dive for speed, then immelman up & over.
Come on tell me you're not being serious! Maybe if the B-26 was stripped to just fuel and a pilot. Never in combat would a B-26 do an immelman. Not only do you have the airframe stressed to a manuver not designed for. You also have crew members being thrown all over the aircraft if not out of it in some cases. Not to mention ammo boxes and other loose gear flying through the aircraft banging into vital equipment. I'd like to see you prove a set of B-26s or even a single B-26 could pull a manuver like that and still be in condition to defend itself afterwards. :rolleyes:
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Thank you VERY much for missing my point.
I absolutely did not miss your point, I merely decided to treat it with levity; this is a game and not a reality, when people stop treating it as a game and try to force too much reality into it, it will cease to serve the intended purpose of entertainment. I am sorry that my irreverent nature caused you such consternation with respect to your "concern".
Like Ghosth said, I don't want to engage in a 9i55ing contest, just accept that we are polar opposites, for the time being, on this topic. :cheers:
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The point of the bomber formations was to improve the defensive capabilities of bombers when HTC decided NOT to allow them to load up with gunners like was possible in Air Warrior, NOT to allow bomber pilots to dogfight with three planes that always stay in perfect formation. Bomber formations should NOT be able to dive to ridiculously high speeds, Split-S, Immelmann, Barrel Roll, whatever and not lose a drone. What an individual plane could do and what a group of planes in close formation DID are two entirely different things.
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I would be happy if drones wouldn't warp around anymore in tight or highspeed maneuvers.
Aim on target... *warp*...getting into position again... *warp*... getting into *warp* *you have collided* :(
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I would be happy if drones wouldn't warp around anymore in tight or highspeed maneuvers.
Aim on target... *warp*...getting into position again... *warp*... getting into *warp* *you have collided* :(
Now this is one aspect I am in complete agreement with about drones. The solution could be that if a drone moves more than "x" distance in "y" time period and collides with anything else, only the drone is affected by a collision and not the object that was there "1st".
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The BETTER solution is that if the drone gets so far out of position it has to warp BACK into place because of how extreme the maneuver is, then the drone should pop outright. Because a bomber formation shouldn't even be MAKING maneuvers that extreme in the first place.
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The BETTER solution is that if the drone gets so far out of position it has to warp BACK into place because of how extreme the maneuver is, then the drone should pop outright. Because a bomber formation shouldn't even be MAKING maneuvers that extreme in the first place.
I am in complete agreement. +1
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Yea, it seems a common tactic these days for buff drivers is to stay in their falling lead plane for as long as possible so that their drones spazz out and flop all over the sky making them impossable to hit and giving them a good chance at getting a collision kill on the fighter attacking them.
at the very least, smooth out how drones rejoin the formation.. if you do some crazy crap and your drones end up 3.0 away, have them.. in a calm and safe manner, maneuver to rejoin you.. that way instead of a spastic invulnerable UFO the drone would be at more risk of being shot down (not being in the formation) and would thus motivate the pilots to not do such aggressive maneuvering.
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Yea, it seems a common tactic these days for buff drivers is to stay in their falling lead plane for as long as possible so that their drones spazz out and flop all over the sky making them impossable to hit and giving them a good chance at getting a collision kill on the fighter attacking them.
That's not a tactic... they just fail to get out, because you can't bail from gunner's position. They just fail to get back to cockpit and bail quickly.
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That's not a tactic... they just fail to get out, because you can't bail from gunner's position. They just fail to get back to cockpit and bail quickly.
Didn't they change this with the latest version?
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No, you still can bail only from cockpit.
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Yea, it seems a common tactic these days for buff drivers is to stay in their falling lead plane for as long as possible so that their drones spazz out and flop all over the sky making them impossable to hit and giving them a good chance at getting a collision kill on the fighter attacking them.
at the very least, smooth out how drones rejoin the formation.. if you do some crazy crap and your drones end up 3.0 away, have them.. in a calm and safe manner, maneuver to rejoin you.. that way instead of a spastic invulnerable UFO the drone would be at more risk of being shot down (not being in the formation) and would thus motivate the pilots to not do such aggressive maneuvering.
