Author Topic: $2.61/gal  (Read 7438 times)

Offline NUKE

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« Reply #180 on: May 16, 2004, 11:45:28 PM »
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Originally posted by GScholz
Last year the 15 member states of the EU spent about half as much as the US defence budget. Europe has 45 nations (including Russia). Even if you exclude Russia, the remaining 44 European nations probably spend more on defence than the US. If you want you look up the defence budgets for all European nations and compare them to the US, go right ahead. I'm not going to spend hours searching the net.


The US is as much a part of the European military as you or anyone else is.

Offline NUKE

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« Reply #181 on: May 16, 2004, 11:49:15 PM »
Based on Gsholz's arguments, the US combined with the rest of the world, spends more on the European military than his country does.

Offline NUKE

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« Reply #182 on: May 16, 2004, 11:50:13 PM »
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Originally posted by GScholz
No, I've never made that claim.
 oh, really?

Offline NUKE

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« Reply #183 on: May 16, 2004, 11:50:51 PM »
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Originally posted by GScholz
Based on what?


NATO

Offline NUKE

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« Reply #184 on: May 16, 2004, 11:52:37 PM »
I'm done Gsholz, you are really not providing an intelligent argument.

Offline lada

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« Reply #185 on: May 17, 2004, 03:32:05 AM »
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Originally posted by NUKE
hello? Who commands the European military?

 


UN ?


since we do not terrorize any region, we do not need central command, but in peace missions.

Offline Thrawn

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« Reply #186 on: May 17, 2004, 04:23:52 AM »
Some of our American friends seem to forget that thier standard of living is subsidised by the rest of the world to a tune of $500,000,000,000 last year.  The EU made up over 94 billion dollars of that subsidy.

Offline Steve

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« Reply #187 on: May 17, 2004, 04:56:17 AM »
Subsidized?  I don't remember any handouts.  Did I get in the wrong line again?!!!  :)

Nuttin wrong w/ loving one's country.  I'm sure Norway is a grand place... been to Canada for a few hockey tourneys... always had fun.  Have several Canadian friends... to be honest they tell me they'd prefer to live in U.S. due to lower income taxes.
I'm not sayin U.S. is better... but I wouldn't rather live anywhere else.   :)
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Offline Thrawn

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« Reply #188 on: May 17, 2004, 05:04:52 AM »
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Originally posted by Steve
Subsidized?  I don't remember any handouts.  Did I get in the wrong line again?!!!  :)


That's understandable, the subsidy last year was in the form of a five hundred billion dollar trade deficiate.  Basically, the US got five hundred billion dollars worth of goods/services (resources by any other name...) basically for free.  


"I'm not sayin U.S. is better... but I wouldn't rather live anywhere else."

In alot of ways the US is better, and I'm glad you live in the country you love the best.  Sometimes I feel like I'm living in the country I hate the least.  ;)

Offline strk

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« Reply #189 on: May 17, 2004, 05:47:21 AM »
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Originally posted by Toad
Strk, like everything else, it's not an issue that is easily generalized.

For example, how much of our current health care costs are driven by our "somebody has to pay" legal system in which attorneys get huge percentages of the settlements? A system where "shot in the dark" lawsuits are common because the hope is the target will settle rather than litigate? In short, what piece of the action are the trial lawyers getting? I see you hammering those evil insurance companies, but not the Association of Trial Lawyers of America.

This is one huge lobbying machine. They're rabidly against tort reform. Who do they contribute to the most in order to achieve their goals?



You're after the insurance companies and rightfully so. It is unconscionable what they pay a CEO of HMO because the ones that make them most are the ones most successful at minimizing client benefits. Not to mention the other dirty tricks they pull, like authorizing medications based on pharmaceutical company kickbacks. They need their house cleaned.

But what's your position on tort reform? That probably has as much to do with health care costs here as anything the insurance companies do.

I'm not really deeply informed on Vermont's health care but could you read this article and tell me of any inaccuracies you find?





Vermont's Badly Managed Care


first of all, dont bother linking to RW spin trash like the Weekly Standard.  You might as well site Matt Drudge or Rushbo.

Second - Med Mal does increase insurance premiums - but premiums also go up when insurance stock investments go south - this is well documented.  Also people who have been injure by Med Mal need a system to redress those injuries, and bad things do happen.  Also in every state and the federal system a defendant can get his legal costs paid by the plaintiff for frivolous lawsuits
and the big problem with med mal is that the state boards and the AMA are highly reluctant to pull a DR's license after he is sued, even if he causes serious injury.  So we have this small percentage of MDs that get sued over and over again.  This is part of the problem
Look at VA's solution - state supplied insurance for the highest risk MDs - thereby lowering insurance costs for all - not bad imo

Offline strk

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« Reply #190 on: May 17, 2004, 05:55:09 AM »
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Originally posted by storch
Strk the health care issue certainly needs to be addressed.  Look at it from another angle.

I have two friends that are physicians and one dentist.  These guys all went to school forever and at great expense.  

One works for the County Hospital and the VA he is a surgeon.  He chose this path because he is a liberal and feels like he's giving, blah blah blah.  Also he pays no malpractice insurance.  Apparently if you die from a bad proceedure in the federal hospital/County Hospital there is no one you can sue.

The other is a private practice cardiologist, he pays IIRC approximately $350,000.00 a year for his malpractice insurance.  That means that his patients are paying for that.

If we are to have a sensible and affordable health care system here in the US. it must begin with tort reform.

Both of these guys are in economic parity.  The guy that makes the most money and has the most free time is the dentist, go figure.

He has six practices utilizes recently licensed grads to do the lion's share his work and accepts no insurance work at all.  He also pays no malpractice, you sign a waiver, some sort of hold harmless document.  They perform first rate work at half the cost of what others charge.  a root canal with the crown is around $1500.00.  I just recently had one done and he charged me half that amount.

It seems that if we think outside of the box a bit there are sensible solutions to the healthcare situation in the US.

The European and Canadian model started out as a marvel.  But as the equipment and the facilities aged and there was no capital to upgrade they have sadly fallen behind and the quality of the service has suffered.  It's just hard to beat free enterprise.  I want whom ever is treating me for whatever to be happy and successful in their work.  I want them to make lots of money also.


check out what Virginia is doing about the problem - imo it is a good and suitable solution - the state will insure high risk MDs, allowing lower insurance premiums for the rest of the Drs.
the current bill - http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?041+ful+SB601ER

Offline strk

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« Reply #191 on: May 17, 2004, 05:58:30 AM »
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Originally posted by Toad
Just saw an interesting comment:

"The United States Marine Corps is larger than any single continental European army."


that may be true but given the small size of the Corps I find it hard to believe

Offline strk

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« Reply #192 on: May 17, 2004, 06:01:46 AM »
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Originally posted by NUKE
he also implies that Europe as a whole has a military..as in a unified force.


in my humble I think you assumed that

Offline Staga

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« Reply #193 on: May 17, 2004, 06:56:22 AM »
When thinking about military power you shouldn't forget that many europen countries are having mandatory military service for all males.
Finland, Sweden and Norway alone are having 4 million more or less combat ready men who have served their time in army in different branches.
Only way to keep unwanted Russian visitors away from Fenno-Scandinavia... :D

Offline Westy

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« Reply #194 on: May 17, 2004, 08:07:47 AM »
"Only way to keep unwanted Russian visitors away from Fenno-Scandinavia..."


Norway today? Finland tommorow?!

 http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,119670,00.html


 sniffing for oil?   ;)