Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Badger85 on December 29, 2015, 10:32:49 AM
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Full disclosure: Though I had joined AH in 2012 and supported it for a couple of years, I have not been a member for over a year.
One of the significant things that prevents me from joining again is what I perceive to be a steep pricing model. One way of lowering prices for gaming companies, in my opinion, is to offer their product on Steam and get a tremendous boost in people trying the game.
Is there any chance AH3 will be on Steam with a new pricing structure? I did a cursory search for this in the forum and have not seen a discussion of this yet (though I'm sure it has been mentioned somewhere sometime).
What are your thoughts?
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50 cents a day for unlimited play just doesn't seem steep to me.
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I guess if $15.00 breaks the bank, you need to work on bettering your salary, either through a better job or promotion at your current one. Perhaps your efforts right now should not be spent on any online game. You could always give up one or more of the porn sites you subscribe too. I know that's a tough one, porn or AH, porn or AH.
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I have been on a prolonged job search, unfortunately. And who needs to pay for porn these days?
My reasoning is this: AH is not really at the peak of game development these days, sadly. I don't mean offense, I'm just keeping it real. So if the top developers don't price their games at a cost of $180/year, why should AH? It's simple economics. If my community -- the one not insulting me in this thread -- were to move to another combat simulator, I'd drop AH in a heartbeat at its current price.
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As I have posted many times the fifteen bucks is a filter screening out the trouble makers. Well . . . most of them.
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This post is not about causing trouble. I think AH does have positive things other games do not: mainly, the Special Events with coordinated squad tactics and strategy. That is unique in the flight sim world, I will gladly admit.
Notice I'm not the one throwing out ad hominem attacks. My topic is about discussing a constructive idea: what are the pros/cons of a game like AH3 being available on the Steam platform?
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Okay, I'll start, though sorry for the double-post. I think the "retro" quality of AH would not necessarily be a turn-off on a platform like Steam. Heck, if a game with only text and no graphics (http://store.steampowered.com/app/375130) can receive a "Very Positive" review score, I think Aces High can stand on its own merits if the pricing is reasonable.
On negatives, I don't know how big of a cut Steam takes from its sales. According to this article (http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2015-06-19-the-average-game-on-steam-sells-only-32-000-copies), an average game on Steam will only sell 32,500 copies. But it does seem that Steam "early access" programs contribute to media hype that helps sales.
What do you guys think about this (re: Steam; please no personal attacks)?
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I for one have never played Air Warrior or Aces High because of the graphics and I wouldn't have stopped if they got dated. It's the gameplay and the wet palm fights I'm here for.
I haven't had a job for my entire gaming career and still manage the $15 a month and a few donuts for the staff :aok
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If hitech could increase the player base, reduce the sub. cost per month, and hitech still makes more $ through steam, I'm all for it. I'm sure he would be too.
It seems like that's the only way it would make sense.
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One movie ticket is 15 bucks for two hours of entertainment. The way I look at it, I've got my money's worth if I play more than two hours per month.
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Obviously, if HT lowered the price he'd have to increase the subscriber base to maintain the same revenue. At the same time the costs of maintaining those additional accounts as well as the headaches they potentially bring also rise so the subscriber base has to increase even more to offset this. How much more? Only HT knows.
The bigger issue is taking a step that may be irreversible and not having it pay off.
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See rule #4
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As a business, a price war can be a race to see who goes bankrupt first. Better to make a better game and people will pay for it.
Look at car makers - how many high end companies are hurting for customers? A lot of the cheaper brands have gone extinct in recent years.
Look at the price of your cable bill, internet bill and wireless bill. $15 a month gets you much more for much less.
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$15 is a good deal for this game, but only if you don't judge the book by its cover.
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if the guy is out of work, it might be time to give up gaming until you can afford it. it's much more than $15.00 a month to play Aces High or any other online game, you need a computer that can play the game, internet connection, unless you living in Mom's basement all that comes at a cost and looking for work costs money.
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This will be an approximate memory of Hitech's reason for not partnering with Steam. To be a Steam product offering member, they want more of his money from Aces High revenues than he is willing to part with for people to have the illusion of Aces High being cheap to play. Unless the person asking is a Steam shill and already knows how Steam prices for access to their gateway. Steam is not very friendly in terms of keeping your own profits. Unless the icing on the cake is exposure to eyeballs in the offering list and all the advertisements.
Can anyone find Hitech's response from about a year ago where he gave a very detailed explanation about Steam and it's real cost to the subscriber company?
The bottom line from Hitech: No interest.
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Thanks, bustr! I'd be interested in reading that post; like I mentioned, I searched and couldn't find it by my own Boolean efforts.
As to the points you mentioned, the only thing that gives me pause is that literally every current flight sim has found it advantageous to partner with Steam: WT, IL-2: BoS & BoM, DCS, RoF, XP10, and even FSX almost a decade after the original came out.
I should say, I guess, that I have no affiliation with Steam or will profit in any way from AH going on Steam. I really just want the Special Events (esp. FSO) community to survive in one form or another so that large-scale historical aerial battle reenactments can continue on to the next generation. That's my motivation.
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Full disclosure: Though I had joined AH in 2012 and supported it for a couple of years, I have not been a member for over a year.
One of the significant things that prevents me from joining again is what I perceive to be a steep pricing model. One way of lowering prices for gaming companies, in my opinion, is to offer their product on Steam and get a tremendous boost in people trying the game.
Is there any chance AH3 will be on Steam with a new pricing structure? I did a cursory search for this in the forum and have not seen a discussion of this yet (though I'm sure it has been mentioned somewhere sometime).
What are your thoughts?
Lowering the price of AH and then putting it on Steam will hurt AH, despite the potential for added new players that Steam may bring. Steam takes 30% of all transactions, so HTC would have to fork over 30% of each monthly paid subscription to Steam.
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and besides some of those "free" games out there, aren't really free, because you have to buy stuff to upgrade.... in aces high, you get everything with a few exceptions and you have to EARN them not BUY them......as far as im concerned ACES HIGH is still the best Deal and the best game out there! oh and the "other" games. only 15 players at a time. try FSO with that!!
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I think they should consider letting a few planes be free to play. Then $15 unlocks the whole game. Maybe Spit V, 109F, P51B, La5.
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the OP has a point IMO
Note that you can publish a game on steam while keeping a secondary login system. And don't underestimate how much people are willing to give on skins and pink tracers :D
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People also don't factor in the increased development cost that would happen if AH is put on Steam. HiTech will have to develop a Steam version of the game, and maintain that version along with the regular non-Steam version.
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Why would you log in through Steam to get to this game and wreak havoc on a connection that is the tightest and most refined I have ever experienced?
You have to be right to get a kill, nearly everything else out there, just get close.
This is not a mass appeal game, it's a niche game. It changes slowly but the changes matter and are well thought out.
