Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: RotBaron on December 07, 2012, 10:19:36 PM
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I used the search to look up this topic first, and I seem to have found two common trains of thought on this subject. First take it as a compliment and move on, secondly the guy is a jackwaggon, if you are not a cheater - you know you are not and move on.
I doubt I'll have a problem moving on, but would like some feedback, I'll probably gain some enemies and I apologize if proper etiquette in this post isn't adhered to. My ruffle here was the continual pm'img (at least 4) that I'm a cheat, been filmed and I'll be reported, to which I said "be my guest."
Nevertheless, and attempting to be brief here:
So I'm in Lanc's, said cheat accuser in K-4 comes in high but misses, then pursues co-alt and from 6 at never less than D300 and often up to D600+. As fight progresses and in my desperation to survive it appears he only gets a few pings in me and for whatever reason he stays co-alt on my 6 firing away. He makes evasive maneuvers by turning wings, swinging out to my drone's sides, but remains for most part co-alt. After a few moments I get the first accusation, saying "you'll be the first I've ever reported" and I reply something to the effect of 'why...' His reply to that is something like bye bye and you know why, sending film in... Then the next is "my 30 mils" would have taken you apart, cheater...
More to the story: so I look this guy up, the most recently completed tour, this guy has 7 kills in K-4, and 43 total kills on Lancs. He's got 118 kills in an La-7, but nothing more even worth mentioning in other fighters. He's a GV'er.
As someone who thus far has done a fair amount of bombing in Lancs and a fair amount trying to shoot them down, I know he was either impatient or doesn't know their (significant) sweet spot; it's not from direct-6 o'clock...
Even more to the story: during this drawn out fight, somehow my drones became separated from me in a way I've never seen. They were significantly below me, 1k according to this guy. I tried mightily to get them to re-form, to no avail, and I believe they went poof. However, this was not his basis for several pm's calling me a cheat and that I'll be reported. It was the 30mils not connecting.
I fly the K-4, I know hitting anything with the 30mils is hard, especially at D300+.
Just don't like being called a cheater, and honestly feel that harassing someone about such should have some consequences if proven to be wrong in their accusation. Are there consequences?
I take it seriously, probably too much, but in my work (and play) integrity is premium and without it I'm out of work.
BTW, he did finally get me in flames, but drones were probably proxy.
TIA,
Rot
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First, a post like this isn't good unless you name names ...... so we can all enjoy this :devil
Second, as your researched showed you, let it go and take it as a compliment if you like. Seeing as you really didn't do anything ....like out maneuver this clown, or out fight him. you probably don't deserve the compliment :neener:
What most likely happened is this clown doesn't understand the drop of the 30m and was just throwing them away. So instead of admitting he himself is an idiot and doesn't know how to aim (nor attack a set of buffs by your description) he takes it out on you to make himself feel better for being an idiot.
If it happens again you can use the "report" function on the kneeboard. But, like watching someone fall off their bicycle, there is no reason to get mad at them when they blame you. Of course you really shouldn't laugh in their face, wait until your around the corner, or in this case ignore the clown, or use the ".squelch" function and not be bothered with him the rest of your evening.
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Registered forums Oct 2012. Accused of cheating December 2012.
3 months. Took me 6 years in to get that particular honor, well done.
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:huh :huh :huh :huh Dude!!! I suck at cheating. Well, I cant even figure out how to cheat. :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead But im Nekked! :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
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I have no problems naming this guy, just want to first make sure I'm not breaking any rules in doing so.
:salute
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I have no problems naming this guy, just want to first make sure I'm not breaking any rules in doing so.
:salute
something I finally learned. If in doubt; dont.
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:huh :huh :huh :huh Dude!!! I suck at cheating. Well, I cant even figure out how to cheat. :bhead :bhead :bhead :bhead But im Nekked! :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
:aok
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I have no problems naming this guy, just want to first make sure I'm not breaking any rules in doing so.
:salute
Fugitive loves to trick people into violating rules so he can get them bbs banned. Its his hobby. Dont name names. Dont post films.
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Judging by some of the "hackusation" PMs I have had HTC must have a load of films of me. Funny, I've never heard back from them though....
I doubt many of these films ever get sent in, even if they existed in the first place. I've flown this game for ten years and have yet to see anything that looked like an opponent cheating, yet some people run into "cheats" all the time. I suspect 99% of this is just bruised egos venting.
