Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: BaldEagl on February 20, 2018, 03:58:38 PM
-
Why is there so much animosity against those who get their fun from sneaking largely or wholly undefended bases? When the base flashes go stop them.
The funny thing about this to me is that most of those complaining don't care if a base is taken or not.
I was never much into taking bases but back in the day when I played for score/rank you had to get enough captures to get your score up and that often required a solo base take effort. I admit that occasionally my heart was pumping wondering if opposition would appear to ruin my plan. Yes, actual excitement over sneaking a base unopposed. Imagine that.
I also remember the days of NOE as the modus operandi in base capture. Of course the argument against it was you couldn't mount a defensive force fast enough to stop it. Big deal. With the loss of NOE we also lost the circumstance of running into one accidently. I remember the day I was cruising along in my A8 when I spotted 10-15 escorted J87's NOE over the waters of Mindy (what a turkey shoot) or the day I killed 8 of 9 NOE Lancs on Baltic.
If trying to sneak around without opposition is how someone gets their fun it should be encouraged. After all, more players than fewer is ultimately better for all no matter how they find their fun.
-
The difference is what happens when their plan fails? If a group is trying to be sneaky and they're found, do they press the attack or do they vanish and go looking for the next undefended base? Depending on the answer to that question, it affects how people on the other side perceive them.
It's the same with an alt monkey or hordeling. If the person preferentially comes in above the enemy or one of many, the difference between them being a decent fight or annoying is what they do when they get there and someone's higher than them/the enemy are more numerous. If they fight anyways, it's fun for all. If they don't, the game devolves into "Runner Chaser III".
Wiley.
-
The difference is what happens when their plan fails? If a group is trying to be sneaky and they're found, do they press the attack or do they vanish and go looking for the next undefended base? Depending on the answer to that question, it affects how people on the other side perceive them.
It's the same with an alt monkey or hordeling. If the person preferentially comes in above the enemy or one of many, the difference between them being a decent fight or annoying is what they do when they get there and someone's higher than them/the enemy are more numerous. If they fight anyways, it's fun for all. If they don't, the game devolves into "Runner Chaser III".
Wiley.
Nailed it.
-
If trying to sneak around without opposition is how someone gets their fun it should be encouraged. After all, more players than fewer is ultimately better for all no matter how they find their fun.
I disagree. This game markets itself as "high intensity online multiplayer environment." What could possibly be "high intensity" about having your opponents being encouraged to avoid combat?
-
See Rule #14
-
I disagree. This game markets itself as "high intensity online multiplayer environment." What could possibly be "high intensity" about having your opponents being encouraged to avoid combat?
That just got stuck there from 20 years ago, when there wasn't anything with higher intensity. Patience required to get into the fight makes it the lowest intensity imaginable today. Well, there's fishing simulators, and there's the option to watch others play said fishing simulators. I'm not saying that requiring some patience is a bad thing.
BaldEagl is right. If there's X% more players on each side who persue activities that don't cause any interaction with the rest of the players, it does no harm to anyone whatsoever. The only thing that happens is that the server shows bigger numbers online. At least as long as the arena player limit is not reached.
See Rule #14
-
The difference is what happens when their plan fails? If a group is trying to be sneaky and they're found, do they press the attack or do they vanish and go looking for the next undefended base? Depending on the answer to that question, it affects how people on the other side perceive them.
It's the same with an alt monkey or hordeling. If the person preferentially comes in above the enemy or one of many, the difference between them being a decent fight or annoying is what they do when they get there and someone's higher than them/the enemy are more numerous. If they fight anyways, it's fun for all. If they don't, the game devolves into "Runner Chaser III".
Wiley.
And add to this the low numbers. If half the people playing are of the "avoidance" type that leaves 3 to 12 players per front if the numbers are evenly spread per side. Certainly makes it hard to find a fight if your looking for one.
-
It seems all the same to me, I mean yes, there are people avoiding combat having a good time trying to catch undefended bases etc., but it isn't like they are actively immiserating the other players by pursuing there fun. It might be more fun if they would engage more but their non engagement doesn't make the game worse then if they weren't there. OTH things like circling a field vulching without any intent to capture but merely as an expression of sadistic proclivities has a worse effect on MY mood than if the Vulchers weren't there.
-
:)
-
It seems all the same to me, I mean yes, there are people avoiding combat having a good time trying to catch undefended bases etc., but it isn't like they are actively immiserating the other players by pursuing there fun. It might be more fun if they would engage more but their non engagement doesn't make the game worse then if they weren't there. OTH things like circling a field vulching without any intent to capture but merely as an expression of sadistic proclivities has a worse effect on MY mood than if the Vulchers weren't there.
Agreed.
- oldman
-
It all boils down to certain people expecting everyone else to play the game the way THEY want it played, and I'm not talking about Hitech. Now those of you know who you are and you can deny it all you want but that is the fact.
-
It all boils down to certain people expecting everyone else to play the game the way THEY want it played
That sounds like human nature to me.
-
Wait a damned second here!!!! You're asking why everyone is animated? In a video game? Get it? Animated, animosity... Hehehehehehehehe! This is the planet earth, where people insist on making others do things their way, and complaining is a way of life......
-
This is the planet earth
I knew I was in the wrong place....
Should have taken a left in Dubuque.
- oldman
-
I knew I was in the wrong place....
Should have taken a left in Dubuque.
- oldman
:x
-
I do not see the animosity directed at sneaking bases or undefended bases. I see animosity towards GVers at being unable to locate an enemy that could be anywhere within a 6-7 square mile area before GV dar's arrival. Now that GV dar has arrived the area has been narrowed down to about half that to 2-3 square miles. There is no flashing arrow, but it does make the possibility of find a GV more realistic and less time consuming. So now there is animosity from GV'ers who feel like they can no longer hide for long periods of time undetected. Action is forced if there is a determined hunter on the ground or in the air. In my opinion GV DAR is a great add to the game and I still see no reason to remove it.
-
I do not see the animosity directed at sneaking bases or undefended bases. I see animosity towards GVers at being unable to locate an enemy that could be anywhere within a 6-7 square mile area before GV dar's arrival. Now that GV dar has arrived the area has been narrowed down to about half that to 2-3 square miles. There is no flashing arrow, but it does make the possibility of find a GV more realistic and less time consuming. So now there is animosity from GV'ers who feel like they can no longer hide for long periods of time undetected. Action is forced if there is a determined hunter on the ground or in the air. In my opinion GV DAR is a great add to the game and I still see no reason to remove it.
And who says Pigs ain't smart! Perfectly answered Waystin.
-
I think the animosity stems from those who through either lack of training, or the inability to learn tactics blaming deaths on game mechanics, 'inaccurate' modeling, poor client end security, updates to the game, or a myriad of other excuses to somehow justify their death as a result of the world being out to get them. :old:
-
Stealth, feinting, and flanking are frowned upon here.
-
And who says Pigs ain't smart! Perfectly answered Waystin.
+10 Who don't like BBQ :neener: Well unless it's shooting at you :bhead Oh and snake tastes like chicken, if you can find the sneaky bastages :ahand miss flying with ya Coppr :devil
-
Don’t know about animosity ?
Daftness more like
On knights they try and take 6 bases all over the map at the same time.
And all the bases have the town white flagged and all the hangers are up.
Knights are the UN of AH
-
I knew I was in the wrong place....
Should have taken a left in Dubuque.
- oldman
Dubuque? I muffed up and went right at Albuquerque...No wonder we were a no show for beers on Friday. Puma was furious.
(http://www.childrensillustrators.com/portfolioIllustrations/46485.jpg)
-
Don’t know about animosity ?
Daftness more like
On knights they try and take 6 bases all over the map at the same time.
And all the bases have the town white flagged and all the hangers are up.
Knights are the UN of AH
:rofl :rofl Aint that the truth.