After years of playing games through steam I've finally ripped that garbage out of my system and won't play a game through that junk ever again.
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Why would you log in through Steam to get to this game and wreak havoc on a connection that is the tightest and most refined I have ever experienced?
You have to be right to get a kill, nearly everything else out there, just get close.
This is not a mass appeal game, it's a niche game. It changes slowly but the changes matter and are well thought out.
After years of playing games through steam I've finally ripped that garbage out of my system and won't play a game through that junk ever again.
Agreed its crap!
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oh yah and my credit card was hacked through steam, if it wasn't for one particular game, I wouldn't use them at all!! lack of security from steam, hows that for a reason not to do it!!
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AH is the best flight sim out there.
I have bought a few and graphics are very nice but game is poo
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AH is the best flight sim out there.
I have bought a few and graphics are very nice but game is poo
Yep your not going to find another game in the world that offers so much.
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As the always pleasant to read Bustr said, somebody asked Hitech in the past about Steam, and his answer was pretty straightforward and understandable, pretty much what AckAck said. That said, other players have also asked HT if it was his plan to keep Aces High a "niche game with small numbers", and he very vehemently denied that, and made it plain that he was all for large scale expansion of numbers. I have the thread linked someplace else, I'll find it later.
So, IMO this represents a paradox of sorts - the one proven vehicle out there in the gaming world for expanding numbers/players is a no-go for completely understandable reasons, yet HTC doesn't necessarily wish to remain a small niche game. What to do...
I wonder how Eagle Dynamics/DCS does it with Steam - they have their own in house sales vehicle/page, yet also have a presence on steam. A sort of hybrid model if you will. If Steam didn't enforce some sort of contract taking a slice of DCS sales on their own page, but only on Steam, IMO this would be a possible area to examine for HTC, a similar hybrid system. Yes, supporting a Steam variant would equal more work, question is, would it be worth it. I wonder what Warbirds sales are like on Steam? I'd wager crap, but then, so is the product and support without Steam. HTC would fare much better there IMO, especially with some FTP options like a couple GVs and maybe a very weak fighter/bomber.
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So steam games have you login to the game from the steam site? If they are simply a skimming middleman, why the need to login to their site or have a separate version of the game?
I have never used it.
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The are a skimming middleman in effect, but instead of having to produce game boxes or provide a streaming data service themselves, game companies can instead offset that cost and go through Steam - for a price. Now that Steam is so popular and most gamers instantly check there before anywhere else, it's almost a "must use" deal for anything other than niche products. Even indie games have the largest following on Steam IMO.
I remember back when I worked full time for an online gaming site, back in 2000 or so, when the Valve people first told us about the Steam concept and how nobody would buy boxed games in the future. We laughed, thinking that nobody would fork over their 50$ to not get a hard CD copy and box of their game for their hard earned dollar. Heh. Didn't see that one coming obviously. Same deal I guess for when Microsoft gaming first told us about their secret "XBox" project that would bring PC hardware into a gaming console - who would want to buy that instead of a PC?!
I still think HTC could increase numbers back to their peak levels and higher on their own. IMO having a system that allowed free to play members into the arena, yet would prioritize sub clients over them, to fill up the open slots say to 800 or whatever the servers can take would be the best, cheapest option. Give them a jeep, crappy tank, Storch, and maybe a very weak fighter/bomber. Nothing would make new players want to pay to sub more than seeing the fun everyone else is having in all the planes/tanks/etc that they can't unlock - it'd be a far better hook than tic-tac-toe or sheep stealing, I'd bet it all on that.
IMO this would work - I have no idea regarding the complications of implementing such a thing, I just believe that it's the most cost effective way to go, better than any ad campaign or Steam type venture. Fill up the empty player slots with FTP - some of them will become paying clients, and eventually it'll get to the point where there will be enough paying members flying again to fill the arena, and then another split could happen or an even larger arena made. This method also fixes a lot of complaint/issues as well, as the most common is "not enough players". Well, having a ton of FTP targets will fix that in short order, and give sub paying members a lot more live players to interact with. This interaction will also breed more subs from the FTP players, as they'll want to be in on what the sub players are up to and talking about, higher end fighters and bomber raids etc they'd be locked out of without a sub.
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Catch South Park episode "Freemium isn't free". Pretty much explains it all in a way only they can!
Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
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This isn't quite just a game.... This is a hobby...
A very large portion of the playerbase have multiple years under their belts while other games are littered with many people that are mere thrill seekers and those same games cater to those people.
By paying a mere 15 a month you are paying for this grand clubhouse of aces high and a community full of the best people in the world and that is even accounting for the occasional miscreant that likes to spoil the fun for others.
Tell me.. how many of these other games have a community like this? A community that will not fizzle out after a few years?
Anyways a recap... This is a hobby for many not some game.
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Running AH on Steam COULD result in a truly horrific nightmare. Hey, JMHO but we have plenty of game-the-game console kiddie style players hangin around here already. Sure, it might increase numbers, but at what cost? There's an ever decreasing niche of the kind of people AH is good for, and good for AH. I'd just as soon see HTC finish up III, and concentrate on prying these kinds of players out of the woodwork via targeted advertising.
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If you don't play anything other than aces high and have no interest in other game, your opinion is not worth anything.
Everyone wants to think he's "elite" and plays the superior game. Superior unknown game die like any other, and that's what is happening to aces high.
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Log on
Up a plane
Make loads of noise
Log off
Nuke does not play anymore so has no opinion on AH.
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I have not played in a long time. And I have seen the few get even fewer to paraphrase the Longest Day. I wish I could say that Aces High could be saved. But War Thunder and other F2P models are killing us. And to be honest, as long as they keep up the pressure. They will. The fact is a monthly sub is a huge difference to something free.
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Nuke does not play anymore so has no opinion on AH.
I wish I was, but an empty arena is not worth 15$ a month
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Thank you all for contributing to the discussion. Two further points from me:
To get onto Steam, in addition to the development costs, I think HTC would have to invest in a marketing effort to re-brand AH3. I thought Gman brought up some really good points, and I looked up how many players WarBirds has playing on Steam: the numbers are almost non-existent (http://steamcharts.com/app/365620). So it seems Steam didn't really help WarBirds.
WB 2016 was released on Apr 2015 onto Steam, but they don't really have good brand positioning, if you ask me, based on their Steam store page. What sets them apart from the likes of WT and IL-2? It's hard to say based on their own branding, so that may have contributed to their lackluster performance on Steam. I think AH would have to make a strong case, if HTC were to use Steam, on their store page for what makes it different from other combat flight sims on the market.
This brings me to my second point. How would AH be able to attract the serious type of gamers that could contribute in a productive way to Special Events like FSO? I'm a little biased in this regard because, as I've said earlier, I think Special Events are what make AH unique in the gaming arena. I know I'm not alone in this because I remember seeing a poll on the AH forums which suggested there was a very large percentage of people that feel the same way that I do about AH Special Events.