Or you can just make the damn thing pop which would be even MORE incentive to not do it.
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I would be happy if drones wouldn't warp around anymore in tight or highspeed maneuvers.
Aim on target... *warp*...getting into position again... *warp*... getting into *warp* *you have collided* :(
+1 :aok its a very annoying problem.
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I did not know P38s had formations enabled? :bolt:
The only thing I have seen is lanc stukkas, so far I have not had the pleasure to engage with some acrobatic buffs yet. but the accuracy of the guns does get me down sometimes as there seems to be next to 0 recoil on them :(
I agree that the buffs should not be able to pull of them manovers regardless if the airframe could, as in the combat situation with the crew and ammo etc..it would cause quite a mess imho
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Ive never seen the most advanced bombers of the miltary today do immelmens in formation......just sayin :salute
of course the ww2 buffs were more advanced. and could dive bomb and do immelmans.
this is for ghost: think about releasing bombs from inside the fuselage at a 45 angle or even a 30 degree angle. they would actually go right thru the cockpit window. and I am talking about the b26's, lancs, b17's doing immelmans and loops. yeah right the gunners wouldda love you for that, that is if they didnt get killed with all the junk inside the plane. any plane can do loops, even todays largest planes can do one, just not a very good idea, lots of passengers, ded. same for the buffs in ww2. you wanna do loops, I am cool with that, but the gunners should be ded and you would end up with a pilot and co-pilot, forget the navigator he's a gonner too.
semp
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of course the ww2 buffs were more advanced. and could dive bomb and do immelmans.
this is for ghost: think about releasing bombs from inside the fuselage at a 45 angle or even a 30 degree angle. they would actually go right thru the cockpit window. and I am talking about the b26's, lancs, b17's doing immelmans and loops. yeah right the gunners wouldda love you for that, that is if they didnt get killed with all the junk inside the plane. any plane can do loops, even todays largest planes can do one, just not a very good idea, lots of passengers, ded. same for the buffs in ww2. you wanna do loops, I am cool with that, but the gunners should be ded and you would end up with a pilot and co-pilot, forget the navigator he's a gonner too.
semp
Wow. Just... Wow. That was so stupid my eyes heart, I now have a migraine, and I want to jump off a bridge into the frigid water of an Alaskan river.
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I like to do immelmans with my formations in order to precisely reverse course. It's a piece of cake.
Golly, it sure is great that the flight model is so durn realistic!
;)
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The BETTER solution is that if the drone gets so far out of position it has to warp BACK into place because of how extreme the maneuver is, then the drone should pop outright. Because a bomber formation shouldn't even be MAKING maneuvers that extreme in the first place.
Saxman has good medicine and his words make much sense. I would walk a mile with Saxman on any day.
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If the head bomber can do it no reason the drones cant do it same planes I'm surprised they don't keep up better. :joystick:
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Wow. Just... Wow. That was so stupid my eyes heart, I now have a migraine, and I want to jump off a bridge into the frigid water of an Alaskan river.
why, please do explain, before you jump off the bridge. sarcasm included.
semp
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Sorry to hear that you had to work for your supper; must be awful that BUFFs don't just rollover and lay-down when your fighter enters icon range.
:bolt:
if its a B24 it does :rofl cant get it over 350 and make any maneuvers safely
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I have advocated for years that planes which drop bombs at an angle, which would result in the bomb hitting the planes frame should take the damage for that.
But that is NOT what we are talking about..
We are talking about the ability, given certain death if we do nothing, of doing a dive then an immelman.
There is no WWII bomber that in the right circumstances could not, or would not do exactly that.
Now you could perhaps make a case that making such a maneuver should cause more separation of the drones.
Thus causing one or both to explode. You can attempt to make the case for the distance involved to be shorter.
But I very much doubt that HTC will at this point change it.
