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General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: grizz441 on January 20, 2012, 08:33:45 AM

Title: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: grizz441 on January 20, 2012, 08:33:45 AM
Just curious, and this is not intended in the least bit to be anything other than getting your 2 cents:

Would you guys be for or against having town ack and base ack stay down for a determined period of time after a capture, OR, on the same timer that the ack were on when you killed them, before they spawn up again?  In other words, would you embrace the challenge of having to temporarily defend weakened territory you just captured, or do you prefer it the way it is?  Would this additional commitment require bases be slightly easier to capture?  Or are things too easy as is?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: 4deck on January 20, 2012, 08:44:59 AM
I wanted a squad on squad duel with those characters, and thought we had it worked out to do it. Apparently a No show.

Theres my 2 cents.  Good luck with actually getting any kind of reply from a brainstem over there.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Bruv119 on January 20, 2012, 08:52:38 AM
see the aces high squad dueling forum.

For re-launch we have

TopGuns
Loose Deuce
The Few   

Need at least two more squads prepared to fight!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: mthrockmor on January 20, 2012, 08:53:05 AM
Good question. Some version of this could make for an improved fight. How many times was a hill, town, etc captured and recaptured over and over again.

Boo
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: RTHolmes on January 20, 2012, 09:01:53 AM
the Vguys dont defend bases they just took as it stands, delaying ack resupply would make them harder to defend.

that pretty much answers your question.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: grizz441 on January 20, 2012, 09:03:30 AM
the Vguys dont defend bases they just took as it stands, delaying ack resupply would make them harder to defend.

that pretty much answers your question.

Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 20, 2012, 09:15:45 AM
Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.

I figure this to be correct, they would much rather take a base quickly as possible and regroup to storm another undefended base, by the time you mount some kind of offense to reclaim the first base, they are hoping some will up to defend it - while they are on their way to target #2.

I rarely ever see them on any kind of defense, but in the case the 2nd base does fall - they will regroup fast enough to defend the first base.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Debrody on January 20, 2012, 09:21:17 AM
Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.
Honestly... yup. I dont like how they, the jokers, alchemists, nippon awsomenesses etc etc just try to avoid every contact with any enemy what can shoot back.
Heck i seen a pony rather diving from 10k and suicide in the ack rather than playing with a 190.
Remains me to a guy i knew, he was playing Diablo2 a year ago. I just friggen couldnt get it whats fun in raping a strong but extremely predictable "boss" again and again
Effectiveness über alles. Fun is somewhere else.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: wil3ur on January 20, 2012, 09:39:20 AM

Would you guys be for or against having town ack and base ack stay down for a determined period of time after a capture.


I still think that this in combination with 'active aircraft' levels for hangars at bases would make the mass and roll mentality a bit different, and definitely give a chance for defenders to have a chance at defending.  If there were as an example a maximum of 6 fighters per FH to launch, and 1 FH goes down, the base just lost ability to launch 6 fighters.  If you're upping a mission with 30 fighters from a small base...  only 18 of those fighters would get up under perfect circumstances, the rest would need to up from nearby fields.

For fighter raids, it would be a minor inconvenience... however for trying to get bomber missions together, it would require coordinating, flying around in small groups until you could mass your large formations, and actually spending time to get your horde into some sort of cohesive attack, just like they had to in real life.

Just my thoughts.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Soulyss on January 20, 2012, 10:10:01 AM
IIRC waaaaay back when the ack stayed down after the capture and at some point the change was made to the current system of instant re-spawn when the field changes hands. 
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: JUGgler on January 20, 2012, 10:26:59 AM
Excellent approach Grizz, I would submit the same question to other "base taking" squads as well. Pigs, Freebirds, WOT (not so much anymore), tg etc etc. Also input from some well known "mission planners" would be helpful like GHI, Chewie etc etc.



 :salute




JUGgler
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: waystin2 on January 20, 2012, 10:33:37 AM
Excellent approach Grizz, I would submit the same question to other "base taking" squads as well. Pigs, Freebirds, WOT (not so much anymore), tg etc etc. Also input from some well known "mission planners" would be helpful like GHI, Chewie etc etc.



 :salute




JUGgler

Well to answer on behalf of the Pigs...considering that base captures are not a primary focus, we stay and defend no matter what the ack situation may be.  We just like to scrap with whatever red guys are there or are willing to show up.  Efficiency has never been a consideration (no defense put up because the newly upped acks covers the capture, so move on to the next capture).  Of more concern is red guys to shoot at.  :aok
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: JUGgler on January 20, 2012, 10:35:32 AM
the Vguys dont defend bases they just took as it stands, delaying ack resupply would make them harder to defend.

that pretty much answers your question.


This is not so true, I think Grizz hit it on the head, efficiency! Also currently there is NO reason to stay and defend, "troops in" it's over!! Ack pops, base can be used immediately, essentially the fight is over cause there is no reason to continue it.

Also I've seen brigade boys defend plenty, some are quite good!


just saying




JUGgler
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: waystin2 on January 20, 2012, 10:48:32 AM

Also I've seen brigade boys defend plenty, some are quite good!





JUGgler

vReaper comes to mind.  Flew with me in the RAF during last scenario and he tore it up!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: AWwrgwy on January 20, 2012, 11:02:52 AM

This is not so true, I think Grizz hit it on the head, efficiency! Also currently there is NO reason to stay and defend, "troops in" it's over!! Ack pops, base can be used immediately, essentially the fight is over cause there is no reason to continue it.

Also I've seen brigade boys defend plenty, some are quite good!


just saying




JUGgler
Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.

There are what, six, eight ack to take down in town and run troops? Not much of a defense when all the hangers are still down.

You're making it sound like everything pops after they take a base. I mean, you already said they don't defend. Even with hangers up, just kill the town ack and run troops back in.

The problem is the country that just lost the base, the defenders, if any, immediately wander off and give up.

It sounds like you don't want a fight and make it easier for a base re-capture.




wrongway
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Daddkev on January 20, 2012, 12:13:35 PM
 :banana: One F-8 with Bomb and 12 rockets can de-ack and pork ords and drop radar! Quit whining people...im Naked! :neener:
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: grizz441 on January 20, 2012, 12:42:03 PM
There are what, six, eight ack to take down in town and run troops? Not much of a defense when all the hangers are still down.

You're making it sound like everything pops after they take a base. I mean, you already said they don't defend. Even with hangers up, just kill the town ack and run troops back in.

The problem is the country that just lost the base, the defenders, if any, immediately wander off and give up.

It sounds like you don't want a fight and make it easier for a base re-capture.


You sure do make it sound easy to recapture a base after it has been captured.  Let me break it down.

Lets say there are 8 town acks, that sounds right to me.  And the hangars may or may not be down.  If they are, one usually pops within 5 minutes of the capture.  It is nearly impossible to cap the base that was just captured in its "defenseless state" (quoted for sarcasm).  By the time you even get a chance to start taking a good portion of the field ack down, the hangars are up.  By the time you take down all the field ack in the town, buildings may start to pop.  Once buildings start to pop, it is a disaster to try to capture a base because you don't know what percentage the town is going to be at upon capture.  So you might say, well you should start taking more buildings down then.  Yep that's what you have to do, we have to take down a) all town ack b) destroy town buildings as they sporadically pop at any given moment c) Fend off fighters upping from a full auto acked airfield.  

Now, how many people do you think it will take to recapture a base that was just captured?  You think 3 guys can do it?  Pwah, try 8-10, which in itself could be argued to be a base taking horde.  And how long does it take to organize 8-10 guys?  And keeping that time it takes to organize a counter offensive in mind, time is of the essence!.  If you take too long, which, is likely the case, the town and base will be fully up.  You might as well start from scratch.  Typically it will take 5-10 minutes to organize 8-10 guys in a mission.  So lets say 10 minute till launch + 5 minute to get there.  That's 15 minutes right there.  Every single hangar will be up.  Every auto ack is up.  Every town ack is up.  Town building will start to pop within the next 15 minute interval at any given time.

Imo, there should be a minimum down time that a base's defense is deactivated for after captured, which is in a neutral "up for grabs" state.  The country that just captured the base can run supply goons to resupply it and cut this time down.  I'd say 20 minute down time, each supply goon takes 5 minutes off wait time.

One of the broken functions within Aces High game play (although there are many issues), is how bases change hands.  This interaction promotes, no.. "promotes" is too weak of a word, BREEDS the rolling horde mentality.  It makes little sense to stick around and defend when it only takes one or two random guys to fend off any non horde-like recapture attempt.  
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Daddkev on January 20, 2012, 12:54:40 PM
 :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: JUGgler on January 20, 2012, 12:57:51 PM
There are what, six, eight ack to take down in town and run troops? Not much of a defense when all the hangers are still down.

You're making it sound like everything pops after they take a base. I mean, you already said they don't defend. Even with hangers up, just kill the town ack and run troops back in.

The problem is the country that just lost the base, the defenders, if any, immediately wander off and give up.

It sounds like you don't want a fight and make it easier for a base re-capture.




wrongway


I agree with Grizz, it aint that easy or it would be happening at the same rate as the initial horde capture.

A "dead, unusable" base is a tasty morsel for quite a few folks, and a liability (at least in pride) for those who just captured it!

I say , dead base after capture for 20 -30 minutes, NO ack, NO hangars, NO buildings pop! Add Grizz' idea allowing the country who just captured it to mitigate the (down time) by re supplying the base to make it fully functional "quicker" <-- That is a nice touch Grizz!




JUGgler
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 20, 2012, 01:14:42 PM
I wanted a squad on squad duel with those characters, and thought we had it worked out to do it. Apparently a No show.

