This is Battle Over Germany, but with another name. :headscratch: MORE GVS, MORE :mad: :mad:http://ahevents.org/events/scenarios/previous-scenarios/49-european-theatre/870-der-grosse-schlag-07.html
http://ahevents.org/events/scenarios/previous-scenarios/49-european-theatre/870-der-grosse-schlag-07.html
If anything, BoG was a partial remake of DGS.
hopefully this one will be even better
I feel...like I've been here before. :D
I'm not a good fighter pilot, but I want to fly Axis. That's a bit of an issue to debate in my head.
The bombers will be escorted! :)
That is a rarity these days. :p
Last time I flew B-24s, and as I remember they were a bit heroic...as in bravely blast through to score points before turning into scrap. :D I'm curious about the other side's experience and not sure I want to put forth the effort of GLing bombers in such a coordinated style. I'm more used to the unescorted-ninja style. But, then again, there's a long time to decide.
That all depends on who you're talking to. :)
It's a lot more fun to break through than say, "well, there's enemies over there, guess we better go home."
Bomber Alt cap 26k, no 262s, no fighter alt cap.. 24+ targets, 3 minimum per frame must be hit.
That begs the question: Why? Why higher alt caps? Bombers in these scenarios fly 1 inch under cap every time. In the real war you'd have almost a thousand bombers, most of them lower. These 26k bombers were more rare, and when they were unreachable the 200-mile-long chain of bombers below that were then targetted.
The only plane that had a chance of catching the bombers before they RTBed most times in BOG was the 262. Here we have near-max speeds. Historically they were quite interceptable. There's a big difference. Even in BOG with fighter alt caps we had allies constantly breaking it by large margins sometimes. With the current modeling (no cold fatique, no hard flying conditions, instant air spawns spitting allied fighters out at 30k) it simply stacks odds in the allied favor.
99.999% of the time German fighters were slaughtered in BOG by higher planes in superior numbers. It was rather awful at times.
Not sure why you'd want to make that.... even worse?
P.S. I will say this: Let them have no alt cap if they climb there themselves. No air spawns for allied fighters. The top echelon of LW planes in this game can barely bank at 30K without losing 1000ft in the process. All the allied ones can cruise at 40k without problem.
That begs the question: Why? Why higher alt caps? Bombers in these scenarios fly 1 inch under cap every time. In the real war you'd have almost a thousand bombers, most of them lower. These 26k bombers were more rare, and when they were unreachable the 200-mile-long chain of bombers below that were then targetted.
The only plane that had a chance of catching the bombers before they RTBed most times in BOG was the 262. Here we have near-max speeds. Historically they were quite interceptable. There's a big difference. Even in BOG with fighter alt caps we had allies constantly breaking it by large margins sometimes. With the current modeling (no cold fatique, no hard flying conditions, instant air spawns spitting allied fighters out at 30k) it simply stacks odds in the allied favor.
99.999% of the time German fighters were slaughtered in BOG by higher planes in superior numbers. It was rather awful at times.
Not sure why you'd want to make that.... even worse?
P.S. I will say this: Let them have no alt cap if they climb there themselves. No air spawns for allied fighters. The top echelon of LW planes in this game can barely bank at 30K without losing 1000ft in the process. All the allied ones can cruise at 40k without problem.
99.999% of the time German fighters were slaughtered in BOG by higher planes in superior numbers. It was rather awful at times.
Not sure why you'd want to make that.... even worse?
Further, the multitude of P-47s were not flying around with fake double-capacity ammo belts like AH has. To carry any load under the wings this wasn't even possible, let alone ever done. Any load, like say DTs. Try having all the P-47s fly with historic 267rpg ammo loads. It changes the dynamics... No longer can they just horde-spam sectors racking up kills. Let's face it that is always a main tactic in these types of setups. If they do that with 267 rpg they'll be out of ammo and the bombers are toast.
Boy that suuure ain't how I remember it. The overriding memory for me had to do with the bombers getting pulverized, and us escorts only being able to hold off the Luftwaffe for so long.
That is my memory of flying Allied in BOG as well. Scratching my head here seriously Krusty... :headscratch:
Dear GOD Krusty..
I can attest to MEETING LW fighters in BOG at my alt or HIGHER every damn frame. If anyone got hit by higher Allied fighters it was after the initial sortie. If they were slaughtered I commend your AAA gunners which seemed to do an effective job of wiping out the bombers.
Bombers in DGS didn't fly 1 inch under the Alt Cap.. and they won't here either.. every time like you stated. Also I have previously refuted your 100% power complaint from DGS and I am not going to go through that all over, you can look it up if the search engine will allow it..
