Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: SFRT - Frenchy on December 26, 2016, 03:19:59 PM
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No offense to the maker, but I hate it. It's awfully unrealistic looking, the flak seems to be always shooting at you and you have to waste time climbing over mountain only to drop down on the other side. I would not mind it that much if it was flatter. It seems to be a bomber/tanker paradise though.
So what do you like in it? I'll start doing more of it.
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I also dislike it. Very unorganized middle area. The high alt mountains force most players to fly alt monkey 190Ds and P51Ds. When you get caught low in the valleys it's pretty much a death trap. It seems like all the action is forced to be in the middle of the map because outside bases are unorganized and too far away from each other. I see no symmetry which has its problems in the outside area of the map.
I think it was good that creator decided to start from the middle of the map and push outward, but I feel like the layout of the bases make 0 zero sense, which is why everyone goes to the middle, where it's still challenging to find enjoyment with all the extra pylons like high mountains and 88s shooting all over the place. When you make bases 27-35 miles apart for the outside bases, no one is going to roll because it's just too far of a flight, which is why there is little action on the outside of the map. Dump this map and bring back Festers without the TT!
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ive changed my mind - i like it. It clearly promotes a lot of action
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I understand the design is to keep fights in close proximity, but to me it feels like I'm flying in a Dr. Suess land. Which, for me, is bad.
-Mutha
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I like when it gets reset. Strats and bases all jumbled together into one high altitude mess. Difficult to even know who owns what sometimes, with the bases flashing different colors. The majority of the map seems largely unused, save for an occasional steamrolling of a remote port.
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Awful map. I don't care how close the bases are on the mini-map when I have to climb to 15K to get over the mountains in between. It's a mini Trinity.
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My only real complaint is the passageways between the islands are hard to steer CVs around in. I keep getting hitting land message when I am not.
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I thought it was interesting at first, but I find many of the same compaints here to be true for me. I also Do not care for how close vehicles spawn to strate but than again I am not much of a vehicle guy so perhaps this makes sense for in couraging tank battles. If you have an organized flight you can dive into a valley for a bit and get out but some of these vallies are a real pain. Also, some of the basses are in bazaar places, with a hill making it a real pain for a heavy plane to gain alt to clear it followed by a large flat plain on top of it… seems like where I'd put the base is up on the higher flat land mass vs making it harder for my aircrafts to depart and harder to defend.
I appreciated the effort and all but this map should at most only come up once or twice a month, not in every rotation. Once we have some more approved terrain I vote to replace it.
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the unrealistic terrain ... dont like it. front line factories ... dont like it. the unrealistic terrain ... dont like it. I do like having gv spawns to factories. the unrealistic terrain ... dont like it. I do like the small map but could use closer air bases (maybe high eny planes outta v-bases n ports. :x ). I really dont like being forced to climb two sectors through 10k at 200 ft AGL to get to the next air field. CVs in the channels are cool. the unrealistic terrain, like the 10k cliffs around the channels ... dont like it.
Drop the elevation and i could kinda like it.
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The elevations at the center of the map are great for high-alt aircraft. People love to go there to find fights only to find out it is not so easy to fight there. Love it.
The ships are fairly ridiculous, though, because the waterways are too narrow for maneuvering (not that turning boats does any good, really).
It's good precisely because it promotes GVs and bombers.
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I like it because it has everything: high alt bases; hittable strats by buffs, GVs, or jabos; opportunities for almost instant action or subtle sneakiness; occasional 3 way fights; predictable CV battles; you name it. It minimizes the time you have to take to do the thing you currently want to do. A big winner in that respect.
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I had fun on it earlier today
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Low on my list but I do appreciate the boldness of the map designer.
Biggest problem starts are always down.
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Buzzaw was not the reason I cancelled my subscription, just the final straw.
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Hate it, favours high alt aircraft. Nobody builds bases that high, they'd blackout before they got in their ride.
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I don't hate it, but I'm not keen on geometrically-designed terrains as they ruin my suspension of disbelief. I like something that looks like it could be real terrain both on the map and out the cockpit. OTOH I can often take off from a 9K field and quickly get to a fight over one of the nearby ports, so it is one of the "funner" maps for me.
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It's the worst terrain ever created for Aces High. I absolutely hate it.
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Newcomer take on it: weird.
<S>
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I like nothing about Buzzsaw, i played for about an hour last night until i logged off in frustration. This map does not promote air to air combat. Even the 'fighter town' does not promote air combat because of the high altitude of fields and volume of ack. If you like being in a gv or in a bomber hitting strats it may be an enjoyable map.