Why should they?
They need to balance "both" sides for gameplay.
Saxman already had the edge flying a late war monster like the F4u-4.
What more do you need?
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But I very much doubt that HTC will at this point change it.
Why should they?
Because the purpose of the drones was to give a bomber pilot extra defensive firepower, NOT three fighters with as many as 30 blasted machine guns a gunner can point at you while looping and weaving all over the frelling place.
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I would be happy if drones wouldn't warp around anymore in tight or highspeed maneuvers.
Aim on target... *warp*...getting into position again... *warp*... getting into *warp* *you have collided* :(
What he said :aok
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I'm actually not a fan of the model that kills drones when "manouvering" causes them to extend too far from the lead aircraft.
Ideally there should be a point where the distance gets so great that the drone effectively "gets lost" and AI takes over (driven from the players FE) and the Drone ditches its bombs and RTB's. If it gets shot down or forced to ditch then so be it and kills/losses awarded appropiately. If the lead plane is destroyed then the player may find himself in charge of an aircraft free of payload on its way to origin base. He can do with that as he pleases.
I assume (and thats caught me out before) that positional control/reference reporting re drones is not like other ac else they would not warp quite so much in comparison to other ac.........
There is of course loads of other stuff re "level bombers" F6, pilot release, fuses etc but that I assume is for elsewhere
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I would be happy if drones wouldn't warp around anymore in tight or highspeed maneuvers.
Aim on target... *warp*...getting into position again... *warp*... getting into *warp* *you have collided* :(
+1
This and when destroying the center bomber causes one of the drones to insta-warp into center position...
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engaged 2 sets of buffs that thought the were fighters. That didn't bug me but dodging the warping drones did.
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+2 best suggestion is some time. YES! simply put.
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We are talking about the ability, given certain death if we do nothing, of doing a dive then an immelman.
There is no WWII bomber that in the right circumstances could not, or would not do exactly that.
That explains all the Luftwaffe gun camera footage of Allied bombers doing immelmans to shake off the 109s and 190s. Not to mention the Bettys doing the same thing to shake off the Hellcats. :rolleyes:
I've seen frame after frame of gun camera footage and have yet to see an Allied or Axis level bomber do an immelman. In fact in all the books I've read on air combat since age 12 and I am now 51, the only reference I've ever seen of a level bomber attempting such a radical maneuver was described in Saburo Sakai's book Samurai about a G4M pilot who tried to loop his Betty. It didn't end well for him. The designed defense of level bombers was massed firepower from a mutual supporting formation of other level bombers. If a plane was damaged and fell out of formation it was doomed and already too damaged to accomplish anything but flying straight and level long enough for the crew to bail.
Loop roll and immelman to your heart's desire, but don't try and pass it off as a historically valid tactic.
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I agree with Sax.
Ghosth, although the plane WOULD be able to do it (erm, maybe, depends on the pilot and the specifics of the day along with the aircraft and it's condition, a lot of variables), the CREW could not. Here is a picture of a B-24 waist turret...
(http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m56/alecksismeboo/DSZ_7699.jpg)
Tell me, if the plane goes vertical, what happens? Gravity says, they fall. They fall, and more than likely, get hurt or crush the tail gunner. Now, after your done falling, what happens when that plane goes up-side-down? You fall again. Now, you also had ammo boxes and other misc. loose items, which, yup, you guessed it, as gravity says, they fall too. Now, what happens when you fall, then have 150 rounds of ammunition, stored in a box, fall on your arm? Your arm hurts like hell. So, you just fell, crushed your tail gunner, had ammo fall onto your arm, you're in not-so-great shape. Now, while the plane is up-side-down, shoot your waist gun...
Oh wait...
You're hurt, and odds are, you won't be shooting the waist gun if you needed to, even after leveling out...
You wanna do it? Fine I say, but say good-bye to your gunners...
My $.02.
~Trig
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Trigger, know what centrifigal force is? Why can roller coasters go loop de loop without the passengers falling out?