-
Dubuque? I muffed up and went right at Albuquerque...No wonder we were a no show for beers on Friday. Puma was furious.
(http://www.childrensillustrators.com/portfolioIllustrations/46485.jpg)
Yeah! What up with that!
-
I do not see the animosity directed at sneaking bases or undefended bases. I see animosity towards GVers at being unable to locate an enemy that could be anywhere within a 6-7 square mile area before GV dar's arrival. Now that GV dar has arrived the area has been narrowed down to about half that to 2-3 square miles. There is no flashing arrow, but it does make the possibility of find a GV more realistic and less time consuming. So now there is animosity from GV'ers who feel like they can no longer hide for long periods of time undetected. Action is forced if there is a determined hunter on the ground or in the air. In my opinion GV DAR is a great add to the game and I still see no reason to remove it.
Since I'm not playing any more I can only guess based on the BB posts on the subject; but, given how many people are now complaining about "invisible" GVs, I'm guessing that for most players they're every bit as hard to find in the post GV dar era as they were before. You're right that the search area has narrowed down, but because their presence is now instantly known, and they have no real defense against planes with bombs, they are much more inclined to skulk around in cover and hide as opposed to progress toward a target and fight.
The reason to lose the GV dar is simple: a lot of players, especially GVers, loathe it, and the players that like it never complained about not having one before, which suggests the previous status quo wasn't an issue for them.
-
Since I'm not playing any more I can only guess based on the BB posts on the subject; but, given how many people are now complaining about "invisible" GVs, I'm guessing that for most players they're every bit as hard to find in the post GV dar era as they were before. You're right that the search area has narrowed down, but because their presence is now instantly known, and they have no real defense against planes with bombs, they are much more inclined to skulk around in cover and hide as opposed to progress toward a target and fight.
The reason to lose the GV dar is simple: a lot of players, especially GVers, loathe it, and the players that like it never complained about not having one before, which suggests the previous status quo wasn't an issue for them.
Seeing as how you were always at 30,000 feet on a strat run it would have been hard to hear the complaints either way. You do not have much a horse in this race. Sorry to see you go but hard to figure out why you are trying to fan flames under a roast you never plan on eating if it gets cooked. :headscratch:
-
The reason to lose the GV dar is simple: a lot of players, especially GVers, loathe it, and the players that like it never complained about not having one before, which suggests the previous status quo wasn't an issue for them.
I believe the previous status quo wasn't an issue for them because before, they didn't do it because they had to search 25 square miles or so when a base was flashing, and get to within short icon range before the GV could be seen. GVs were effectively protected by the level of boredom GV hunting created.
Now with GV dar, the area they have to search is about 9 square miles. That's a lot more manageable, and more people feel that's something they can do with a reasonable chance of success. That's why they like it, because it makes GV hunting more worth their time.
The reason GVers loathe it because it made GV bombing more attractive where before only a few people would bother with it.
Wiley.
-
Seeing as how you were always at 30,000 feet on a strat run it would have been hard to hear the complaints either way. You do not have much a horse in this race. Sorry to see you go but hard to figure out why you are trying to fan flames under a roast you never plan on eating if it gets cooked. :headscratch:
Are you just trolling about the strat run thing? Look at my stats (Havermyr) for tours 214 and previous to see what I flew or drove and how often I flew/drove them.
And I've described ad nauseum why the GV dar was a big enough deal for me to unsubscribe over. I'm persistent and emphatic about the GV dar because it changed a game I loved to one that, to my sorrow, I don't play any more. It's not all bad--the time that's free now is used in doing other things I enjoy--but it's a sad thing nevertheless.
If I were the only one who loathed the GV dar and thought it changed the game in a fundamental way there'd be no point in me pursuing this, but I'm not: lots of people loathe it, some just as much as I do.
And finally, I'll repeat the post to which you responded (not answered!) in case you missed its point.
"Since I'm not playing any more I can only guess based on the BB posts on the subject; but, given how many people are now complaining about "invisible" GVs, I'm guessing that for most players they're every bit as hard to find in the post GV dar era as they were before. You're right that the search area has narrowed down, but because their presence is now instantly known, and they have no real defense against planes with bombs, they are much more inclined to skulk around in cover and hide as opposed to progress toward a target and fight."
Agree or disagree?
-
Flew on my son's $$$ unit via Steam again(keep trying to tempt him, I'm just try chip away) was 'handed' to myself, but loved it....seems better than I keep hearing. There is SOME aspect I love not being transmitted...and no I have no clue past that.
-
Are you just trolling about the strat run thing? Look at my stats (Havermyr) for tours 214 and previous to see what I flew or drove and how often I flew/drove them.
And I've described ad nauseum why the GV dar was a big enough deal for me to unsubscribe over. I'm persistent and emphatic about the GV dar because it changed a game I loved to one that, to my sorrow, I don't play any more. It's not all bad--the time that's free now is used in doing other things I enjoy--but it's a sad thing nevertheless.
If I were the only one who loathed the GV dar and thought it changed the game in a fundamental way there'd be no point in me pursuing this, but I'm not: lots of people loathe it, some just as much as I do.
And finally, I'll repeat the post to which you responded (not answered!) in case you missed its point.
"Since I'm not playing any more I can only guess based on the BB posts on the subject; but, given how many people are now complaining about "invisible" GVs, I'm guessing that for most players they're every bit as hard to find in the post GV dar era as they were before. You're right that the search area has narrowed down, but because their presence is now instantly known, and they have no real defense against planes with bombs, they are much more inclined to skulk around in cover and hide as opposed to progress toward a target and fight."
Agree or disagree?
I disagree. GV's have always skulked around. They would be foolish to drive boldly in the open without disabling ordnance or air cover during an attack. This is not because of the addition of GV dar, it has always been that way. What you are really asking is "why can't I up a vehicle and let them guess if it's an NOE plane or a vehicle instead of them knowing exactly that it is a vehicle and that the vehicle is in this 2-3 square mile area." By the way 2-3 square miles a pretty huge hiding spot by the way. Go ahead and sit on the sidelines and pout, but I do not see HTC changing this. Too many like the addition and only a handful seem to dislike it.
-
There's more complaining than combat these days, sneaky or otherwise.. quit whining and play. Same damn stupid arguments I've read for the past 5 years. :old:
-
Go ahead and sit on the sidelines and pout, but I do not see HTC changing this. Too many like the addition and only a handful seem to dislike it.
We seem to have different peer groups. Everyone I am still in contact with from AH3 hates it. (You're still not addressing my points and questions, btw, just avoiding them by casting invalid aspersions on what I liked to do in-game).
Don't think this will be picked up on, but here's an idea...
The BB crowd here is not necessarily a reflection of the AH community as a whole. Whereas the community as a whole, by definition, is. The GV dar is such a divisive product that, just maybe, HT could send out an e-mail to all subscribers asking their opinion on the dar? Nothing complicated: just a "good, bad, or don't care" would suffice. That would give HT comparative clarity on what people really think about this newest addition to the game and hopefully inform whatever choices he chooses to make in the future.
-
There's more complaining than combat these days, sneaky or otherwise.. quit whining and play. Same damn stupid arguments I've read for the past 5 years. :old:
Agreed.
Pretty sure a lot of folks was sneaking in WWII, instead of getting their bellybutton shot.
Coogan
-
Agreed.
Pretty sure a lot of folks was sneaking in WWII, instead of getting their bellybutton shot.
Coogan
The difference is that when you got your @zz shot off in a war you were done, here we get to return again and again.
People play this game for action. the less action the less people we are going to have. That has been proven out over time. As more and more people leave due to no action, and less and less people join due to the difficulty in getting started, we WILL continue to drop in numbers.
-
The difference is that when you got your @zz shot off in a war you were done, here we get to return again and again.