I can't believe i used to hate Mindanao- it felt like a godsend when it popped up the other day.
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Last night was my first time on it, quickly was annoyed by the elevations and how it plays. Felt like it was built in mine craft. I just moved to the low populated outer areas and attacked a couple ports.
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I applaud the creator for the interesting design, other than that, it's a pain. :uhoh
Was there ever a map in AH2 that was an enormous lush green grass island of land with various sharp snowy peaks here and there on it, with water only on the outside of the mass of land, where the CV's would be constantly involved in naval warfare throughout the map uptime? I also believe the majority of the fields were within 0 - 1k altitude, with only a couple ranging up to 4k or so.
Does it exist, did it ever, or am I just imagining a map I wish we had? :headscratch:
Either way, I am not a big fan of the Buzzsaw map.
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I like it. Sure, the terrain is unrealistic but it promotes a lot of action.
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Looking at the swirls almost gives me a seizure. Hate it.
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Nothing. Its terrible.
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Strats are constantly down so most front line fields are deacked most of the time.
Its a weird map but people are fighting, i have seen very few sneak attempts, only way to take a base is by frontal assault.
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I don't care for the proximity of the Ack strats and not a fan of having to climb out of a field that's already @ 10k to get to a fight. Then climb to 15k to get back to my 10k base if I do manage to survive till the fuel gets low.
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This map is almost like someone trying to see what works for quick action without having to make a half dozen maps show casing each element to test against generating fast community fun. Kind of like the ndisles swap out of the three GV bases on tank town island for small airfields.
Buzzsaw has many good elements being used crammed together out of context to what the community has come to expect as environmental norms. Almost like throwing it against the wall and seeing what sticks.
Anyone notice santa asked how we all liked having radar show everything to everyone on Christmas eve?
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when i log in if it's night or buzzsaw map, i quickly log out. I dont play as much as I used to, but this two items I hate the most.
semp
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Not a thing !!!
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I hate this map. Get rid of it!
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The map just sucks....... and that's being being about.
Cavalry
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Buzz is made for bombers and GVs.
Very slow for fighters.
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I'm not a fan either, its way too busy of a map. Icon overload if you are zoomed out at past 1 sector. The strat system is rediculous, I got shot down by a strat because I thought it was my own while looking for the vehicle causing it to flash(color blind)...whats it doing behind our normal lines?
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Seems like it was made for GVs, and I'm not much of a GV driver, so don't enjoy it.
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I'm not a fan either, its way too busy of a map. Icon overload if you are zoomed out at past 1 sector. The strat system is rediculous, I got shot down by a strat because I thought it was my own while looking for the vehicle causing it to flash(color blind)...whats it doing behind our normal lines?
I am not a fan of the odd color flashing either. One side actually flashes to look like a friendly field color. That is not right.
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I am not a fan of the odd color flashing either. One side actually flashes to look like a friendly field color. That is not right.
If the "flash" color was black, it would be a lot less confusing.
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The center is great area for P47s with the 9kft floor. It was funny to see yak3s struggling to catch my P47D25. I have not tried it yet, but the M jug is probably a menace where the base alt to be over the auto acks is 16kft.
On the other hand, my poor Moss VI really struggles. Even spitfires run it down, and above 12kft its relative performance really starts to fall behind the popular planes.
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A lot of things change with the 9k bases. The high alt demons is starting to gain the advantage. La-7 has lost its speed advantage and is outrunned by the K-4, Spit XIV and the M-jug. At 15K the difference is even bigger and the La isn't even among top 5 in top speed.. A lot of the popular planes are struggling at 15k, even the D-pony have lost its speed advantage and can no longer rely on being able to run away from a fight...
K-4, spit XIV and the P-47M is the new masters along with the Dora.
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The P38J and L models seem to be able to adapt to any alt with ease...
...at least for Shuffler that is. :salute
I personally haven't flown either one at 20k+ though.
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A lot of things change with the 9k bases. The high alt demons is starting to gain the advantage. La-7 has lost its speed advantage and is outrunned by the K-4, Spit XIV and the M-jug. At 15K the difference is even bigger and the La isn't even among top 5 in top speed.. A lot of the popular planes are struggling at 15k, even the D-pony have lost its speed advantage and can no longer rely on being able to run away from a fight...
K-4, spit XIV and the P-47M is the new masters along with the Dora.
You have for gotten the ultimate high altitude interceptor, the TA152.