I think it would be possible to attract the right kind of gamer on Steam and create a gateway for them to enter the Special Events world. The community is already here, but it may take greater cooperation of squads (who already have an interest in expanding their membership base) to help new players assimilate into FSO type events. Maybe there would be a special registration and training process for new players interested in Special Events that would also weed out the trolls looking to commit their antics.
What do you guys think?
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Full disclosure: Though I had joined AH in 2012 and supported it for a couple of years, I have not been a member for over a year.
One of the significant things that prevents me from joining again is what I perceive to be a steep pricing model. One way of lowering prices for gaming companies, in my opinion, is to offer their product on Steam and get a tremendous boost in people trying the game.
Is there any chance AH3 will be on Steam with a new pricing structure? I did a cursory search for this in the forum and have not seen a discussion of this yet (though I'm sure it has been mentioned somewhere sometime).
What are your thoughts?
then why are you still here in this forum?
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:aok
I guess if $15.00 breaks the bank, you need to work on bettering your salary, either through a better job or promotion at your current one. Perhaps your efforts right now should not be spent on any online game. You could always give up one or more of the porn sites you subscribe too. I know that's a tough one, porn or AH, porn or AH.
:aok +1
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Am I the only one that saw Steam accounts had a bug (feature) or was hacked over Christmas?
http://kotaku.com/valve-still-hasnt-told-steam-users-about-the-christmas-1750114754 (http://kotaku.com/valve-still-hasnt-told-steam-users-about-the-christmas-1750114754)
Look how wonderful they are about communicating! Do you think you could get the admin of the Steam servers on the phone in about 12 seconds from now? I think some people have no idea what we have here and how wonderful it truly is.
Giving 15+ years of established customers / users and their accounts plus 30% off the top, to some third party gaming company that is the flavor of the week, would be business seppuku. These guys are having growing pains and this issue above might actually kill them.
Enough with the crazy talk, a Steam version is as tangible as Glzz's leprechaun's pet unicorn's seamen sample (All things mentioned there I think are banned on the BBS).
This whole thread is one big word vomit, including the unicorn seamen part. Please think or Google then read the results or something before you post this crap. :bhead
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As I have posted many times the fifteen bucks is a filter screening out the trouble makers. Well . . . most of them.
:aok +1
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why should Hitech pay for another company to run their game when they can pay for their own site?
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If you don't play anything other than aces high and have no interest in other game, your opinion is not worth anything.
Everyone wants to think he's "elite" and plays the superior game. Superior unknown game die like any other, and that's what is happening to aces high.
it is said you don't play ah2 anymore so why should you have an opinion?
I was away from this game for 7 months-and every day all I could think of was getting back to this game.
and yes this is the only game I play. I have been playing since 2008 except for the 7 months I was out.
so my opinion is worth a whole hell of a lot.
where is it said I have to play other games as well as AH to have an opinion.
in my book ACES HIGH 2 is the SUPERIOR GAME.
I have looked at the other games on youtube.
warthunder's a joke-too cartoonish-even the ene players callsigns are visable-all the info to see the enemy you don't have to hunt for the badguy.
world of tanks-is a joke looks like a cartoon-in real life tanks didna run into each other to blow them up
world of ships-all sides have id and range markers-a joke.
I play the game I want to play-not what somebody wants me to play.
and no I was not in jail or prison.
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it is said you don't play ah2 anymore so why should you have an opinion?
I was away from this game for 7 months-and every day all I could think of was getting back to this game.
and yes this is the only game I play. I have been playing since 2008 except for the 7 months I was out.
so my opinion is worth a whole hell of a lot.
where is it said I have to play other games as well as AH to have an opinion.
in my book ACES HIGH 2 is the SUPERIOR GAME.
I have looked at the other games on youtube.
warthunder's a joke-too cartoonish-even the ene players callsigns are visable-all the info to see the enemy you don't have to hunt for the badguy.
world of tanks-is a joke looks like a cartoon-in real life tanks didna run into each other to blow them up
world of ships-all sides have id and range markers-a joke.
I play the game I want to play-not what somebody wants me to play.
and no I was not in jail or prison.
I see where you are coming from, I started gaming in ~88 and I appear for the first time on the AH scoreboard on tour 21. I still check the AH BBS daily because there is no real MMO air combat alternatives out there, and wish to play AH in all its glory, but numbers at euro prime time prevent me from doing and I see no clear sign from HTC to improve on that which saddens me. So I deleted my accounts and spend my game money on other games like CS:GO and rocket league. World of warships is decent fun aswell.
My specific post was strictly relative to the steam discussion at hand, I am a enthusiast steam user and looking at all the payment options available for the games I believe that AH could gain the players I need for my own little fun to start again, while keeping a tight community. I don't know the financial implications for HTC's business, my guess is that Aces High should be a proud pay-to-win game, where non subscribers only have access to a limited number of roles/planes/arenas.
Note that I was salty when I typed this, looking at people dismissing the steam option without ever using it once and looking down on the newb plebs that could come from steam (snobbery?). I also believe Aces High is a great game and would shine from its qualities on steam, bringing a new crowd for Aces High III, giving it all it's glory back.
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I am still awesome Nuke :
We miss you a lot.
Well not a lot.
Well not at all :rofl
Steam is poo!
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I am a long time Steam user and I own 178 games, 296 DLC, and my household averages 40 hours per week on some game or other on Steam (I am personally a little too busy at the moment). I love Steam as an outlet for games I might not otherwise see if Steam did not exist. That said . . .
Steam is where games go to die. You might disagree, because you can think of a title or many titles that thrive, but there are many more that do not thrive and instead spiral into nonexistence. Steam is great for Indie developers that need to get the word out. While HTC is an Indie company they are here (by their own words) to provide a service to a close knit community. AH would not grow on Steam.
I thought the same thing (that it might grow), until I came to understand a few things about the various types of games. While a game like Flight Simulator has a user base that is huge, it is not a game like Aces High. Flight Sim is a casual game, more or less. AH is not a casual game. There are other flight combat simulations, but if you look at them they are not structured like AH. They are either extreme (study simulations), or super-relaxed (play school varieties).
There are other games similar to AH, but they are either limited environments (small maps) or limited as to the number of players.
What HTC does is unique, and Aces High should be left alone except for the graphical updates and repair of the strategic gameplay (in my mind even the upcoming mission upgrade and game types are not needed).
Steam is unnecessary.
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yeah, what chalenge said.
I don't "get" most of the flying combat games I have seen. They seem to be games about flying as opposed to games where you fly. I'm not a big video game fan so I am thinking that probably most video game players like games about flying and wouldn't really like a game where you fly so putting ah on a platform that has exposure to game players doesn't seem like it would give that much of a boost.
