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General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: lulu on March 25, 2011, 05:25:25 PM

Title: p51 D vs la7
Post by: lulu on March 25, 2011, 05:25:25 PM: Let's discuss pls.

TY

:salute
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: gyrene81 on March 25, 2011, 05:27:31 PM: don't care for either, but if i had a choice i'd take an la-57d...need all the ammo i can get.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: B-17 on March 25, 2011, 05:29:09 PM: Quote from: gyrene81 on March 25, 2011, 05:27:31 PM
don't care for either, but if i had a choice i'd take an la-57d...need all the ammo i can get.

:rofl me too
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: gyrene81 on March 25, 2011, 05:35:44 PM: forgot to mention, lulu...both toon planes will fall out of the toon skies just like any other when you hit them with toon bullets.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: MachFly on March 25, 2011, 05:56:11 PM: P-51, it's can actually fly over 10K. I don't know the specific numberes for each planes so it's hard for me to compare, take a look at the following: http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/P-51D (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/P-51D) & http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/La-7 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/La-7)
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: MachFly on March 25, 2011, 06:03:39 PM: gyrene,

I think he's asking a valid question. Sure he posted it on the wrong section of the forum and his opening post did not have much info in it, but why make fun of someone who is trying to compare two planes? And what makes you think he is talking about cartoon planes? As far as I know P-51 and La-7 did exist.

Lets try to be a little nicer next time :)
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Shane on March 25, 2011, 06:19:15 PM: What question was asked, exactly?
:noid

Quote from: MachFly on March 25, 2011, 06:03:39 PM
gyrene,

I think he's asking a valid question. Sure he posted it on the wrong section of the forum and his opening post did not have much info in it, but why make fun of someone who is trying to compare two planes? And what makes you think he is talking about cartoon planes? As far as I know P-51 and La-7 did exist.

Lets try to be a little nicer next time :)
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Masherbrum on March 25, 2011, 07:01:43 PM: Quote from: MachFly on March 25, 2011, 05:56:11 PM
P-51, it's can actually fly over 10K. I don't know the specific numberes for each planes so it's hard for me to compare, take a look at the following: http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/P-51D (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/P-51D) & http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/La-7 (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/La-7)

I'd take the La-7.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Yeager on March 25, 2011, 07:14:15 PM: a P51 flow smartly is untouchable in this game....might not ever get any kills though.......be brave, be bold, be beautiful and stay out of my P51.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Tec on March 25, 2011, 07:44:10 PM: Quote from: lulu on March 25, 2011, 05:25:25 PM
Let's discuss pls.

Heads up the La7 eats the 51 for lunch, but the 51 is by far the more versatile of the two.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: 321BAR on March 25, 2011, 07:49:34 PM: Quote from: Yeager on March 25, 2011, 07:14:15 PM
a P51 flow smartly is untouchable in this game....might not ever get any kills though.......be brave, be bold, be beautiful and stay out of my P51.
which 51 is that? because i claim a 51 also :aok

The La-5FN and La-7 are very amazing planes below 9k feet. Fast, extremely maneuverable in the right hands, a great punch (if ammo is conserved). But its short range affects its ability.

The 51Bs and 51Ds are also amazing aircraft, VS an La7 in a turn fight, the La can have the upper hand if you keep the fight slow. High speed turnfights (where the Las cant use flaps) the P51s can keep the upper hand. The 51s have much less torque than that of the Lalas but you can still feel it when slow. 51Bs are beautiful at altitudes and the 51Ds are beautiful lower alt although both can be flown in each others forte. 51Ds have a lower high alt peak than the 51Bs though so watch for that above 30k
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Oldman731 on March 25, 2011, 07:51:50 PM: Quote from: Yeager on March 25, 2011, 07:14:15 PM
a P51 flow smartly is untouchable in this game....might not ever get any kills though.......

....er...doesn't that apply to any plane? Avoid combat and you're untouchable?