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A lot of things change with the 9k bases. The high alt demons is starting to gain the advantage. La-7 has lost its speed advantage and is outrunned by the K-4, Spit XIV and the M-jug. At 15K the difference is even bigger and the La isn't even among top 5 in top speed.. A lot of the popular planes are struggling at 15k, even the D-pony have lost its speed advantage and can no longer rely on being able to run away from a fight...
K-4, spit XIV and the P-47M is the new masters along with the Dora.
High alt fighting is very different. Almost slow motion.
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You have for gotten the ultimate high altitude interceptor, the TA152.
10-15k is too low for a 152 :D
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10-15k is too low for a 152 :D
That's the low end of the bounce. He's cruising at 25-30. ;)
I haven't seen much good fighter action on this map, not sure of the cause.
Wiley.
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If we are trying to attract/keep peeps under the premise of an accurate and immersive combat simulator, you cannot show up with a sandbox terrain that looks so unrealistic.
There are good lessons with this map learned about GV spawn points from both side straight to Strats, and high altitude starts (didn't say bases) for bombers only to encourage this type of gameplay. But for forcing high alt fights ... I guess ... but dogfighting is really poor in this terrain, and we are a dogfighting game in the chore. I know some mentioned it is great because you can dive straight down to a fight after take off, but to be reminded that for each that "dives down" one as to "climb up" to the fight ... and in a P47 OMFG ... climbing .... :eek: You know I fly P47s mainly and I so rarely go over 10K because of the climb. I cringe when a mountain forces me to go over 10K as I'll be back at tree top in seconds as soon as I engage someone anyway. Then I'll have to waste time going all the way back over 10K just to go home.
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-gFTOqOThQhk/UWg1cEHF8RI/AAAAAAAACIc/JHUsTzfV3-o/s1600/waiting+skeleton.jpg)
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we are a dogfighting game in the chore.
I assume you mean at the core? Citation needed. ;)
What I find really odd on this map is, it seems like people capture the high bases then don't often use them to attack lower ones for some reason.
Wiley.
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The P38J and L models seem to be able to adapt to any alt with ease...
...at least for Shuffler that is. :salute
I personally haven't flown either one at 20k+ though.
I don't know... the trees seem taller as they still get meeeeeeeeeeee :D
:salute
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I assume you mean at the core? Citation needed. ;)
What I find really odd on this map is, it seems like people capture the high bases then don't often use them to attack lower ones for some reason.
Wiley.
:lol :aok Interesting involuntary play on words. :cheers:
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Come on Frenchy you just want the environment to look slightly more real world than an experiment in trying to create instant action. Seven and nine thousand foot fake air spawns. Bases in each others armpits figuratively. CV's around every corner to blow up like fish in a barrel. And GV honey pots everywhere that are supposed to possible achieve what the old AH2 craterma tank town and V85 did for tank battles.
Now that the novelty wore off, air spawns promote timid game play. Our vets can sink CV's in their sleep. Bases in each others arm pits work better if they are all generally about the same elevation. The GV honey pots prove that there is a GV community that wants as much attention as the air community wants. The only sense of anything about the terrain is it is reminiscent of a War Thunder arena appealing to the lowest common denominator urges of game players.
Like I posted earlier, I wonder if this terrain is an experiment to see what novel features will help promote fun and combat. There were good lessons to be learned from buzzsaw. Frenchy you just want old school realistic looking terrains with no bases higher than 4 or 5k. I've always wondered how you make a terrain look real world when that means you have to dominate the landscape with signs of human habitation and activity. Much of western Europe in the 40's was dominated by farmland with towns and villages. Airfields, ports and any other installations would be hubs of human activity.
(https://s20.postimg.org/z4p3a1hu5/level03.jpg)
(https://s20.postimg.org/elu74z3wt/level04.jpg)
And this one is to give the GV community some love. The old cratema tank town long range sniper vets like eurastus and airstud are gonna love this. And airjer and gifa are going to drive everyone nutz sneaking around behind them with all of those buildings in each village.
(https://s20.postimg.org/ulcuoizyl/level05.jpg)
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From reading replies in here.. the majority agree, this map blows.
This follows the dozens of complaints from folks in the MA when they see it.
Baltic was a good map.. i think thats the name. The battle for v38/a39 was always fun, along with the furball between 41/45 & 42/43.
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Now that you have decreed it a flop, got anything to replace it with?
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Now that you have decreed it a flop, got anything to replace it with?