Same for a plane doing a loop.
You know I don't think you guys really have a clue what its like trying to fly a bomber these days.
So I dare ya, I double dog dare ya. Fly this tour in nothing but bombers in formation.
Then come back at the end of the tour and tell me that they need to be changed.
Go ahead, prove me wrong. I dare ya.
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Trigger, know what centrifigal force is? Why can roller coasters go loop de loop without the passengers falling out?
Same for a plane doing a loop.
You know I don't think you guys really have a clue what its like trying to fly a bomber these days.
So I dare ya, I double dog dare ya. Fly this tour in nothing but bombers in formation.
Then come back at the end of the tour and tell me that they need to be changed.
Go ahead, prove me wrong. I dare ya.
I never said the bombers needed to be changed. I said your claim that doing immelmans in a bomber is a valid tactic is bulls**t.
You haven't proved me wrong and you haven't proved it was a tactic used in the war. It's gaming the game pure and simple. I'm not even saying don't do it. I'm just saying if you do it or support it you're officially on the gamer side of the sim. Not what I like to see in a guy sporting an AH Trainer Avatar. By the way ever done a loop in an airplane? I have quite a few times. Also have you ever been on a C-130 that was manuvering hard? I've been there too and thank God the pilot didn't try an immelman :lol
So I dare ya, I double dog dare ya.
:rofl
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That's a total physics fail.
Centrifugal force isn't some magical anti-gravity field, especially when you consider the extremely low G-load that most of these bombers could tolerate. IIRC our B-24 loses its wings around what, 3-4G? The bombers don't have NEAR the acceleration forces acting on its crew and internal components to keep them rooted in place while the plain is spinning around like a top.
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How about you kill the bombers before they dive away!! :confused: yes it is possible :x
:joystick:
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How about you kill the bombers before they dive away!! :confused: yes it is possible :x
:joystick:
Actually I prefer the buffs to maneuver. That means the guy is in the pilots seat not in a gun position, and if he has a gunner it makes it harder for him to track me. Plus it usually offers a better target. They're much more dangerous when they are stable and the guns manned. YMMV.
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Plus it usually offers a better target. They're much more dangerous when they are stable and the guns manned. YMMV.
Not if the bomber pilot is maneuvering in such a way, that the drones are warping all over. And you don't need to do an immelman to do so. There are ways to do a relatively flat turn so that the drones start hopping again & again to catch up with the lead. In such a situation it's terrible difficult to attack the bombers. Try to go for the lead, and the drones may warp into you, or go for a drone and they will quickly warp out of your sight.
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That's a total physics fail.
Centrifugal force isn't some magical anti-gravity field, especially when you consider the extremely low G-load that most of these bombers could tolerate. IIRC our B-24 loses its wings around what, 3-4G? The bombers don't have NEAR the acceleration forces acting on its crew and internal components to keep them rooted in place while the plain is spinning around like a top.
You should only need 1G.
On the other hand, rolling over at the top of an Immelmann might be unpleasant for the crew.
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You should only need 1G.
On the other hand, rolling over at the top of an Immelmann might be unpleasant for the crew.
You do realize that 1G is regular, plain-old, force-of-gravity, right?
The reason a pilot stays in his seat while looping isn't because of centrifugal force. It's because he's STRAPPED DOWN. And for a pretty damn good reason.
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Regular, plain-old, force-of-gravity seems to work pretty well for me at my desk. I don't need to be strapped down.
I could be wrong. I'm not a physicist or engineer and it's been awhile since I took physics in school.
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Regular, plain-old, force-of-gravity seems to work pretty well for me at my desk. I don't need to be strapped down.
I could be wrong. I'm not a physicist or engineer and it's been awhile since I took physics in school.
Then again you aren't pulling 9 G's over the top of an immelman in your chair, either.
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1G (gravity) pulling down countered by 1G (radial acceleration) pulling up ..........produces ? weightlessness.. ..................direction (vector?) is everything.
