Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Axis vs Allies => Topic started by: Shane on February 24, 2011, 10:49:00 AM
-
While Lusche never bothered to give the AvA much of a glance (too podunk for him to bother with) he did at least include an interesting chart for AvA for 2010. It's the second picture of his initial post.
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,306464.0.html
Taking a look at the graph that shows monthly "AvA activity" during 2010, it shows some interesting peaks and valleys but in the end, it was back to where it was in Jan 2010.
I've been going thru the no icon vs icon issue and have seen the progression from limited no-icon below certain alts, to various limited friendly icon settings (Shifty insisted, "Yes I agree the friendly icons should be around 3k. There are going to be setups where teamwork is essential for survival the limited friendly icons almost makes this impossible."
This right there is a clear indication of the advantages friendly-only icons provide.
But, I'm not here to argue the no-icon setting, only to point to the graph Lusche did so you can make your own analysis of AvA activity over 2010 (which concides with the no-icon movement.)
Since i did not play during 2010, I'm interested in seeing how the "regulars" can explain that graph to me?
When did the no-icon at any alt become the norm?
-
march-april 2010
-
OK, that would explain the dip in attendance between March and August...
What was so special that resulted in the ginormus Sept spike, which tapered off in Oct and by Dec back to Jan levels?
-
one thing you're missing in your view is the available terrains and what the dev group was doing to make the setups more playable...a large part of last year was spent hashing out settings, determining optimal base setups, finding playable setups, etc...all of that contributed to the highs/lows...very little to do with the switch to no enemy icons...if it caused a 10% +/- difference i would be seriously surprised
-
Fighter Ace shut down and had an influx of FA people to AH..... FA shut down right there around August of 2010 was it not?
the AvsA Staff started tinkering with the icon settings around Jan/Feb of 2010 ( and a few times before ) but it went main stream around end of Feb to first of April...somewhere in there...
anyways.....
come fly the AvsA and have fun :aok :D
TC
-
Started around early March, here's the thread
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,284901.0.html
Also the twinrivr terrain saw it's debut early Sept. That was a big draw.
-
OK, that would explain the dip in attendance between March and August...
What was so special that resulted in the ginormus Sept spike, which tapered off in Oct and by Dec back to Jan levels?
i think that's around when i started coming in......and when i first came in there, is also around when i started spamming the forums with ava stuff. when i started spamming, a couple other guys started doing the same...
this arena has as mentioned before revitalized the game for me.
as it is now, i won't fly another arena. if i log in and there's no one in the ava, i'll practice the bomb sight calibration. or i'll go de-ack a base. or i'll just fly around and look at one of usrangers incredible maps.
there was also the twin river map. it has destroyable bridges, and moving weather, including dust storms.
-
It wasn't the no icons that brought me here as my eyes aren't that good anyway. What did bring me here, and probably others, is the fact that I will never be in combat with the same aircraft that I am in. The name of this arena isn't "No bad guy icons" it's "Axis vs Allies". If they decided to turn bad guy icons back on, I would still continue to fly here for the more realistic opportunity to fly against aircraft that are indeed true enemy aircraft for that period. The only caveat that I see with this arena is that you may not get to fly in your favorite cartoon airplanes for a very long time.. (couP38gh). This may be another reason why activity drops off.
A thought occurred too me the other night that perhaps in the MA scenarios they should get rid of all the current skins and only have KNIGHT, BISHOP and ROOK skins.
-
Since i did not play during 2010, I'm interested in seeing how the "regulars" can explain that graph to me?
When did the no-icon at any alt become the norm?
I can't explain graphs to anyone, because usually I don't understand them.
First, if I read the chart correctly, it only implies the level of activity. The orange line shows the number of individual pilots who logged into the arena during the month, and the blue line shows the total number of kills in the arena that month. So if, for example, the same three pilots logged in every night of the month for tour 122, but only one night each during the month of tour 123, the orange line would show the same value (three), even though there were 90 pilot-days in tour 122 and three pilot-days in tour 123 (although presumably the total kill number would be higher for the first tour). Am I right? If I am, then this chart really wouldn't tell you which tours were virtually empty and which tours had sustained action, so long as people continue to check in once or twice a month.