- oldman (OTOH, no one ever accused me of being smart) (well, my mother. Once.)
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: SmokinLoon on March 25, 2011, 10:52:36 PM: in a 1v1, I'd give the edge to the La7. The acceleration, climb, and better mid and low speed turn give it an advantage. The La7 is limited to a certain few roles (base defender, fighter, low alt interceptor), while the P51x is far more versatile.

I will take the P51D any day though. I cant stand the short legs of the Lgay7.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: TUK on March 25, 2011, 10:59:04 PM: A decent p51 pilot could beet a La7 with the right defensive first move. If the LA7 didn't run for home after the initial merge. :old:
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5174/5509823183_6b1863a65b_b.jpg)
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: MachFly on March 25, 2011, 11:30:07 PM: Quote from: TUK on March 25, 2011, 10:59:04 PM
A decent p51 pilot could beet a La7 with the right defensive first move. If the LA7 didn't run for home after the initial merge. :old:
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5174/5509823183_6b1863a65b_b.jpg)

I think you got the wrong picture, that's a Spitfire. :cry
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Krupinski on March 25, 2011, 11:35:57 PM: Equal pilots La7 vs P51... La7 should win every time.

P51 is of course better if you're a score wh**e!
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: MaSonZ on March 25, 2011, 11:38:54 PM: Quote from: MachFly on March 25, 2011, 11:30:07 PM
I think you got the wrong picture, that's a Spitfire. :cry
thought the same LOL.

back to OP...
Quote from: Krupinski on March 25, 2011, 11:35:57 PM
Equal pilots La7 vs P51... La7 should win every time.

P51 is of course better of you're a score wh**e!
i agree
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: BnZs on March 26, 2011, 05:12:48 AM: Taking into account its considerable advantage in wing-loading and very long WEP, the La7 is actually competitive up to 20K. Just because the La7 has tremendous relative performance at low altitude does NOT mean its performance sucks higher. Of special importance, note that power/weight-as indicated by climb rate-remains essentially better or equal than that of the P-51D up to 18K. Lighter wingloading and equal or superior power/weight translates into winning the dogfight, all other factors being equal, and while the P-51 is faster, it has the problem that it cannot dive to disengage.

(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/scores/genchart.php?p1=0&p2=42&pw=2&gtype=0)
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/scores/genchart.php?p1=0&p2=42&pw=2&gtype=2)
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: TUK on March 26, 2011, 07:53:33 AM: Quote from: MachFly on March 25, 2011, 11:30:07 PM
I think you got the wrong picture, that's a Spitfire. :cry
Its just a 51 picture. Sorry to disappoint ya.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: MachFly on March 26, 2011, 03:12:41 PM: Fixed

(http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/7705/55098231836b1863a65bb.jpg)

:devil
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: MachFly on March 26, 2011, 03:30:20 PM: Quote from: MachFly on March 26, 2011, 03:12:41 PM
Fixed

(http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/7705/55098231836b1863a65bb.jpg)

:devil

Made a type, really don't feel like making a new one.

*Thread
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: jolly22 on March 26, 2011, 03:33:05 PM: Quote from: Oldman731 on March 25, 2011, 07:51:50 PM

....er...doesn't that apply to any plane? Avoid combat and you're untouchable?

- oldman (OTOH, no one ever accused me of being smart) (well, my mother. Once.)

So my M3 reuse runs are incredible skills? OH YEA!!!! :rock
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: katanaso on March 26, 2011, 05:22:47 PM: Quote from: Krupinski on March 25, 2011, 11:35:57 PM
Equal pilots La7 vs P51... La7 should win every time.

I've always felt the opposite -- that La7's seem to be pretty easy to outmaneuver while in a 51, if you get it into a turnfight.

Just what I've experienced.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Yeager on March 26, 2011, 05:28:03 PM: Quote from: Oldman731 on March 25, 2011, 07:51:50 PM

....er...doesn't that apply to any plane? Avoid combat and you're untouchable?