Too much of this would be bad for HTC though, some newbie reads constant hacking claims on 200, thinks "oh, that's why I'm getting beaten" and quits the game. I've always tried to reason with people who accuse me and explain why they lost a fight, but some won't have it. Perhaps I should report them for the good of the game.
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Network problems may have caused his 30mm hits not to register. I know for a fact that I've blasted lancasters in a 262 with bursts of hits that would down a plane in MG armed planes let alone 30mm - and only to have them lose a flap (if Im lucky) and fly away.
When stuff like that happens it's natural to start to wonder if this was just a freak network accident or something the other player caused on purpose.
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Fugitive loves to trick people into violating rules so he can get them bbs banned. Its his hobby. Dont name names. Dont post films.
starting crap can have the same affect. How bout we raise above the petty horsecrap in these threads. :cheers:
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I have no problems naming this guy, just want to first make sure I'm not breaking any rules in doing so.
:salute
The rules are the first thread in each main heading of the BBS, and you can read them any time you like to be sure.
Rule number 8 says....
8- Complaints about a player's behavior online should be emailed to support@hitechcreations.com rather than posted to this board.
so technically you should send the info to HTC. However if you want a good witch hunt you can post the name here and we will all glad drag this clown through the mud for ya :devil
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(http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk121/TheAmish/mj3h4k.jpg)
so much for the higher ground
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Registered forums Oct 2012. Accused of cheating December 2012.
3 months. Took me 6 years in to get that particular honor, well done.
Hell, I've been here 10 years and have only been accused of cheating once. And that was about a year ago. LMAO.
First off. If he remained on your 6 co alt. Then you didnt cheat. He's just stupid
Secondly.. refer to the third sentence above.
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So is he a cheater or not? :old:
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The rules are the first thread in each main heading of the BBS, and you can read them any time you like to be sure.
Rule number 8 says....
8- Complaints about a player's behavior online should be emailed to support@hitechcreations.com rather than posted to this board.
so technically you should send the info to HTC. However if you want a good witch hunt you can post the name here and we will all glad drag this clown through the mud for ya :devil
:lol
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Wear it as a badge of honor RotBaron my friend...... :aok
Best line ive ever read on the bbs was something as follows (im paraphrasing) "Sometimes people just need to explain away their suckage"
Seems fitting in this instance
:salute
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:aok
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Posting complaints about individual players is always a bad idea. Complaints about players should always be emailed to HTC.
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Bringing stuff like this to the BBS serves no useful purpose...plus will get the thread locked for Rules violations.
But since we're talking...
I got called a cheater because I could kill a certain Hurri 2c with a Spit V. "No way a Spit V can out-turn a Hurri - it seems you're the only one who can do it". :lol It's called "out-flying", not "out-turning". :aok
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Copy, thank you all for the sage advice.
I have read the rules a couple times so far, and I'll keep all of the things mentioned in mind...
:salute
Rot
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In 2+ years I've had 'rubber bullets' once. Logged out, back in problem solved. A few months ago I took after some Lancs over our strats armed with a Me-163. My first pass I watched several bursts as the 30mms hit the fuselage, nothing. Didn't until second pass. It happens. No cheating.
Boo
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starting crap can have the same affect. How bout we raise above the petty horsecrap in these threads. :cheers:
You trying to show moral superiority? :rofl
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I know for a fact that I've blasted lancasters in a 262 with bursts of hits that would down a plane in MG armed planes let alone 30mm - and only to have them lose a flap (if Im lucky) and fly away.
I would simply say your aim sucks, unless show a film to say otherwise, people tend to blame to many things - Cats, internet connection, the sun etc. Reality is unless you hit key areas the plane will not go down.
I'm not being a sweetheart or anything, but unless you seriously fly a 262 multiple times per tour, the aim can be a little...tricky, adding high speed makes it more of a problem. I can show proof there is absolutely nothing wrong with 262s.
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This is an ongoing complaint about the expected outcome of gunnery with the tater in the K4. It may be the best platform to showcase all of the factors that can cause you to achive the unexpected outcome of missing from almost point blank with the tater.