As to climbing without air spawns, you were one of the most complaining when we ran this originally about the hour wait for the Allies to get to alt, get into formation and start moving. We cannot do that this time as the maps distances disallow it.. as does the lack of patience from the LW to sit in the tower for an hour waiting.. of course we got accused of running the LW outta gas last time, in fact I think YOU were arguing that the Allies would only take 25% in DGS which had us in stitches.
I just realized that the forum does not have a "SQUELCH" command! :lol
If you would like to know why I am not concerned about the alt, you need to join up and get involved, I won't be explaining it to you out here, as that would give up strategy.
Don't listen to him, it's not because of strategy... It's because we don't want the Allies to quit early. :ahand
Fencer, I can attest that every bomber in DGS in every frame was as high as it could get unless it was diving away at 300+ mph to run home after dropping. Every one I encountered, that is. I was attacking bombers every frame. Aside from a first-encounter attack run you couldn't chase them. Even with real time coordination, lone fighters tailing the formations and vectoring others in, you could never catch them unless you were in position already.
We may have shot a number of bombers down, but by god we paid for it. Almost every first-encounter was a massive black eye for us. Much of our successes were second lives and the few that limped back to base to replane, etc. Even then we wasted hours chasing cons and reports and if the bombers weren't flying towards us they got away most of the time. From memory I recall the actual bomber attackers could never catch the bomber stream -- it was actually the fighter patrols that were meant to go after escorts that ended up killing more than we did. We had a saturation going on to sweep and screen fighters and as the bombers moved on they ran into more fighter squads already in front of them. We whittled away at them, but only by being in their path most of the time. Even when I was lucky to be chosen as a 262 pilot we wasted much time chasing bombers across the map and had limited success before they passed the "do not pass" line on their rtb. I believe my 262 run netted more fighter kills than bomber kills.
you do understand WHY we shipped you to the Luftwaffe don't you Seph? You are the Allies secret weapon! :)
I am strongly considering flying a jug this one.
I am strongly considering flying a jug this one.
Group Leaders have already been chosen by the CO's?
You've been demoted to 1/8th KN member status. Put an iron cross in your BBS avatar and Perd'll probably kick you upto 3/4ths member status.
Kinda figured you were already working with the Axis guys StampfIt's tough getting old, Dan. I guess I missed the box to drop my resume into.
I know Morf wants to fly it.A good man. And already has taxi clearance from Frau Morf too.
I tried to talk him into a Mustang but he goes where you go I thinkMy boys are weird like that.
PMs stampf, JG11 is sitting vacant waiting for you to claim it.
cc.
and...
It's going to be another very sexy time...
(http://www.gyges.dk/Fw%20190%20JG%2011.jpg)
Don't you want to fly an Allied bomber this time. You know you want to. Just let it out. :devil
Stampf, if a recon outfit wasn't offered to me, I would have sought a spot with JG11 this scenario. My intention was to fly Luftwaffe to change things up, but I had a great opportunity. I wish you gents the best of luck, unless you're within 3k of my recce P38. :D
Stampf! You better take JG/11.
I'll be seeing you up DGS....I'm CO of the 56th FG.
The gents of JG/11 are top notch....on the ground and off.
(BTW....the HEMI is out of the garage taking advantage of the good weather)
Stampf, sounds like we'll be flying along side you. Glad to know we have someone who knows their buisness up there.
cc.
and...
It's going to be another very sexy time...
(http://www.gyges.dk/Fw%20190%20JG%2011.jpg)
I guess I could dust off the old PSD templates here and there... Seems they might be useful again.Those were some really great images you made Krusty.
(http://i814.photobucket.com/albums/zz63/krustacious/BoG%20profiles/profile_white11_Vandals1.jpg)
(http://i814.photobucket.com/albums/zz63/krustacious/BoG%20profiles/Bf109G-6_template3.jpg)
(http://i814.photobucket.com/albums/zz63/krustacious/BoG%20profiles/profile_white13_Krusty1.jpg)
Hello gents, am I missing something? Is registration open for this scenario? I logged into register and can see the event write up but the registration link isn't showing it's open yet on my end.
Boo: Glad you liked it! I shared that with JG54's CO but I fear it came too late. One thing I regretted was not thinking of the idea sooner, and doing it more thoroughly. By the time BoG was almost over I was wishing I'd done a bigger series and covered both teams.