Logic is a dangerous thing when wielded as a weapon.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: 1Boner on March 26, 2011, 06:34:12 PM: Quote from: TUK on March 25, 2011, 10:59:04 PM
A decent p51 pilot could beet a La7 with the right defensive first move. If the LA7 didn't run for home after the initial merge. :old:
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5174/5509823183_6b1863a65b_b.jpg)

A LA-7 runnin from a Runstang???

Now I KNOW he's just kiddin around!!
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: ink on March 26, 2011, 06:43:10 PM: LA7 vs P51....equal pilots the LA will win every time :aok
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: katanaso on March 26, 2011, 06:54:28 PM: Quote from: ink on March 26, 2011, 06:43:10 PM
LA7 vs P51....equal pilots the LA will win every time :aok

How? I know that's a very generalized question...

I'm genuinely curious here though.

I find that I can get into turning fights, nose down, and more often than not, I end up on the La7's 6 and the La7 will extend away.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: TUK on March 26, 2011, 06:56:00 PM: Quote from: katanaso on March 26, 2011, 06:54:28 PM
How? I know that's a very generalized question...

I'm genuinely curious here though.

I find that I can get into turning fights, nose down, and more often than not, I end up on the La7's 6 and the La7 will extend away.
+1
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Urchin on March 26, 2011, 07:00:23 PM: Quote from: katanaso on March 26, 2011, 06:54:28 PM
How? I know that's a very generalized question...

I'm genuinely curious here though.

I find that I can get into turning fights, nose down, and more often than not, I end up on the La7's 6 and the La7 will extend away.

Well, there was an equal pilots caveat.

If you know that your plane can turn, you are up on about half the folks playing the game. Even if your plane doesn't turn very well. If you understand how to manuever in a different plane from your opponent (i.e. you manuever vertically instead of horizontally, or vice versa) you are up on roughly 95%.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: vNUCKS on March 26, 2011, 07:00:54 PM: It all depends on whose terms the fight occurs. At <10k the Pony will be at a marked disadvantage to the LA7, at higher altitudes the Pony will gain an advantage, and that advantage will increase with altitude. A Pony has a reasonable chance of winning an engagement against an LA7 in the LA7's low altitude "home" if he brings enough E to the fight. An LA7 is nearly hopeless against a Pony at his "home" of altitudes greater than 15k.

But in AH, everybody ends up on the deck, or dying on the way to it... Beware the LA7
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: MachFly on March 26, 2011, 08:01:41 PM: What has a tighter turn rate at the deck, 5K, and 10K with flaps and without La-7 or P-51D?
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Debrody on March 27, 2011, 06:34:54 AM: La-7 turns much tighter all the way up to 20k. No chance for the pony. The p51 only excels at scenario altitudes.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: gyrene81 on March 27, 2011, 09:37:28 AM: Quote from: ink on March 26, 2011, 06:43:10 PM
LA7 vs P51....equal pilots the LA will win every time :aok
only if the p-51 is willing to fight to the la-7s strengths...but then equal pilots would know better than to fight on the other's terms.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: hotard on March 27, 2011, 04:18:56 PM: The LA-7 is my favorite ride, and a rate myself better than average in one. I never, never have 2nd thoughts about mixing it with a pony, and usually it's a pretty short fight. Even 2 on 1, the LA can prevail, or at least survive. That doesn't mean I win all, or most of the time, just I wouldn't avoid that fight.

LA gets a bad rap for short range, but if you get it up to cruise and then reduce rpm's you can cruise faster than most fighters going full throttle, and greatly reduce your fuel consumption.

There are a couple of things you never want to do in an LA.
1. Turn fight with over 1/2 gas.. a heavy LA is a pig.
2. Get suckered into going too fast (unless your are running for your life). Over 500 and the stick is sitting in a bucket of cement. Get too fast on a pony's 6 and he can be on yours before you have maneuvering speed back.