Theres my 2 cents.  Good luck with actually getting any kind of reply from a brainstem over there.

Who did you talk to? Because this is the 1st I've heard of it.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 20, 2012, 01:20:12 PM
I wanted a squad on squad duel with those characters, and thought we had it worked out to do it. Apparently a No show.

Theres my 2 cents.  Good luck with actually getting any kind of reply from a brainstem over there.

Who did you talk to? Because this is the 1st I've heard of it.

As far as Grizz's question goes....  It all depends.  We've taken bases and began moving on the next one only to have 2 enemy players take it back by having one deack the town while it's still flagged and the other drive in with an M3.

I'd be up for keeping the ack down if there were a way to get rearmed or replaned without getting vulched or waiting for the hangers to come back up.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: bustr on January 20, 2012, 01:26:18 PM
With maps as large as they are, defending just captured territory is a waste of time if base capturing efficiency and results are the primary focus.

I'm seeing a new factor emerging in the vBoys strategy that may reflect the fact that some of them are becoming better at personal ACM. They are not wasting time on attacks that meet emidiate strong resistance. Instead they seem to have a secondary and tertiary target plan as a fall back to divert attention and enemy resources for up to an hour to their real intent. Granted this is with their full compliment online. You are seeing vestiges of this when it's just a few of them in how they adapt to loosing in furballs.

Large maps are conducive to base capturing with no thought to defending your spoils becasue thats not an incentive by virtue of the scale. Small maps have a similar problem with scale which favors the vBoys smash and grab style becasue the reset is realy a base grab foot race.

If you want them to stick around and defend their just captureed territory. You will have to change the scale and reward system in concert with what the ultimate end game is for the effort. It has to cost as much not to defend as it does to capture while tieing it into winning the war. But, then in a sneaky way you are asking them to hang around to defend/furball in one place against superior players for an extended period of time via this kind of a change. That does not seem to be why they play this game though.

Still the base and town staying as dead as it's been pounded down to when captured for the completion of it's regeneration cycle would be a start. That would place the new owner in a precarious position if they didn't have assets in place for the defence period. This is the kind of thing the vBoys would leverage to impliment ownership flip greifing by hiding M3 in the bushes and mass suicide C47 NOE followup raids. Large maps may never get reset by players again if the current dynamics are left in place with this being the only change.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: dirtdart on January 20, 2012, 01:40:21 PM
Auto Ack should stay down for 45 minutes no matter what.  Manned Ack stays down 15 minutes, no matter what.  The rate of repair of the field and it's services are contingent on time or the receipt of supplies.  I like the idea Grizz.  +1. 

Conversely, I suspect it will slow the rate of map changes as it becomes more tedious to retain captured fields, or sustain tempo of operations.  Since I flat despise a couple of the maps, I just through that out as a consideration. 
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 20, 2012, 01:44:22 PM
I like it when the maps stay fresh.  Last night was a prime example of a stagnation map.  All momentum stops once the countries are back to their original front lines.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Ardy123 on January 20, 2012, 01:44:26 PM
Auto Ack should stay down for 45 minutes no matter what.  Manned Ack stays down 15 minutes, no matter what.  The rate of repair of the field and it's services are contingent on time or the receipt of supplies.  I like the idea Grizz.  +1. 

Conversely, I suspect it will slow the rate of map changes as it becomes more tedious to retain captured fields, or sustain tempo of operations.  Since I flat despise a couple of the maps, I just through that out as a consideration. 

I always felt that too. The timer starts on repairs, and nothing should be expedited because a base 'changed hands'.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Traveler on January 20, 2012, 01:45:56 PM
Just curious, and this is not intended in the least bit to be anything other than getting your 2 cents:

Would you guys be for or against having town ack and base ack stay down for a determined period of time after a capture, OR, on the same timer that the ack were on when you killed them, before they spawn up again?  In other words, would you embrace the challenge of having to temporarily defend weakened territory you just captured, or do you prefer it the way it is?  Would this additional commitment require bases be slightly easier to capture?  Or are things too easy as is?

This is a great question.  Speaking for the 113th Lucky Strikes.  We would like to see a shift in game dynamics.  We have always thought that a capturing army taking a base may not arrive in force with enough spare parts , engineers or gun, to bring up all the ack at each base or Town.  Perhaps in that line of thinking that only half the town ack could be replaced or repaired until re-supply.  But we also believe that the original timer on gun, building, hangers should stay in place. There should not be an additional penalty of down time because the you captured the base.


I agree with Grizz, it aint that easy or it would be happening at the same rate as the initial horde capture.

A "dead, unusable" base is a tasty morsel for quite a few folks, and a liability (at least in pride) for those who just captured it!

I say , dead base after capture for 20 -30 minutes, NO ack, NO hangars, NO buildings pop! Add Grizz' idea allowing the country who just captured it to mitigate the (down time) by re supplying the base to make it fully functional "quicker" <-- That is a nice touch Grizz!


Again the 113th would want to see the original down timers in place on each item destroyed, however, an adjustment to game play,  extend the down time of Hangers with the ability to shorten that down time by re-supply.  With the ability to shorten down time of buildings in the town by re-supply of field supplies from any field including the towns own airfield.   The newly captured Airfield could only be re-supplied as it is now with supplies from a different airfield.  Perhaps with a new resource such as Engineering Troops to rebuild.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: RTHolmes on January 20, 2012, 02:17:59 PM
You sure do make it sound easy to recapture a base after it has been captured.

if the vGuys took it, it is. roll anything with cannons, in the 4mins it takes you to get there they have all landed and moved onto the next base. they cant up to defend because the hangars they dropped will all be down for another 10mins or so, the town for another 35mins. so deack the town and wait for your M3 to arrive. 2 guys, job done. :aok

(this isnt just theory btw, coupla weeks ago me and another knit followed the NOE bish around and retook 2 bases exactly this way. could have done the 3rd too but he had to log and no one else could be bothered to roll an M3 for a capture. such is life on knits ;))
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: grizz441 on January 20, 2012, 02:32:47 PM
if the vGuys took it, it is. roll anything with cannons, in the 4mins it takes you to get there they have all landed and moved onto the next base. they cant up to defend because the hangars they dropped will all be down for another 10mins or so, the town for another 35mins. so deack the town and wait for your M3 to arrive. 2 guys, job done. :aok

(this isnt just theory btw, coupla weeks ago me and another knit followed the NOE bish around and retook 2 bases exactly this way. could have done the 3rd too but he had to log and no one else could be bothered to roll an M3 for a capture. such is life on knits ;))

I'm not saying it cannot be done if the opposing side gives the utmost negligence to the sneak attack.  But just one guy, not even associated with the rolling horde, can up and thwart a retake.  Unless of course like you said, the hangars are down, but that would require they dropped hangars and captured the base almost immediately.  Your window for opportunity for such a sneak in most applications is almost non existent.  Well done on the recapture though.  :)
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: RTHolmes on January 20, 2012, 02:41:35 PM
Well done on the recapture though.  :)

thanks, although the victory felt rather hollow because it only involved killing a few auto acks and ... well you know ;)
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: The Fugitive on January 20, 2012, 03:17:15 PM
Who did you talk to? Because this is the 1st I've heard of it.

As far as Grizz's question goes....  It all depends.  We've taken bases and began moving on the next one only to have 2 enemy players take it back by having one deack the town while it's still flagged and the other drive in with an M3.

I'd be up for keeping the ack down if there were a way to get rearmed or replaned without getting vulched or waiting for the hangers to come back up.


There is a way, don't take everything down during your attack! Yes I know this might make things a bit more difficult to get the capture, but it would make things much easier to defend. Of course you could wipe the place out like normal but then holding it would be a bit tough. Such a dilemma, and a great way to create combat!  :D
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: PFactorDave on January 20, 2012, 03:31:26 PM
What is the problem just rearming?  You don't need hangars to rearm.  Do it in shifts, to prevent the vulching.  Squads rearm in shifts during FSO and Scenarios all the time.  It would be a good skill to develop in a squad.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Guppy35 on January 20, 2012, 04:33:43 PM
Not to derail the thread, but I happened to be defending a base and a bunch of V guys showed up to help in the defense.  They did a good job.  The funny part to me was the commentary on local.  It was absolutely the same comments that go on when you are defending a base when a mob of V guys are there.  Complaints about hording, HO'ing, lack of skill etc.

The more things in this game change the more they sound the same or something like that :)
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: dirtdart on January 20, 2012, 05:12:32 PM
Corky take the v guys out of the picture. I think the idea of having to defend a captured base against a quick counterattack is intriguing.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: AWwrgwy on January 20, 2012, 05:25:53 PM

You sure do make it sound easy to recapture a base after it has been captured.  Let me break it down.

 

I agree with Grizz, it aint that easy or it would be happening at the same rate as the initial horde capture



JUGgler


The reason it doesn't happen is because no one even tries.

I tried to do it solo recently and, yes, I failed, because I could not get a single person to help.

I de-acked the town, got a goon and flew back. The town started popping but those friendlies there were busy trying to kill the fighter hangers. I landed the goon and still no one on the town. Goon killed by that lone upper you speak of.

I'd say retakes aren't for the lack of trying but they are for the lack of trying.

I managed to de-ack the town, shoot down a random BUFF, and RTB before returning with a goon.

So, the answer is for the ack to stay down after the capture? What about that single, lone defender.....?