Nevertheless, in an attempt to figure out what went on in 2010 I went back through the AvA Development and Staff forum posts to see if I could glean insight into what was going on that year and - more important - before.
Judging from the posts, virtually all of 2010 was a rejuvenation period for the arena. The most notable thing, for me, was that Jaeger, Shifty and Jimson all became very active with AvA in December 2009 - January 2010. Each of these guys was very effective in getting his friends and/or squad members to try AvA out during that time, and those efforts essentially primed the AvA pump (looks sideways at Fork: "Don't say it"). They were subsequently joined by more and more devoted rabble-rousers, as we see today.
Institution of no-icons was in March, 2010 (122 on the chart). By then we were already getting decent-sized groups of people in the arena on a regular basis because of the proselytizing. You see that quite a few new faces came in during March and April to try out the no icons settings. Attendance of new people dropped during the summer - nothing new there - and skyrocketed in the fall with the introduction (in September - tour 128) of USRanger's Twin Rivers map, which has been a big draw ever since. The chart suggests that there is a core group of regulars - and has been such a group - for the past year, and I think this is consistent with our own "anecdotal" senses. The no icons setting, I believe, has maintained the interest of this group so that people don't just drift away to their old familiar squadrons/arenas. In early 2010 it was common to log into the arena at 10 pm Eastern time and find no one. That has not been so for some months now.
I would love to see this chart going back to 2008 and 2009, which were really tumbleweed years, and I'd like even more if there were a way to measure player hours per unit of time.
Don't know if those are answers to your questions, though.
- oldman
-
From what I understand, Lusche pulled the names/nbrs of players with any sortie during a time frame - doesn't matter if one person flew 1 sortie or 100, it counts as "1" for active player. Of course, some setups drew in more people than others, but again the graph is just a raw count of how many stuck their nose in the AvA.
I'd disagree with your asseetion nbrs dropped off in summer, because you actually see a big decline after no-icons became the norm, and then it picked up May-August (summer!) with the net result still indicating less activity than back in Jan/Feb.
Sept and Oct are the oddities in statistical terms, and could be attributed to the influx of FA and a few curious AHers, along with the new map as was pointed out.
It bottomed out in Nov, and Dec saw a slight increase (why? I dunno what was being offered here that month.)
Now looking at player activity (not kills) you'll see than Jan 2010 and Dec 2010 are very comparable, with there actually being slightly less at the end of the year as opposed to the beginning.
In effect what this map is indicating is that the no-icon experiment took a big hit on the AvA overall and it's just now "recovering." I'm not so sure I buy into the terrain-revisions argument as a reason for the decline.
Taking a quick look at Jan/Feb 2011, by looking at the rankings and finding the highest (lowest actually) ranked player on the page for fighter stats (which would exclude people who popped in once or twice and didn't fly a ftr sortie - altho the AvA bills itself as a mostly ftr arena, which it is) I see a 216 ranked guy in Jan and a 197 ranked in Feb which shows AvA seems to be flattening out for the time being, but still below Jan 2010 numbers.
My count could be off in the absence of a full ranking roster, tho'.
Anyone care to provide a different analysis?
You could do a similar search on prior years, and I'm sure Lusche could do it in his sleep in 5 mins, lol.
I'll PM him and see if he's willing to do 2008/2009 with a similar graph.
-
i shouldn't go here, but i have to.
it sounds like you're just trying another door to get icons back on in there? or to justify your desire for them?
-
Is this thread going some where? the AVA is what it is. its Axis Vs Allies. doesn't matter how many people are in there. whether the player base rises or falls, its a fun arena. so lets just play the game and get on with it!
-
honsetly,
it looks like Shane and Oldman might be having a discussion, since the thread is titled AvA "stats" 2010 - for Oldman
this thread is not interfering with anyone, nor is it interfering with game play in the AvsA.......
Shane is just researching the icons/no icons, and he should have every right to, since he was not around and does not know what all was involved when the decision came down to do it.....
no need to make a mountian out of a mole hill when all I see is Shane discussing some stats with Oldman....
getting snappy about these threads is what drags everything down......... try and be civil will go a long way
see ya'll in the AvsA to have some fun :aok
TC
-
i shouldn't go here, but i have to.
it sounds like you're just trying another door to get icons back on in there? or to justify your desire for them?