People play this game for action. the less action the less people we are going to have. That has been proven out over time. As more and more people leave due to no action, and less and less people join due to the difficulty in getting started, we WILL continue to drop in numbers.
Let me put it this way.
Play "A" doesn't play at all on a Friday. Does anyone miss him/her?
Now on Saturday Player "A" decides to run around in a tank and hide. Did that really hurt anyone?
BTW I'm player "B" and this is getting old.
Coogan
-
1) I disagree. GV's have always skulked around. They would be foolish to drive boldly in the open without disabling ordnance or air cover during an attack. This is not because of the addition of GV dar, it has always been that way.
2) What you are really asking is "why can't I up a vehicle and let them guess if it's an NOE plane or a vehicle instead of them knowing exactly that it is a vehicle and that the vehicle is in this 2-3 square mile area."
1) There was more skulking in the GV dar era before I unsubscribed, and the "invisible GV" comments on this BB suggest that that continues. Of course I don't know, but the rash of complaints about "invisible GVs" and the comparative ease with which they can be found now (unless they hide!) strongly suggests they're having to hide vs fight.
Pre-GV dar era, when the v97th tried to take a base with GVs, we didn't skulk--we headed directly to target because the longer it was flashing, the more likely a bad guy with bombs would guess that we were GVs and find and bomb us. That's less viable of an option now.
2) Yes. There's more to it than that, but yes. That was part of the "strategy" aspect of the game that I loved and is gone now.
-
Pre-GV dar era, when the v97th tried to take a base with GVs, we didn't skulk--we headed directly to target because the longer it was flashing, the more likely a bad guy with bombs would guess that we were GVs and find and bomb us. That's less viable of an option now.
It seems to me that GVdar does nothing to change the effectiveness of a direct assault. When you get to the town and start shooting, it doesn't matter whether there is GVdar or not. In fact, GVdar would be an advantage for the attackers, since it would give away defending GVs before the "end sortie" went red.
-
It seems to me that GVdar does nothing to change the effectiveness of a direct assault. When you get to the town and start shooting, it doesn't matter whether there is GVdar or not. In fact, GVdar would be an advantage for the attackers, since it would give away defending GVs before the "end sortie" went red.
Ah, but that ignores the "get to town" part, which generally takes 7-10 minutes. If anyone is doing anything at the base to which the town is attached, once a GV spawns in, bad guys are instantly alerted. And it is that 7-10 minute window that slow and vulnerable GVs need in order to have a chance to accomplish their objective.
Someone is likely to say "So why go it alone? Get a crew together. Bring some fighter cover! Even if you don't take the base, we got a fight out of it! Right?"
If AH had a lot more players that'd be the best option. If the squad I was in had a lot of players that were on at the same time, it would still be the best option. But we didn't. And AH doesn't. So being sneaky and clever was the best path to success. I'm not complaining that circumstances required this--strategy is my sweet spot--but the GV dar is just pissing off more and more players, and as numbers continue to dwindle, coordinated efforts like that are more and more unlikely to happen.
It's a pretty safe guess that the GV dar was meant to induce the kind of raging battle that everyone loves. Even the 49ers! I'm not in a position to know it it's being successful in that realm--though it's a pretty safe guess that it's not--but it's alienating a lot of people who have been playing AH a lot of years. How can this be a good thing?
-
Why is there so much animosity against those who get their fun from sneaking largely or wholly undefended bases? When the base flashes go stop them.
The funny thing about this to me is that most of those complaining don't care if a base is taken or not.
I was never much into taking bases but back in the day when I played for score/rank you had to get enough captures to get your score up and that often required a solo base take effort. I admit that occasionally my heart was pumping wondering if opposition would appear to ruin my plan. Yes, actual excitement over sneaking a base unopposed. Imagine that.
I also remember the days of NOE as the modus operandi in base capture. Of course the argument against it was you couldn't mount a defensive force fast enough to stop it. Big deal. With the loss of NOE we also lost the circumstance of running into one accidently. I remember the day I was cruising along in my A8 when I spotted 10-15 escorted J87's NOE over the waters of Mindy (what a turkey shoot) or the day I killed 8 of 9 NOE Lancs on Baltic.
If trying to sneak around without opposition is how someone gets their fun it should be encouraged. After all, more players than fewer is ultimately better for all no matter how they find their fun.
You know better. It's human nature for the entitled.
-
I'll stop resupping when they pry the M3 steering wheel from my cold dead hands... I get plenty of air to air kills and I suck
-
Some maps promotes fights, even the avoiding types get into the turmoil after a while on the outskirts.
The best maps are the one's that start with a 3-way fight.
-
The animosity is almost amusing. One GV proponent claims they just want a chance to reach their objective undetected. That seems to counterproductive to what GV dar, and this game in general, is supposed to be about. That's my opinion at least. But to each his own. If that is what he calls fun and he enjoys, I hope he finds a way to achieve that.
The animosity I've seen in almost every thread on this subject appears to be coming from the GV crowd. "Bomb****s" is the favorite term to use. Haven't seen a lot of derogatory comments from the aircraft guys, mainly comments on the GV guys hiding and evading contact.
My very oversimplified suggestion is: If you don't want the "bomb****s" coming after you and trying to kill you, stay away from the air bases. Stick to attacking GV bases. You will still probably see aircraft coming in and trying to kill you, but not many, certainly not as many as when you spawn in to attack an airbase.
I've read all the threads, and I cannot fathom how one can play a game that has aircraft, ground vehicles, boats, etc.....and get upset at the prospect of aircraft being able to locate and kill you. That is part of the game, the main attraction for many, fighting against others and hopefully achieving the kills. AH has always, since I have played starting back in 2000-01, been a game where you find yourself doing battle against players in all the available vehicles.
This "I don't want the aircraft to be able to locate me" has been going on for several years, going back to when someone, can't remember his ID, came onto the BBS whining about losing a Tiger or Tiger II to an aircraft. It grew from there, icon ranges were reduced, some players felt that was the wrong direction, or they had been reduced too much......and they left.
Along comes AH3, with trees galore, which pleases the GV crowd, but places the aircraft guys at a huge disadvantage (yeah, guys in Wirbs or M16's sitting right off the runway, invisible to the planes taking off places them at a unfair disadvantage). HT implements the GV dar, which mainly lets you know the GV is out there "somewhere"......and the GV diehards have a fit, some threatening to quit or actually doing so.
I think bustr is trying to fix some of the things in the terrains that have skewed gameplay so out of whack, such as the excessive amount of trees around the bases, trees on base (I hope he is considering doing away with those if HT allows such), and fewer available spots for GV's to snipe at fields with relative impunity. Lord knows the guy is putting in a ton of time with these terrains, and I for one appreciate his efforts.
The game's not perfect, never has been, never will be. It's a work in progress, 18 years in the making. I have fun when I get home after 4 or 5 weeks on jobs and get to log in and play. If you aren't having fun, take a break, try other games, try no games, whatever works for you. But don't come on the BBS being drama queens, making accusations that HT doesn't care about you, that he is out to get the GV crowd.
RANT MODE OFF
-
The animosity is almost amusing. One GV proponent claims they just want a chance to reach their objective undetected. That seems to counterproductive to what GV dar, and this game in general, is supposed to be about. That's my opinion at least. But to each his own. If that is what he calls fun and he enjoys, I hope he finds a way to achieve that.
The animosity I've seen in almost every thread on this subject appears to be coming from the GV crowd. "Bomb****s" is the favorite term to use. Haven't seen a lot of derogatory comments from the aircraft guys, mainly comments on the GV guys hiding and evading contact.
My very oversimplified suggestion is: If you don't want the "bomb****s" coming after you and trying to kill you, stay away from the air bases. Stick to attacking GV bases. You will still probably see aircraft coming in and trying to kill you, but not many, certainly not as many as when you spawn in to attack an airbase.