It's toooo haaaaarrrd.  :cry

wrongway
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: grizz441 on January 20, 2012, 08:19:00 PM
Lolz, the last thing this game is is too hard for me. All I'm looking for is a logical approach to improve gameplay across the board. I've explained why changing this would, others have agreed.  Has nothing to do with things being "too hard", that is an incredibly myopic view because u once almost recaptured a base by yourself.  If you could read between the lines you would see that the intent is not to make it easier to recapture but instead to force the rolling horde to stick around and defend real estate that logically would have low defenses after being leveled.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: wil3ur on January 20, 2012, 08:36:54 PM
I'd still like to see a complete drop of everything on base upon base capture, and require a resupply, or standard respawn times for stuff to come back.  Why would I leave a bunch of ord sitting around for you to drop on me as I evacuate a base?  Why would my troops suddenly join your army just because you took my base?  Why would I leave Radar intact so you could track and kill my retreating masses?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Ardy123 on January 20, 2012, 08:42:32 PM
At one point there was some interest in adding a 'first person infantry' role to the game if I remember correctly. This could fit in nicely with having bases' auto ack take time to repair. I can just see having guys on the ground in the town protecting it from someone sneaking in with troop right after it has been captured etc... It could also add a new role to the storch plane too.

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: kilo2 on January 20, 2012, 08:59:30 PM
Lolz, the last thing this game is is too hard for me. All I'm looking for is a logical approach to improve gameplay across the board. I've explained why changing this would, others have agreed.  Has nothing to do with things being "too hard", that is an incredibly myopic view because u once almost recaptured a base by yourself.  If you could read between the lines you would see that the intent is not to make it easier to recapture but instead to force the rolling horde to stick around and defend real estate that logically would have low defenses after being leveled.

I think all that would be accomplished would be no one around after 10 minutes. Once guns pop everyone lands. Or everyone lands and goes to another base immediately. While you take the base they just left they take another somewhere else.  Nothing is gained and we have maps for ever or 1 week at a time.

I think you and others place to high a value on bases.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: RealDeal on January 20, 2012, 09:31:31 PM
Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.

I don't see much point in defending any base since you'll just be pushed back to a base that has all the same planes, tanks, and automobiles. The only appreciable difference that I know of is that the new base isn't full of holes and theres no horde overhead.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: SEseph on January 21, 2012, 02:58:51 AM
In RISK, no matter how big the horde that took the territory, someone must be left behind to hold a garrison. It should be the same way here IMO. Maybe it should be once a capture takes place, your manned ack comes up (put some functioning manned ack in the town please) and the auto ack comes up after 45 minutes like the town buildings (or with). Now, this could be accelerated by resupplying the base, but would ONLY affect the ack, not the town. Basically requiring the newly captured base to have it's guns and what not 'trucked' in.

I can't believe I'm doing this... I've seen alot of the vGuys lately being very side oriented in terms of working with the team. Be it defense, attacks, joining missions etc etc, they are not the squad we saw 6+ months ago in how they operate for the most part. Some are still really big Richard Craniums, and follow the old sentiment only, but mostly they have evolved past it. So, for the most part, these comments of them not defending or only doing a horde should really be withdrawn, as should a thread meant partly to antagonize.

Yes, I, the guy who spoke out against the method of the vGuys so passionately, have just stood up for them. It is 2012, tho, so maybe that's why the snowballs all have little horns and devil tails.  :devil
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 21, 2012, 04:04:55 AM
Seems to me the topic of this thread has changed to 

"How we should change the rules in Aces High in order to counter the Devil's Brigade?"

You still give us far too much attention as well as attribute way too much of what the bishops are doing to what the Devil's Brigade is doing.  I'm flattered but this has gotten out of hand.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: killnu on January 21, 2012, 05:37:48 AM
wow, did that above post really just happen?!?!    :O   
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: JUGgler on January 21, 2012, 11:36:44 AM
wow, did that above post really just happen?!?!    :O   


Yes it did, now get back in the game dweeb!!


We miss joo!


 :salute     :banana:



JUGgler
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Daddkev on January 21, 2012, 11:38:45 AM
 :O :OI like vGuys.....they have a cream filling that spreads over the sky nicely! :rofl :rofl :rofl
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 21, 2012, 12:08:32 PM
Seems to me the topic of this thread has changed to 

"How we should change the rules in Aces High in order to counter the Devil's Brigade?"

You mean a squad that will not face any opposition what so ever and storms undefended bases, for example If your NOE get's busted your entire raid of 20 something bails out instead of facing a handful of defenders?

Not something i'd be openly ecstatic about.


Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 21, 2012, 01:45:43 PM
NOE isn't a part of out playbook.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 21, 2012, 05:41:04 PM
something is seriously wrong with the vtards.  I have noticed that for the past 4 weeks or so (at least) then have been upping to defend the bases they took or bases that we were attacking  :salute.  what the heck is wrong with you guys, you not supposed to defend, gonna have to report all of you guys to vdallas as this is a serious breach of protocol  :uhoh.   <end sarcasm> 

but seriously it's been fun fighting instead of chasing you guys noe after noe.


semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BaldEagl on January 21, 2012, 07:12:49 PM
The return of the zone strat system along with down times remaining no matter if the base just changed hands or not would go a long way.

It should concentrate more of the base taking attempts to the zone bases and if the others are taken first they'll have extended down times as they have no supply factories.

It's really too bad HT took that away.  Now instead we have a really beutiful large city so far in the hinterlands no one ever sees it and, outside of location, all bases are strategic equals.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: DMGOD on January 21, 2012, 08:52:52 PM
Seems to me the topic of this thread has changed to 

"How we should change the rules in Aces High in order to counter the Devil's Brigade?"

You still give us far too much attention as well as attribute way too much of what the bishops are doing to what the Devil's Brigade is doing.  I'm flattered but this has gotten out of hand.


LMFAO

NOE isn't a part of out playbook.


Just because you don't make the missions you guys still participate  in a lot of the alchamists  missions which are almost all noe lanc missions.


+1 to GRIZZs idea I think that it would promote combat.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 21, 2012, 11:23:21 PM
LMFAO


Just because you don't make the missions you guys still participate  in a lot of the alchamists  missions which are almost all noe lanc missions.


+1 to GRIZZs idea I think that it would promote combat.

just curious about how would it promote combat if the ack was left down after base capture?  ack up or down wont matter if people dont want to defend they wont defend.

semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BowHTR on January 22, 2012, 12:15:15 AM
You mean a squad that will not face any opposition what so ever and storms undefended bases, for example If your NOE get's busted your entire raid of 20 something bails out instead of facing a handful of defenders?

Not something i'd be openly ecstatic about.




Log on. We just took one of the knights most defended bases. Yes it was in our territory, but it was being defended pretty well, until after about 3-4 missions of being out number. We finally had enough numbers to come back and take the base, without all hangers. Only hanger down was VH. Not trying to make it sound like we did an unbelievable take but it was a tough take.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BowHTR on January 22, 2012, 12:18:36 AM
something is seriously wrong with the vtards.  I have noticed that for the past 4 weeks or so (at least) then have been upping to defend the bases they took or bases that we were attacking  :salute.  what the heck is wrong with you guys, you not supposed to defend, gonna have to report all of you guys to vdallas as this is a serious breach of protocol  :uhoh.   <end sarcasm> 

but seriously it's been fun fighting instead of chasing you guys noe after noe.


semp

Usually if were part of a noe, there is only a few on and they are joined into one of chewies missions. We rarely ever fly a noe mission that was planned by us and has a majority of our members. But thank you for noticing that we do defend.  :salute

See ya in the skies
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 22, 2012, 12:39:18 AM
Log on. We just took one of the knights most defended bases. Yes it was in our territory, but it was being defended pretty well, until after about 3-4 missions of being out number. We finally had enough numbers to come back and take the base, without all hangers. Only hanger down was VH. Not trying to make it sound like we did an unbelievable take but it was a tough take.

you guys killed the hangars many times there.  you may have captured the base with hangars up but they were only up for a few minutes as most of the guys tried to come in from another base to defend.  in the end you guys had the numbers as we also had to defend two more bases that were being attacked, i killed both goons at 199 right after somebody else killed another one.  surprised you didnt take it faster as you had more attackers both on air and ground, I saw at least 15 gvs,  than we had defenders.  but over all it was fun.


semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BaldEagl on January 22, 2012, 09:51:52 AM
Log on. We just took one of the knights most defended bases. Yes it was in our territory, but it was being defended pretty well, until after about 3-4 missions of being out number. We finally had enough numbers to come back and take the base, without all hangers. Only hanger down was VH. Not trying to make it sound like we did an unbelievable take but it was a tough take.

you guys killed the hangars many times there.  you may have captured the base with hangars up but they were only up for a few minutes as most of the guys tried to come in from another base to defend.  in the end you guys had the numbers as we also had to defend two more bases that were being attacked, i killed both goons at 199 right after somebody else killed another one.  surprised you didnt take it faster as you had more attackers both on air and ground, I saw at least 15 gvs,  than we had defenders.  but over all it was fun.


semp

I was there last night.  semp's right.  The hangers went down several times and the Nits were flying in from other bases.  Near the end I was driving an Osti and heard Dallas say on range "Kill all the hangers" and later "All the hangers are down".  Sounds like more than the GV hanger to me plus the fact I was checking field status regularily.

Frankly I viewed it as killing the best furball on the map.  I was having fun trying out all the 40 ENY fighters in that furball last night until it was killed.  Once that base was taken I logged off.

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: wil3ur on January 22, 2012, 10:03:24 AM

Near the end I was driving an Osti and heard Dallas say on range "Kill all the hangers"

...Once that base was taken I logged off.