Just asking for an honest assessment. No icons won't drive me away - I do just as well with or without them. And to be honest my AvA stats would exceed my MA stats if you turned them on. If anything, no-icons give *you* an advantage over me. I'll allow you your crutch. :aok
But... looking at the numbers leads one to ask whether it has actually been better for AvA or not.
Are you saying that the AvA will never go back to icons? Of course, you can't say that. What will it take to get them turned back on - AvA becoming a ghost town again? Or admit that it might be an experiment that didn't quite pan out?
It's obvious to me there's a very small, exclusive group of people who *prefer* no-icons... which only reinforces the perception of AvA being a clique-ish place that the avergae player has no input in, despite the claim the AvA is made for and run by the players.
And again, *I* have no power or influence in the AvA settings and I'll either stick around or leave - a *personal* choice, right? Right? Just like *you* have the preference to turn off icons if you choose, for the "immersion" factor and all. My immersion factor is the plane matchups, but then I fly any and everything, not limiting myself to one or two ride, but again, that's a personal choice, right?
I'm asking for is an assessment of the claims I'm seeing about the AvA being healthy and growing because of no-icon setting... and the subjective opinions of a few people don't seem to jibe with the actual nbrs/trends I'm seeing presented for 2010.
-
OK, that would explain the dip in attendance between March and August...
What was so special that resulted in the ginormus Sept spike, which tapered off in Oct and by Dec back to Jan levels?
Jet week I believe should explain the spike!
JUGgler
-
Jet week I believe should explain the spike!
JUGgler
jet week was a friggin BLAST!!
-
Just asking for an honest assessment. No icons won't drive me away - I do just as well with or without them. And to be honest my AvA stats would exceed my MA stats if you turned them on. If anything, no-icons give *you* an advantage over me. I'll allow you your crutch. :aok
But... looking at the numbers leads one to ask whether it has actually been better for AvA or not.
Are you saying that the AvA will never go back to icons? Of course, you can't say that. What will it take to get them turned back on - AvA becoming a ghost town again? Or admit that it might be an experiment that didn't quite pan out?
It's obvious to me there's a very small, exclusive group of people who *prefer* no-icons... which only reinforces the perception of AvA being a clique-ish place that the avergae player has no input in, despite the claim the AvA is made for and run by the players.
And again, *I* have no power or influence in the AvA settings and I'll either stick around or leave - a *personal* choice, right? Right? Just like *you* have the preference to turn off icons if you choose, for the "immersion" factor and all. My immersion factor is the plane matchups, but then I fly any and everything, not limiting myself to one or two ride, but again, that's a personal choice, right?
I'm asking for is an assessment of the claims I'm seeing about the AvA being healthy and growing because of no-icon setting... and the subjective opinions of a few people don't seem to jibe with the actual nbrs/trends I'm seeing presented for 2010.
my ava stats, even before i hooked up trackir, never matched my mw stats. but then in mw, i had a "crutch". it was that big red "shoot here" sign over the bad guys airplane. i don't have that "crutch" in the ava, although i did have a few GREAT 3-1's, the most recent of which was with rammey, hoey, and vultchy. i think someone else jumped in at one point, but drano(who was otw to help me) took him out. he also augered rigfht behind that one.
i for one don't want you, tc, or anyone that likes to fight to leave. just don't worry about the settings. come in, have fun, and kick our asses. if you'd be so kind as to teach some of us schmucks something here and there, we'd definitely appreciate it too. :aok
-
For me personally it's the aircraft matchups I'm here for. I can take or leave the no enemy icons. In fact I prefered the old limited enemy icons of the past.
-
For me personally it's the aircraft matchups I'm here for. I can take or leave the no enemy icons. In fact I prefered the old limited enemy icons of the past.
fully agree on the matchups. i like the fact that i'm kind of being forced to fly aircraft that i may never have flown. same for fighting against em. i've fought aircraft in here that i've never fought against in the mw arena.