A much better thread could be started in the training section to talk about the problems related to gunnery with the K4. I've recently filmed offline K4 gunnery testing a new gunsight I hoped will help me address the obvious differences in lead and azmuth from wing mounted guns. There are many factors going against you that will contribute to missing a B25 at 100 yards with the MK108 which I tested. One giant factor is in realy having no clue where that round is going at high speeds in an arched pursuit path in a 3D physics environment opposed to the dispersion clouds generated by horizontal stream crossing in wing cannon birds.
We don't know from this anything about the accusing player's conditions in his K4. Yes a film would be nice. But, even something as simple as knowing from him what his MK108 convergence was set to. The flatest trajectory to 400 yards is a Conv of 325-350. If he was under or over that and attacking from higher or lower and other factors to add up his 3D physics debt in resolving a guns solution for 1-3 taters touching somewhere on a bomber.
Another factor many players don't think about is how their mind looks at relative scale. Most of us spend our time shooting at small fighters from short distances. Suddenly we attack something 3 times as big as a fighter. Our aiming strategies come from a smaller closer picture. So now many get caught in letting that sight picture undermine our ability to hit something as large as a bomber. Even though we may see the distance flag. We are used to firing at a certain size silloutte in our gunsight picture and often fire too short from too far and miss or scatter our rounds all over a 100ft wingspan opposed to a 30ft wingspan we hit with concentrated fire. It's also hard to hit something with a single tater from 400yds when the dispersion can be upwards of 20ft.
Then many who shoot from engine mounted guns don't calculate the fact that the closer you get inside of 200 the higher you have to raise your nose because your cannon is down between your knees. You can shoot right under the rear gunner in a B17 inside of 200 thinking you should be blowing it out of the sky.
The K4 pilot probably had a bad night with the Internet and can hit a fly in the eye with a tater at 1000 yards any other time. After all we are all Carlos Hathcock's in this virtual reality and men just don't pry into how other men choose to aim their squirl gun. That could get emberassin..........
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Network problems may have caused his 30mm hits not to register. I know for a fact that I've blasted lancasters in a 262 with bursts of hits that would down a plane in MG armed planes let alone 30mm - and only to have them lose a flap (if Im lucky) and fly away.
When stuff like that happens it's natural to start to wonder if this was just a freak network accident or something the other player caused on purpose.
Network problems can NOT cause a hit not to register. ALL hits you see WILL allways be processed by the host unless you disco.
HiTech
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Lancs can be tough but when you see the bright orange pumpkin its a pretty good indication that the target airplane is inches from destruction. If you are coming in from 12oc on a lanc in a 262 the merge could be 750-850 or so? Its pretty hard to hit the same spot twice at that speed even with the easier guns like the Hispanos or 50cal.
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Network problems can NOT cause a hit not to register. ALL hits you see WILL allways be processed by the host unless you disco.
HiTech
Seems like the player in the K4 needs to start a tech and help post.
If he is reading this. Practicing offline with the tater using the lead computing gunsight and filming say 20 minutes of shooting only the 30mm from 200, 400, 600, 800 will be helpful.
When you playback. Hit Z and goto about full zoom. Have the box for trails checked. Slow your film down to about .15 and for your sucessfull hits look at the relationship between the red wire frame trails and how you were using your gunsight. Elevation has two purposes. Bullet drop compensation somewhat but, forward relative motion compensation. Why does it seem like you miss alot shooting from a level dead-6? Also try different convergences. 325-350 is about the flatest you will get to 400. After 400 your 30mm begins to rapidly drop along with your time to target is getting really long.
This chart tells the story of why so many budding K4 drivers have problems past point blank and luck.
500m\sec InitV
-----------109yd--219yd--328yd---437yd--656yd
Distance-100m---200m---300m---400m---600m
Time-----.205----.422----.649-----.888-----1.443
Drop------8in-----2.7ft----6.4ft-----12ft-----28.7ft
Disper----7ft------14ft-----22ft-----30ft-----49ft
The combat speeds chart will give an idea of how easy it is to miss in .422 second with a tater with your con 219 yards. At 250mph 45 yards is 135ft. At 437yds at 250mph, 267ft. It's very easy to throw taters everywher but at a bomber. And they are so big when you look at them..........
Combat Speeds 90 degree left<--->right Travel in Yards.