Unfortunately this is a problem on all sides.  There are a few people out there that get extremely upset when people are not listening to their Armchair General Orders.  Usually, there will be a very decent dogfight going on somewhere.  The General and his Joint Chiefs decide that these people won't listen because they currently have an alternative.  So they put together a horde mission, go in, drop the hangars and take the base.  Furball over, end of story.  MISSION UP!!! EVERYONE JOIN!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: DMGOD on January 22, 2012, 11:01:04 AM
just curious about how would it promote combat if the ack was left down after base capture?  ack up or down wont matter if people dont want to defend they wont defend.

semp

I think that if the base didn't "pop" as soon as it was taken and people were forced to defend till the base did regenerate, we would see a big difference in game play. As it is now they take the base and with in seconds of capture the base is a ghost town.

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Changeup on January 22, 2012, 11:13:46 AM
I think that if the base didn't "pop" as soon as it was taken and people were forced to defend till the base did regenerate, we would see a big difference in game play. As it is now they take the base and with in seconds of capture the base is a ghost town.



+2...its more immersive.  It would take days to repopulate/repair a taken airbase that was bombed into the stone age.  I'm not saying it should take days here, I'm just saying ack shouldn't pop immediately on a take.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: hotard on January 22, 2012, 12:22:55 PM
You mean a squad that will not face any opposition what so ever and storms undefended bases, for example If your NOE get's busted your entire raid of 20 something bails out instead of facing a handful of defenders?

Not something i'd be openly ecstatic about.



As usual Butcher is full of himself.. meaning he is full of poop.

If you just want a fur ball to pad your score, then by all means 1. Pick a target base 2. Climb; 3. Climb higher than your opponents; 4. Pick 5. Vulch. 6. Repeat.  Eventually your country men will show up in bombers, level things, de-ack and take the base. You've had your fun and the base is now belongs to your side.

_____________________________ ___________________________

I've never been in an NOE mission that has been "busted" where everyone has bailed. No doubt in the long history of Aces High it has happend.. I've just never witnessed it myself, and I wager I've been on more missions than Butcher. Well, for that matter anyone who has been on a mission has been on more missions than Butcher.

Alchemists; Brigade et.al Run numerous mission profiles: NOE (as noted ad nauseam), High level, hanger bangers, gv missions, ord/dar/vh kill, etc. etc. etc.

If the goal is base capture, what idiot (butcher excluded) would set out to take a quiet (read undefended) base by anouncing his intentions well in advance if it could be avoided??  


If my goal is to acquire real estate i.e. any base will do, then why would I beat myself to death on a defended target, when an undefended one waits next door?

If I think we need the base and it is defended, I will plan the mission accordingly.. guarentee it won't be NOE.

I don't like paying for the same real estate twice. If the base is in danger of re-capture I stick around to defend it and try to get enough others to do the same.

In general my goal is to be effecient. For the most part my missions capture bases with a minimum of resources.. usually ~10 joiners.  In my experience smaller missions are easier to control and coordinate. There are those  occasions when it becomes a snowball, and I end up with 30+ guys jumping in as soon as the mission is posted.. then as noted, it becomes a roll, and I'm surely not going to set around defending what we just took when we can grab another base in 5 min. You know, kinda like the rooks we doing last night when it was nits + rooks v bish..  

For those of you not into missions (butcher) I understand the fine points of mission planning escape you. In your case you are happy to tag along with your countrymen and pick and vulch till your hearts content.

Anyway as far as ack immediately regenerating after a take, or it regenerating on a timer regardless of a take.. I'd be fine changing it.. The knife cuts both ways.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: DMGOD on January 22, 2012, 01:14:32 PM
As usual Butcher is full of himself.. meaning he is full of poop.

If you just want a fur ball to pad your score, then by all means 1. Pick a target base 2. Climb; 3. Climb higher than your opponents; 4. Pick 5. Vulch. 6. Repeat.  Eventually your country men will show up in bombers, level things, de-ack and take the base. You've had your fun and the base is now belongs to your side.

_____________________________ ___________________________

I've never been in an NOE mission that has been "busted" where everyone has bailed. No doubt in the long history of Aces High it has happend.. I've just never witnessed it myself, and I wager I've been on more missions than Butcher. Well, for that matter anyone who has been on a mission has been on more missions than Butcher.

Alchemists; Brigade et.al Run numerous mission profiles: NOE (as noted ad nauseam), High level, hanger bangers, gv missions, ord/dar/vh kill, etc. etc. etc.

If the goal is base capture, what idiot (butcher excluded) would set out to take a quiet (read undefended) base by anouncing his intentions well in advance if it could be avoided??  


If my goal is to acquire real estate i.e. any base will do, then why would I beat myself to death on a defended target, when an undefended one waits next door?

If I think we need the base and it is defended, I will plan the mission accordingly.. guarentee it won't be NOE.

I don't like paying for the same real estate twice. If the base is in danger of re-capture I stick around to defend it and try to get enough others to do the same.

In general my goal is to be effecient. For the most part my missions capture bases with a minimum of resources.. usually ~10 joiners.  In my experience smaller missions are easier to control and coordinate. There are those  occasions when it becomes a snowball, and I end up with 30+ guys jumping in as soon as the mission is posted.. then as noted, it becomes a roll, and I'm surely not going to set around defending what we just took when we can grab another base in 5 min. You know, kinda like the rooks we doing last night when it was nits + rooks v bish..  

For those of you not into missions (butcher) I understand the fine points of mission planning escape you. In your case you are happy to tag along with your countrymen and pick and vulch till your hearts content.

Anyway as far as ack immediately regenerating after a take, or it regenerating on a timer regardless of a take.. I'd be fine changing it.. The knife cuts both ways.

lmfao fine points of mission planning. Man u r a hoot! such skill and talent is needed to run 30 sets of lancs noe and then carpet bomb a field. Seriously it must be hard to come up with such genius well thought out plans. Could have used you guys back in WW2
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 01:31:43 PM
lmfao fine points of mission planning. Man u r a hoot! such skill and talent is needed to run 30 sets of lancs noe and then carpet bomb a field. Seriously it must be hard to come up with such genius well thought out plans. Could have used you guys back in WW2

They pay $15 like the rest of us, if they choose to need 30 lancs to shut down a base before someone ups then its all good.
One 262 does a fine job in stopping a good portion of them, if I can't get them to fight in the air willingly then I will hunt down the horde, even though
a 262 isn't much skill involved in dropping 10 lancs - then again neither is 30 needed to drop an entire base to capture it.

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: hotard on January 22, 2012, 01:45:11 PM
lmfao fine points of mission planning. Man u r a hoot! such skill and talent is needed to run 30 sets of lancs noe and then carpet bomb a field. Seriously it must be hard to come up with such genius well thought out plans. Could have used you guys back in WW2

pfft dmjesus. You guys used to run missions if memory serves.. now what are you? A score potato.

100 lanc raids are just for the pure fun of it. Just like the Stuka raids, the val raids, the Brewster raids, so forth and so on.. All the "Leroy Jenkins" missions we run that the horde whiners conveniently overlook.

Stay with your 1D gameplay.. It suits you.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: DMGOD on January 22, 2012, 02:04:25 PM
pfft dmjesus. You guys used to run missions if memory serves.. now what are you? A score potato.

100 lanc raids are just for the pure fun of it. Just like the Stuka raids, the val raids, the Brewster raids, so forth and so on.. All the "Leroy Jenkins" missions we run that the horde whiners conveniently overlook.

Stay with your 1D gameplay.. It suits you.

(http://i1204.photobucket.com/albums/bb414/noelle1231/thomas298-1.jpg)

^ That is DMJESUS (willing to bet he'd own u in a 1v1 too)

Your memory FAILS u. DM's have never been a mission squad. A score potato? lol last thing I care about is score.
So you contradict yourself in one post you say u are about efficiency and that u run missions with ~10 people. Then in ur next post u say the missions are +100 and are for fun.

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 02:32:19 PM
(http://i1204.photobucket.com/albums/bb414/noelle1231/thomas298-1.jpg)

^ That is DMJESUS (willing to bet he'd own u in a 1v1 too)

Your memory FAILS u. DM's have never been a mission squad. A score potato? lol last thing I care about is score.
So you contradict yourself in one post you say u are about efficiency and that u run missions with ~10 people. Then in ur next post u say the missions are +100 and are for fun.



You need to caption this photo and say "WANTA TAKE IT TO THE DA PUNK?"
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 22, 2012, 02:36:28 PM
As usual Butcher is full of himself.. meaning he is full of poop.

If you just want a fur ball to pad your score, then by all means 1. Pick a target base 2. Climb; 3. Climb higher than your opponents; 4. Pick 5. Vulch. 6. Repeat.  Eventually your country men will show up in bombers, level things, de-ack and take the base. You've had your fun and the base is now belongs to your side.

_____________________________ ___________________________

I've never been in an NOE mission that has been "busted" where everyone has bailed. No doubt in the long history of Aces High it has happend.. I've just never witnessed it myself, and I wager I've been on more missions than Butcher. Well, for that matter anyone who has been on a mission has been on more missions than Butcher.