I would guess that there are quite a number of people who would be interested in trying AH but I don't know that they would be gamers as much as people interested in flying old airplanes. If I was to market AH I would be looking at EAA members, Warbird fans, I'd organize a simple poster hanging campaign at FBO's, I'd try to make it clear that it existed to anyone who ever went to an airshow or paid for a ride in a B-17.
That and have a mailing insert with anything the AARP sends out.
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Here is a 2009 Hitech response, I believe he has an even newer one from the last 18 months I'm searching for. Anyone who has been here over 5 years knows Hitech changes his opinions slowly. I suspect Hitech as a game business owner knows more about Steam then most everyone in this post. Unless anyone is willing to step up and admit being a shill or employee for Steam.
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Steam would never work from what I am seeing.
Steams purpose is to sell products online with a method of making the distribution secure with out the CD. I.E. I would bet products like EQ still do there own updating.
AH on the other hand is a free distribution unlike the other products. And hence steam would not be interested.
HiTech
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,274094.msg3435992.html#msg3435992
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Finally found Hitech's response to Free to Play.
While running many different searches on his responses to marketing, attracting new players, costs, free stuff and what ever else. A reoccurring theme runs through all of it. No one listens to Hitech's answers and every 6-18 months repeats their answer to how he should market or change this game over, and over and over again. Sometimes I wonder how he doesn't get angry being treated like a business moron from the bleachers on a predictable yearly schedule.
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While the concept of offering something free to bait the hook is not new in game marketing, the devil is in the details.
Limited plane set arenas at a different price has been tried before. The issue is that it does not integrate the new players into the same world as the paying players. Players form bonds / friends in the free arena and moving to the pay arena is not worth the loss of those friends.
Hence you almost completely cut off your influx of new players into the paying arena.
HiTech
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And not many liked this answer from a few years back by the constant returning to the theme of FtP to solve all of his marketing and numbers problems. So why return to FtP over and over again unless the benefit is to that OP to play AH in a limited manner to get around $14.95 per month. Altruistic intentions aside that are used to present FtP each time, the real world runs on money. And we see two weekers all the time who fly like 10 year vets.
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To address bustr's points in his first post above (he posted the second post as I had finished this message), a lot of products on Steam now (I don't know how it was in 2009) are free-to-play. For example, WT, which also has a "Premium" subscription option available outside of Steam. That subscription is "introduced" to Steam members with a WT "Steam Package" that includes some months of Premium membership. So I think Steam wouldn't disqualify a free distribution product like AH, at least these days.
By the way, for those that don't know, Valve/Steam is a multi-billion dollar company with an enormous community of young and old individuals interested in all kinds of computer games and simulations; so it's not like some small-fry operation.
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As to lunatic1's rantings and ravings, I'll just say that this thread is for adults, not children, so please keep the discussion civil and intelligent. I've supported the development of AH with over $400 of my own money (and am willing to give more if I see the game is going in the right direction) so if one of us should be opening up a tall can of hush-up juice, it shouldn't be me.
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As to bustr's second post, you're conflating Free-to-PlaY (FtP) with what Steam is, my friend. For a game to be listed on Steam, it doesn't have to be FtP. In fact, the vast majority of games, from my anecdotal experience, are not listed as FtP there. Steam is just a distribution network and you can market and charge for your game almost however you want (I say "almost" because Steam runs sales/deals; I don't know how they negotiate those with the game developers).
With this thread, I'm not trying to insult HiTech's business acumen. I've already stated my intentions above: to preserve the historical squadrons community for a new generation of historically-minded simmers (they're out there, trust me; I'm one of them at age 30).
I searched for this exact topic before I posted my thread. There has been no forum topic yet that I could find devoted to the discussion of Steam as a distribution platform for AH. Is it not worth at least hashing out the arguments pro/con, then? I understand the frustration with the constant "recommendations" to the developers, but do you see my perspective as a supporter of AH who has given hundreds of dollars to its development and is willing to give more if the game becomes more open to those without an AARP card?
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HT's hypothesis is spot on. I played the the H2H arena for a long time until it was eliminated. It wasn't until it was gone that I finally ponied up the subscription. For me It wasn't that I was too cheap or didn't want to get in the big sandbox. I just remembered AW in my younger days would soak up entire weekends where I wouldn't leave my office and wasn't sure I could control myself. The only thing I can think to do to bring in the new players is to extend the two weeks out further to get players thoroughly hooked. The learning curve is HUGE for true noobs and two weeks isn't long enough to get competent enough for people to get addicted IMO.
AH a lot like golf. Once you hit that perfect shot...you're hooked.
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AH a lot like golf. Once you hit that perfect shot...you're hooked.
Amen! I would agree to that -- golf is a nice analogy to AH.
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Badger,
At some point you need to let go of this or directly contact HTC to privately persuade Hitech into changing his business model. To defend your position here, you have gone from an innocent questioning player to an experienced insider. So which are you since like many sales and marketing people, you are not feeling the love with seeing Hitech's answers. Or not getting a personal appearance in your post.
You seem to be beyond seriously vested in flight sims by your youtube page. So how do you keep up the subscriptions for all those other simulators?
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HT's hypothesis is spot on. I played the the H2H arena for a long time until it was eliminated. It wasn't until it was gone that I finally ponied up the subscription. For me It wasn't that I was too cheap or didn't want to get in the big sandbox. I just remembered AW in my younger days would soak up entire weekends where I wouldn't leave my office and wasn't sure I could control myself. The only thing I can think to do to bring in the new players is to extend the two weeks out further to get players thoroughly hooked. The learning curve is HUGE for true noobs and two weeks isn't long enough to get competent enough for people to get addicted IMO.
AH a lot like golf. Once you hit that perfect shot...you're hooked.
again, steam does not equal F2P
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Okay, bustr, your last post barely made sense. Let me try to address your "points" on their "merits" (or the most coherent version of them that I could attribute to them).
At some point you need to let go of this or directly contact HTC to privately persuade Hitech into changing his business model. To defend your position here, you have gone from an innocent questioning player to an experienced insider.
When have I claimed to be an innocent player? How am I an experienced insider? From the very beginning, I've said what I am: a former AH player of two years who wants to have a serious discussion about a game (rather, community) that I care about but which seems not to cater to players like me anymore. This forum exists to discuss topics like this. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. I want to contribute to a greater understanding for all by talking about the pros and cons of the subject. That's generally how good discussions work...
So which are you since like many sales and marketing people, you are not feeling the love with seeing Hitech's answers.
Though I have worked in marketing in the past, that was in the computer hardware and sporting goods industries. Again, I'm not a "shill" or "employee" of Steam, as you perhaps insinuated.
And as for "feeling the love with seeing Hitech's answers:" I addressed those answers on their merits, did not I? I don't think "love" has anything to do with what we're talking about. Unless you mean love for the AH community, which I do have despite our current disagreement. I wouldn't be bringing up this topic if I didn't have this love, and if I didn't want to be persuaded to return to AH under the right circumstances.