--Time----.10--.20---.30--.40--.50--.60--.70--.80--.90---1.0--1.5--seconds
Speed
250mph---11---22---33---45---56---67---78---89--100--112--168--yards
300mph---14---29---43---58---73---87--102--116--131--146--219
350mph---17---34---51---68---85--102--119--136--153--171--256
400mph---19---39---58---78---97--117--136--156--175--195--292
Notice a very sorry trend here in drop and dispersion? Since Hitech lets you virtualy tilt the barrel up through the engine you might as well take advantage of the up tilt to get about 2 feet high of your LoS between 200 and 350. If he locked it in place like it should be you guys would have to learn about Mil and reticles instead of dots and kentuky game windage.
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Seems like the player in the K4 needs to start a tech and help post.
Not really, he sat behind Lancs and couldn't shoot them down.
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Not really, he sat behind Lancs and couldn't shoot them down.
I'm kinda looking at helping players want to keep paying subscriptions even if their eyes cross reading the data tables I beleive Hitech is using that are thwarting thier kentucky windage aiming misconceptions. This isn't the Marines where you sign up to be told you suck and thank the nice gunny for caring. The best revenge in the free market by the consumer is to tell HTC they suck and vote with their wallet when a gunny unloads on them.
A certaint amount of myth busting then is in order even if the player couldn't find his kester with the help of a birdog and a proctologist. Past 75yds the MK108 tater has abismal ballistics becasue of dispersion. If I think I might fly the K4 in the MA, I spend 30 minutes offline plinking at the drones. I wonder how many K4 kills are really the MG 131? The last time I flew the K4 exclusively Platano flew for the muppets. It took weeks after I stopped flying it to hit anything with other guns consistantly.
And congratulations to you if you are the gunnery and kentucky windage god of our universe and can use any gun in existance with your eyes closed to shoot the wings off a fly at 1000yds. Seems to be a very large concentration of gunnery gods in this game or at least posting to this forum.
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And congratulations to you if you are the gunnery and kentucky windage god of our universe and can use any gun in existance with your eyes closed to shoot the wings off a fly at 1000yds. Seems to be a very large concentration of gunnery gods in this game or at least posting to this forum.
Nobody said their aim was kentucky windage, I certainly didn't. I am barely average in aim and acm. However since you consider me a BBS warrior, maybe you can prove me to only be a troll on the BBS - for example the last scenario I flew was Winter Death grounds - here was my stats:
Stab I./JG7
Butcher
21:03:35 Departed from Field #31 in a Me 262A-1
21:48:38 Shot down a B-26B flown by EVZ.
21:48:48 Shot down a B-26B flown by Kuya.
21:48:51 Shot down a B-26B flown by Kuya.
21:49:17 Shot down a B-26B flown by tudza.
21:49:48 Helps HamHawk shoot down DWOldDog.
21:49:53 Shot down a B-26B flown by thomace.
21:49:54 Shot down a B-26B flown by thomace.
21:50:39 Shot down a B-26B flown by DWOldDog.
22:01:55 Takes on fuel/ammo/ord at field #31.
23:16:18 Shot down a P-38L flown by SEBaker.
23:16:20 Shot down a P-38J flown by Fencer.
23:16:58 Shot down a P-38J flown by SIK1.
23:17:51 Shot down a P-38J flown by mir.
23:20:52 Helps IrishOne shoot down TomD.
23:21:26 Shot down a P-47D-25 flown by kyle53.
23:23:00 Shot down a P-51D flown by AHJoker.
23:23:46 Shot down a P-51D flown by AHRatTat.
23:33:01 Arrived Safely at Field #31
Interesting I don't see Bustr period in FSO, Scenarios or Snapshot logs and you really call me a BBS warrior? I admit I am average pilot with average aim - but at least I bring facts to the table. Trolling seems to be your high point, please continue training.
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LOL, I had a guy PM(s) me the other night after 3 successive kills in 3 different aircraft. One of them was from 5K as I bombed the CV he was trying to launch from. He told me in no uncertain terms he had film of every kill and was going to post it. There was no way I could kill him every time and kill a CV with a B26. I begged him to post it. Even said "pretty please"... I need the street cred. :airplane:
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This post is about a player and a problem with his perception of how the Mk108 should work.
This is not the FSO. You got a thingy going with Hammy and Irish we should know about?? Or are you attempting to slip in some free PR about your personal FSO abilities for the next event? Or should we start calling you gunny? I'm attempting to help the disgruntaled player if he is reading this post or if the OP wants to point him to this post.