Alchemists; Brigade et.al Run numerous mission profiles: NOE (as noted ad nauseam), High level, hanger bangers, gv missions, ord/dar/vh kill, etc. etc. etc.



dood, we have all seen mission bail out when the mission gets busted many times over.  I would see at least 2 per week that we would find out and everybody would just dissapear within icon range when they saw that we had organized a defense.  a couple of times I had upped a pony to go kill ords on likely noe spawning bases and found the goons just outside dar range and the noe mission, I gave the alarm killed the goons and the mission "disappeared", anybody that has been on knights can confirm this.


semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 02:48:47 PM
dood, we have all seen mission bail out when the mission gets busted many times over.  I would see at least 2 per week that we would find out and everybody would just dissapear within icon range when they saw that we had organized a defense.  a couple of times I had upped a pony to go kill ords on likely noe spawning bases and found the goons just outside dar range and the noe mission, I gave the alarm killed the goons and the mission "disappeared", anybody that has been on knights can confirm this.


semp

It wasn't Hotard specifically that bailed on that mission, it was Devils Brigade and other alchemist - I caught a goon trying to land off A23 (island map) and called out NOE, being there are very few bases in the area - i suspected this was the next NOE, handful of knights upped and when we spotted the NOE, half turned around, and half bailed - the ones that turned around eventually just crashed out of range before anyone got any kills.

It wasn't a few 110s, it was literally a half dozen Lanc sets that augered or bailed - including the N1ks and 110s - at least 20 in all.

Basically this tells me - Devils and Alchemist do not want any opposition period, which is my reason I call it poor game play, I mean its already overwhelmingly numbers verses a few defenders, we at least had a chance and instead everyone bails?





Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Debrody on January 22, 2012, 02:51:34 PM
Quote from: hotard
If you just want a fur ball to pad your score, then by all means 1. Pick a target base 2. Climb; 3. Climb higher than your opponents; 4. Pick 5. Vulch. 6. Repeat.  Eventually your country men will show up in bombers, level things, de-ack and take the base. You've had your fun and the base is now belongs to your side.
Exactly. Thats what a lot of people doing as their daily routine. Including You.

I remember our last encounter. I was a 5k 109 being BnZed by an F4U for a while when you jumped in from 15K in your La7. I decided to run and call my (just lifting) squaddie IrishOne to "jump in" and "pick you".
Unfortunately, all 2 of ya died in 2 minutes. You accoused me of cheating, timid running, picking, calling for help, whatever. Remember that?
And after that, you have skin on your face posting stuff like that above? Or offending Butcher like that?
As usual Butcher is full of himself.. meaning he is full of poop.
lmfao, i fought that dude once, 3v3, he was in a friggen brewster near the deck and wasnt crying for help when his 2 wingmen were killed and he remained alone, just continued to fight and did well.
Get off the high horse dude, you have no rights to offend anyone.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 22, 2012, 03:36:57 PM
Just met a few members of top gun in the game.  Using 262s to hit a group of heavy jugs and ponies from a much higher altitude.  I'm not going to make any assumptions or voice any opinions.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 03:46:28 PM
Just met a few members of top gun in the game.  Using 262s to hit a group of heavy jugs and ponies from a much higher altitude.  I'm not going to make any assumptions or voice any opinions.

Were just a bunch of newbies, we only want a fight that's all :(
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: hotard on January 22, 2012, 04:01:15 PM
Exactly. Thats what a lot of people doing as their daily routine. Including You.

I remember our last encounter. I was a 5k 109 being BnZed by an F4U for a while when you jumped in from 15K in your La7. I decided to run and call my (just lifting) squaddie IrishOne to "jump in" and "pick you".
Unfortunately, all 2 of ya died in 2 minutes. You accoused me of cheating, timid running, picking, calling for help, whatever. Remember that?

no frankly I don't.  What was the cheat I was accusing you of???  Tail guns?? If it was 2 v 1 how in the world would you be a picker.. epspecially if I'm droping in from 15K???  Dude get real.

The last time I was at 15k in an LA I was afk too long on auto climb.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 22, 2012, 04:03:25 PM
Were just a bunch of newbies, we only want a fight that's all :(

I can smell that lie like a fart in the car.  We all know that noobs don't congregate in 262s and nobody flys a jet to have a even fight with prop planes.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 04:06:56 PM
I can smell that lie like a fart in the car.  We all know that noobs don't congregate in 262s and nobody flys a jet to have a even fight with prop planes.

Ok maybe less then 10% of Aces high actually take up a 262 and dogfight with it - its actually quite a nice bird to turn fight with.

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Moelders on January 22, 2012, 04:09:50 PM
Just met a few members of top gun in the game.  Using 262s to hit a group of heavy jugs and ponies from a much higher altitude.  I'm not going to make any assumptions or voice any opinions.

At start of fight (for 5+ minutes).

6x VTARD Ponies/Jugs

1x TG 262


Result 4 dead Vtards, and 3 dead non-V buffs. You may want to put all the facts into your post...

I'd love to show you the film...

EDIT: Just looked at film, edited for accuracy.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 04:12:05 PM
8x VTARD Ponies/Jugs

1x TG 262

Result 4 dead Vtards. You may want to put all the facts into your post...

I'd love to show you the film...

I really would love to see such an epic dogfight unfold, can I make some popcorn real quick?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: hotard on January 22, 2012, 04:17:41 PM
(http://i1204.photobucket.com/albums/bb414/noelle1231/thomas298-1.jpg)

^ That is DMJESUS (willing to bet he'd own u in a 1v1 too)

Your memory FAILS u. DM's have never been a mission squad. A score potato? lol last thing I care about is score.
So you contradict yourself in one post you say u are about efficiency and that u run missions with ~10 people. Then in ur next post u say the missions are +100 and are for fun.



Perhaps I should have refered to them as squad ops.

U've beaten me.. I've beaten you. Owned?? hardly.
Now Debrody in his 109.. different story... but he still needs to get over himself.
DA is for the f3 needy SA challenged.

Now carefully read the following sentences:
The base take missions I post don't have any more than 4 lanc slots. Joiners are by and large in short supply.

I have participated in the mega-lanc missions with 30+ sets.. for those missions it's all about the - dare I say it - "HORDE" There I said it.. About the spectical of 100 bombers in tight formation.. a base capture, if it happens, is just frosting on the cake.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Moelders on January 22, 2012, 04:18:35 PM
I can smell that lie like a fart in the car.  We all know that noobs don't congregate in 262s and nobody flys a jet to have a even fight with prop planes.

6vs1 more than good odds in your favor....prop plane or not. Don't make excuses.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: DMGOD on January 22, 2012, 04:20:29 PM
Perhaps I should have refered to them as squad ops.

U've beaten me.. I've beaten you. Owned?? hardly.
Now Debrody in his 109.. different story... but he still needs to get over himself.
DA is for the f3 needy SA challenged.

Now carefully read the following sentences:
The base take missions I post don't have any more than 4 lanc slots. Joiners are by and large in short supply.

I have participated in the mega-lanc missions with 30+ sets.. for those missions it's all about the - dare I say it - "HORDE" There I said it.. About the spectical of 100 bombers in tight formation.. a base capture, if it happens, is just frosting on the cake.


lol only time u ever beaten me ( and i use that term ever so loosely) was u in ur lgay and me on somebody else not paying attention
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: hotard on January 22, 2012, 04:28:07 PM
lol only time u ever beaten me ( and i use that term ever so loosely) was u in ur lgay and me on somebody else not paying attention

Well you're half right anyway.. I'm always in an LA.  :banana:
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 22, 2012, 06:41:02 PM
6vs1 more than good odds in your favor....prop plane or not. Don't make excuses.

Yoda in a 262 jumped us from high above at the beginning of the flight.  Ran off.

System and Yoda showed up in 262s at our target.  Luckily they never got low enough with us to see our troops running into their maproom.

Don't offer to show half the truth while passing it off as the full truth.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 06:50:04 PM
Yoda in a 262 jumped us from high above at the beginning of the flight.  Ran off.

System and Yoda showed up in 262s at our target.  Luckily they never got low enough with us to see our troops running into their maproom.

Don't offer to show half the truth while passing it off as the full truth.

So what you were saying, you were hording and they were stopping it? I was on earlier and heard they were in 262s. Yeah the entire area was plastured with Bishops, I was in a tank trying to stop your little horde of M3s - after 9 of you I get either bombed or killed.

So your 6 plus how many dozens of others?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 22, 2012, 08:01:32 PM
I'm just calling out your guy for pretending one thing happened while only telling 25% of the story.  I'm not saying anyone cheated, acted cowardly etc...
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 08:08:50 PM
I'm just calling out your guy for pretending one thing happened while only telling 25% of the story.  I'm not saying anyone cheated, acted cowardly etc...

Lets check the facts:

At start of fight (for 5+ minutes).

6x VTARD Ponies/Jugs

1x TG 262

- I know a second squaddie was in the area in a 262, however the base in question was completely over-ran by bishops - air and ground.

I counted at least 20 bishops on radar before it went down, I was in a tank trying to stop the horde of m3s.

Want to re-check your facts?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 22, 2012, 08:11:42 PM
I was there, 6 vtards in heavy ponies/jugs x 2 trips
1 guy on the ground.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 08:20:20 PM
I was there, 6 vtards in heavy ponies/jugs x 2 trips
1 guy on the ground.

In your squad or total?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 22, 2012, 08:24:18 PM
Total pilots in the attack group.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 22, 2012, 09:37:44 PM
Total pilots in the attack group.

must of been another base I was at then, which ever one had the horde over it. My apologies!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 23, 2012, 12:18:00 AM
I don't believe you were there either.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Debrody on January 23, 2012, 01:01:36 AM
Dont be proud for that, Yoda. I remember clearly: 50 knights trying to capture a field (called vulch) + 1 TG 262 at 15k = one AoM 262 running on the deck with 2 kills + many "Yoda" offends about how lame i am
huh? You got 4 vtards and 3 buffs in a high jet, really? haha

Come on, get over this BS. Mega-mass-horde actions are quite lame, still, youre bashing only the "vtards" while they are far from being the worst. They only want the field, in a low way (in my dictionary) tho.
I could list 5 other squadrons who are not only horde-tards but also score-potatoes in the most timid way i have ever seen.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Moelders on January 23, 2012, 06:02:54 AM
.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Moelders on January 23, 2012, 06:06:14 AM
Dont be proud for that, Yoda. I remember clearly: 50 knights trying to capture a field (called vulch) + 1 TG 262 at 15k = one AoM 262 running on the deck with 2 kills + many "Yoda" offends about how lame i am
huh? You got 4 vtards and 3 buffs in a high jet, really? haha

Come on, get over this BS. Mega-mass-horde actions are quite lame, still, youre bashing only the "vtards" while they are far from being the worst. They only want the field, in a low way (in my dictionary) tho.
I could list 5 other squadrons who are not only horde-tards but also score-potatoes in the most timid way i have ever seen.