-
no offense shane but...you're fishing
situation is this...ava has had ups and downs depending on the setup, other activities around the ah community...etc...
before the switch to no enemy icons...ava was a veritable ghost town...it's been up and down but the number of regulars is on the rise...and if the words of oldman, jaeger and the other long time staffers isn't enough for you, then nothing will convince you...personally i don't give a rats patootie whether you're convinced or not, you're just another toon pile-it.
fact is, the no enemy icons brought about some new excitement...not to mention a lot of arguments public and private...as long as it took to turn the ava into a ghost town, it's taking longer to build it back up...not because of no enemy icons, but because of the negative views people formed due to the type of poop you're spreading...there is now a team of people building terrains specifically for the ava, never existed before...the development group has new people with fresh ideas and we all try to anticipate what will work and what won't...how best to use the terrains that are available until new terrains are introduced...it's a slow process
yes there is some elitist mentality...and it's well deserved...some of us have and are continuing to spend a lot of time to make the ava a place where players can go to get away from the main arena b.s. and experience a bit more challenging environment where score and having your name appear in the text buffer doesn't mean a thing...to have someone like yourself who is overly obsessed with no enemy icons come along and try to urinate in the pond, doesn't go over very well...you won't have anything to do with whether the setting fails or succeeds in the long run...accept it and move on.
-
This graph does not show everything.
I remember the time period and what happened. Everyone who was there can remember that once the no enemy icons were put in there was a spike in the arena attendance.
I distinctly remember this being an exciting time for the community as we were getting some very good numbers, and a lot of positive feedback from folks that very much enjoyed something different.
Then the WW1 arena came.
I distinctly remember the AvA people groaning about the timing and fearing we would lose the momentum we had and it did seem that that is what happened.
Once momentum has been interrupted it's difficult to recapture.
I reject that the arena took a hit because of the setting change.
I am absolutely sure that we would have taken a similar hit if the icons had never been changed.
-
What one should really do is go and take a look at the forum posts in early March 2010.
You will see the excitement and favorable responses that convinced even those who were initially against the idea to make it a standard setting.
In any case no minds will be changed stats or no stats, pages of favorable views or not, but perhaps one can get a feeling for what prompted the change whether you agree with it or not.
-
Jet week I believe should explain the spike!
JUGgler
he's right it was jet week.
-
....
-
btw.........
did I mention that I don't care if it is "no enemy icons" or "with enemy icons".........
just shut up and go fly :D
TC
-
Ok Ladies & Gentlemen, sorry, I'm a bit late to this thread ;)
Right now I have not the time to answer in detail to every post in this thread, but let me explain some general things about the numbers I presented.
On the method:
The number of players (and their names) I have simply taken from the plane stats page, going through each plane and gathering all names. This gives me all pilot ID'S that had killed or been killed at least once during a tour. A player who only jumped into an empty arena, did fly a uneventful sortie and never was seen again is not included.
Problems with that data specific to AvA:
There are two reasons why I didn't bother with any further analysis and did not present additional conclusions/opions of mine, and none of them is because I do not have any interest in this arena as a player.
The first one: lack of data consistency. On the past there had been repeating "problems" with the scoring and stats recording. We had occasional glitches on some tours meaning that data wasn't recorded entirely. In some tours, score had been disabled deliberately. As a non-AvA player, I'm not always aware of those issues, and identifying all of them in retrospect is very difficult. So I saw the data I presented in my main stats thread more like giving a very general assessment for AvA activity in the bigger multi-arena context, mainly to show how "dominant" the LW arena is compared to the special interest ones.
Th second one: Even if I'd assume the gathered data is consistent and complete for the period presented, it's very difficult to draw any simple & direct conclusions from it. More like any regular MA, both game settings (for example ack strength, icon settings) as well as game setup (map, planeset) are constantly varying ind happen in different combination. Some setups/maps are very much more popular than others. And in an arena as small as this one, with a small core of very dedicated players having a much greater share in overall activity even personal circumstanced can have some noticeable effects on kills & played hours for the arena in toto.
All those factors combined make it very difficult (at least for me) to trace apparent changes in numbers/activity back to any single change in settings. In other words: I have a hard time "proving" anything here, so I do not try :D
It's a different thing with the three "regular" mains, which are much more stable in settings as well as population, much more reliable in terms of data consistency and are being monitored by me not only by data scrounging or reading forum talk, but by playing there and observing things.