I've read all the threads, and I cannot fathom how one can play a game that has aircraft, ground vehicles, boats, etc.....and get upset at the prospect of aircraft being able to locate and kill you. That is part of the game, the main attraction for many, fighting against others and hopefully achieving the kills. AH has always, since I have played starting back in 2000-01, been a game where you find yourself doing battle against players in all the available vehicles.
This "I don't want the aircraft to be able to locate me" has been going on for several years, going back to when someone, can't remember his ID, came onto the BBS whining about losing a Tiger or Tiger II to an aircraft. It grew from there, icon ranges were reduced, some players felt that was the wrong direction, or they had been reduced too much......and they left.
Along comes AH3, with trees galore, which pleases the GV crowd, but places the aircraft guys at a huge disadvantage (yeah, guys in Wirbs or M16's sitting right off the runway, invisible to the planes taking off places them at a unfair disadvantage). HT implements the GV dar, which mainly lets you know the GV is out there "somewhere"......and the GV diehards have a fit, some threatening to quit or actually doing so.
I think bustr is trying to fix some of the things in the terrains that have skewed gameplay so out of whack, such as the excessive amount of trees around the bases, trees on base (I hope he is considering doing away with those if HT allows such), and fewer available spots for GV's to snipe at fields with relative impunity. Lord knows the guy is putting in a ton of time with these terrains, and I for one appreciate his efforts.
The game's not perfect, never has been, never will be. It's a work in progress, 18 years in the making. I have fun when I get home after 4 or 5 weeks on jobs and get to log in and play. If you aren't having fun, take a break, try other games, try no games, whatever works for you. But don't come on the BBS being drama queens, making accusations that HT doesn't care about you, that he is out to get the GV crowd.
RANT MODE OFF
This!
-
Maybe should recruit more chicks , :devil the environments dominated by one sex only , like military for men or nurses in hospitals for women are uni polar energetic charged by same repulsive yin or yang energies resulting in conflict. In the beginning was the word, carries vibratory energy , a state of consciousness transmitted to the receiver ,the MA environment is like Dr. Masaru Emoto tests on freezing water exposed to different words, kind words only generated symmetric harmonic crystals ; https://youtu.be/tAvzsjcBtx8 I see the the game room like like this tests with few hundreds individuals looked in same room and exposed to "You have been killed", "wounded" ,"death", "kills". I would change this "rewarding" label words with something milder for people minds; negative words generate negative perspectives.
-
Chill winston
-
The animosity is almost amusing. One GV proponent claims they just want a chance to reach their objective undetected. That seems to counterproductive to what GV dar, and this game in general, is supposed to be about. That's my opinion at least. But to each his own. If that is what he calls fun and he enjoys, I hope he finds a way to achieve that.
The animosity I've seen in almost every thread on this subject appears to be coming from the GV crowd. "Bomb****s" is the favorite term to use. Haven't seen a lot of derogatory comments from the aircraft guys, mainly comments on the GV guys hiding and evading contact.
My very oversimplified suggestion is: If you don't want the "bomb****s" coming after you and trying to kill you, stay away from the air bases. Stick to attacking GV bases. You will still probably see aircraft coming in and trying to kill you, but not many, certainly not as many as when you spawn in to attack an airbase.
I've read all the threads, and I cannot fathom how one can play a game that has aircraft, ground vehicles, boats, etc.....and get upset at the prospect of aircraft being able to locate and kill you. That is part of the game, the main attraction for many, fighting against others and hopefully achieving the kills. AH has always, since I have played starting back in 2000-01, been a game where you find yourself doing battle against players in all the available vehicles.
This "I don't want the aircraft to be able to locate me" has been going on for several years, going back to when someone, can't remember his ID, came onto the BBS whining about losing a Tiger or Tiger II to an aircraft. It grew from there, icon ranges were reduced, some players felt that was the wrong direction, or they had been reduced too much......and they left.
Along comes AH3, with trees galore, which pleases the GV crowd, but places the aircraft guys at a huge disadvantage (yeah, guys in Wirbs or M16's sitting right off the runway, invisible to the planes taking off places them at a unfair disadvantage). HT implements the GV dar, which mainly lets you know the GV is out there "somewhere"......and the GV diehards have a fit, some threatening to quit or actually doing so.
I think bustr is trying to fix some of the things in the terrains that have skewed gameplay so out of whack, such as the excessive amount of trees around the bases, trees on base (I hope he is considering doing away with those if HT allows such), and fewer available spots for GV's to snipe at fields with relative impunity. Lord knows the guy is putting in a ton of time with these terrains, and I for one appreciate his efforts.
The game's not perfect, never has been, never will be. It's a work in progress, 18 years in the making. I have fun when I get home after 4 or 5 weeks on jobs and get to log in and play. If you aren't having fun, take a break, try other games, try no games, whatever works for you. But don't come on the BBS being drama queens, making accusations that HT doesn't care about you, that he is out to get the GV crowd.
+1
RANT MODE OFF
-
The animosity is almost amusing. One GV proponent claims they just want a chance to reach their objective undetected. That seems to counterproductive to what GV dar, and this game in general, is supposed to be about. That's my opinion at least. But to each his own. If that is what he calls fun and he enjoys, I hope he finds a way to achieve that.
The animosity I've seen in almost every thread on this subject appears to be coming from the GV crowd. "Bomb****s" is the favorite term to use. Haven't seen a lot of derogatory comments from the aircraft guys, mainly comments on the GV guys hiding and evading contact.
My very oversimplified suggestion is: If you don't want the "bomb****s" coming after you and trying to kill you, stay away from the air bases. Stick to attacking GV bases. You will still probably see aircraft coming in and trying to kill you, but not many, certainly not as many as when you spawn in to attack an airbase.
I've read all the threads, and I cannot fathom how one can play a game that has aircraft, ground vehicles, boats, etc.....and get upset at the prospect of aircraft being able to locate and kill you. That is part of the game, the main attraction for many, fighting against others and hopefully achieving the kills. AH has always, since I have played starting back in 2000-01, been a game where you find yourself doing battle against players in all the available vehicles.
This "I don't want the aircraft to be able to locate me" has been going on for several years, going back to when someone, can't remember his ID, came onto the BBS whining about losing a Tiger or Tiger II to an aircraft. It grew from there, icon ranges were reduced, some players felt that was the wrong direction, or they had been reduced too much......and they left.
Along comes AH3, with trees galore, which pleases the GV crowd, but places the aircraft guys at a huge disadvantage (yeah, guys in Wirbs or M16's sitting right off the runway, invisible to the planes taking off places them at a unfair disadvantage). HT implements the GV dar, which mainly lets you know the GV is out there "somewhere"......and the GV diehards have a fit, some threatening to quit or actually doing so.
I think bustr is trying to fix some of the things in the terrains that have skewed gameplay so out of whack, such as the excessive amount of trees around the bases, trees on base (I hope he is considering doing away with those if HT allows such), and fewer available spots for GV's to snipe at fields with relative impunity. Lord knows the guy is putting in a ton of time with these terrains, and I for one appreciate his efforts.
The game's not perfect, never has been, never will be. It's a work in progress, 18 years in the making. I have fun when I get home after 4 or 5 weeks on jobs and get to log in and play. If you aren't having fun, take a break, try other games, try no games, whatever works for you. But don't come on the BBS being drama queens, making accusations that HT doesn't care about you, that he is out to get the GV crowd.
RANT MODE OFF
Well said! :aok.
-
Well said! :aok.
+1...well said Eddie. Well said.
-
The animosity is almost amusing. One GV proponent claims they just want a chance to reach their objective undetected. That seems to counterproductive to what GV dar, and this game in general, is supposed to be about. That's my opinion at least. But to each his own. If that is what he calls fun and he enjoys, I hope he finds a way to achieve that.