Please show me proof of where "I offend" you; otherwise you are just talking out of your arse again as usual. And I never said I was "proud" of picking a bunch of v-guys; I just merely tried to bring some truth to his forum accusation. As I said, not much skill involved in what I did at all....but to whine and cry like a little girl about a single 262 is quite....funny.

Oh wait, sorry I take it all back--I came in a "horde" of one with vast altitude advantage....
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: RedBull1 on January 23, 2012, 06:17:05 AM
 :bolt:
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: dirtdart on January 23, 2012, 06:30:32 AM
If there was no horde, a 262 would run out of gas before it found seven kills, damaging your kills per XXX.  Enjoy the targets, why complain.  Frankly I think it is neat to see so many work together and pull it off.  If you recall, capturing a base, regardless of size, used to be possible with a rocket sherman and an M3. 

I flew in a coupe of the bish groups yesterday and found a collective effort, albeit it desynchronized because the first attempt was repelled, and pretty fun.  The fighter fights on the outside of the horde had TG, GFC, Few to name a some of the squads, and were a hoot.  Witout a horde, maps don't rotate, fight stagnates. 

IN cause' is suspect this one is getting skuzzified. 
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Moelders on January 23, 2012, 07:00:18 AM
Total pilots in the attack group.

WRONG....(see buffs that I "ran off" to). Film here: http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,327494.0.html


Let me be constructive and sprinkle some USAF Weapons School Style Debrief on this, as it should have been done from the vBob perspective:

Observations: We were torn apart by a single ME 262, vBob posted immediately afterwards on the BBS w/false information (being horded by TG 262s), the single 262 found us easily

Debrief Focus Point (DFP): WHY DID WE DIE SO EASILY TO A SINGLE 262?
- Because we did not fly as wingmen (gaggle)
  -- Because we do not train as such (Root Cause 1)
- Because we did not stagger our alts and have one High CAP
  -- Because we do not train as such
- Because the 262 found us easily
  -- Because we created a huge DAR BAR that was obviously heading to a base slowly
     --- Because our mission planning lacked in foresight (Root Cause 2)
- Because our evasive moves lacked skill
  -- Because most of us lack basic ACM skills
    --- Because we do not take the time to learn ACM (Root Cause 3)
    --- Because we do not take the time to study aircraft characteristics (Root Cause 3)

Lesson Learned #1: We will learn basic skills by initiating a training regimen that will teach us the basics of ACM, mission planning and by studying aircraft characteristics so that we do not die easily to a single 262, that we outnumber.

Lesson Learned #2: Flying in a horde/gaggle does not save you from a single 262 when basic skills lack.

DFP #2: WHY DO THEY THINK I LIED
- BECAUSE I POSTED FALSE INFORMATION ON THE BBS
 -- BECAUSE I SAID THAT TG was HORDING IN 262s

    
Just met a few members of top gun in the game.  Using 262s to hit a group of heavy jugs and ponies from a much higher altitude.  I'm not going to make any assumptions or voice any opinions.

   --- BECAUSE YODA POSTED FILM SHOWING OTHERWISE
   --- BECAUSE I WAS MAD I WAS SHOT DOWN SO EASILY
      ---- BECAUSE I LACK BASIC SKILL (SEE DFP #1)

Lesson Learned#3: I WILL NOT LACK BASIC SKILL WHICH WILL LEAD ME TO MAKE FALSE STATEMENTS ON THE BBS WHEN I GET PWNED/OWNED BY GOING TO THE TA/SEEK ADVICE FROM MORE SEASONED PILOTS AND WILL CONTINUE TO LEARN SO THAT I DO NOT HAVE TO POST FALSE INFORMATION (out of emotions) ON THE BBS THAT WILL MAKE ME LOOK LIKE A LIAR.

Due to size limitations I can't include the last part where I kill 2 more of them. Film is boring as heck; but it pretty much proves my point..Bottom Lime, you come in a horde, then you cry about a single 262 tearing it apart. What do you expect, an undefended base?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BowHTR on January 23, 2012, 08:53:31 AM
Your right, we should all bow down to all those that are greater than us. We are so lucky to even be able to fly with those that are such seasoned pilots.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Peyton on January 23, 2012, 09:33:17 AM
My Mother makes good Chicken Pot Pie and Biscuits.  Shall we round table this, eat and be merry?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Raphael on January 23, 2012, 09:40:55 AM
 :rofl
madness!
madness!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: RedBull1 on January 23, 2012, 09:41:18 AM
Listen this can all be resolved quickly and easily, watch this video.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0QY96fwTlE DONE!  :rock

.... :bolt:
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: wil3ur on January 23, 2012, 09:50:44 AM
My Daddy's stronger than your Daddy!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Slash27 on January 23, 2012, 09:50:52 AM
WRONG....(see buffs that I "ran off" to). Film here: http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,327494.0.html


Let me be constructive and sprinkle some USAF Weapons School Style Debrief on this, as it should have been done from the vBob perspective:

Observations: We were torn apart by a single ME 262, vBob posted immediately afterwards on the BBS w/false information (being horded by TG 262s), the single 262 found us easily

Debrief Focus Point (DFP): WHY DID WE DIE SO EASILY TO A SINGLE 262?
- Because we did not fly as wingmen (gaggle)
  -- Because we do not train as such (Root Cause 1)
- Because we did not stagger our alts and have one High CAP
  -- Because we do not train as such
- Because the 262 found us easily
  -- Because we created a huge DAR BAR that was obviously heading to a base slowly
     --- Because our mission planning lacked in foresight (Root Cause 2)
- Because our evasive moves lacked skill
  -- Because most of us lack basic ACM skills
    --- Because we do not take the time to learn ACM (Root Cause 3)
    --- Because we do not take the time to study aircraft characteristics (Root Cause 3)

Lesson Learned #1: We will learn basic skills by initiating a training regimen that will teach us the basics of ACM, mission planning and by studying aircraft characteristics so that we do not die easily to a single 262, that we outnumber.

Lesson Learned #2: Flying in a horde/gaggle does not save you from a single 262 when basic skills lack.

DFP #2: WHY DO THEY THINK I LIED
- BECAUSE I POSTED FALSE INFORMATION ON THE BBS
 -- BECAUSE I SAID THAT TG was HORDING IN 262s

    
   --- BECAUSE YODA POSTED FILM SHOWING OTHERWISE
   --- BECAUSE I WAS MAD I WAS SHOT DOWN SO EASILY
      ---- BECAUSE I LACK BASIC SKILL (SEE DFP #1)

Lesson Learned#3: I WILL NOT LACK BASIC SKILL WHICH WILL LEAD ME TO MAKE FALSE STATEMENTS ON THE BBS WHEN I GET PWNED/OWNED BY GOING TO THE TA/SEEK ADVICE FROM MORE SEASONED PILOTS AND WILL CONTINUE TO LEARN SO THAT I DO NOT HAVE TO POST FALSE INFORMATION (out of emotions) ON THE BBS THAT WILL MAKE ME LOOK LIKE A LIAR.

Due to size limitations I can't include the last part where I kill 2 more of them. Film is boring as heck; but it pretty much proves my point..Bottom Lime, you come in a horde, then you cry about a single 262 tearing it apart. What do you expect, an undefended base?
Why am I in the mood for pizza now?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Dead Man Flying on January 23, 2012, 10:06:00 AM
Your right, we should all bow down to all those that are greater than us. We are so lucky to even be able to fly with those that are such seasoned pilots.

By your sig's admission, you've been playing since Tour 35.  How are you not a seasoned pilot yet?  What have you done to improve yourself in the game?  Why so defensive?

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BowHTR on January 23, 2012, 10:14:46 AM
By your sig's admission, you've been playing since Tour 35.  How are you not a seasoned pilot yet?  What have you done to improve yourself in the game?  Why do defensive?



I have been flying in AH since tour 35. What exactly is a "seasoned pilot". If it is someone that has been around for awhile, then yes, i think i would be. If it is someone that must prove to everyone else how great they are and how much skill they have and how others dont have skill, then no, i am not a "seasoned pilot". I don't think you should have to prove yourself worthy to be consider one. But others of the forum see otherwise. So no, i am not a "seasoned pilot".

Defensive? Maybe because we constantly get attacked on these boards, and blamed for no skilled horders that are not good for game play because we don't play the game as others want us to play. We take bases. We don't furball. If you don't wanna loose a base and you want to furball, go to the DA.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: wil3ur on January 23, 2012, 10:22:17 AM
I've been marinading for 3 days, if that counts....


What exactly is a "seasoned pilot"?

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 23, 2012, 10:45:44 AM
6 planes is a horde now?

Regardless we took 2 trips and ended up getting the airfield.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Moelders on January 23, 2012, 10:47:17 AM
Your right, we should all bow down to all those that are greater than us. We are so lucky to even be able to fly with those that are such seasoned pilots.