And a private word beyond the stats talk: I have seen (though often only from the outside) many ebbs & flows in AvA activity over the years. Some settings had been greeted with great enthusiasm, resulted in great numbers and participation for a while... and then the numbers were falling again. There may be better & worse setting, but I don't think there is any setting for this arena which really is "it".
-
It's obvious to me there's a very small, exclusive group of people who *prefer* no-icons... which only reinforces the perception of AvA being a clique-ish place that the avergae player has no input in, despite the claim the AvA is made for and run by the players.
It's time to put up or shut up.
Prove that a small minority of newcomer radicals ran over both staff and the majority wishes of the AvA regulars or it didn't happen.
I'll start.
All staff members who were and remain opposed to the current icon setting and were bowled over by a small minority please post here.
I was not on staff at the time, neither were NRaVen, Shifty or Ranger.
You can gather for yourself who the remaining staffers were, and decide whether or not the majority were old school CT people or cliquish radicals.
You are basing the statement that the average player has no input on the fact that what you want is not being capitulated to.
The burden of proof is on you to show that what has been done is against the wishes of the people who frequent the arena
So do it.
-
It's time to put up or shut up.
I vote "shut up". This thread is not providing the community any great service.
Oh, this wasn't a poll? :D
-
Jim,
what you ask for someone to show proof of can not be done........ only a small minority of the AvsA players even read / post to these boards, just like the rest of the AH arenas and SEA events, etc.......
so it will always be the views of the minority verse the majority...... now it is easy to say that the majority of the people posting in the AvsA forum ( which is actually an over alll minority of all the people who play in the AvsA ) might well indeed be for "no enemy icons".......
but that is not fair to say or point out either....... no way to show proof of any true facts here........ hence is the same reason Lusche ( Snailman ) does not monitor / play in or keep data on the AvsA......
now, everyone can continue to stand their ground in their beliefs..... but that is as far as any of us will ever get, unless one of us is chosen to one day become a staff member and change the way things are, but right now the Staff or some Staff members has already posted that there never will be a change with the icon settings... either like it or leave.... that is the ultimatum given, is it not?
edit: what I honestly do not understand, is that a compromise was never offered for both camps, why could the AvsA Staff not split up the setups 50/50 with limited icons / no icons ? how hard would that have been to offer a choice for Everyone? andnot just be onesided about the issue.......???
TC
-
btw,
I don't care either way, no enemy icons or limited enemy icons..... I still have the same amount of fun regardless....
come have fun in the AvsA <S>
TC
-
It is wrong to say that their will never be a change in the icon settings.
It is also wrong to say that the change was made for the wishes of a minority clique rather than for what people thought would be good for the arena.
Does any one else see how insulting it is to insinuate that the change was made for any other reason than it was thought that it would help the arena by contributing to a different environment from the others?
The staff does take input from the regular players, but how has it been shown that a majority of players would prefer a full icon setting?
TC you are correct, it can't be proven either way so how can it be proven that we are wrong?
-
It is wrong to say that their will never be a change in the icon settings.
It is also wrong to say that the change was made for the wishes of a minority clique rather than for what people thought would be good for the arena.
Does any one else see how insulting it is to insinuate that the change was made for any other reason than it was thought that it would help the arena by contributing to a different environment from the others?
Jim, I am not wanting to argue, so I will take this to PM's if that is ok with you
I only posted what I have seen on these boards written by others, guess I should have quoted those people instead of just typing my last reply out..
so it does not look like I am making those claims
The staff does take input from the regular players, but how has it been shown that a majority of players would prefer a full icon setting?
how has it been show that a majority of the players would prefer no enemy icons? where did the poll or vote take place? to come to that conclusion
-
edit: what I honestly do not understand, is that a compromise was never offered for both camps, why could the AvsA Staff not split up the setups 50/50 with limited icons / no icons ? how hard would that have been to offer a choice for Everyone? andnot just be onesided about the issue.......???
TC
Do you have links where staff members are saying the icons will never change so take it or leave it?