The animosity I've seen in almost every thread on this subject appears to be coming from the GV crowd. "Bomb****s" is the favorite term to use. Haven't seen a lot of derogatory comments from the aircraft guys, mainly comments on the GV guys hiding and evading contact.
My very oversimplified suggestion is: If you don't want the "bomb****s" coming after you and trying to kill you, stay away from the air bases. Stick to attacking GV bases. You will still probably see aircraft coming in and trying to kill you, but not many, certainly not as many as when you spawn in to attack an airbase.
I've read all the threads, and I cannot fathom how one can play a game that has aircraft, ground vehicles, boats, etc.....and get upset at the prospect of aircraft being able to locate and kill you. That is part of the game, the main attraction for many, fighting against others and hopefully achieving the kills. AH has always, since I have played starting back in 2000-01, been a game where you find yourself doing battle against players in all the available vehicles.
This "I don't want the aircraft to be able to locate me" has been going on for several years, going back to when someone, can't remember his ID, came onto the BBS whining about losing a Tiger or Tiger II to an aircraft. It grew from there, icon ranges were reduced, some players felt that was the wrong direction, or they had been reduced too much......and they left.
Along comes AH3, with trees galore, which pleases the GV crowd, but places the aircraft guys at a huge disadvantage (yeah, guys in Wirbs or M16's sitting right off the runway, invisible to the planes taking off places them at a unfair disadvantage). HT implements the GV dar, which mainly lets you know the GV is out there "somewhere"......and the GV diehards have a fit, some threatening to quit or actually doing so.
I think bustr is trying to fix some of the things in the terrains that have skewed gameplay so out of whack, such as the excessive amount of trees around the bases, trees on base (I hope he is considering doing away with those if HT allows such), and fewer available spots for GV's to snipe at fields with relative impunity. Lord knows the guy is putting in a ton of time with these terrains, and I for one appreciate his efforts.
The game's not perfect, never has been, never will be. It's a work in progress, 18 years in the making. I have fun when I get home after 4 or 5 weeks on jobs and get to log in and play. If you aren't having fun, take a break, try other games, try no games, whatever works for you. But don't come on the BBS being drama queens, making accusations that HT doesn't care about you, that he is out to get the GV crowd.
RANT MODE OFF
All right, I'll give this a go.
1) "The animosity I've seen in almost every thread on this subject appears to be coming from the GV crowd. "Bomb****s" is the favorite term to use. Haven't seen a lot of derogatory comments from the aircraft guys, mainly comments on the GV guys hiding and evading contact."
Dundee got form 4ed quickly enough often enough so I don't always know what he said on the subject. But I used the term "bomb****" because that's what they're called in-game. If it's a derogatory term I am honestly unaware and apologize. The derogatory comments on the other side primarily come from devil505--he seems to be gloating that fellow players who play a style different from his are no longer having nearly as much fun. *shrug
2) "Along comes AH3, with trees galore, which pleases the GV crowd, but places the aircraft guys at a huge disadvantage (yeah, guys in Wirbs or M16's sitting right off the runway, invisible to the planes taking off places them at a unfair disadvantage)."
Agreed that the added trees makes it a lot easier for GVs to hide. Not sure how many wirbs or m16s have been sitting off the end of runways cloaked and waiting for uppers, but it hadn't happened any more than in AH2 before I unsubscribed. The base ack usually made that untenable in my limited experience.
I'd be totally fine with trees going away as long as the GV dar did too. It's that disruptive.
3) "HT implements the GV dar, which mainly lets you know the GV is out there "somewhere"......and the GV diehards have a fit, some threatening to quit or actually doing so. "
Agreed that there ought to be a solution for the relative ease with which GVs can hide AH3 vs AH2, but the GV dar just makes GVers hide while it also kills long range or stealthy GV endeavors. GV dar doesn't solve the problem, it just compounds it. Which is why people are quitting because of it.
4) "I think bustr is trying to fix some of the things in the terrains that have skewed gameplay so out of whack, such as the excessive amount of trees around the bases, trees on base (I hope he is considering doing away with those if HT allows such), and fewer available spots for GV's to snipe at fields with relative impunity. Lord knows the guy is putting in a ton of time with these terrains, and I for one appreciate his efforts."
Even though bustr and I are polar opposites on this topic, I agree with his approach. That's the way to do it; NOT by instituting a disruptive and illogical dar that did not exist in the world this game is simulating and which limits creative game-play.
5) "The game's not perfect, never has been, never will be.. .If you aren't having fun, take a break, try other games, try no games, whatever works for you. But don't come on the BBS being drama queens, making accusations that HT doesn't care about you, that he is out to get the GV crowd."
I haven't seen anyone say that HT is after the GV crowd (though, again, dundee got 4ed often enough that maybe he did and I missed it). But I continue to post here--and I'm trying to be reasonable and careful in what I say and not be drama queen-ish-- because I hope my voice will be heard. If people don't like what I'm saying they can always skip past my posts.
-
Listen here Moly.
I am giving voice to all the other players in this game who enjoy flying in this game. It's why we came here - to a game called Aces High. We want air combat and the changes going back to 2011 have progressively shifted this game into a GV dominated one. Air combat used to be dynamic when base attacks and town captures were mostly done. The old GV icons meant that the average player could hunt a GV with enough success to encourage further attempts - that was removed with the Storch and GV hunting became a high skill endeavor.
My animosity towards you and your ilk is a direct result to you foolishly believing that the broken MA which allowed you GV'ers to dominate the action for the last 7 years was somehow good. Your arrogance on the subject has forced me to respond to your bullcrap, to expose it for the bullcrap that it is, and to show HTC that the GV Dar does in fact help bring back balance to the MA.
Stop crying about the balance of power being moved towards the center with the GV dar. Stop playing the victim - you created this mess.
-
The animosity is almost amusing. One GV proponent claims they just want a chance to reach their objective undetected. That seems to counterproductive to what GV dar, and this game in general, is supposed to be about. That's my opinion at least. But to each his own. If that is what he calls fun and he enjoys, I hope he finds a way to achieve that.
The animosity I've seen in almost every thread on this subject appears to be coming from the GV crowd. "Bomb****s" is the favorite term to use. Haven't seen a lot of derogatory comments from the aircraft guys, mainly comments on the GV guys hiding and evading contact.
My very oversimplified suggestion is: If you don't want the "bomb****s" coming after you and trying to kill you, stay away from the air bases. Stick to attacking GV bases. You will still probably see aircraft coming in and trying to kill you, but not many, certainly not as many as when you spawn in to attack an airbase.
I've read all the threads, and I cannot fathom how one can play a game that has aircraft, ground vehicles, boats, etc.....and get upset at the prospect of aircraft being able to locate and kill you. That is part of the game, the main attraction for many, fighting against others and hopefully achieving the kills. AH has always, since I have played starting back in 2000-01, been a game where you find yourself doing battle against players in all the available vehicles.
This "I don't want the aircraft to be able to locate me" has been going on for several years, going back to when someone, can't remember his ID, came onto the BBS whining about losing a Tiger or Tiger II to an aircraft. It grew from there, icon ranges were reduced, some players felt that was the wrong direction, or they had been reduced too much......and they left.
Along comes AH3, with trees galore, which pleases the GV crowd, but places the aircraft guys at a huge disadvantage (yeah, guys in Wirbs or M16's sitting right off the runway, invisible to the planes taking off places them at a unfair disadvantage). HT implements the GV dar, which mainly lets you know the GV is out there "somewhere"......and the GV diehards have a fit, some threatening to quit or actually doing so.
I think bustr is trying to fix some of the things in the terrains that have skewed gameplay so out of whack, such as the excessive amount of trees around the bases, trees on base (I hope he is considering doing away with those if HT allows such), and fewer available spots for GV's to snipe at fields with relative impunity. Lord knows the guy is putting in a ton of time with these terrains, and I for one appreciate his efforts.