Not the point.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 23, 2012, 10:59:36 AM
I have been flying in AH since tour 35. What exactly is a "seasoned pilot". If it is someone that has been around for awhile, then yes, i think i would be. If it is someone that must prove to everyone else how great they are and how much skill they have and how others dont have skill, then no, i am not a "seasoned pilot". I don't think you should have to prove yourself worthy to be consider one. But others of the forum see otherwise. So no, i am not a "seasoned pilot".

Defensive? Maybe because we constantly get attacked on these boards, and blamed for no skilled horders that are not good for game play because we don't play the game as others want us to play. We take bases. We don't furball. If you don't wanna loose a base and you want to furball, go to the DA.

So your point is simple - You don't care to learn the game, or the history - but rather have fun hording bases with overwhelming numbers and avoid any fight you get into?

Question, why not just play world of warcraft instead? Were trying to promote combat and people to learn the game - not have to stick to flying in a horde until they quit playing because "there isn't anything else to do" or in most cases as I've seen - nobody has taught them ACM to fly otherwise.

Believe it not I ran into quite a few vGuys that decided that hording a base isn't much fun after the first month, that or most don't want to login for an hour a day just to "pork ords".

I guess its each to his own, you can spend your $15 how you want, I won't be surprised when one day you get tired of it and want to expand on the game. Just beware, Dallas has been known to zap his own squadies that don't follow the rest of the lemmings.


Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 23, 2012, 11:08:11 AM
zap?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: SunBat on January 23, 2012, 12:08:04 PM
go to the DA.

How 'bout you go to Midwar or Early war where you can find others of your ilk? 
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Dead Man Flying on January 23, 2012, 12:49:57 PM
I have been flying in AH since tour 35. What exactly is a "seasoned pilot". If it is someone that has been around for awhile, then yes, i think i would be.

That would be my definition, and you would qualify for it.  I asked the question because someone who's been around for that long should even, by accident, have had substantial amounts of air combat experience.  I'd expect a person flying for almost a decade to have a basic understanding and be able to handle himself competently in a fight.  I suspect you can FWIW, even if you choose not to.

Quote
If it is someone that must prove to everyone else how great they are and how much skill they have and how others dont have skill, then no, i am not a "seasoned pilot". I don't think you should have to prove yourself worthy to be consider one. But others of the forum see otherwise. So no, i am not a "seasoned pilot".

No, that's not my definition.  My point is that you and others in this thread play an entirely different game.  You're getting defensive because they won't acknowledge the legitimacy of their play style, while at the same time you brush them off and tell them to go to the DA.  Do you really care what the Muppets or Top Gun have to say about the game you play?  If not, then why even bother defending it to them?  It's almost like two people arguing about the greatness of chess versus checkers.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Raphael on January 23, 2012, 12:51:13 PM
you squad guys are scarier then soccer hooligans
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Butcher on January 23, 2012, 01:00:52 PM
That would be my definition, and you would qualify for it.  I asked the question because someone who's been around for that long should even, by accident, have had substantial amounts of air combat experience.  I'd expect a person flying for almost a decade to have a basic understanding and be able to handle himself competently in a fight.  I suspect you can FWIW, even if you choose not to.

No, that's not my definition.  My point is that you and others in this thread play an entirely different game.  You're getting defensive because they won't acknowledge the legitimacy of their play style, while at the same time you brush them off and tell them to go to the DA.  Do you really care what the Muppets or Top Gun have to say about the game you play?  If not, then why even bother defending it to them?  It's almost like two people arguing about the greatness of chess versus checkers.

pfffffft everyone knows chess beats checkers.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BowHTR on January 23, 2012, 01:01:58 PM
That would be my definition, and you would qualify for it.  I asked the question because someone who's been around for that long should even, by accident, have had substantial amounts of air combat experience.  I'd expect a person flying for almost a decade to have a basic understanding and be able to handle himself competently in a fight.  I suspect you can FWIW, even if you choose not to.

No, that's not my definition.  My point is that you and others in this thread play an entirely different game.  You're getting defensive because they won't acknowledge the legitimacy of their play style, while at the same time you brush them off and tell them to go to the DA.  Do you really care what the Muppets or Top Gun have to say about the game you play?  If not, then why even bother defending it to them?  It's almost like two people arguing about the greatness of chess versus checkers.

Checkers are for the unskilled.

Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: JOACH1M on January 23, 2012, 02:39:16 PM
We take bases. We don't furball.
Here is your answer... :airplane:
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: mechanic on January 23, 2012, 03:32:55 PM
I asked the question because someone who's been around for that long should even, by accident, have had substantial amounts of air combat experience. 

 :lol


I think the idea of the ack staying down is good for one reason. I hate it when I fly from an adjacent base to my horde infested base with the idea of defending only to lose the base just as I get there and see ten enemies immediately dive down and land never to return. Without the insta-ack I could have vulched half of them and maybe they would be forced to fight.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: SectorNine50 on January 23, 2012, 05:27:24 PM
Why do we care so much what other people do again?

I'm starting to wonder if losing a base or seven to a horde is even that big of a problem.  Big whoop, the map changes... :headscratch:

Is it really believed that hordes ruin the game?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: 68ZooM on January 23, 2012, 05:35:55 PM
Checkers are for the unskilled.



Hoards are for the unskilled.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: SunBat on January 23, 2012, 05:42:10 PM
:lol


I think the idea of the ack staying down is good for one reason. I hate it when I fly from an adjacent base to my horde infested base with the idea of defending only to lose the base just as I get there and see ten enemies immediately dive down and land never to return. Without the insta-ack I could have vulched half of them and maybe they would be forced to fight.

Plus a bunch
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: SunBat on January 23, 2012, 05:52:28 PM
|\_/\/|_/\/|
|             |
|             |
|             |
\            /
  \        /
    \    /
     |. |
     |. |
    [__]

Btw, I'll cut chu fools with my broken bottle.

Just sayin'....
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Changeup on January 23, 2012, 06:17:36 PM
|\_/\/|_/\/|
|             |
|             |
|             |
\            /
  \        /
    \    /
     |. |
     |. |
    [__]

Btw, I'll cut chu fools with my broken bottle.

Just sayin'....

A philosopher AND an arteest!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Babalonian on January 23, 2012, 07:47:49 PM
Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.

Sure there is, one plane can de-ack and retake an otherwise already destroyed town.  I did it myself a couple times this weekend at A199....  that map is still up, ain't it?  :devil
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Shane on January 23, 2012, 09:35:17 PM
Sure there is, one plane can de-ack and retake an otherwise already destroyed town.  I did it myself a couple times this weekend at A199....  that map is still up, ain't it?  :devil

I think a base could even be taken with 8 players max. 3 to cap base, 3 to whack town, 1 goon/m3 and one cover for goon/m3.  I think there's a wish I haven't really seen - mission caps?  Too many ways around it I suppose.

In any case, any base ops with more than 20 poepl... err lemmings... is way overkill imho. I see no sense of strategy (or tactics for that matter)... I can recall when there would be interdiction missions toward nearby bases (also prepping them for the next assault) and you would see goons getting better escorting (now I rarely see a goon properly escorted - merely flying under the lemming trail.) Neither do I really see buffs being escorted properly (if at all.)

What I now see more of, that makes me :oldrolleyes are two things I kind of  :headscratch:  at:

1. So many "jabo" being run right off base at the closest enemy vehicle spawn
2. picking the aforementioned jabos, often in range of ack/gv fire

In the top ten most used (deaths + kills) vehicles... 6-7 are gv.

The game dynamic is shifting, and I think in a positive way, as HTC seems to be working towards separating the air/ground combat from the whack a mole it is now, to something more planes vs planes, gv/fps vs same, with planes going after them with somewhat less "clarity" - and accuracy (we're way too proficient at bombing, dive or level on small targets. low-level carpet bombing will become much more difficult, as well.)  What would be helpful, would be newer maps where the airfield isn't so much a target unto itself, as opposed to some other target (town or factory or whatever) that isn't quite so close to the airfield. Toss in some of the "should also defend a capture" ideas and things look pretty interesting.

We'll see.


Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BowHTR on January 23, 2012, 09:56:26 PM
Hoards are for the unskilled.

Isn't a horde also a mission or a squad flying together?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 23, 2012, 10:36:02 PM
Hordes can be defined as a true 100% bona fide horde by any single horde metric in the aces high measurement system.  Basically any member of the community is free to declare horde at any time, towards any group of one or more players.

The argument that follows on the BBS is just a bonus.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BaldEagl on January 23, 2012, 10:40:39 PM
someone who's been around for that long should even, by accident, have had substantial amounts of air combat experience.  I'd expect a person flying for almost a decade to have a basic understanding and be able to handle himself competently in a fight. 

 :O   :cry
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Daddkev on January 23, 2012, 10:47:34 PM
 :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 24, 2012, 12:09:47 AM
I think a base could even be taken with 8 players max. 3 to cap base, 3 to whack town, 1 goon/m3 and one cover for goon/m3.  I think there's a wish I haven't really seen - mission caps?  Too many ways around it I suppose.

In any case, any base ops with more than 20 poepl... err lemmings... is way overkill imho. I see no sense of strategy (or tactics for that matter)... I can recall when there would be interdiction missions toward nearby bases (also prepping them for the next assault) and you would see goons getting better escorting (now I rarely see a goon properly escorted - merely flying under the lemming trail.) Neither do I really see buffs being escorted properly (if at all.)