Besides the advantages the pony has on the LA at altitude, it also, in my experience will out accellerate an LA diving away at any altitude.. sure the LA can catch up eventually, but it gives you time to consider plan B.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: 321BAR on March 27, 2011, 11:29:33 PM: Quote from: Debrody on March 27, 2011, 06:34:54 AM
La-7 turns much tighter all the way up to 20k. No chance for the pony. The p51 only excels at scenario altitudes.
not true. you've seen me on the deck killing and evading enemy in my 51B debrody. alot of them being lalas. fly the 51 right and it'll out do the lala, fly the lala right it'll out do the 51. simple
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: BigR on March 28, 2011, 01:35:41 AM: I almost never lose to LA7s in my 51. In fact I cant remember the last time someone got a legit 1v1 kill against me in the LA. Having said that, I do fly the LA quite a bit in base defense, and it is also a great plane. The 51 is best in the initial merge because of its flaps. If the fight drags on, the LA can gain the advantage. If the fight starts at about 5k or so, the 51 will have the advantage in a downward spiraling dogfight. If the fight starts on the deck, the mustang is going to have to act fast because once the fight gets slow, that LA can use its power to weight to go vertical where the 51 has trouble when its slow. Its pretty much the same thing 109s and Nikis can do vs the mustang in a slow dogfight. Fortunately, 99% of the pilots in the MA dont know any better, and they are so astonished a mustang merged with them in the first place, they usually get caught with their pants down and never recover. Equal pilots...I give the advantage to the LA, but only very slightly. It would be a good fight.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Debrody on March 28, 2011, 01:43:15 AM: Quote from: 321BAR on March 27, 2011, 11:29:33 PM
not true. you've seen me on the deck killing and evading enemy in my 51B debrody. alot of them being lalas. fly the 51 right and it'll out do the lala, fly the lala right it'll out do the 51. simple
But thats you... i was talking about average pilot vs average pilot.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: LCADolby on March 28, 2011, 05:08:47 AM: Hmm :headscratch:
Fight on the deck money's on LA7
Fight at 5k plus money's on P51
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: RoGenT on March 28, 2011, 01:58:31 PM: I've had some pretty awesome fights against LAs on the deck and up high. I usually will risk slow turnfights on the deck with them, sometimes I win, sometimes I know. Since I turned combat trim off for T/B, it seems to help. I would say out of 10 fights against LA, I've won 6. It just really depends on the pilot too. I can't remember who it was but got into a 5-7 minute fight with one on the deck, in the end though we both called it quits due to fuel. I really wish I recorded it.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Krusty on March 28, 2011, 02:05:28 PM: La-7 out runs (and chases down) the P-51. La-7 out turns it every day of the week (one of the better turning planes in the game even, while P-51 is one of the worst). La-7's massive horsepower allows better acceleration, better climb rate, better vertical manuvers.

So unless the P-51 wants to run at alts over 15k, the La-7 holds all the advantages.

Just because you kill some LAs in the MAs doesn't really mean the P-51 is better. It means those La pilots weren't. Or they were busy and you picked them. Or any number of things that may or may not be related to actual plane performance.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Karnak on March 28, 2011, 02:15:51 PM: I'll go with the La-7 at typical AH combat altitudes. I found La-7s were usually a very hard fight whereas the P-51D was an easy kill. This is from a Mosquito flier's perspective.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: dedalos on March 28, 2011, 02:26:02 PM: Quote from: Masherbrum on March 25, 2011, 07:01:43 PM
I'd take the La-7.

Yep. Even above 10K.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: perdue3 on March 28, 2011, 02:29:30 PM: Lame twittiness vs Lower alt lame twittiness
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: BigR on March 28, 2011, 03:11:39 PM: Quote from: perdue3 on March 28, 2011, 02:29:30 PM
Lame twittiness vs Lower alt lame twittiness

It takes a lot of skill to fly the 51 well in an actual fight. It is severely outclassed by the K4 in a typical MA (low alt) dogfight. So how is it a twit ride? I have seen plenty of 109s and 190s that wont come down, and wont fight. There are no twit rides, just twit pilots.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Shuffler on March 28, 2011, 03:27:20 PM: With all of the above said...... the best way to learn a plane is to fly it. If you need help, there are several trainers and many other folks that will be glad to assist.