While on the subject of choices for everyone... If the AvA has to give everyone the choices they want then people that want every airplane available on every setup should be catered to as well. Not to mention those that want a three country war they should get their wish too. How one sided of the staff not to consider their wants all these years. ;) Since you've mounted your steed and are determined to slay this windmill err dragon... Did you know the FSO does things a certain way and are pretty set up on it as well? You might want to go tell them unfair it is that people only get one life on their events each Friday night. Why can't they give people unlimited lives I'm tired of getting killed and being done after one mishun. :furious Go get em TC and straighten them out! :D Plus I think it would be a good idea to start training people new to AH2 to get accustomed to no enemy icons. Since you're on AH2 Training Staff I think it would be fair of you to turn the icons off in the TA half the time. That way maybe more people will be attracted to the AVA. :aok
Seriously everybody relax it's graphs. It's not a 10 mile square meteor heading towards your city. I believe most people flying in the arena have been having fun have they not? Especially Shane.
-
TC, I agree that the absolute "It will never be changed" was wrong.
how has it been show that a majority of the players would prefer no enemy icons? where did the poll or vote take place? to come to that conclusion
We got a good reaction when it was first tried as an experiment, it seemed to create a lot of interest and maybe we are all crazy but it seemed to help build a regular base of players.
I don't want to argue either and I will let it go
Come enjoy the AvA for the planesets, settings or whatever you find about it you like.
We are not elitists, all are welcome.
<S> all
-
give me a few hours to go sift and I will post em for you Shifty if you wish, Sir....
as for the FSO - that is SEA , it is not a 24/7 open arena to the public, so it is like comparing Apples & oranges.....
as for the Training Arena - HTC will not allow that unless it is a specific class being held at a scheduled time, and I would not be qualifyed to give such a class..... might need to ask the expert guy on that one :devil
off to gather my research edit: <----scratch that
edit: ok I will not bother with gathering the posts then...... but just to put this out there for everyone......
this no icons/limited icons : talk-debate-discussion-fueding-fussing has been going on for well over a year now....it dies out but then it comes back......
if everyone was to go back to around November of 2009 and read through all the threads, and specifically read those that involve the no icons/limited icons debate...... you might just be surprised or maybe even appauled at all the different things that were posted/said....all be it most of it was because of this heated discussion and people getting hot under the collar.... but the fueding and arguing has been a hot bed of white coals...
I just want to have fun, just like everyone else.... :cheers:
-
btw Shifty,
that was a good idea / suggestion you thought up there, about using the TA for "no enemy Icons Training"....
I will see if someone capable might be willing to offer such a clinic............. could help people in FSO just as much as the AvsA players...
:aok
TC
-
as for the FSO - that is SEA , it is not a 24/7 open arena to the public, so it is like comparing Apples & oranges.....
Apples and Oranges really? It's an arena run by a player staff just like the AVA. The FSO staff determines it's operating parameters. The AVA just happens to be 24/7. So the AVA staff is not free to choose the parameters the area operates under? If Saxman comes in and demands the F4U be in every setup or he won't fly here the staff needs to honor that for him ? If Rox comes in wanting a three country all aircraft and vehicles enabled horde war the staff needs to cater to that as well just so he'll fly here? You keep saying it doesn't matter to you but you're clamped down on it like a pit bull.Maybe you should approach HTC and ask and I'm being serious. Nobody on this staff has the power some of you seem to think. Actually it's a bunch of guys doing their best to make a fun arena for the more history minded. It's not some cartel all smoking cigars around a big table out to ruin TC's Shane's or anybody elses fun. Seriously contact HTC with your concerns if they think the staff is out of bounds every staff member here would be more than happy to comply with your wishes I'm sure. Especially me I prefer the limited icons of old and would gladly fly them again. I was one of the first to admit the no enemy icons seemed to appeal deeply to those that tried it. So I'm for what's popular and keeping guys flying in the arena, and no icons is what they like. So seriously you Shane or anybody else who feels this strongly about it should consider touching base with HTC on the subject. Charts debates and time spent arguing would better be spent flying one way or the other.
<S>
-
Have A Good Evening, Shifty, Sir
-
U2 Sir.
<S>
-
@jimson: I agree the no-icon was presented in the hopes it would spur more activity, and from the BBS activity it appears so, still, it's the numbers that aren't quite matching up to that (*thx lusche for the input about stats). How much of the missing data can be attributed to shutting off scores, I wouldn't have the slightest idea.
