Author Topic: A sub-par nomination from Bush (Read 2410 times)

Nash · « **Reply #90 on:** July 08, 2004, 12:52:53 AM »

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Originally posted by NUKE
What control does it have over the mother's action?

fetuses have a lot of control over their host's actions.

some chicks simply go berserk.

NUKE · « **Reply #91 on:** July 08, 2004, 12:55:46 AM »

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Originally posted by Sandman
It's not a double standard. The womb belongs to the woman. She gets to decide if the fetus lives or dies. If she wants to have the baby and someone else kills it, they can be charged for murder (and rightly so, IMHO). If she wishes to terminate, it is within her rights (and none other) to do so.

I'm perfectly happy with leaving this decision up to the people that actually possess a womb (and then only their own).

Of course, this will no doubt bring on the whine, "What about the father?" Suck it up... life's hard, wear a helmet and find a woman that will honor your wishes as equally as her own.

sandman, I totally dissagree with that premise. If a fetus is considered a life as a fetus in control of the mother, what is different about a single mother in control of a born baby?

Either a fetus is a human life or it is not..... no middle.

Sandman · « **Reply #92 on:** July 08, 2004, 12:58:56 AM »

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Originally posted by NUKE
sandman, I totally dissagree with that premise. If a fetus is considered a life as a fetus in control of the mother, what is different about a single mother in control of a born baby?

Either a fetus is a human life or it is not..... no middle.

Disagree all you like, but the law is with me, I think. Once they're born, the rules change.

Nash · « **Reply #93 on:** July 08, 2004, 12:59:32 AM »

TEH END!

Sandman · « **Reply #94 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:00:10 AM »

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Originally posted by Nash
TEH END!

Thank you. Thank you. I'll be here all week.

mietla · « **Reply #95 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:02:08 AM »

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Originally posted by Sandman
Disagree all you like, but the law is with me, I think.

Yes, we've already agreed on that, but the discussion is not about what's legal but about what's moral, and thus whether the law should change.

Nash · « **Reply #96 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:02:42 AM »

TEH BEGINNING AGAIN!

NUKE · « **Reply #97 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:03:16 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sandman
Disagree all you like, but the law is with me, I think. Once they're born, the rules change.

but the law was never the question here. Anything can be legal.

And actually, you believe that the legal status of a fetus ( life or not a life) is determined by the mother, not by law.

The law does have a double standard on the issue. On the one hand, a fetus is not a life (mom's choice to decide) and on the other hand a fetus is a life.... you cannot have it both ways and not be a hypocrite.

Sandman · « **Reply #98 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:03:39 AM »

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Originally posted by mietla
Yes, we've already agreed on that, but the discussion is not about what's legal but about what's moral, and thus whether the law should change.

I firmly believe that morality should not be legislated.

NUKE · « **Reply #99 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:04:47 AM »

It's funny too me..... the law takes two completely opposite positions on the issue.

NUKE · « **Reply #100 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:07:48 AM »

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Originally posted by Sandman
I firmly believe that morality should not be legislated.

It's not morality that is the issue. The issue is the definion of life.

If you believe a fetus is a life in one case ( can be charged with murder) yet in another case, the mother can kill that same life at her whim.....then you have not come to grips with the issue.

Nash · « **Reply #101 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:11:37 AM »

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Originally posted by NUKE
...a fetus is a life in one case ( can be charged with murder) ...

lol.... funny to see some of the more bizarre stuff I hurl actually stick.

Sandman · « **Reply #102 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:14:12 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by NUKE
but the law was never the question here. Anything can be legal.

And actually, you believe that the legal status of a fetus ( life or not a life) is determined by the mother, not by law.

The law does have a double standard on the issue. On the one hand, a fetus is not a life (mom's choice to decide) and on the other hand a fetus is a life.... you cannot have it both ways and not be a hypocrite.

That's because you're tripping over the "is it life or not" argument.

Of course it's life. The question is, "When does the fetus become a person and have rights of its own?" Some argue conception, but that's a slippery slope if ever. Birth is a much more practical milestone.

I believe the argument for convicting someone of killing a fetus isn't simply about the fetus. It's about violating the mother's right to have the baby.

NUKE · « **Reply #103 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:15:36 AM »

lol Nash.... I get it.... I should have worded that differently

I am still not drunk enought to be unable to tie in your fetus causing mommy to go nutz comment

Sandman · « **Reply #104 on:** July 08, 2004, 01:18:07 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by NUKE
It's not morality that is the issue. The issue is the definion of life.

If you believe a fetus is a life in one case ( can be charged with murder) yet in another case, the mother can kill that same life at her whim.....then you have not come to grips with the issue.

The fetus is a living parasite. Any right to life it might enjoy is derived from its host.

Simple as that.

If you think it immoral to kill it, don't. I think it's immoral to try and tell anyone what they can or cannot do with their own body.