And, again, note that the quotes you dug up by HiTech (thank you for doing that, by the way, as I was curious about seeing them) don't quite address the topic at hand (Steam), as I've mentioned in my above posts. So I think my replies to those quotes were fair and constructive.
Or not getting a personal appearance in your post.
I'm not sure what this means. Do you mean I should post a photo of myself as my avatar? You can see my flight sim videos for that, if this really interests you...
You seem to be beyond seriously vested in flight sims by your youtube page.
I'll take this as a compliment, I guess. Are you implying I work in the industry based on the intensity of my interest in flight sims? Well, I don't work in the industry as of writing this: I just like aviation and flight sims that much :)
So how do you keep up the subscriptions for all those other simulators?
That's the whole point, my friend. I fly a lot of flight sims, both civilian and some combat, and none of them require a monthly subscription (the only other one I used to subscribe to until this summer was PilotEdge, but that's not a simulator pe se and is a whole other ball of wax)! That's why AH, love it as I do, sticks out in a not-so-good way in this regard, in my opinion.
Come on, bustr, I used to fly with Pigs on a Wing (and even with you, I think) in the Dueling Arena. We're all good fellows here. I'm being genuine when I say I want to have an open discussion on the topic without being offensive to anyone.
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Business models change, AH doesn't? McDonalds just added all-day breakfast sandwiches, something the franchise owners reportedly hate, but an effort to keep the brand alive. That aside, hundreds of McDonalds will close this year.
As HiTech rolls out AH3 every aspect needs to be considered. The ultimate lifeblood of any business is NEW clientele. Asking the dweebs who have played AH for a decade what they think is somewhat useless. Every failed business will have their 'usual suspects' that show up for dinner the very last day. If AH3 is going to survive it must attract several thousand new sticks this year alone. The funding model for online gaming has changed. HiTech needs to consider what works.
In any case, the same debate goes on and on. We'll see what happens. I am confident the eye candy will be nice; and, that is not enough for AH3 to be successful. Just my broken record, two cents.
boo
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Finally found Hitech's response to Free to Play.
While running many different searches on his responses to marketing, attracting new players, costs, free stuff and what ever else. A reoccurring theme runs through all of it. No one listens to Hitech's answers and every 6-18 months repeats their answer to how he should market or change this game over, and over and over again. Sometimes I wonder how he doesn't get angry being treated like a business moron from the bleachers on a predictable yearly schedule.
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While the concept of offering something free to bait the hook is not new in game marketing, the devil is in the details.
Limited plane set arenas at a different price has been tried before. The issue is that it does not integrate the new players into the same world as the paying players. Players form bonds / friends in the free arena and moving to the pay arena is not worth the loss of those friends.
Hence you almost completely cut off your influx of new players into the paying arena.
HiTech
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And not many liked this answer from a few years back by the constant returning to the theme of FtP to solve all of his marketing and numbers problems. So why return to FtP over and over again unless the benefit is to that OP to play AH in a limited manner to get around $14.95 per month. Altruistic intentions aside that are used to present FtP each time, the real world runs on money. And we see two weekers all the time who fly like 10 year vets.
I don't think steam would work. From what I seen and heard the financial side of the system wouldn't work for HTC. Small company, small demographic of players and such.
However, the bolded part of Hitechs quote above is something I think needs to be looked at. If HTC could build a second subscription model into the game so that those "free" players login to the SAME main arena we all do, but on their screens all the planes and vehicles are "redded out" except a few choice midwar selections. A couple fighters (one off a cv, one off land bases), a bomber and a GV. Only once you sign up for a paid subsription do the rest of the planes become available.
This way the arenas get,
1. a bigger population
2. those friendships aren't lost once switching to a paid subscription.
3. those on the "free ride" can see all that they are missing.
4. a longer training period to learn the ins and outs of the game and to become hooked.
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Badger, Hitech would probably not put AH3 on Steam cause he likes to keep the content and play-ability to an even level.When you put a game on an engine like steam , you lose some of the rights to the game . This is a great game and will be even better when 3 is released. We just need to wait until all the bugs and glitches are worked out. If you are having troubles paying for the game, contact them by Email and work something out . I'm sure they can help. By all means, don't just end the game! We have lost more players than we need to due to the fact we won't wait for a huge re do.
Keep the faith!!
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Unless anyone is willing to step up and admit being a shill or employee for Steam.
Some of us have worked on putting games on Steam and know what we're talking about.
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Do you have any other ideas. Steam pretty much sucks so that is really not an option.
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Do you have any other ideas. Steam pretty much sucks so that is really not an option.
I do
Set up booths at airshows
Start advertising on TV again
Pay for good search engine reutrns
Then set up some hardcore training teams none of that one on one stuff for group noob training
Just to name a few ideas
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And not many liked this answer from a few years back by the constant returning to the theme of FtP to solve all of his marketing and numbers problems. So why return to FtP over and over again unless the benefit is to that OP to play AH in a limited manner to get around $14.95 per month. Altruistic intentions aside that are used to present FtP each time, the real world runs on money. And we see two weekers all the time who fly like 10 year vets.
What do you suggest HTC does then to fix the problem of ever decreasing numbers? An add campaign on TV? A new version which catches the game up to about 2010 graphic standards by the looks of it so far? Tic Tac Toe and Catch the Sheep - maybe new potential players will see that and thing "wow", I better try this out.
NO.
None of this will work, in fact it's been established already that it won't. Ask HTC about the returns they got advertising on a pretty decent TV program about WW2 Aces a couple years back. Airshow stands and demos, same deal. No potential players are going to look at the new version and try the game based on the improvements over what exist now IMO - it isn't that staggering of a difference so far from what I've seen to persuade anyone that it's somehow incredibly superior to what exists now. Sure, the Battleship looks great, plane models/cockpits are slightly improved, as is the terrain - slightly. Overall it's still inferior to games that are 2 or 3 years old now in terms of looks. So, if looks aren't going to attract new players, what will, at 14.95 after 2 weeks free?
I disagree completely with HT regarding the isolation of new players with a FTP set of weak gv/planes - sure some may leave because they have somehow been sequestered from the rest of the paying group, but it's just as possible that as many will subscribe to join in that part of the game - in fact, if the price isn't going to change for subs, what I ask is there to lose on that point? The player will either find value and sub, or won't - but at least with a hybrid FTP model like I suggested you'll be getting WAY WAY more eyes on the paying part of the game, and the law of averages means at least SOME of those will join, which is more than are joining now based on word of mouth, thanks to the non existent social media footprint or add campaign (which I understand is pointless now with a new version otw, but it's been this way for years, if not decades). Also, IMO ego will get just as many players to sub from FTP accounts - being sick of being an easier target, not in on the stuff that makes the game fun, wanting to prove themselves in more capable equipment, etc, directly targets human nature.