The game's not perfect, never has been, never will be. It's a work in progress, 18 years in the making. I have fun when I get home after 4 or 5 weeks on jobs and get to log in and play. If you aren't having fun, take a break, try other games, try no games, whatever works for you. But don't come on the BBS being drama queens, making accusations that HT doesn't care about you, that he is out to get the GV crowd.
RANT MODE OFF
Then you have ignored the comments of Bustr, Fugitive, Devil 505, and Waystin.
I don't need the gv/dar for bomb****ing or gv-ing, if fact I'm am getting more kills with it than with out it.
I've read all the threads, and I cannot fathom how one can play a game that has aircraft, ground vehicles, boats, etc.....and get upset at the prospect of aircraft being able to locate and kill you. That is part of the game, the main attraction for many, fighting against others and hopefully achieving the kills.
You may have read the threads but you obviously did not understand what you read. No one is arguing against aircraft being able to locate and kill you, what the issue is about is the added advantage the aircraft now has.
-
Then you have ignored the comments of Bustr, Fugitive, Devil 505, and Waystin.
I don't need the gv/dar for bomb****ing or gv-ing, if fact I'm am getting more kills with it than with out it.
You may have read the threads but you obviously did not understand what you read. No one is arguing against aircraft being able to locate and kill you, what the issue is about is the added advantage the aircraft now has.
I dont think Ive had any derogatory remarks about the GV dar. I have pointed out that Hitech has said he has wanted to do this for a long time, and it's main purpose is to make it easier the find fights.
What we had with with the new "Speed Tree" software was much better cover for GVs. Adding the GV dar has leveled that play field again. I doenst give you an arrow to point out exactly where a vehicle is, but it lets you know ones in the area and should you want to hunt one you wouldn't be wasting your time to do so.
Again, the biggest complainers of the new GV dar are those that seem to either want to avoid ALL contact, or those that look to rack up huge kill counts by spawn camping. Both activities have been somewhat curtailed, but they have not been done away with. Everyone talks about those great GV battles at "85". Most of it was spawn camping, but if you didnt move much you were dead. Now the hunt and evasion is more important, but the kills are still there.
-
Listen here Moly.
I am giving voice to all the other players in this game who enjoy flying in this game. It's why we came here - to a game called Aces High. We want air combat and the changes going back to 2011 have progressively shifted this game into a GV dominated one. Air combat used to be dynamic when base attacks and town captures were mostly done. The old GV icons meant that the average player could hunt a GV with enough success to encourage further attempts - that was removed with the Storch and GV hunting became a high skill endeavor.
My animosity towards you and your ilk is a direct result to you foolishly believing that the broken MA which allowed you GV'ers to dominate the action for the last 7 years was somehow good. Your arrogance on the subject has forced me to respond to your bullcrap, to expose it for the bullcrap that it is, and to show HTC that the GV Dar does in fact help bring back balance to the MA.
Stop crying about the balance of power being moved towards the center with the GV dar. Stop playing the victim - you created this mess.
Gosh, don't know where to start and it's near bedtime here, but I'll try to be short and sweet.
1) Kinda arrogant of you to think you are the voice of all flyers (vs Gvers) in this game, don't you think?
2) Nearly all the people who hate the GV dar don't solely GV. I hate it as much as anyone and I was primarily a bomber pilot. You think displeasing people enough to get them to leave the game is a satisfactory outcome, given the dwindling numbers of players due to other reasons? The skies will just be further depopulated and you'll have fewer people to fight, or can't you grasp that concept?
3) Since when is piloting a Storch a "high skill endeavor"? I flew Storches a lot because it required minimal skill and I was comparatively skill-less but wanted to help.
4) The "you Gvers" comment just underscores your lack of grasp of the objections a lot of people have re: Gv dar. As I said before, I was primarily a bomber pilot, not a GVer. My issues with the GV dar are based on how it affects game strategy; although, if i were a GVer, I'd have huge issues with the comparative ease with which bomb****s can now take out GVs before a GV vs GV fight can get started.
5) I didn't create any mess. If there is a mess, the creation of the GV dar made it. If you want a scapegoat, choose cybro. :P
-
Thinking you can have a GV vs GV war without aircraft "interfering" as you called it is about as hopeless as thinking you can go do bomb runs on the strats without fighters "interfering' with you.
I don't see ANY difference between Dar that allows you to find aircraft and Dar that allows you to find GV's. Either one can be used to find a fight or avoid it. The Dar around your friendly base for air cons, pinpoints EXACTLY where the aircraft are, even so much as showing the direction they are traveling and when they are turning. The Dar bar for air cons gives you a general idea of where they are, if not specifically where they are within a given sector. There is no pinpoint location dar for GV's. To me, this does seem to be a reasonably fair middle ground. Not perfect, nothing will be perfect for everyone with such a diversity of opinions.
I think GV'ers who proclaim that they just want a fight with other GV'ers is frankly disingenuous. If that were the case you guys could form a nice friendly club, open your own custom arena and just go there and duke it out, but you don't. I think you want to be in the main arena and get your name in lights for everyone to see, including seen by the aircraft pilots who I believe 95% of don't even care you are there, nor do they interact with you in any way.
I find it quite interesting that GV'ers have a derogatory name for aircraft that bomb them, but there really isn't a catch all derogatory name that I see used all the time for the reverse, players who shoot and kill aircraft from ground based guns and vehicles.
I'm sure my opinion has no value unless I agree with yours none-the-less.
Personally, and this is just my wish, I would like to see players that GV, fly aircraft and interact with other aircraft. I will NEVER understand why so many choose to spend so much time in GV's. I look at it this way......."YOU" have just graduated from Officer "school". Your commander says, "Would you like to be a pilot, or drive GV's?". I just cannot imagine there would be many men who dreamt of driving around on the ground rather than flying, in the sky, in a three dimensional world, instead of two.
Havermyr. Please come back. I truly miss playing the game with you. You were certainly one of the greatest challenges I had when you were intent on making a bomb run, and I was intent on finding, and then intercepting you. We had fun did we not? Let the GV thing get worked, you can still play and I know it will get worked out. things will change, and then change again. Mistakes will be made, folks will be happier and others won't. This is a community, come play again.
Havermyr is my friend :)
-
Gosh, don't know where to start and it's near bedtime here, but I'll try to be short and sweet.
1) Kinda arrogant of you to think you are the voice of all flyers (vs Gvers) in this game, don't you think? No more than Dundee is the voice for all the GV'ers
2) Nearly all the people who hate the GV dar don't solely GV. I hate it as much as anyone and I was primarily a bomber pilot. You think displeasing people enough to get them to leave the game is a satisfactory outcome, given the dwindling numbers of players due to other reasons? The skies will just be further depopulated and you'll have fewer people to fight, or can't you grasp that concept? And why do you think the the numbers were dwindling over the last several years even before AH3 launched. Because the air combat dried up due to the GV surge.
3) Since when is piloting a Storch a "high skill endeavor"? I flew Storches a lot because it required minimal skill and I was comparatively skill-less but wanted to help. I said "hunting GV's" which means having an aircraft that can actually damage a GV. The Storch was only mentioned as the GV icons changed with its introduction
4) The "you Gvers" comment just underscores your lack of grasp of the objections a lot of people have re: Gv dar. As I said before, I was primarily a bomber pilot, not a GVer. My issues with the GV dar are based on how it affects game strategy; although, if i were a GVer, I'd have huge issues with the comparative ease with which bomb****s can now take out GVs before a GV vs GV fight can get started. Given your adamant opposition to the GV dar, I just assumed you were a frequent GV'er. My apologies.