Nothing will make you a genie in any plane without stick time. All the info in the world is no good till you practice and it becomes second nature.

I do commend you on your quest for knowledge on the planes in this game.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Debrody on March 28, 2011, 03:39:40 PM: Quote from: BigR on March 28, 2011, 03:11:39 PM
It takes a lot of skill to fly the 51 well in an actual fight. It is severely outclassed by the K4 in a typical MA (low alt) dogfight. So how is it a twit ride? I have seen plenty of 109s and 190s that wont come down, and wont fight. There are no twit rides, just twit pilots.
Sir, you are right, and i respect your skills. But youre one of the few pony pilots who can turnfight in it properly. 90% of the pony pilots just pick and run. Same with the La.
Pony can be very twitty in the picknrun role tho... it can get you from 800 when the k-4 has to be below 200. In an 1v1, the k-4 is better, but in a 10*k-4v10*pony, the k-4 has only a minor chance.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: perdue3 on March 28, 2011, 04:33:43 PM: Quote from: BigR on March 28, 2011, 03:11:39 PM
It takes a lot of skill to fly the 51 well in an actual fight. It is severely outclassed by the K4 in a typical MA (low alt) dogfight. So how is it a twit ride? I have seen plenty of 109s and 190s that wont come down, and wont fight. There are no twit rides, just twit pilots.

Doesn't matter how it CAN be flown it matters how it is generally flown. Most Ponies you see in MA are high above the fight BnZing which is twitty. Just like Twitfires, they can be flown invincibly by good sticks but the fact is most of the Twitfires in MA are flown by skilless twits. La's are the same way, only difference is they are usually not very high but they generally run from a fight just to come back and gang and/or HO. Therefore, lame twittiness vs low alt lame twittiness.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Ardy123 on March 28, 2011, 04:36:40 PM: Quote from: Debrody on March 28, 2011, 03:39:40 PM
Sir, you are right, and i respect your skills. But youre one of the few pony pilots who can turnfight in it properly. 90% of the pony pilots just pick and run. Same with the La.
Pony can be very twitty in the picknrun role tho... it can get you from 800 when the k-4 has to be below 200. In an 1v1, the k-4 is better, but in a 10*k-4v10*pony, the k-4 has only a minor chance.

k4 is a little faster than a p51D so the trick is to drag it out and get co-e, even in a 10v10. After that, you have to put the p51 in a situation where it has to turn to avoid loss of position. Once this occurs, its only a matter of time before the p51 dies.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: ink on March 28, 2011, 04:56:49 PM: Quote from: perdue3 on March 28, 2011, 04:33:43 PM
Doesn't matter how it CAN be flown it matters how it is generally flown. Most Ponies you see in MA are high above the fight BnZing which is twitty. Just like Twitfires, they can be flown invincibly by good sticks but the fact is most of the Twitfires in MA are flown by skilless twits. La's are the same way, only difference is they are usually not very high but they generally run from a fight just to come back and gang and/or HO. Therefore, lame twittiness vs low alt lame twittiness.

so you are judging a plane by those that fly it?

one thing that bugs me is all the spit hate, brew hate, 51 hate, LA hate......ect ect.....the damn plane does NOTHING on its own, they are all awesome prop planes, its the dweeb in said plane doing the dweeby things not the plane.

I don't know why people cant except/understand this, its really quite simple.

say someone flies a P40..or hell Ill say 38 because those that fly it are dedicated to it ( for the most part) if they are a dweeb in the 38, does flying the 38 make their actions un-dweeby? I think not......if someone flies the spit 16, I dont think damn what a dweeb he is in a 16....now if all he does is face shoot and run away as soon as I get a bit of advantage...then I say damn what a dweeb...