So, if not something along those lines, then what? Again, the infamous "hook" I've heard from HTC - wth is it going to be? TicTacToe with Sheep will fail, I'll bet anyone, any amount on that right now. A TV/Print Mag/Online mag add campaign will fail. See above regarding bets. This being the case, IMO, but again, the betting thing, what else can HTC do other than radically change both how and the amount of new players get a look at the game - and again, if anyone thinks the new version is going to somehow massively increase potential new player interest, they are kidding themselves. If Steam indeed turns out to not be an answer for the current problem of low numbers, this leaves little option other than the above to fix it IMO. Longer trial, cheaper price, none of that will work either.
Bookmark this thread/post. If nothing is changed with the pricing/intake model, and it's just the new version of the game, with some goofy arena ideas, we'll see just how many new subs come and stick a few months after it goes online. For numbers to return to the peaks they were at, and surpass them, IMO having a FTP hybrid is the only thing that is going to work at this point, based on the trends in gaming, the competition, as well on how little the new version has truly changed from the current at its root level.
Bustr - what do you think HTC should do to increase numbers? Just release the new version when it's in beta/done, and go from there? Maybe a couple new cheesy arena ideas, like WW1 only worse? Tv adds? Even a radical new Combat Tour like facet of the game? Think any of that is going to work in terms of growing the most important feature of a PVP online MM WW2 game, which is the MA game?
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I agree with gman. Why does f2p have to be isolated in a separate arena like the old h2h anyhow? Why not just let a few planes be f2p in the MA?
You can literally convince people to spend money upgrading their carrot patches for $$$ on a f2p farming game... you think allowing them access to a Pony D or Spit 16 wouldn't do it?
What would they hurt putzing around in an early war plane in the MA anyway?
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That's another point I didn't get in Vudak - other than a bit more stress on the trainer/support end of the product, what is the harm in filling up the blank spots with FTP players, all of whom will be potential subs, and also give the subbing players a LOT more live people to interact with, even if they are mostly just targets. I think the potential for revenue would massively offset any extra time spent supporting FTP players.
I'm not saying this idea is the only one - the right answer has to be out there, I just haven't heard anything else that I thought would work in terms of gaining more players. I do know it's 100% possible for this to be a game where every time you log in there is 1000 players in the arena. WT, IL2 BoS, and EvE Online all prove this to be true IMO, it's just doing SOMETHING about it to get there. I firmly believe that the root/base of the product is superior to those other 3, and that the team that created it is smarter/better as well. It's just very, very slow to make changes/moves. The time for sitting still is over IMO, the numbers of players having been down arrow for the last few years pretty consistently.
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That's another point I didn't get in Vudak - other than a bit more stress on the trainer/support end of the product, what is the harm in filling up the blank spots with FTP players, all of whom will be potential subs, and also give the subbing players a LOT more live people to interact with, even if they are mostly just targets. I think the potential for revenue would massively offset any extra time spent supporting FTP players.
I think this is a great idea too. A few free early war planes in the MA and a free TA would really do a lot to attract new players. Sure some players would take advantage and only fly the early war couple of planes, but it would intern make the fights better as not every player is in the latest best plane so there would be more constant action. It would really convince a lot of people to pay 15 a month just to get to fly the rest of the planes with the people they've gained relationships with . There has to be a hooker and I think allowing people to play the game longer than 2 weeks without making a payment decision while still being able to fly the weaker airplanes would at least allow people to consider paying 15 a month much more satisfyingly, than if they play for 2 weeks and forget about it or just aren't certain enough to subscribe after that. At least if anything, you have more people playing the game and much bigger fights that interest people.
I really think you should consider it Hitech, especially since the new game is coming out soon.
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If hitech could increase the player base, reduce the sub. cost per month, and hitech still makes more $ through steam, I'm all for it. I'm sure he would be too.
It seems like that's the only way it would make sense.
To put things in perspective. HTC does NOT need to lower its price. Its been the same price for the last 13 years that I have been here. How many products can you say have remained the same price as they were 13 years ago?
By comparison out of necessity I've raised prices in my business by more then double in the same time frame. A single gallon of semi gloss paint that I got for $20 in 2000 I now pay $45 dollars for now and Ive heard rumblings of those prices going up yet again.
Im sure HTCs rent and other common expenses has gone up in the last 13 years yet the price point on his product hasn't.
Thats pretty remarkable
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badger what is your point coming here? if you dont really play. if you cannot afford the 15 bucks a month and you still love the game send me a pm, I'll pay your next 2 months but just for the pete's sake stop with your "want to save ah" rant when in really you want to play but not pay for it.
semp
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This whole thread needs to be squelched. Hitech is going to do what He Deems necessary for AH2 and AH3, as he should. What have any of us done to get new players into the game?? Who doesn't have $14.95 a month to spend on AH? Very few in both cases I dare say. But what I really don't understand is, How can you give something away and still make money on it? :headscratch:
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badger85 you said your not a shill for steam--but it sure sounds like you are--it sound like your trying to sell steam to us and htc.
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Why not just let a few planes be f2p in the MA?
Makes sense to me. I guess it works in that WarThunder game, but don't they start you out on P-26s or something like that?
I'm thinking P-40Cs and P-39Ds, Yak 7Bs and 9Ts, A6M2s, F4Fs, possibly the Emil and the 110C (heck, let them have the A8)...it could work here.
- oldman
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I know a lot about advertising and flight sims in general.
I have worked in this sphere of business for 27 years.
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Steam is awesome for some games and it is definitely nice to have your gaming buddies on there so you can chat and link up in games...Krup and I played rocket league today.
The only possible way to sell Aces High on there would be a flat rate up front to download....then pay for planes/skins.
And the skins would have to be non historic...something we all know HT wouldn't do. (Non historic as in blue tiger camo and all gold planes)
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Steam nor F2P is not the cure for AH. Just putting a game on Steam or making the game "Freemium" or F2P isn't going to bring in the masses again, what will bring in the masses and keep them is the game play and that is what needs a major revamp.
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Steam nor F2P is not the cure for AH. Just putting a game on Steam or making the game "Freemium" or F2P isn't going to bring in the masses again, what will bring in the masses and keep them is the game play and that is what needs a major revamp.
I know you're in the industry (or at least used to be). From my outside perspective it seems like many games these days are either F2P for basic content, or have a set price for the initial game and then spam DLC (think Borderlands, Battlefield, really many of the popular games).
To me it just seems kind of weird to see that a game wants $15 monthly these days.
Have you studied any modeling or had observations as to how people prefer to purchase games these days? Again from my perspective which is admittedly completely uneducated it seems like AH's model is no longer the norm but perhaps I'm way off base.
I'm just curious what you've seen or are seeing in your career if you're still in the field.
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That is the truth, I do not understand the clamor for steam it sucks big time.
Why would you log in through Steam to get to this game and wreak havoc on a connection that is the tightest and most refined I have ever experienced?