5) I didn't create any mess. If there is a mess, the creation of the GV dar made it. If you want a scapegoat, choose cybro. :P See the note above. So maybe you personally are not the cause, but the Dundee and the other GV'ers like him most certainly are
-
I’m not really a gv person for the most part. I don’t think the gv dar is the right solution. My one and only issue with the current situation with gvs is the Klingon cloaking devices they now have. You can have a tank sitting in the middle of a field with its engine off and it disappears. I think the icon range needs moved out to 2-2.5 k and ditch the dar.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
-
I’m not really a gv person for the most part. I don’t think the gv dar is the right solution. My one and only issue with the current situation with gvs is the Klingon cloaking devices they now have. You can have a tank sitting in the middle of a field with its engine off and it disappears. I think the icon range needs moved out to 2-2.5 k and ditch the dar.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think that I could be open to an "Icon Distance" increase. ONLY if the icons kept the same...not sure the term I am looking for here...tendencies? Like Icon is hidden when GV is parked engine off-in trees or brush cover. I really have no dog in this fight as I have no problem with how GV dar might affect the GV part of the game. I can find GVs just as well, with/without the Gv DAR. The ONLY reason I brought my opinion into this thread is this, IF it helps GVers either actually OR by preconception to stay in the game---ITS A PLUS
-
Never knew so many women played this game.
-
Never knew so many women played this game.
Everyone likes a good purse fight once in awhile. (We need an emoji of an arm swinging a purse or two going at it would be even better)
Look, aspects of the game have changed. Accept them and improvise. I believe none of these changes have hurt the game. I enjoy doing everything the game has to offer and never have a hard time finding an opponent to fight. If someone wants to sit in a manned gun, vehicle or fly all the time......GREAT! They are having fun. If you aren't, then you need to look for a change in what you do in the game. We can be creatures of habit, myself included. If you haven't flown bombers much, fighters or spent time in a GV, try them out and learn that aspect of the game. It's all there to be experienced. Let's quit pointing fingers at one another saying that someone's gameplay is ruining the game. An example: I hate being in a GV and getting a 1000 pound egg dropped on my head, but I love dropping a 1000 pound egg on someone else's head. It's gratifying, because the whole aim is to kill the enemy.
one-eye
-
Personally, and this is just my wish, I would like to see players that GV, fly aircraft and interact with other aircraft.
So you want them to change their game to suit you.
I will NEVER understand why so many choose to spend so much time in GV's.
Because it's easy, spawn camping is quick action and it's the closest thing AH offers to a first person shooter?
I look at it this way......."YOU" have just graduated from Officer "school". Your commander says, "Would you like to be a pilot, or drive GV's?". I just cannot imagine there would be many men who dreamt of driving around on the ground rather than flying, in the sky, in a three dimensional world, instead of two.
I guess that would depend on which branch of the service you joined.
I'm not picking on you. That paragraph just stuck with me.
I get the perspectives of both the GV and A2A crowd. I've done everything the game has to offer in the MA. A lot! This argument isn't much different than the land grabbers vs furballers arguments of the past several decades. In fact, it's pretty much the same. Each side wants to make their jobs easier. Each side petitions for change. Change happens. The losing side pouts and AH loses a few more players. And the cycle continues.
-
I am with devil on the air to air combat, I do gv on occasion when the spawns are close and its up close and personal fighting, much like planes I like to turn fight and stay close. the air combat in here has gone to garbage! you cant find a 1v1 fight to save your life, and I don't mean I fly into 5 enemy planes and expect 4 to stay out. I do expect when I am 8k in a spit and run across another spit,yak,la c2 or the likes that is about coalt for them not to turn and run like there hair is on fire and the left the coffee pot on at the base when they took flight. but that rarely happens and I mean rarely. at best I get to chase him back to his ack or 2 or 3 of his friends to get a fight. I say that to say this gvs are a nuicance when a field is under attack/attacking a field. if my dar bar is the slightest bit bigger no one will up a plane there go to move is the gvs (boo) and vice versa if the others dar is slightly bigger than ours no one on our side ups watched this on many case last night (3-6 pizza debackle map).
I joined about a year and 4 months ago to fly and fight airplanes, i think thats why most of us came here. i just hate to see that side of the game dying so quickly.
p.s. this post nothing to do with gv dar and i dont hate gvs just want more things with wings to shoot at me!
-
I'll fight ya flippy!!
:airplane: :airplane:
-
<S> sir you among the 1%
-
I love to fly into a gaggle of goobers. For the most part, they never work together, all trying to get the kill so they can look cool when they land, and more often than not I can get quite a few before they get me. Even better when your tree wingman, or enemy bullets killshot your pursuers as well.
I find if you stay below 10K and offer up your 6, you can normally get the more timid to try an BnZ you until they lose advantage. If you can roll them and get guns on, the whines and PMs of despair and hacking make it even more fun. Getting in a fatgirl B38 also makes people do all sorts of dumb things to try and kill you.
You just gotta play to their ego and let them think they're the aggressor... :old:
-
1) I don't see ANY difference between Dar that allows you to find aircraft and Dar that allows you to find GV's. Either one can be used to find a fight or avoid it. The Dar around your friendly base for air cons, pinpoints EXACTLY where the aircraft are, even so much as showing the direction they are traveling and when they are turning. The Dar bar for air cons gives you a general idea of where they are, if not specifically where they are within a given sector. There is no pinpoint location dar for GV's. To me, this does seem to be a reasonably fair middle ground. Not perfect, nothing will be perfect for everyone with such a diversity of opinions.
2) I think GV'ers who proclaim that they just want a fight with other GV'ers is frankly disingenuous. If that were the case you guys could form a nice friendly club, open your own custom arena and just go there and duke it out, but you don't. I think you want to be in the main arena and get your name in lights for everyone to see, including seen by the aircraft pilots who I believe 95% of don't even care you are there, nor do they interact with you in any way.
3) I find it quite interesting that GV'ers have a derogatory name for aircraft that bomb them, but there really isn't a catch all derogatory name that I see used all the time for the reverse, players who shoot and kill aircraft from ground based guns and vehicles.
4) Personally, and this is just my wish, I would like to see players that GV, fly aircraft and interact with other aircraft. I will NEVER understand why so many choose to spend so much time in GV's. I look at it this way......."YOU" have just graduated from Officer "school". Your commander says, "Would you like to be a pilot, or drive GV's?". I just cannot imagine there would be many men who dreamt of driving around on the ground rather than flying, in the sky, in a three dimensional world, instead of two.
5) Havermyr. Please come back. I truly miss playing the game with you. You were certainly one of the greatest challenges I had when you were intent on making a bomb run, and I was intent on finding, and then intercepting you. We had fun did we not? Let the GV thing get worked, you can still play and I know it will get worked out. things will change, and then change again. Mistakes will be made, folks will be happier and others won't. This is a community, come play again.
Havermyr is my friend :)
1) My overriding issue with the GV dar is that it tells bad guys that they are there, even were they to take infinite pains not to make their presence known. That kills so much of the strategic aspects of the game that addicted me to it!
In a previous post waystin explained why, as a GV bomber, he felt the GV dar was an important addition to the game. I almost never bombed GVs (never got around to taking the time to learn how to do it well) so his perspective opened my eyes a bit. But we all have our biases, and I think his colored his perspective, even as mine colors mine. My own feeling is that base flash, town flash, and shore battery flash narrowed the search area down enough to make a GV only slightly less difficult to find than the GV dar currently does. (And that GV dar actually inhibits fights, unless you consider A20 vs T34 a fight, but I've made my argument on that score ad nauseum already).
2) That's probably true (the name in lights stuff); but the problem with the rest of your hypothesis is that you can always find fellow GVers in the MA to fight. It would be hard to recruit enough people to make a custom arena fight anything but boring fairly quickly? Just my guess.
Additionally, one of the compelling things about AH to many is belonging to a team (Bish, Nit, Rook). A custom arena makes that part of the game irrelevant.
3) I bet if you come up with a good one it will be universally embraced!