For the most part your opening derision to his abilities is what many fling about in this forum. Then the derieded is supposed to kiss your pinky and beg enlightenment sort of what your B26 killing skill points indirectly that you can do when your skin isn't being rubbed raw from it's thinness. The MK108 in the K4 can drive the inexperienced into a tizzy. I've been there. The math dosen't take a special status of being a game renowned dead eye jonny in a kiddy game to generate it. That's another tendancy in this game that only the personaly accomplished at piu, piu, piu in the game can speak with authority about the game. The tables describe the problem the unnamed K4 driver is having with the ballistics if you look at it. Anyone in this audience can generate it if they have some time.
Unless Hitech is not using the same math we all use to descirbe our physical universe and the universe that existed in the 40's where our planes data sets were generated.
By the way. In WW2 pursuit curves had a component called "seat of your pants". We don't feel that in this game. Hitech I supect uses an instantanious G value instead while we perceive the slowness of getting the pipper on the target or it traveling in directions we didn't expect. I wonder if this unnamed K4 pilot simply lacks enough experience with the gun and it's delivery platform? Experience is what improves Hit% in a K4 in the face of the MK108's down range idiosyncracies. Experieneced K4 players in this game don't usualy accuse others of finessing the game to cover their inexperience. They tend to know each other and understand missing is their own fault becasue of just how crappy that cannons ballistics is.
Ergo, my attempt to help the unnamed K4 driver. Oh Hammy is my squadmate. He wants dinner and a movie before anything else. He's not too bad himself with a K4.
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I got called a cheater because I could kill a certain Hurri 2c with a Spit V. "No way a Spit V can out-turn a Hurri - it seems you're the only one who can do it". :lol It's called "out-flying", not "out-turning".
IIC thought he was going to beat a Spit 5? What a maroon.
- oldman
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something I finally learned. If in doubt; dont.
NO NO NO! DO, the shock value alone is worth ridicule! :D
JUGgler
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NO NO NO! DO, the shock value alone is worth ridicule! :D
JUGgler
I shall follow rule 8 and move on. But thank you all for the constructive posts.
Bustr I appreciate the tables you've provided, I like to fly the K-4 because of the engine power, but have rarely hit anything with the 30 mils myself. I'll up one on the TA drones and try to better my aim with them.
:devil <----this I'll be aware of from now on - ;)
:salute
Rot
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NO NO NO! DO, the shock value alone is worth ridicule! :D
JUGgler
You coming back or what?
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I would simply say your aim sucks, unless show a film to say otherwise, people tend to blame to many things - Cats, internet connection, the sun etc. Reality is unless you hit key areas the plane will not go down.
I'm not being a sweetheart or anything, but unless you seriously fly a 262 multiple times per tour, the aim can be a little...tricky, adding high speed makes it more of a problem. I can show proof there is absolutely nothing wrong with 262s.
My aim does not suck and the hits were verified from film. You're being a sweetheart.
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Network problems can NOT cause a hit not to register. ALL hits you see WILL allways be processed by the host unless you disco.
HiTech
Interesting. I guess a lanc can take 7x30mm hits to the tail without getting damage then. It was on film. Even though it was already years ago this one case has stuck to my mind because I reviewed the film several times afterwards. You literally couldn't see the tail from the hit flashes.
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post the film then
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post the film then
Wow Coombzy that is pretty to the point for you and blunt. I sense a certain level of tension that doesn't exist normally with you and others. Perhaps we should just let this one rest as its a go nowhere thead an d no good will come of this?
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tension? what are you on about?
if he has the film of his 7 30mm rounds hitting a Lanc without any damage, as he says he does, I can't see why he wouldn't post it to support his statements, that's all
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tension? what are you on about?
if he has the film of his 7 30mm rounds hitting a Lanc without any damage, as he says he does, I can't see why he wouldn't post it to support his statements, that's all
just saying you are typically a little more fluid to your approach on such subjects. Just didnt seem like you to be so direct. Sorry If I read too much into it.
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No worries :angel:
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post the film then
You post a film from 2006 saved on a harddrive that probably doesn't exist anymore :D
I have around 6-7 AH2 installations on different backups and they have around 800-900 saved films. Do you wish to get them all so you can sort the sortie in question out?
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You post a film from 2006 saved on a harddrive that probably doesn't exist anymore :D
I have around 6-7 AH2 installations on different backups and they have around 800-900 saved films. Do you wish to get them all so you can sort the sortie in question out?