Would a slow Immelman really cause more discomfort than a standard reversing cork screw taught to Lanc pilots?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/ww2peopleswar/stories/43/a4365443.shtml (http://www.bbc.co.uk/ww2peopleswar/stories/43/a4365443.shtml)
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Oh, let's also remember those bomber crewmen are STANDING with no vertical support. All they have is their feet on the floor. When you accelerate in a car, or go through a loop in a roller-coaster you're not being pushed DOWN. You're being pushed BACK. You don't go anywhere because the seat is there. The result is the car or roller coaster accelerates forward or changes direction while you try to maintain your current speed/direction, and you get pushed into your seat, keeping you in place.
Take off the back of the seat and you're going to fall backwards right out of it as you accelerate.
Bomber crewmen are in that same situation. They don't have anything to be pushed INTO. If you've ever ridden on a train and were standing up while it was pulling out of the station and weren't holding on to anything you'll see EXACTLY what's going to happen to those poor crewmen.
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Then again you aren't pulling 9 G's over the top of an immelman in your chair, either.
stretching WWII planes a little to the limits there if youre going 9Gs :huh
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I'm wrong. Forgot about thrust.
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Bomber crewmen are in that same situation. They don't have anything to be pushed INTO. If you've ever ridden on a train and were standing up while it was pulling out of the station and weren't holding on to anything you'll see EXACTLY what's going to happen to those poor crewmen.
How did the Lancaster crews pull it off when they were forced to use the corkscrew maneuver?
ack-ack
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stretching WWII planes a little to the limits there if youre going 9Gs :huh
Just making a point.
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haha ik you were but some people dont know that its even hard for a freaking eurofighter pilot to do 9gs
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Found this diagram and info on the Corkscrew Maneuver.
(http://www.429sqn.ca/acmem01.jpg)
Figure 1. Corkscrew maneuver
How to:
1. The pilot (originally cruising at 200-225 mph) opens his throttle and banks at 45 degrees to make a diving turn to port (because the enemy aircraft is on the port � reverse the maneuver if enemy is on starboard.); descending through 1,000 ft in six seconds, the bomber reaches a speed of nearly 300 mph. After the 1,000 ft descent, the pilot pulls the aircraft into a climb, still turning to port.
3. He reverse the turn, halfway through the climb which has caused his speed to fall sharply, possibly forcing the attacking night fighter to overshoot.
4. Regaining his original altitude, with speed down to 185 mph and still in the starboard turn, the pilot pushes the aircraft down into another dive.
5. Picking up speed in the dive, he descends through 500 ft before reversing the direction of the turn.
6. If the fighter is still on his tail, he stand by to repeat the maneuver. The physical effort required by the pilot has been compared with that of an oarsman pulling hard in a boat race.
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Found this diagram and info on the Corkscrew Maneuver.
(http://www.429sqn.ca/acmem01.jpg)
Figure 1. Corkscrew maneuver
How to:
1. The pilot (originally cruising at 200-225 mph) opens his throttle and banks at 45 degrees to make a diving turn to port (because the enemy aircraft is on the port � reverse the maneuver if enemy is on starboard.); descending through 1,000 ft in six seconds, the bomber reaches a speed of nearly 300 mph. After the 1,000 ft descent, the pilot pulls the aircraft into a climb, still turning to port.
3. He reverse the turn, halfway through the climb which has caused his speed to fall sharply, possibly forcing the attacking night fighter to overshoot.
4. Regaining his original altitude, with speed down to 185 mph and still in the starboard turn, the pilot pushes the aircraft down into another dive.
5. Picking up speed in the dive, he descends through 500 ft before reversing the direction of the turn.
6. If the fighter is still on his tail, he stand by to repeat the maneuver. The physical effort required by the pilot has been compared with that of an oarsman pulling hard in a boat race.
None of which involves the aircraft turning upside down.
And anyway, this has gotten COMPLETELY away from the point. The point was not what an INDIVIDUAL bomber to do, but what a GROUP of bombers in TIGHT FORMATION could do.