Shifty: Thanks! I'm not sure how much time and effort it might take... but seeing as we have TONS of time, it is possible to make a profile for each plane type in the setup. It would require CO's coming up with a plan (i.e. I was originally planning on updating the images every frame -- that didn't happen though) and being able to work photoshop well enough. You and your boys interested in something like that?
Are people going to be assigned to one plane or will it switch up from frame to frame like BOG?
So any Ki-84, N1K2, or Ki-61 slots open?
This thing really has me thinking about getting back into AH. Wonder if I can find my joystick........
I like Mustangs just fine. Can you get me into the allied side?
Tank, what side are you flying on? I don't have you on the Axis yet, did I miss a request? Sorry if I did :frown: Lot of posts to juggle. If you are flying with us, I need to get you into the forums.
I like Mustangs just fine. Can you get me into the allied side?
Better stick with a 109....
While the Mustangs are flying staight, the jugs will be doing all the dirty work
Hear that Mustang guys? Your own team doesn't need you. Tell you what, I respect your abilities, trash those ponies and come over to where you will be appreciated... :devil
I'm agreeing with you :)
My point is we're going to do it 8th AF style, with fighters escorting the buffs. It's not the Fall of 43 with 60 bombers going down over Schweinfurt. It's the Fall of 44 and we're going deep! :)
Nothing wrong at all with flying Luftwaffe. If you do, I hope that at some point in it, when you spot the mass of bombers against the clouds and the dots that are their escorts, you imagine just for a second what it was like being a 21 year old German pilot staring down at that sight for real.
And if you fly buffs I hope that as the flak bursts around you and the call of fighters comes through your head phones, you imagine what it was like to be a 21 year old bomber commander, responsible for his crew and getting the bombs on target.
That and it's gotta be fun :)
Best I can do on short notice.
(http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s199/guppy35/DGS%20Scenario%20bits/escort.jpg)
Why does this happen in October??? it's May
Well, yes, there has to be an effort to get the other guys to fall apart lol
I'm thinking the Fence is going to break before the Rock cracks.
ALFA is just cranky cause he's on latrine duty for the 80th :)Blasphemy i say :noid
I'm thinking the Fence is going to break before the Rock cracks.
Already trying to mend Fences I see ROC
if we're supposed to be applying for spots...Please make mine a B-24 slot. i like "tail-end charlie"...fighters like to come after that spot...guarantees some gunnery practice... :salute
if we're supposed to be applying for spots...Please make mine a B-24 slot. i like "tail-end charlie"...fighters like to come after that spot...guarantees some gunnery practice... :salute
:headscratch:
OH I see what happened here, I typed that in English!! I should have used pictures :neener:
I might be able to take part in this one. I have someone taking care of my yard this year but it remains to be seen if that will extend to fall clean-up. If it does I'll play but if it doesn't I may not be able. Even if I have to do it myself I might try to make a special effort to get outside early (I'm a sleep in on the weekend kind of guy). It's a 3-4 hour a weekend job in the fall :( If I do get to play I'd hope there's a A8 spot open for me.
I might be able to take part in this one. I have someone taking care of my yard this year but it remains to be seen if that will extend to fall clean-up. If it does I'll play but if it doesn't I may not be able. Even if I have to do it myself I might try to make a special effort to get outside early (I'm a sleep in on the weekend kind of guy). It's a 3-4 hour a weekend job in the fall :( If I do get to play I'd hope there's a A8 spot open for me.
I have your FW in the hanger from last one, Bald. Only one I have left.
I'll take it. Loved flying with you in BOG. You guys made even me look good.
Time for team building, immersion, historical discussion, training.Ok ... Sounds good ... Is there an Axis Forum set up? I'll be flying for der fahdurland (who's sister do I have to marry to get a 410?) ... ?
Any room for a rusty pilot?
EVZ, I'll get you on the axis forums now. The 410s are not a given, they are a "maybe". It is likely that squad will be flying an A8. That is unless the 410 comes out and as said before, meets the expectations.
Fudgums, dude you want to fly with us? Axis has some room and would really enjoy having you.
I am looking for a Leader for the 91st
Sounds like a job for Thundregg and the 91st Ragged Irregulars.
I have been in contact with them.
You know us luft guys are only starting to be serious when we set asside points and move straight on to sheep.
We just started a betting pool on which fighter group clobbers the first 410. Naturally it will be the 364th :aok
I agree, have all your fighters go after our 410's and we'll go after you're bombers. I think that is 100% fair and am glad we could have this discussion, it makes planning so much easier! :devil
You realize you only have one sortie, correct? Not like we can't just send the 410's in a second time :neener:.
Oh, OK. I'll tell the Me-410 flyers to wait an extra 5 minutes in that case.