Author Topic: Garand vs Enfield vs Kar 98 (Read 4168 times)

lazs2 · « **Reply #75 on:** March 12, 2004, 08:06:10 AM »

dune... I agree.. The mg 34/42 were superior weapons.. we had nothing like them. From What I have heard the Bren is a fine gun too.

Verm... you know that because of the gas system and operating rods the Garrand is more accurate and rugged than the M14?

tronski... the SMLE that I have is an australian armory one that was, so far as I could tell... unfired. It is mint. I paid a whopping $100 for it.

lazs

Saurdaukar · « **Reply #76 on:** March 12, 2004, 08:14:00 AM »

Never shot an Enfield.

Between the M1 and the 98 - Id rather shoot at people shooting at me with the Garand, but I much prefer the 98 for target shooting.

Virage · « **Reply #77 on:** March 12, 2004, 08:17:41 AM »

why does the garand make thumbs bloody?

I'd rather have a squad of garand's than a squad of bolt action rifles.

Saurdaukar · « **Reply #78 on:** March 12, 2004, 08:22:33 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Virage
why does the garand make thumbs bloody?

I'd rather have a squad of garand's than a squad of bolt action rifles.

The action has a tendancy to slam closed on your thumb immediately following a reload.

Dowding · « **Reply #79 on:** March 12, 2004, 08:22:38 AM »

What did a US rifle squad have as infantry support? The BAR?

If you were going to choose an historical rifle squad, I'd much rather have bolt action supported by an LMG. Seems more versatile.

lazs2 · « **Reply #80 on:** March 12, 2004, 08:38:00 AM »

dowding.. the U.S. used the BAR and the browning 30 cal light mg. The mg 34/42 was superior as long as you had the ammo for it. The bar was heavy and had only a 20 round mag. The BLMG was very heavy (especially in water cooled version) and took a crew. Thompson sub machine guns and M1 carbines were also very common.

There would be no reason to use a bolt action like the enfield over the Garrand.. The garrand was more accurate, easier to shoot, more powerful and did not force extra motion of working bolts to expose position. The bolt rifle was obsolete for infantry the minute the Garrand came out. It was useable but far outclassed. Two guys with Garrands could lay down a lot of firepower..

lazs

Dowding · « **Reply #81 on:** March 12, 2004, 09:00:40 AM »

According to the web a standard 1944-45 US Rifle platoon would not carry a .30 cal MG. That was placed in a separate LMG section. Whereas a British rifle squad of the same period would have an integrated Bren LMG within the squad.

I'm sure the Garand is a fine weapon, but I don't understand why a bolt action would expose a soldier's position more than the semi-auto. The hand only needs to move a few inches up from the trigger.

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #82 on:** March 12, 2004, 09:13:13 AM »

Quote

In fact I've been wanting to pick up a new M-14 from Springfield for the past couple of years. Very pricey though, when the base models start at $1,500 and go UP from there.

Lol, we were debating whether to get an M1a or head to the CMP store. The CMP Store won, and we got 2 Garands, and 1 springfield this tuesday.

But the M1a is the next gun we'll be getting.

Quote

The action has a tendancy to slam closed on your thumb immediately following a reload.

If you push down the follower in the reciever, it releases the action. Thus, if you have nothing to stop it, it's going to slam shut on your thumb. Rather painfully too. Hence the term, "M1 Thumb."

Rino · « **Reply #83 on:** March 12, 2004, 09:39:41 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by -tronski-
I think it's Lost Battalion with Rick Schroder
IMDB

Tronsky

Just FYI, the Lost Battalion is not about Belleau Wood, it's
another story altogether, a very good one.

Rino · « **Reply #84 on:** March 12, 2004, 09:41:16 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by _Schadenfreude_
Anyway the killers at section level are the crew served weapons, both the Bristish and the Germans had excellent mg's in the Bren and MG34/42.

For America who didn't have a decent lmg the Garand was more important.

The Americans did have the M1919 series from Browning, air
cooled, belt fed 30-06 caliber. I'd take it over the Bren anyday
of the week.

Rino · « **Reply #85 on:** March 12, 2004, 09:44:37 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Dowding
According to the web a standard 1944-45 US Rifle platoon would not carry a .30 cal MG. That was placed in a separate LMG section. Whereas a British rifle squad of the same period would have an integrated Bren LMG within the squad.

I'm sure the Garand is a fine weapon, but I don't understand why a bolt action would expose a soldier's position more than the semi-auto. The hand only needs to move a few inches up from the trigger.

Good point Dowding, although a US infantry company did
usually have a weapons platoon with lmgs and mortars. Perhaps
the firepower provided by semi-auto rifles was able to
compensate for that provided by the Bren.

I don't think the bolt would expose the soldier more, but I am
sure it would take a real pro to keep his sight picture steady
while working the bolt.

lord dolf vader · « **Reply #86 on:** March 12, 2004, 09:57:08 AM »

the garand uses a clip as opposed to a magazine.

when you load the "clip" (c shaped metal bullet holder) and it seats in the action the bolt is released at the same time.

you learn to put the clip in with your left hand and use the bottom of your right hand to let the slide come forward in a sort of reverse karate chop action.

if you just push the clip in the breach closes on your thum. and it is a very very strong spring and heavy bolt. just short of mutilation level. ouch.

_Schadenfreude_ · « **Reply #87 on:** March 12, 2004, 11:29:39 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Rino
The Americans did have the M1919 series from Browning, air
cooled, belt fed 30-06 caliber. I'd take it over the Bren anyday
of the week.

I've used both - Browning is very good but very heavy - try taking one on a 12 mile run, also the 4.5 clicks for the barrel spacing and keeping the damn links from rusting up were a pain in the bellybutton - for a squad weapon Bren for WW2 was far better, for now I'd take the MAG - the Belgians make superb weapons.....

Vermillion · « **Reply #88 on:** March 12, 2004, 11:32:53 AM »

Lazs, maybe so. I've never fired either one enough to make that sort of judgement. But I do know that the new Springfield M1A National Match Rifles (high quality M-14's) are suppose to be damn accurate.

I was looking for an "in between" all purpose rifle. Something with a little more range and knockdown power than an assault rifle, but still clip fed and a semi-auto. With something like the M-14 and a high quality scope, you can go Deer hunting, varmit hunting, sport shooting, or just about anything. Nice all arounder. But still has quick loading and follow up shot capability.

Plus it doesn't look like an evil "machine gun" or "assault rifle".

I challenged my wife when I first met her (she's a pretty far left liberal) to tell me which was the "assault rifle". A pre ban Mini-14, a pre ban AR-15, and a post ban Colt Sporter (CAR-15 with fixed stock). She of course picked the less threatening looking Mini-14.

LOL! Now I have her interested in guns, and asking to go shoot all the time.

Boroda · « **Reply #89 on:** March 12, 2004, 11:45:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by GScholz
They made 425,977 MP-43's, MP-44's and StG-44's during the war (they were the same weapon). Had the war continued another year it would have replaced every rifle, submachinegun and light machinegun in the German army. After the war the StG44 resulted in the outright replacement of almost every infantry gun in the western world, serving as the direct inspiration for the AK-47, the most prolific gun in the world, and the indirect inspiration for practically everything else.

I mean - just look how StG and M-16 disassemble

But IIRC M-16 has a rotating bolt (lock? i am not familiar with English weapon terms) like Kalashnikov, while StG has a different locking mechanism.

Here in Russia it's a common legend that Kalashnikov simply copied the StG, they look similar to many people, while they are absolutely different inside.