I do recall seeing a suggestion and concern about a possible slack-off after the "novelty wore off from one of those threads and that the no-icon should be run often, but not all the time. The big March thread supports that as you see several people say it was a fun "event/experience." Some of them stuck around, most didn't as the graph clearly indicates.
The graph shows pilot #'s only and the trend I think is fairly obvious. I'm trying to understand why and the most coincidential events I see that lead to the overall downward trend could be attributed to the WW1 arena (which has better nbrs and icons enabled(?)) and the instituition of no-icons.
Now the trend is apparently rising (and may continue to do so), but the pilot count is still below the January level. Assessment = net loss for the year in terms of pilots, even tho the arena might have picked up (and lost) the dedicated core at the heart of any small community.
The key fun factor is the activity when each one of us is most likely to log in and play, namely early evening, with a big variable being the current setup, as evidenced by Jet Week (were icons off?), and to a lesser extent, the GV thingy you guys ran in Feb/Mar?
I just think the Staff needs to be open to further tweaking - nothing is ever set in stone, and we all would like to see the same thing, a higher populated arena.
Propaganda of any sort should always be subject to scrunity and debunking. :old:
So perhaps consider the occasional limited icons on and see what trend that might create?
Like I said, either way I'll be around, until I'm not.
I do like TC's idea about a poll... I think the Staff should run one now and then for a variety of issues, even if only as a pulse taking.
<mutters about rarely seeing an Italian setup that features the early USAAF workhorses, 38, 47, 51 (and you could toss in the naval with f4u and wild/hellcats/fm2) vs a wider choice of german (f-g6 maybe?) and italian stuff (both), plus the attack/bombers on each side...>
On that note is there any archived data about the setups that have been run over time?
-
I do like TC's idea about a poll... I think the Staff should run one now and then for a variety of issues, even if only as a pulse taking.
A poll would be a great idea, if people that actually fly or would fly if the icons were set to their liking would post.
The only problem I see with a poll is people coming taking the poll and never setting foot in the AVA regardless.
-
I just think the Staff needs to be open to further tweaking - nothing is ever set in stone, and we all would like to see the same thing, a higher populated arena.
I believe every staff member agrees with you on these three points.
As to the poll: My own opinion is that of Henrik Ibsen: the majority is always wrong. Polls got us the B-29, as an example. That said, I am only one voice, and the tools to do polls exist here.
- oldman
-
I just think the Staff needs to be open to further tweaking - nothing is ever set in stone, and we all would like to see the same thing, a higher populated arena.
I like this post.
Jet week was indeed run with no enemy icons.
I don't believe that WW1 has better numbers than the AvA, but on its debut week it certainly drained all the arenas. It particulary affected the AvA as it seemed to come right at a time that we were appealing to a lot of people but not before we really had them hooked.
Of course this is all my opinion, there is no way to know what "might have been."
I believe that no settings can be set in stone, things evolve in directions we can't foresee.
I and I believe all staff will never stand in the way of whats best for the arena, but we won't always agree on what that is.
Every update, version, has the potential to bring new tools and game play options.
I see you have a particular set up you'd like to see. We can definitely consider that.
One caveat is that for the most part we would like it to be loosely based on a historical reality or at least somewhat plausible.
Even Jet week was originally run as a Korean war tribute. It was quite a stretch, but considering the parity between the Mig-15 and F-86, Me 262 for both wasn't a totally horrible substitute.
All of the setups have been posted in the AvA forum, but you would play hell trying to sift them all out, perhaps a consolidated thread archiving those for the general public is a good idea.
I will make that a project.
-
I just logged into the AvA & banned all of you. Now I can fly in peace.
(http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/145/funnyghostface.gif) (http://img8.imageshack.us/i/funnyghostface.gif/)
-
How about a couple of weeks with no icons on either side and killshooter off? Someone always brings up the issue of one sided no icons. Why not give it a try with both off?
Seems the same issue always comes up about some not liking no icons in the AvA when there are all of the other arenas with full up icons 24/7. It would make one almost think that some are having a gun held on them to fly in the AvA with no icons when it's a free choice to use any arena at will. :salute
-
Seems this has gone off the path.