p-47's kill Tigers

[TheZohan]

even if i posted about someone saying the flipped a tiger II with a bomb what creditablity would you give it? i just read a thread saying pilot saying they where killing tigers because it sounded better when they reported it. i am just repeating what someone else had reported and i am hoping they are being truthful. they very well may not. but the fact its very possible it could have happen is a very lack of insight on your own part.  

[Masherbrum]

even if i posted about someone saying the flipped a tiger II with a bomb what creditablity would you give it? i just read a thread saying pilot saying they where killing tigers because it sounded better when they reported it. i am just repeating what someone else had reported and i am hoping they are being truthful. they very well may not. but the fact its very possible it could have happen is a very lack of insight on your own part.  

Do you understand the difference behind a Tiger I and II?   Or are you just failing not to see what is going on?   The ONLY one in this entire discussion is yourself.   

Again, provide a SOURCE (book, etc) that says "IL2 pilots intentionally flipped over tanks."    6 pages later we're still waiting.   Now you're saying "this is something you heard."   Which is it?    You made the claims, back them up.   

[TheZohan]

this is a report of a modern tank being flipped over

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1218814,00.html

As the two tanks came rumbling back with their wounded cargo, they came under fire. A missile blasted one of the Merkav 4s, killing a soldier and injuring a battalion commander. The second ran over a large explosive device planted by Hizballah that is identical to those used to such devastating effect against U.S. armored forces in Iraq. The force of the blast flipped over the 65-ton tank, killing the vehicle's commander and injuring three other crew. Earlier in the 12-day ground offensive, the Israelis had lost another tank to a hidden mine, killing four men.

[bongaroo]

How many times do we have to remind you that an anti tank mine that the tank rolls over is in a whole different ball park to an air dropped bomb landing beside a tank?

You sir are about as dense as they come.

[Ack-Ack]

Again, provide a SOURCE (book, etc) that says "IL2 pilots intentionally flipped over tanks."    6 pages later we're still waiting.   Now you're saying "this is something you heard."   Which is it?    You made the claims, back them up.   

Sounds like WW2OL when you used to be able to flip tanks over with the Ju87's landing gear.  Maybe that's where he is basing his info on 


ack-ack

[TheZohan]

How many times do we have to remind you that an anti tank mine that the tank rolls over is in a whole different ball park to an air dropped bomb landing beside a tank?

You sir are about as dense as they come.

a 500lb bomb would have more power then a anti-tank mind. and i already proven that a tiger can be flipped from a bomb drop.  and if you noticed theres things called craters left by bombs meaning the blast is forced upward when they hit the ground. which would cause a upward force. i am gonna just end this thread if you want to comment how it cant happen then go right ahead.

[Masherbrum]

a 500lb bomb would have more power then a anti-tank mind. and i already proven that a tiger can be flipped from a bomb drop.  and if you noticed theres things called craters left by bombs meaning the blast is forced upward when they hit the ground. which would cause a upward force. i am gonna just end this thread if you want to comment how it cant happen then go right ahead.

They have the very potential to be equal.   A shaped charge can have just as equal of effect on a tank, as a 500 lb bomb dropped near a tank in say.. sandy soil.     

You should have ended it a long time ago, but you will NOT provide a source of these "IL2" stories.   The game "IL2" does not count. 

[AWwrgwy]

I also still contend that all of the tanks flipped "by a bomb drop" were flipped by massive amounts of bombs impacting at the same time, not a single 500 pound bomb.

There is a picture of a tank hit by naval artillery in Normandy.  Pretty much just a pile of tank.


wrongway

[Ack-Ack]

I also still contend that all of the tanks flipped "by a bomb drop" were flipped by massive amounts of bombs impacting at the same time, not a single 500 pound bomb.

wrongway

Which is probably the most plausible cause, especially if it happened during some of the carpet bombing offensives in support of the Normandy landings and breakout.


ack-ack

[bongaroo]

He still thinks he's right.  Oh man.

[MORAY37]

 

My brain just imploded from all the math..... using trig and physics (Bongaroo, we could probably solve this baby with a little time...), at a detonation point of 50 feet from the direct side of our hypothetical tank, you cannot impart enough force to shift 50 tons around its' axis against gravity, on a horizontal plane.  You may POSSIBLY move it sideways, if the Tiger is inclined past 25 degrees though..  interesting question there.

Underneath, it takes considerably less.  An AT mine of 10 pounds HE can do it, due to the direct impart of force on the target, and owing to it directly acting opposite to the weight (F-gravity).  By my take, around 540 pounds or so of TNT would be required, from an air dropped ord.  A 500 lb allied bomb had about 170lbs TNT, IIRC.

Suffice to say, the percentage yield of one bomb against the side of the target Tiger tank is not enough to flip it.  Kill the crew, yes.... impart enough 3 dimensional force to flip it... no.  Multiple bombs imparting harmonic discourse upon the Tiger from one side, would likely do it, though.

These are the kinds of problems I loved doing in Physics back in college.... bookended by drinking, of course.

[Murdr]

Another note, does anyone know exactly how much explosive was in a 500 lb frag bomb?  For example, what percentage of the bombs mass is explosive versus the case?

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/wiki/index.php/500lb_bomb

[Stoney]

Are there any pictures of Tigers or Panthers in other theaters (Italy, Africa, Russia, etc.) that are flipped over in a similar manner?

p.s. Thanks for the link Murdr.  I guess I need to go to the Wiki first from now on considering how many excellent resources you're including there.