You have to be right to get a kill, nearly everything else out there, just get close.
This is not a mass appeal game, it's a niche game. It changes slowly but the changes matter and are well thought out.
After years of playing games through steam I've finally ripped that garbage out of my system and won't play a game through that junk ever again.
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Steam nor F2P is not the cure for AH. Just putting a game on Steam or making the game "Freemium" or F2P isn't going to bring in the masses again, what will bring in the masses and keep them is the game play and that is what needs a major revamp.
Revamping the gameplay, would be difficult as the common theme is to take the easy way it seems... So how to change that
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Vudak,
Monthly subscription, is something that is an "all access pass" (not really accurate, but close enough).
Several times this month alone, I can recall moments during login time that I have said to myself or someone else online this is what we pay $ub$cription for.
When folks drop off or find other entertainment, they tend to find their way back eventually. It is understandable that when a player finds him/ herself in the "Groundhog's Day" loop of tracing their own footsteps, they try and walk away.
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This is my entire point AckAck - tictactoe with sheep does NOT represent revamped gameplay - that isn't going to bring anyone new in. The alpha looks and plays pretty much just like the current model, so unless there are major surprises in store, I can't think of anything else that could work. I also believe the game at root leve/concept is sound, a large open world that exists in real time, and has WW2 combat equipment split between various teams. Changing how base capture works, or the overall strategic goals of the game, or adding AI opponents isn't really revamped gameplay either, most of the fun still comes down to outfighting your human opponent and shooting him without getting shot yourself.
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To be diddlying honest, the fact that I got to play H2H for as long as I did, to really make me love this game, would never had the same effect as if I only had 2 weeks just to try the game.
I didn't even know how to type for the first week.
Now I know more about my any fighter than most players in this game.
You have a great model Hitech but I think you should take a risk and allow certain early war planes to remain free for players who need more time to develop their interest.
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I'd like to see a change in the 2 weeks free part for new players. Maybe 2 weeks free with a full plane set then 2 weeks with up to mid-war plane set. 2 weeks isn't long enough for a newb to become competitive to where they might stick around awhile IMHO.
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I hope HTC considers a new pricing structure now or when AH3 rolls out. I would offer a 4.99 WW1 arena to get the noobs a taste of what Aces High is with the free 2 week of course for the MA.
Advertising is needed to sell product and I haven't seen any since they hooked me years ago. :uhoh
It's like they are working on their new boat hoping to get it done before the old boat sinks. There may not be any passengers left to jump on the new one. :noid
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This is my entire point AckAck - tictactoe with sheep does NOT represent revamped gameplay - that isn't going to bring anyone new in. The alpha looks and plays pretty much just like the current model, so unless there are major surprises in store, I can't think of anything else that could work. I also believe the game at root leve/concept is sound, a large open world that exists in real time, and has WW2 combat equipment split between various teams. Changing how base capture works, or the overall strategic goals of the game, or adding AI opponents isn't really revamped gameplay either, most of the fun still comes down to outfighting your human opponent and shooting him without getting shot yourself.
I believe the point to the game style modifications is to give map builders a few more options. Hitech is also allowing (or may allow) map builders to create custom objects, which so far has been mentioned but no limit has been placed so it must not be a completed plan yet. There have been some modifications to the factories, and HQ, so there is the possibility that the strategy of the game may change more than we think. If it does, that would be a good thing. I for one would love to see a more in-depth strategic approach that would involve more assistance from AI in rebuilding, rather than filling out missions. Something like that might require a modification to the scoring in the game to monitor drone kills, for instance, but should certainly get players involved in supporting the factories more even if it is just fighter support for the drone suppliers.
The factories and strategy have always been the weak side of AH, but I believe Hitech is working on something to make things more interesting. The achievements were a wonderful addition to the game that helped to get more of every type of AH activity thriving, and I would love to see it reset on an annual basis. That is one thing I hate about Steam. Achievements on Steam games are the best part of games, but there is no way to reset them that does not risk a ban.
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I don't think AI is a viable answer for the main arenas. FSO, scenarios sure, but not the main arenas.
The achievement side of the game is "fun" for those who are after that kind of grind type of play. Does it add to the main purpose of the game? Well that depends on what you think is the main purpose. I always thought it was a combat game. You got together with other players making plans and executing them with the goal being to be fight for a base and ultimately the win the war.
The issue isn't with the game in the sense that all those options to fight and wage that kind of battle, like we use to do in the old days with squads going against squad are still there. What has changed is how the players.... gamers.... of today use these tools. They forgo most of the options in favor of the quick and easy way to get to the final "win the war".
Steam won't work due to the money conditions that will work against a small company like HTC. The graphics update will help if only to bring old players back to check it.... well those that left because of how it looked. What is needed is some new game mechanics that bring back the fight. The need for the "squad" dynamics. Creating these fights/combat type of action again will make it more fun for more players again. Furballers will have a fight to go to, base takers will have more players fighting for and against a base take, strat runners will have something other than dead time flying to and from strats, and GVers will be able to fight under it all instead of waiting for those few spawn camp areas on each map to come up.
Today the top skill in this game is AVOIDing a fight and most players are very skilled at it.
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I too am beginning to wonder if the days of 600 or more online players at a time has passed. Giving into that premise, I still believe there is room for a bump in the numbers. Re- configuring the game to be more accommodating to smaller numbers and/ or low (almost dead) time zones could be a better bang for the buck.
Luring new potential players to the fold, should merit them some immediate positive feedback. Here achievements could go a long way. Award perks with achievements, current perk model depends on skills that won't be as readily available to the true "newbee".
As far as Steam goes, I say move a much smaller area of AH2 (say Early War) over there after AH3 has been released. Those longtime players that may be unable to play AH3 due to equipment, may still be able to remain active through steam until they are able to upgrade to suitable AH3 friendly components. It may also, be an area where folks that play during low populated time zones may find a larger audience (if what proponents of Steam say is true).
AH3 however, should remain available thru subscription and 2 week trials, and map size / gameplay modified to cater to the < 600 online player new norm. The option to adjust to a larger population should be easier than it has been to retain the numbers getting lost in the soup of large, inactive, or stagnant terrains.
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I would like to see either a 30 day or preferably 100 sortie hours as the trial period. If you really want them to get hooked and they aren't hooked, just for being WWII fans, they need a little time to figure things out. Life gets in the way and 2 weeks can evaporate quickly.
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I would like to see either a 30 day or preferably 100 sortie hours as the trial period. If you really want them to get hooked and they aren't hooked, just for being WWII fans, they need a little time to figure things out. Life gets in the way and 2 weeks can evaporate quickly.
Agreed. Years ago we started playing because we were all WWII nuts. Now people play a game. With the learning curve this game has it takes awhile just to get to the point to actually "play" the game. You spend a long time just trying to figure out what does what.
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I don't think AI is a viable answer for the main arenas. FSO, scenarios sure, but not the main arenas.