THERE ARE NO DWEEB PLANES...JUST DWEEB PILOTS
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: 321BAR on March 28, 2011, 07:08:06 PM: Quote from: Debrody on March 28, 2011, 01:43:15 AM
But thats you... i was talking about average pilot vs average pilot.
ive been beat by "average" La pilots. in the end its all about how you fly em
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Bucky73 on March 29, 2011, 11:32:33 AM: LA-7 is easier to drive but a pony used the right way will eat it's lunch hands down. Pony anyday.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: CDR1 on March 29, 2011, 12:49:48 PM: Both these planes were built for very different missions, la's fought the German air force at low level and had the right characteristics to be ultimately the victory.
p51 was built to fly high and escort bombers. it's characteristics allowed it's missions to be expanded to many different roles. both are great planes and flown well against each other ends up being a display of pilot discipline. The winner will almost certainly be the pilot how flew to his planes strength's and avoided it's weaknesses.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: dedalos on March 29, 2011, 02:14:03 PM: Quote from: Bucky73 on March 29, 2011, 11:32:33 AM
LA-7 is easier to drive but a pony used the right way will eat it's lunch hands down. Pony anyday.

:lol I am rusty as hell, but I would love to see anyone in a pony taking my lunch if I am in a lala. And I mean in a fight. Not boring me until I am out of fuel.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Wiley on March 29, 2011, 02:46:44 PM: Quote from: dedalos on March 29, 2011, 02:14:03 PM
:lol I am rusty as hell, but I would love to see anyone in a pony taking my lunch if I am in a lala. And I mean in a fight. Not boring me until I am out of fuel.

Well, one possible definition of 'used right' would be to keep it fast, BnZ you to hell and back, without giving you a chance. I assume that's what you mean by boring you until you're out of fuel.

In a 'get down 1000 feet off the deck and turn until somebody dies' style fight, which a lot of guys seem to define all 'fights' as, I'd give the edge to the LA, mostly due to the speed with which it climbs and regains E compared to the pony. The longer the fight goes on, the more it swings in the LA's favor, IMO.

Wiley.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: hotard on March 29, 2011, 03:16:37 PM: Quote from: dedalos on March 29, 2011, 02:14:03 PM
:lol I am rusty as hell, but I would love to see anyone in a pony taking my lunch if I am in a lala. And I mean in a fight. Not boring me until I am out of fuel.

SAW BUCK ON DEDALOS AT ANY ALTITUDE !!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: dedalos on March 29, 2011, 03:20:39 PM: Quote from: Wiley on March 29, 2011, 02:46:44 PM
Well, one possible definition of 'used right' would be to keep it fast, BnZ you to hell and back, without giving you a chance. I assume that's what you mean by boring you until you're out of fuel.

In a 'get down 1000 feet off the deck and turn until somebody dies' style fight, which a lot of guys seem to define all 'fights' as, I'd give the edge to the LA, mostly due to the speed with which it climbs and regains E compared to the pony. The longer the fight goes on, the more it swings in the LA's favor, IMO.

Wiley.

Ahh, but I could use the lala to extend through every ack on the map. What exactly did he mean by eating its lunch? I would think not BnZ it to death.

So, in a fight, no matter how much we like to pump the 51 as the best fighter, all it really had was fuel and speed. I'd even take a 109, ki84, Spit, B38 you name it vs a P51. At the end, the only thing it has is speed to stay safe or run
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Krusty on March 29, 2011, 03:23:41 PM: There's a difference between fighting and running. And fighting doesn't have to be low and slow turn fighting.

A P-51D is quite capable of FIGHTING an La-7.... (not RUNNING, as you suggested), but given equal pilots, regardless of whatever moves the P-51D pull, the La-7 will generally outperform it.

Taking a pot shot and running outside of icon range is not real fighting. Thats 2-weeker territory right there :P
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Kuhn on March 29, 2011, 03:25:05 PM: La5 trumps both of em. :D
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Krusty on March 29, 2011, 03:38:00 PM: Hate to break it to ya, the La5 has the same climb rate and acceleration as the La-7... Only difference is the top-end of the envelope, the lower drag cowling of the La7 gives it a better top speed. That drag means 25mph across the board up and down, WEP or no WEP.