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None of which involves the aircraft turning upside down.
And anyway, this has gotten COMPLETELY away from the point. The point was not what an INDIVIDUAL bomber to do, but what a GROUP of bombers in TIGHT FORMATION could do.
i agree to a point that our drones need work but at the same time i like being able to go vert, cut throttle and reverse without losing either of the two
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You want to be able to make those hard evasive maneuvers then don't roll drones. Simple as that. I'd be willing to beck that Corkscrew wasn't flown by 3 Lancasters within 200 yards of each other.
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I believe the Air Force did testing with a B47 called toss bombing. The aircraft would come in low and fast over the target pull up sharply open bomb bay doors and "fling" the bombs at the target it would continue through an Immelman and continue in the opposite direction. I think you can even buy a video showing it. try this link.
http://www.zenosflightshop.com/category_s/1.htm&Click=1664
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I'd be willing to beck that Corkscrew wasn't flown by 3 Lancasters within 200 yards of each other.
If you were a betting man, you would have come away a little richer. RAF Bomber Command didn't use bomber streams like the USAAF did, more of a loose formation, sometimes with planes miles apart and didn't see one another until nearing the target as the stream funneled in.
ack-ack
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rgr flying at night in tight formation was not considered conducive to survival............. accidents happened even in lose gaggles
RAF & RACF crew never had any visualisation as to how big their raids were until the very end. My father recounts his first (and only) daylight mission in late January 45. Sticking his head up in the top dome of the Halifax he was amazed at the sheer size of the gaggle dissappearing seemingly endlessly both forward and to the rear of them.
Yet he had participated in several raids of that size throughout 44 and early 45................ at night.
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Is it really that big of an issue? I rarely see bombers doing these maneuvers to evade fighters, the occasional sharp decent or assent but no flips. I'd much rather be on a flat platform to fire guns than spin around which lets you know that I'm not in my guns.
That being said I'm all for smoothing out the drones from warping into positions like they do.
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I've also noticed that the buff pilots (w/drones) have been taking advantage of the warping lately.
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Is it really that big of an issue? I rarely see bombers doing these maneuvers to evade fighters, the occasional sharp decent or assent but no flips. I'd much rather be on a flat platform to fire guns than spin around which lets you know that I'm not in my guns.
That being said I'm all for smoothing out the drones from warping into positions like they do.
Gotta remember Jayhawk that this community tends to be rather Anti-Buff, so any and all chances to get buffs nerfed for easier kills or get them removed totally is usually taken.
I honestly don't get the warping or see where the hard maneuvering increases survivability. I can rack up tons of kills just flying straight and level. The key to owning fighters while flying a bomber is gunnery practice, you may not get them all but like fighters practicing your aim can easily turn you into a triple 9.
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Gotta remember Jayhawk that this community tends to be rather Anti-Buff, so any and all chances to get buffs nerfed for easier kills or get them removed totally is usually taken.
Removing random warps has nothing to do with "nerfing" or being anti-buff.
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Removing random warps has nothing to do with "nerfing" or being anti-buff.
No, it doesn't. And I agree that warping should be looked into and corrected if possible.
What I am referring to is making it so bomber drones pop or bail or do whatever with the slightest maneuver as an anti-buff post. In other words people are using the warping as an excuse to add more limitations on bombers that doesn't really help the warping issue.
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I haven't met a bomber pilot that uses warping to his advantage (not saying they don't exist, just saying they are very rare). I think most bomber pilots, including myself, wouldn't mind seeing that issue fixed.
Gotta remember Jayhawk that this community tends to be rather Anti-Buff, so any and all chances to get buffs nerfed for easier kills or get them removed totally is usually taken.
I've been getting that vibe with a couple running threads over the last few weeks. A smart pilot is going to know a particular aircraft's strengths and take advantage of them, well a bomber's strength is altitude. Those strengths can be countered with the right approach but when that approach doesn't fit how someone wants to play, they criticize the bomber pilots.