Yes, the next map in the rotation.
Like Trinity, Buzzsaw's removal would be addition through subtraction.
Also, your terrain looks like a far superior substitute.
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From reading replies in here.. the majority agree, this map blows.
This follows the dozens of complaints from folks in the MA when they see it.2/43.
Interestingly, when the map came up for the first time I did a quick assessment and identified what I thought to be several problems with the design (some of them now mentioned in this thread).
But when I said "I don't like it, because..." (not even stomping my feet or exclaiming "It sucks" or so, just stating a few problems I'd had with it) I was hooted down by an angry mob ("Whiner... lamer... You just HATE it because you would actually have to fight on this map!... blah blah blah).
On a side note, I'm astonished by what is being called "high altitude fights" these days... :old:
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That map that had that v85 GV base wasn't bad either. There was some fun fights there with planes and GV. Also in the center where 22 and 23 was always had a fight. I would rather that map than buzzsaw crapper map.
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I don't want the map to be thrown out, just improved. We need many different maps to keep the game interesting.
This map was quite the test much like Fester. The only way to map better maps is for HTC to stick its neck out and try new things.
I have whined too on this map but we still should offer our comments with at least some respect for the maps author.
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Just my opinion, but I prefer maps that feel real, especially now that the graphics are better.
I like feeling like I'm in the South Pacific, or the desert, or in Europe. It's one of the major reasons I play.
If I flew only to get into quick fights, I'd go to DA.
My $.02.
Mutha
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Yes, the next map in the rotation.
Like Trinity, Buzzsaw's removal would be addition through subtraction.
Also, your terrain looks like a far superior substitute.
I have no clue if it is, buzzsaw gave me some good insights about spawns and quicker action. I also took to heart GVer complaints. They really have more fun in environments like the old V85 or the AH2 craterma tank town. I still have to find out how I get Skuzzy to be willing to look at it when I've got it ready. Then he could nix it completely dead on arrival after the three months it's taken to get to those screen shots I've been warned.
I'm currently loosing my mind visiting every single spawn on the terrain to make sure I set the direction to match what you really see from the tower and to find any spawn surprises. Looking at the clip board map zoomed in the tower is not the same as looking at it in the editor about 20% of the time. There is a feel to it from years of playing experience that a due east setting in the editor is just not right in the tower. While it really looks north east cosmetically on the clipboard when you are ready to spawn your GV.
And I'm having to face hunting down cosmetic booboos that crept in as a result of working too long some days and going brain numb for it. While making the screen shots for my earlier post, I had a WTF moment looking down at an airfield. Must have been the last field I put down at 1am or something like that.
I'm getting the sense that terrains are like a box of chocolates, you won't know how good or bad they are until someone gets to try them.
“My mama always said, ‘Life was like a box of chocolates. You never know what you’re gonna get.'”-Forrest
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I like the 9k fields.
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I'm in the "Buzzsaw was a nice terrain to try but I'd rather lose it" category.
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From reading replies in here.. the majority agree, this map blows.
This follows the dozens of complaints from folks in the MA when they see it.
Baltic was a good map.. i think thats the name. The battle for v38/a39 was always fun, along with the furball between 41/45 & 42/43.
I agree! I aways liked that map too. Just needed some work on the other side to make the bases closer. I did enjoy that map for fighter action.
I'm in the "Buzzsaw was a nice terrain to try but I'd rather lose it" category.
The actual structure of the "buzzsaw" appearance is a good concept but the base layout needs to be completely re-done. There needs to be a lot less mountains! All of these add-ons and far bases with high mountains create alt monkey timid flying in high eny planes. Not really that great.
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Interestingly, when the map came up for the first time I did a quick assessment and identified what I thought to be several problems with the design (some of them now mentioned in this thread).
But when I said "I don't like it, because..." (not even stomping my feet or exclaiming "It sucks" or so, just stating a few problems I'd had with it) I was hooted down by an angry mob ("Whiner... lamer... You just HATE it because you would actually have to fight on this map!... blah blah blah).
On a side note, I'm astonished by what is being called "high altitude fights" these days... :old:
You now stand exonerated. :salute
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I love this map quick fights, keep it.
I hate this map. Get rid of it!
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I love this map quick fights, keep it.
Where?
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No offense to the maker, but I hate it. It's awfully unrealistic looking, the flak seems to be always shooting at you and you have to waste time climbing over mountain only to drop down on the other side. I would not mind it that much if it was flatter. It seems to be a bomber/tanker paradise though.