4) Not everyone plays the game for the same reasons than you do. You like flying at high alt and pouncing on bad guys in your 190 or 152 or 262 and what happens with the map is irrelevant to you, but whatever I did had to help my team or it was meaningless to me. Hence all the strat runs I flew, even though they consumed a lot of time. Being a bomber pilot was my identity, but often driving a wirb or an m3 helped my team more, so I did that.
5) We had fun. :) And it is a community. But the GV thing shows absolutely no signs of being worked out. The game is progressing in a direction that excludes strategists like me and there are other communities out there.
But you are still my friend. <S>
-
1) My overriding issue with the GV dar is that it tells bad guys that they are there, even were they to take infinite pains not to make their presence known. That kills so much of the strategic aspects of the game that addicted me to it!
In a previous post waystin explained why, as a GV bomber, he felt the GV dar was an important addition to the game. I almost never bombed GVs (never got around to taking the time to learn how to do it well) so his perspective opened my eyes a bit. But we all have our biases, and I think his colored his perspective, even as mine colors mine. My own feeling is that base flash, town flash, and shore battery flash narrowed the search area down enough to make a GV only slightly less difficult to find than the GV dar currently does. (And that GV dar actually inhibits fights, unless you consider A20 vs T34 a fight, but I've made my argument on that score ad nauseum already).
2) That's probably true (the name in lights stuff); but the problem with the rest of your hypothesis is that you can always find fellow GVers in the MA to fight. It would be hard to recruit enough people to make a custom arena fight anything but boring fairly quickly? Just my guess.
Additionally, one of the compelling things about AH to many is belonging to a team (Bish, Nit, Rook). A custom arena makes that part of the game irrelevant.
3) I bet if you come up with a good one it will be universally embraced!
4) Not everyone plays the game for the same reasons than you do. You like flying at high alt and pouncing on bad guys in your 190 or 152 or 262 and what happens with the map is irrelevant to you, but whatever I did had to help my team or it was meaningless to me. Hence all the strat runs I flew, even though they consumed a lot of time. Being a bomber pilot was my identity, but often driving a wirb or an m3 helped my team more, so I did that.
5) We had fun. :) And it is a community. But the GV thing shows absolutely no signs of being worked out. The game is progressing in a direction that excludes strategists like me and there are other communities out there.
But you are still my friend. <S>
I use a Hurricane IID it does not carry bombs it uses cannons. Just to clarify.
-
I use a Hurricane IID it does not carry bombs it uses cannons. Just to clarify.
Apologies, you're right, I should have said "as a GV hunter," not "bomber." The distinction matters: it's a lot more sporting to hunt a GV with cannon.
-
Get rid of the GV dar.......bad idea.
(http://media.giphy.com/media/lF5bH6enH9F1m/giphy.gif)
-
Keep the GV dar, great idea.
(https://s6.postimg.org/lwqdtgzip/Nailed_it.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
-
Sorry not reading 5 pages and maybe it's been said but
Lets not have any animosity in here!!! After all, Its the War Room. :bolt:
-
Sorry not reading 5 pages and maybe it's been said but
Lets not have any animosity in here!!! After all, Its the War Room. :bolt:
"Angst" might be a better word than animosity, now that dundee is apparently gone for good.
I'll synopsize (word?) the 5 pages for you in 5 sentences.
Fighter pilots mostly love the GV dar because they think GVs hide too easily in AH3 and hope GVers will now fly planes vs drive GVs now that GVing is less fun.
The A20 ilk totally love it because they have early warning of a target, and a narrowed down search area.
Gvers and strategists almost universally hate it because it makes bombing relatively defenseless GVs relatively easy and limits offensive creativity.
I actually left the game because of it, and so have several others. It's unhistoric and changes part of the game in a fundamental way.
And for my 5th sentence, nice riff on Dr. Strangelove. :aok
-
To me the fix is to easy......
I think the ground radar is to gamely to be in a combat simulation, but if you're going to have it, tie it to the radar tower. If the tower is up you have both ground and air dar....
radar tower down.... You have neither.
CAV
-
To me the fix is to easy......
I think the ground radar is to gamely to be in a combat simulation, but if you're going to have it, tie it to the radar tower. If the tower is up you have both ground and air dar....
radar tower down.... You have neither.
Agreed. Except you also have to harden the radar towers. It's not like we don't already have enough suicide radar shooters.
- oldman
-
To me the fix is to easy......
I think the ground radar is to gamely to be in a combat simulation, but if you're going to have it, tie it to the radar tower. If the tower is up you have both ground and air dar....
radar tower down.... You have neither.
CAV
Just playing the devil's advocate here: So if the GV dar is tied to radar tower, and when the dar tower is taken down, the defending GV guys lose their dar.
But do the attackers still have GV dar? Unless the bases are close enough for there to be overlapping dar bars, the attackers should lose it too, right?
Makes me no difference.....I've been through the various gameplay changes introduced over the years. I'll stick around and see what happens, regardless. Not trying to be oppositional or argumentative. Just trying to see both sides of your idea.
Because it is a game, there are, always have been, and always will be limitations. We see things on a 2D screen when our MkI eyeballs are far more capable of picking things out in RL than what we are able to see on a screen.
My own thoughts are that until HTC can find a way to code in GV tracks, blast effect from the main guns firing, and other "realistic" things that one would see on a RL battlefield, the GV dar and icons are a needed compromise. The issue, from what I've read, is how to code them in without causing framerate issues. Just like the wish for planes at high alts to leave contrails.........I am all for that. Would increase the immersive effect, and be more "realistic". What I find unrealistic is 20 and 30 ton tracked vehicles driving around on "soft" ground like we have in the arenas, leaving no tracks, and the GV crowd is fine with that. It's been called cloaking, invisibility, stealth, etc......justified by those whose main play is in GV's so that their "defenseless" GV don't get bombed by defending aircraft.
So, the GV's can ID aircraft from 6K or more away, determine plane type, country, and distance....yet they remain invisible til what? 1K? 1.5?
I think the GV dar was and is needed, at least until some of the limitations can be overcome. Until GV's leave tracks on soft ground, leave a visible exhaust haze (for those whose engines were known for smoking while running), the blast effect from the main guns are modelled (watch wartime footage of tank cannon firing.....the dust and smoke hang around and give your position away), the GV dar is a good compromise. It doesn't pinpoint a GV's exact location, but it gives a rough idea on their movement.
If you want realism, ask for full realism, not just selective realism.
-
+10 Who don't like BBQ :neener: Well unless it's shooting at you :bhead Oh and snake tastes like chicken, if you can find the sneaky bastages :ahand miss flying with ya Coppr :devil
:furious
-
GV dar is bad. It ran off half my squad. They might come back if you get rid of it.
-
:O
:furious
Was it something I said? :uhoh OH,RIGHT! I LOVE BBQ of ALL kinds...sorry SAM :devil
-
Harken back to the late night early mid war arena. Maybe 6 Rooks on and taking bases with no opposition and then a Knight or Bishop logs on shows up at a base, ambushes Them and spoils the base taking . I sure miss that. I would much rather play than win. many wouldn't and It upsets Them... maybe They should play Solataire.
-
Dont ~Joke~
-
People can lose at Solitaire. :old:
-
How about no gv dar but the old gv icon distances?
As a pilot that would make me happy.
Tank drivers, what say you?
-
How about no gv dar but the old gv icon distances?
As a pilot that would make me happy.
Tank drivers, what say you?
He weighed in already :devil
-
How about no gv dar but the old gv icon distances?
As a pilot that would make me happy.
Tank drivers, what say you?
What are the old GV icon distances?
-
What are the old GV icon distances?
More than they are now, dont remember the specific distance. Like it was a while before the stork.
-
The old "back in the day" icon ranges for GV's and everything was 6K. I agree that was perhaps a bit much.
Try 3K and see how it works out.