We already have AI.
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Steam nor F2P is not the cure for AH. Just putting a game on Steam or making the game "Freemium" or F2P isn't going to bring in the masses again, what will bring in the masses and keep them is the game play and that is what needs a major revamp.
agreed
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We already have AI.
I know, but we do not have them in the main arenas. I think that they are not a solution to issues in the main arenas. FSO, and scenarios sure, use them to fill out the game, but in the main arena it won't work.
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The troops that run to capture the map room are AI. The convoy trucks and barge and train are AI. Even the ships in the task group are AI in the basic sense that they can function without anyone touching them. The auto ack on each field is AI. The background function controlling rebuilding of objects is an AI. And the two drones in your bomber box are AI.
As of yet the MA has no independent interactive combat aircraft, PT\LVT, or GV AI.
Be carful, we could end up with doodlebugs, baka, kamikaze and V2 showing up randomly to hit task groups, strats, the city, and the HQ. Hopefully the origin points for those would be a target for the personal combat adverse players.
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The troops that run to capture the map room are AI. The convoy trucks and barge and train are AI. Even the ships in the task group are AI in the basic sense that they can function without anyone touching them. The auto ack on each field is AI. The background function controlling rebuilding of objects is an AI. And the two drones in your bomber box are AI.
As of yet the MA has no independent interactive combat aircraft, PT\LVT, or GV AI.
Be carful, we could end up with doodlebugs, baka, kamikaze and V2 showing up randomly to hit task groups, strats, the city, and the HQ. Hopefully the origin points for those would be a target for the personal combat adverse players.
....and the more of this stuff that comes in the more of those that want to fly and fight in a WWII combat game against other players will leave. The game doesn't need more AI drones..... that you can get in any other box game out there.... it's needs more players who want to PLAY.
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Years ago we started playing because we were all WWII nuts.
Those players are still out there, but AH hasn't gone after them in years. The last thing we need is more PS4/XBOX players that think Furballin and sitting in a GV spawn camping at V85 is Fight
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I know, but we do not have them in the main arenas. I think that they are not a solution to issues in the main arenas. FSO, and scenarios sure, use them to fill out the game, but in the main arena it won't work.
Sure we do. I'm not talking about combat planes, but resupply is handled by drone trucks and trains (well, there used to be trains). One way to keep a factory down is to keep killing the drones, which is where at least a few achievements come from. Since those damage points are accumulated outside of combat (hiding really) I think there should be a completely new category to handle them. I was hoping the idea might fork out into an expansion of strategic elements in the game.
EDIT: Oops, Bustr called it.
Here is what I have been contemplating, but I have not got it taken to completion yet. That would be up to HTC.
No one really wants to resupply. However, the resupply of factories is essential to rebuilding after an attack. Instead of having drones/AI delivering supplies even when a factory is down, why not have them run only when a factory is damaged? Also, those supplies should run from the other factories, logically speaking that is. Young men should go from the city to training, for instance. Maybe we could introduce a few other factories that support radar in different ways, and the same for AAA, and ammo (ore, gunpowder, rolled steel, and so on). Then each and every factory would support the individual fields, and HQ. That's the basis of the expansion of strategy anyway.
I would also like to see some form of alert system for towns that are being shelled, and convoys/drones/AI that are being attacked. That way we don't have a fleet completely killing a town before anyone knows it, or someone running up damage points shooting helpless trucks.
I would suggest that a field flash another color, like yellow or orange, so if I am shelling the town from 10k you at least get a warning.
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I do not know how much of game income takes Steam or how much effort cost to develop some special version for Steam but I taking the game to Steam I should see a great opportunity to introduce AH to large number of potential players - Steam has millions of users. No TV or web advertising has the chance to show the game to so big number of users. I think it is worth to consider it.
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I do not know how much of game income takes Steam or how much effort cost to develop some special version for Steam but I taking the game to Steam I should see a great opportunity to introduce AH to large number of potential players - Steam has millions of users. No TV or web advertising has the chance to show the game to so big number of users. I think it is worth to consider it.
Did you read any of these 7 pages of this op?
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Did you read any of these 7 pages of this op?
@Zach: op means the original post (the first upon a topic)
The entire topic is called a thread.
Your use of it here is much like AH users when they use "CAP," which is super-annoying.
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My reasoning is this: AH is not really at the peak of game development these days, sadly. I don't mean offense, I'm just keeping it real. So if the top developers don't price their games at a cost of $180/year, why should AH? It's simple economics. If my community -- the one not insulting me in this thread -- were to move to another combat simulator, I'd drop AH in a heartbeat at its current price.
I agree with this 100%
You cant price a dated game that high and expect the numbers to grow. One of the many reason AH is tanking in its player base.
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That would be absolutely incorrect as far as assessments go. Even the AH3 update is not really needed, but it will help to satisfy some people that want the eye candy. Since we are discussing Steam you might want to check out the game The Long Dark, which is a game that has very few graphical elements at all. Yet, The Long Dark has over 500,000 users.
What most people fail to understand about a game as vast (that means BIG as in map size) as AH is that there are only two things that are critically important. The first is frame rate. Without adequate frame rates you cannot shoot well. The second is getting enough graphical information to see which way your target is moving. Beyond that very little matters. So, when you get something pleasing to the eye, smooth, consistent frame rates, and you are also able to talk with your friends on vox, well stop right there and count your blessings. Everything beyond that is gravy, and yet you complain.
Wow.
EDIT: typo
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@Zach: op means the original post (the first upon a topic)
The entire topic is called a thread.
Your use of it here is much like AH users when they use "CAP," which is super-annoying.
That's what I meant to say but that I could recall the term thread.
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I figured, Zach, I just had to say it. It's like the term "ENM," which should really be "NME," or "con" when they mean "bogey." Just not enough people care.
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czpilot actually brought up a good point about the original intended topic of this thread (which has now gone on to other sub-discussions). As of the minute I am writing this, Steam has 11,114,581 users playing one of their games. So he is not exaggerating when he says the potential market segment is in the millions. I don't think it's right for him to be criticized in the matter that he was for making this point, which I think is a very valid one.
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Sorry, Badger, it's just a completely incompatible business model. It won't work.
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I do not know how much of game income takes Steam or how much effort cost to develop some special version for Steam but I taking the game to Steam I should see a great opportunity to introduce AH to large number of potential players - Steam has millions of users. No TV or web advertising has the chance to show the game to so big number of users. I think it is worth to consider it.
he has a point
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In my humble opinion only AH needs a fun 7 or 8 chapter campaign style single player game on Steam to entice people to want more and pay the 15 bucks to fly multiplayer.
problem solved
next?
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he has a point
Except that the web is the better place to advertise. HTC already has a YouTube channel, so now all they need is a focused ad to run on relevant channels. This is of course assuming they want to get more players. I remember the large user base as being very contentious.