If it was from that long ago, then I bet you saw the film viewer bug where it would show 2 hits for every real one. Basically it used to show the recorded hit, and then show the bullet from the film viewer also hit again.
HiTech
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also, back then there was an issue with the spud that HTC sorted out as well.
Sounds like the complaint is along the same lines as "Lets condemn the new mustang, because the Edsel looked like crap!"
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I can only think of three places on a Lanc that I would hold any reasonable hope of taking him out with only one tater hit, like a fighter - the wing tips and the cockpit. Otherwise all bets are off, the Lanc can be a very tough nut to crack even with taters.
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If it was from that long ago, then I bet you saw the film viewer bug where it would show 2 hits for every real one. Basically it used to show the recorded hit, and then show the bullet from the film viewer also hit again.
HiTech
Even if it was only half i.e. 3 tater hits to the lanc tail it should have dropped off.
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Even if it was only half i.e. 3 tater hits to the lanc tail it should have dropped off.
Per a previous post of yours. Yes you should find it and post it, you are the accuser afterall
No three tater hits to a lancs tail may not make it fall off. Where exactly did you hit him in the "tail"? Was it all the tail? Was it all to just one component of the tail? was it possible some of the shells hit the fuselage? Can you remember properly this event that lasted probably less than a second this long after?
But none of that really matters.
If its such a problem? Why is it the only event you seem to have had from years ago?
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Per a previous post of yours. Yes you should find it and post it, you are the accuser afterall
No three tater hits to a lancs tail may not make it fall off. Where exactly did you hit him in the "tail"? Was it all the tail? Was it all to just one component of the tail? was it possible some of the shells hit the fuselage? Can you remember properly this event that lasted probably less than a second this long after?
But none of that really matters.
If its such a problem? Why is it the only event you seem to have had from years ago?
1) I no longer have the film in question and I doubt you have films from 2006 anymore. I brought this 1 sortie up because it was rare in the caliber and amount of hits applied with almost no effect and I reviewed the film later not believing what I just saw online - I even mentioned it in a thread in 2006 for the first time.
2) Hits were to the tail section from the side, horizontal stabilizers which resulted in 1 elevator missing. In action I saw a big blast of hits and later on film counted 7 hits - if the multiplying bug would be there I would have got an even number, not 7. Even 3 tater hits to the tail should IMO blow a lancs whole tail off. Maybe I'm wrong.
3) It's such a problem if HT claims network problems can under no circumstances eat the damage, what then explains the rubber bullets I regularly used to see? When I used to play AH there were cleraly differences in days when sometimes you could land 5-6 kills with a single ammo load and other days where you had to blast half the load just for 1 kill, using the same type of aircraft. I always counted them on my crappy ping to US but now that I hear that couldn't be the reason I'm really intrigued.
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Fought you in a 51d vs your K4 your not a cheater bro, but you do suck at returning Salutes :cheers:
:bolt:
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Fought you in a 51d vs your K4 your not a cheater bro, but you do suck at returning Salutes :cheers:
:bolt:
I don't return salutes if I'm HO'd.
If you didn't HO me and I didn't salute back then I must have missed it. :salute
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I don't return salutes if I'm HO'd.
If you didn't HO me and I didn't salute back then I must have missed it. :salute
I return all salutes or tell them why I'm not saluting (which is rare).
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I return all salutes or tell them why I'm not saluting (which is rare).
One fingered salutes? :noid
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I :salute and return :salute unless it's something lame ie, run to 3 buddies, then return to get kill.
Pick when engaged , Ho, etc.
Not really :salute worthy, but depends on my mood too :)
But, we do seem to have some who are too good to return a :salute (yeah, they're on 200 at the time).
Now to calling people cheaters. They're the ones who don't get/refuse to understand lag and or poor connections.
I've had planes fly past me, then bullets hit.
Crashed into other planes inadvertently (as most do), because of lag and my connection.
:cheers: Oz
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One fingered salutes? :noid
I've had plenty of those, too. :airplane:
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The other night, I rolled up on a Panther (sitting on concrete) and Boom geht das Dynamit!!
60 seconds later "You've been reported for cheating"
=(
Sent the film to Skuzzbucket.
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-cQ5xvKcD95Y/UNSXF7ut4SI/AAAAAAAAB5k/Phb7M-7Pl8g/s912/Gadwin311.jpg)
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LOL nice one Rat.