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Gotta remember Jayhawk that this community tends to be rather Anti-Buff, so any and all chances to get buffs nerfed for easier kills or get them removed totally is usually taken.
Hmm that comment sounds rather anti fighter.
I don't think the OP or anyone else in this thread has taken the stance that they want buffs easier to kill or removed from the sim.
However don't let stop your axe grinding. :D
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Hmm that comment sounds rather anti fighter.
I don't think the OP or anyone else in this thread has taken the stance that they want buffs easier to kill or removed from the sim.
However don't let stop your axe grinding. :D
I don't have an axe to grind with fighter pilots, I just simply get tired of reading post after post of people trying to make up their lack of skill in attacking buffs by making artificial rules to hinder them. I'm the type of buff pilot who loves to engage enemy fighters to test my gunnery skills, kind of like 999. So I don't want to lose my little enemy friends.
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I don't have an axe to grind with fighter pilots, I just simply get tired of reading post after post of people trying to make up their lack of skill in attacking buffs by making artificial rules to hinder them. I'm the type of buff pilot who loves to engage enemy fighters to test my gunnery skills, kind of like 999. So I don't want to lose my little enemy friends.
there's no artificial rules. people will take a fighter apart down to the weight, speed, climb, positions of cannons any difference between that and in ww2 gets fixed, posted or discussed to death. but mention anything about how buffs are not able to dive bomb or do loops without losing drones and its always called about how people are trying to hinder them. buffs should not be allowed to dive bomb with bombs inside the fuselage or do loops without losing drones. that's not clipping their wings its making them closer to what they were able to do in ww2. ever shot the lead buff down the pilot takes a while to bail out and your bullets just go right thru the drones? or they warp away when you are withing 200 to 400 to more than 1k. it is just ridiculous.
semp
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+1
I would be happy if drones wouldn't warp around anymore in tight or highspeed maneuvers.
Aim on target... *warp*...getting into position again... *warp*... getting into *warp* *you have collided* :(
annoying.
This and when destroying the center bomber causes one of the drones to insta-warp into center position...
really annoying.
I dont see why they have to warp at all, whether its because you shot the lead or due to maneuvering.
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I don't have an axe to grind with fighter pilots, I just simply get tired of reading post after post of people trying to make up their lack of skill in attacking buffs by making artificial rules to hinder them. I'm the type of buff pilot who loves to engage enemy fighters to test my gunnery skills, kind of like 999. So I don't want to lose my little enemy friends.
People complain about the gamey aspects . It doesn't matter what you fly.
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there's no artificial rules. people will take a fighter apart down to the weight, speed, climb, positions of cannons any difference between that and in ww2 gets fixed, posted or discussed to death. but mention anything about how buffs are not able to dive bomb or do loops without losing drones and its always called about how people are trying to hinder them. buffs should not be allowed to dive bomb with bombs inside the fuselage or do loops without losing drones. that's not clipping their wings its making them closer to what they were able to do in ww2. ever shot the lead buff down the pilot takes a while to bail out and your bullets just go right thru the drones? or they warp away when you are withing 200 to 400 to more than 1k. it is just ridiculous.
semp
+1 YES! kill the lead and the other two auger toward hard deck within 500 ft of ground, then suddenly are flying flat & level 1k+ higher and are shooting at you with all guns.... are these thing too difficult to fix? Can't they continue to fly flat & level until the pilot hit's the dirt dead or otherwise & remain vulnerable to enemy fire....? :old:
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I must say something is wrong with the drones. I always have my drones chicken out shortly after takeoff. it gets annoying
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I must say something is wrong with the drones. I always have my drones chicken out shortly after takeoff. it gets annoying
Leadership....
:devil
(You need to fly straight and climb until the drones get into formation or they won't follow you.)
wrongway
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The only way to keep them in tow is to slow way down, flaps down, then watch them come around...they won't pass you. Not a great choice if you're being dived on...but really the only way. :joystick:
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and when youre flying straight and level at cruise speed 10k agl and they dont return or they chicken out then?