All other stats are almost identical.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Kuhn on March 29, 2011, 03:41:08 PM: Yeah Krusty. Leave it to you to spoil a troll. :D
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Krusty on March 29, 2011, 03:44:43 PM: Sorry, was under the impression most folks didn't realize that about the La-5.

Whoops... :bolt:
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Kuhn on March 29, 2011, 03:46:52 PM: Quote from: Krusty on March 29, 2011, 03:44:43 PM
Sorry, was under the impression most folks didn't realize that about the La-5.

Whoops... :bolt:

C'est la vie
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: SPKmes on March 29, 2011, 03:56:18 PM: Had nice little fight with sads last night...He La7, me 51D....We got down to it in a turn fight . For the most part we were ending up in the same air space after our turns (no HO's here) and from my side I still had the option to maneuver away from the head on.... our fight lasted for about 2 mins with close proximity turn fighting (max d800) near the end, with lack of airspeed and flaps 2-3 notches most of the time it got harder and harder to match the turns and when I pushed it a little to hard, stalled...basically stopped on my side and fell hahaha....From experience (a little limited) of the La7 I'm sure sads still had plenty to give at this point but my pony was a fight to keep steady and pointed.....So from my point of view...keeping the pony in a faster (not hit and run style) angles fight (Extending out to D1-1.5 it held up well against the La7....slower, still was able to but really was a struggle....and any bad move on the ponies part causes death.

This was a fight I happened upon and after this thread so took note of the fight and thought this was an ok comparison as I feel Sads, although a bit better than myself was a reasonable comparison for this particular match up.
Had this been another La7 driver I may have had to make harder/different maneuvers to avoid a facial massage but i didn't in this case.

Edit to try and fix up my grammar a bit so you guys didn't lose you breath trying to read it hahaha
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Wiley on March 29, 2011, 04:25:58 PM: Quote from: dedalos on March 29, 2011, 03:20:39 PM
Ahh, but I could use the lala to extend through every ack on the map. What exactly did he mean by eating its lunch? I would think not BnZ it to death.

So, in a fight, no matter how much we like to pump the 51 as the best fighter, all it really had was fuel and speed. I'd even take a 109, ki84, Spit, B38 you name it vs a P51. At the end, the only thing it has is speed to stay safe or run

*shrug* By 'eat its lunch' I would say he meant 'wins'. Staying safe is a 'kind' of winning. :) If you're supposing a fight where both guys are committed to killing one another rapidly, the pony is not the be-all and end-all. The LA negates the pony's advantage at low alt, so as long as the LA's got a credible BnZ defense, it's stalemate even if the pony plays it safe and starts with advantage.

Same with most of the planes you listed there. Speed controls the fight, the pony may not get you but he also isn't going to open up much room for you to attack. Again we're back to the pony is alright, if it's used lamely. ;)

Wiley.
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: 321BAR on March 29, 2011, 07:48:08 PM: Quote from: dedalos on March 29, 2011, 02:14:03 PM
:lol I am rusty as hell, but I would love to see anyone in a pony taking my lunch if I am in a lala. And I mean in a fight. Not boring me until I am out of fuel.

me and my 51B vs you in either Lala
NOW
we'll see who comes on top :aok
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: Ack-Ack on March 29, 2011, 08:57:35 PM: Quote from: 321BAR on March 29, 2011, 07:48:08 PM
me and my 51B vs you in either Lala

we'll see who comes on top :aok

I think Dedalos will be in the missionary position at all times in your duel.

ack-ack
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: ink on March 29, 2011, 09:25:55 PM: Quote from: Ack-Ack on March 29, 2011, 08:57:35 PM
I think Dedalos will be in the missionary position at all times in your duel.

ack-ack

:rofl :rofl :cry :cry :rofl
Title: Re: p51 D vs la7
Post by: PFactorDave on March 29, 2011, 09:30:25 PM: Quote from: Krusty on March 29, 2011, 03:23:41 PM

Taking a pot shot and running outside of icon range is not real fighting. Thats 2-weeker territory right there :P

Apparently HTC's business must be picking up then, there seem to be A LOT of two weekers in the MA these days! :rofl