What I now see more of, that makes me :oldrolleyes are two things I kind of  :headscratch:  at:

1. So many "jabo" being run right off base at the closest enemy vehicle spawn
2. picking the aforementioned jabos, often in range of ack/gv fire

In the top ten most used (deaths + kills) vehicles... 6-7 are gv.

The game dynamic is shifting, and I think in a positive way, as HTC seems to be working towards separating the air/ground combat from the whack a mole it is now, to something more planes vs planes, gv/fps vs same, with planes going after them with somewhat less "clarity" - and accuracy (we're way too proficient at bombing, dive or level on small targets. low-level carpet bombing will become much more difficult, as well.)  What would be helpful, would be newer maps where the airfield isn't so much a target unto itself, as opposed to some other target (town or factory or whatever) that isn't quite so close to the airfield. Toss in some of the "should also defend a capture" ideas and things look pretty interesting.

We'll see.




a town can be taken with only one person.  1 trip with lancs, 1trip with rockets/cannons fighter to take down any ack left, 1 trip to bring goons.  piece of cake.  3 trips and you can capture a base.  do that 20 times and you can capture the whole map by yourself.

damn wonder why nobody thought of it before  :uhoh.


semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Changeup on January 24, 2012, 12:29:20 AM
Isn't a horde also a mission or a squad flying together?

Only if they have the same colored panties on...if not, they are just a lot of guys upping at the same time
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Beefcake on January 24, 2012, 02:31:44 AM
*sets out his lawn chair and start munching on popcorn*
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: JUGgler on January 24, 2012, 08:42:38 AM
a town can be taken with only one person.  1 trip with lancs, 1trip with rockets/cannons fighter to take down any ack left, 1 trip to bring goons.  piece of cake.  3 trips and you can capture a base.  do that 20 times and you can capture the whole map by yourself.

damn wonder why nobody thought of it before  :uhoh.


semp


I'm sure this happens in the EW and MW and maybe, just maybe during OFF hours on large maps in the LW, but this would be extremely rare if not impossible during primetime. I submit what you say here is bunk and only by the most rare flukes could and does it happen!




JUGgler
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: BowHTR on January 24, 2012, 02:42:14 PM
Only if they have the same colored panties on...if not, they are just a lot of guys upping at the same time

ok, thanks for clearing it up!  :aok :salute
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 24, 2012, 02:57:37 PM

I'm sure this happens in the EW and MW and maybe, just maybe during OFF hours on large maps in the LW, but this would be extremely rare if not impossible during primetime. I submit what you say here is bunk and only by the most rare flukes could and does it happen!




JUGgler

oh man juggler i was just being sarcastic  :D.  was just making fun of the idea that only 8 people are needed to take a base.  both are doable but highly improbable  as if 2 or 3 defenders up the base take has a high chance of a fail.

there's times when a base can be taken with just a handful of people and there are others when you can bring 100 and you wont take the base.  it all depends on how much the enemy wants to defend the base.


semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: The Fugitive on January 24, 2012, 03:48:19 PM
oh man juggler i was just being sarcastic  :D.  was just making fun of the idea that only 8 people are needed to take a base.  both are doable but highly improbable  as if 2 or 3 defenders up the base take has a high chance of a fail.

there's times when a base can be taken with just a handful of people and there are others when you can bring 100 and you wont take the base.  it all depends on how much the enemy wants to defend the base.


semp

That's another thing that drives me a bit nuts, what's wrong with failing? It's not like you will be hung or something, jailed and fed bread and water, it's not the end of the world.

There is nothing wrong in failing. If you remove ALL of the challenges so that you can't possibly fail, WHY PLAY?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Wiley on January 24, 2012, 03:52:14 PM
That's another thing that drives me a bit nuts, what's wrong with failing? It's not like you will be hung or something, jailed and fed bread and water, it's not the end of the world.

There is nothing wrong in failing. If you remove ALL of the challenges so that you can't possibly fail, WHY PLAY?

Because you get to win.

Wiley.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Ardy123 on January 24, 2012, 03:57:14 PM
Because you get to win.

Wiley.

Well thats what offline is for.. you can win all by yourself!
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Wiley on January 24, 2012, 04:38:07 PM
Well thats what offline is for.. you can win all by yourself!

Hey, I never said I agreed with it, but that seems to be the motivating factor.

I believe it stems from the way the rest of gaming has gone.  When was the last time you saw a game where there was a goal you could not complete if your threshold for boredom was high enough?  Video games have moved away from something you play with a chance of losing that requires skill to complete to something you consume, like a movie.  There is an implicit understanding when people play a video game these days that they will be able to see and do everything in the game.

It seems to me most gamers have grown used to this, and when they encounter an unlimited PvP game, such as this one, suddenly they run into unwinnable situations.  Often times things in this game are simply not fair.  That really kinks a lot of peoples' tails, and you can see it in the whines about gangs, hording, NOEs, HOing better than you, and soforth on 200 and in here.

Most people want a little bit of resistance from their opponents, but resistance that they can overcome and ultimately prevail in their inexorable march to 'winning' however they've defined it.

People who are looking for a challenge, going into situations with 50/50 chances of winning are a vast minority these days.  It is my sneaking suspicion they were a minority in the old days too, but there were enough of them to entertain one another.  I wasn't there, can't say for sure.

Wiley.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 24, 2012, 05:33:03 PM
That's another thing that drives me a bit nuts, what's wrong with failing? It's not like you will be hung or something, jailed and fed bread and water, it's not the end of the world.

There is nothing wrong in failing. If you remove ALL of the challenges so that you can't possibly fail, WHY PLAY?

the question was about base taking.   And last I checked there wasn't any failure in ah.  Actually there isn't any wining either.   It's a game and you play it to have fun.   Making it about anything else is a failure in itself.



Semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: SectorNine50 on January 24, 2012, 05:36:18 PM
the question was about base taking.   And last I checked there wasn't any failure in ah.  Actually there isn't any wining either.   It's a game and you play it to have fun.   Making it about anything else is a failure in itself.



Semp

The game has all sorts of situations you can win in!

You can win the "war," and reset the map.
You can win a dogfight.
You can win a base.
You can win a tank battle.

All of these flip-side into failures as well.  Just because you can't "beat the game" doesn't mean that there is no winning or losing.  If there was no competition, why would you play?
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 24, 2012, 08:28:34 PM
The game has all sorts of situations you can win in!

You can win the "war," and reset the map.
You can win a dogfight.
You can win a base.
You can win a tank battle.

All of these flip-side into failures as well.  Just because you can't "beat the game" doesn't mean that there is no winning or losing.  If there was no competition, why would you play?

WRONG!!!  I get a score of 14.99 every month!!!  I probably have the most consistent score in the game.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 24, 2012, 09:19:16 PM
The game has all sorts of situations you can win in!

You can win the "war," and reset the map.
You can win a dogfight.
You can win a base.
You can win a tank battle.

All of these flip-side into failures as well.  Just because you can't "beat the game" doesn't mean that there is no winning or losing.  If there was no competition, why would you play?

win exactly what.

Semp
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: The Fugitive on January 24, 2012, 09:42:45 PM
The game has all sorts of situations you can win in!

You can win the "war," and reset the map.
You can win a dogfight.
You can win a base.
You can win a tank battle.

All of these flip-side into failures as well.  Just because you can't "beat the game" doesn't mean that there is no winning or losing.  If there was no competition, why would you play?

win exactly what.

Semp

I think he spelled it out pretty well. With those "wins" there must be the ability to lose as well.
 
Player hordes have removed the chance, almost completely of not capturing the base winning a dog fight (gang), winning a GV battle (dive bombing lancs), and of course this means they roll on through the "win the war" scenario as well. If that is the case, why bother? Might as well just have every one log one and one night a week one team get a capture for the other teams automatically every 5 minutes. This way they can win the war each night and get their perks and don't even have to fly. Sounds like fun !
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: JUGgler on January 25, 2012, 06:06:36 PM
oh man juggler i was just being sarcastic  :D.  was just making fun of the idea that only 8 people are needed to take a base.  both are doable but highly improbable  as if 2 or 3 defenders up the base take has a high chance of a fail.

there's times when a base can be taken with just a handful of people and there are others when you can bring 100 and you wont take the base.  it all depends on how much the enemy wants to defend the base.


semp


My bad


 :salute
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Ardy123 on January 25, 2012, 06:58:42 PM
Player hordes have removed the chance, almost completely of not capturing the base winning a dog fight (gang), winning a GV battle (dive bombing lancs), and of course this means they roll on through the "win the war" scenario as well.

Its simpler that that... They (all horde squads) are a bunch of pvssies who are afraid of taking any risk of cartoon death but want to feel the 'high' of winning. They just haven't figured out that the 'high' is much better when you've invested some effort & taken risk.

Time to quit drinking the wine coolers kiddo, and move to whiskey.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Coronado on January 25, 2012, 07:49:16 PM
Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.
Easy to be efficient when you have the other country out numbered by 30/40 and you have that many in a mission. (just my 2c)
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Rob52240 on January 25, 2012, 08:28:05 PM
Easy to be efficient when you have the other country out numbered by 30/40 and you have that many in a mission. (just my 2c)

The enemy of my enemy is not my friend, but he may not be messing with me so much while I'm attacking the other enemy sometimes.
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: Coronado on January 26, 2012, 01:06:40 AM
Not necessarily.  I see the vguys just being "efficient".  There is no incentive to stick around to defend a base that defends itself the instant you capture it.
Easy to be efficient when you have the other country out numbered by 30/40 and you have that many in a mission. (just my 2c)
Title: Re: Question for VBrigade guys
Post by: guncrasher on January 26, 2012, 01:13:56 AM

My bad


 :salute

 :salute

semp