So what do you like in it? I'll start doing more of it.
On a flight over the middle of the map I discovered the most excellent "Tank Town"
(http://i1055.photobucket.com/albums/s513/ts086/Tank%20Town_zpsxxb9ygey.png)
I think the 49th will have to check this place out
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Looks like a great setup for King Of the Hill tank edition. A great feature of the map is indeed the ability for the tankers to fight over a Strat. Definitely to be incorporated into other maps.
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Waffle's tank town object forces the reverse of what the AH2 craterma tank town did by being a king of the hill for tankers. AH GV combat is based on sneak and ambush from the safest places possible, the higher the better. Not search and destroy until you become king of the hill. If Waffle had ringed the 2x2 tank town object with tree covered hills the same height as the central mound, it would have carried over the spirit of the AH2 tank battle crater.
Ask your self, why in Aces High do you never see GV's race up into the town at high speed, the moment you assure them from your fighter there are absolutely no GV's between them and the town. Aces High GVing as not about search and destroy style GV combat, King of the Hill is.
That is why the AH2 tank town crater was so popular, the high bluffs with trees to hide in looking out over the central bowl. The central bowl had enough hiding places to make spawning down there a reasonable opportunity to gain kills and survive. The 80% who had no real tactical GV skill nor the interest in dying enough times to gain it, could still take part in a large scale GV battle and land some kills. For the 20% with the tactical skillz, all those stationary tanks in the trees were free kills. The V85 spawn camp fight was another accidental genius of a setup to give players exactly that condition. Good places to hide and long open shooting lanes.
A 2x2 object cannot be placed on the geographic center of a terrain so I didn't build my caldera tank arena with one as the center. Would have been nice if it came as a 4 1x1 object version for just that condition. Ringed with bluffs slightly taller than the central mound, it would have replicated the AH2 caterma tank arena nicely.
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It's kind of weird but I like it.
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I have determined that the best part of buzz saw is the reset.
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It's kind of weird but I like it.
Agree, its a weird map for sure but as i said earlier, it creates a lot of different action, more than most of the other maps.
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Agree, its a weird map for sure but as i said earlier, it creates a lot of different action, more than most of the other maps.
Mostly bombing or gving.
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not really providing your team holds its altitude fields and some bases to work with it directs the fight kind of like the brief test of a capture order system.
if your a rook your screwed because they have so few players to hold onto anything off hours.
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if your a rook your screwed because they have so few players to hold onto anything off hours.
It is an everyday event now. You log in and find guns and ammo bunkers are down for 2 hours at a lot of bases. The eny has no affect on side imbalance.
I wish HTC would drop eny and harden strats automatically and shorten down times when the imbalance occurs. Of course perk planes would still be turned off when thee imbalance occurs
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This is the first time i have seen 150 people on. This map is up and there is zero a2a action.
This map is garbage- get rid of it.
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Still very little a2a action.
(http://i66.tinypic.com/2usvo9e.jpg)
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Like I said, it is a bombing and gv map.
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time of day I log on usually afternoons Pacific time never lack for action somewhere.
Where?
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Like I said, it is a bombing and gv map.
Just the center of the map is good for GV's......the rest is seperated by cliffs you can climb and water you can't cross
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Just the center of the map is good for GV's......the rest is seperated by cliffs you can climb and water you can't cross
Except with bombers.
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Fun map.
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I admit I know nothing about tactics and such. To me the map looks plain ugly, sort or an artificial island built by a filthy rich evil Dr. Buzzsaw in a cheap James Bond movie clone. The only way I can look at it is to zoom into the map so I can't see the circular saw pattern. What next? A daisy with flat petals and a rough center? Sunflower map?
I like maps like Baltic and Mindanao, where I can give places names. I don't care about a certain corner being "the losing starting point". After all, the countries rotate on those maps and on the other hand, learning how to win despite the disadvantage should provide challenge to the more tactics oriented, too.
There's not too many areas in the world where you could set three countries, naval vessels, tanks and planes in a balanced way. Aside the Baltic map the Great Lakes area might provide a similar experience.
During the years I've played with the idea of taking a known place in the globe and triplicating it in a kaleidoscope. A triplicated peninsula could be pointing both outwards and in, depending on what kind of a sea is preferred. Think about three Italies or Greeces protruding into the Trediterranean Sea... Or a clover like Iberian peninsula... Real landscapes, real elevations, fields positioned in recognizable places... If I only could make the maps!
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Yeah I'm about the same :cheers: