Author Topic: Students Killed in school shooting... (Read 4897 times)

lazs2 · « **Reply #210 on:** March 25, 2005, 08:02:20 AM »

vulcan.. the uzi comment was a tounge in cheek one to bugs silly one. I said I don't think uzis are needed in schools.

scholtzie... I think plenty responded to nashwans post... england is just less murderous. it is a pretty pale and watered down society.

vulcan... if you have any armed police at all (which you do) then the exact same thing that happened here could happen there.. some kid could steal his policeman relatives guns and go on a school shooting.

as for those of you who think bolt action only rifles will stop crazy people... some of the most high profile shootings here have been done with bolt action rifles or less including the first school shooting (and bloodiest) from a tower in Texas.

No.. if killing is the thing they desire let's pray to gawd that they don't realize how much they can do with a car. Some of our worst massacres have been when a person is deranged and gets behind the wheel to mow people down. What will be the answer then? what will you ask nannie to do to save you then? what about bombs or poison? can nannie save you?

An armed guard would have ended this trajedy as would allowing teachers to carry concealed.... probly... you wouldn't know it tho because it simply wouldn't have happened at all.

There is hope...We are getting smarter tho... more and more people are seeing the gun bans as not only worthless but... a cause of needless trajedy... armed guards are appearing in schools and pilots are of comercial flights are being armed.... more and more states are allowing concealed carry and... crime is going down.

lazs

lazs2 · « **Reply #211 on:** March 25, 2005, 08:04:28 AM »

and... speaking of not answering.... vulcan never answered me... What gun laws passed in NZ have caused a drop in crime or even suicide?

lazs

Shuckins · « **Reply #212 on:** March 25, 2005, 08:24:31 AM »

Ah yes, Thomas Hamilton. Known pervert...a suspected paedophile...who had unrestricted access to the Dunblane school...good friend to local police authorities, who issued him a firearms certificate despite his reputation...the man which the government made the focus of an official investigation and inquiry and then locked up the records of that inquiry for 100 years...(One HAS to wonder why. Sounds like they're trying to protect somebody's arse.)

THAT Thomas Hamilton. A seriously disturbed, perhaps mentally ill individual. A man bent on inflicting as much punishment on the society that had offended him as humanly possible. The man who committed an extremely atypical, for Scotland, act of violence. Had he not had access to a firearm, he could just as easily have followed the example of an American psychopath of the early 20th century who drove a truck full of explosives to a school and detonated it outside the entrance, killing more than 75 students and teachers.

A maniac in south Africa a few years ago committed a similar atrocity...the perp killed more than 50 homeless young men who were sleeping in a type of flop house. He simply tossed in a gallon-sized molotov cocktail and then blocked the door.

Defenseless innocents have been, and always will be, targets of violence.

lazs2 · « **Reply #213 on:** March 25, 2005, 08:38:55 AM »

wait till the little buggers realize that you can kill more sheep with a truck running up on the sidewalk than a gun.

lazs

beet1e · « **Reply #214 on:** March 25, 2005, 09:25:29 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
No.. if killing is the thing they desire let's pray to gawd that they don't realize how much they can do with a car.

We've solved that problem here. Gasoline is too expensive for the perps to afford it. And I now realise why the govt. priced diesel even higher than petrol.

But don't forget death by syrup tins.

bustr · « **Reply #215 on:** March 25, 2005, 02:00:46 PM »

Beet,

I assume in england you can purchase chlorox and ammonia for cleaning purposes? Mix 1 to 1 in a sealed glass container. Throw into a crowded class room, subway stop, store, your favorite pub on a saturday night. Can you purchase nitrogen based fertilizer in england? I know you can purchase deisle fuel.

Can you purchase small propane canisters for saudering copper tubing. You can produce home grown napalm in your bath tub. Take some styrafoam and petrol along with the propane. All bug sprays can be boiled down on your stove top to create concetrated toxins which are lethal to humans. Smear some of the resulting slime on a small sharp object and bump into someone in a crowded shopping mall. It goes on and on....Are you adovacting progessive banning for each technology every time people kill each other with it?

South Africa has just banned firearms. Now everyone is buying battel axes, spears, knives, cudgels and cross bows. SA has one of the highest crime rates in the world. You have a 1 in 60 chance of being violently assulted. The criminals have discovered that cross bows have advantages over guns. Silent and bolts are not traceable like bullits.

All of the formulas for these alternate applications are on the internet. The peices for making any of it are freely purchased from your local stores. Oh and don't forget about making shanks out of plexiglass, hardwood, and metal strapping. Ive been reading about an increase in knife crime lately in England. Some kind of a knife ban has been put in place recently. But last I checked people are still shanking each other, especially teenagers where the marked increase recently in knifings in and around schools was the cause for the new ban.

People of all ages kill each other with "Tools" all the time around the world. There is a point where in the zeal of banning, and the full time enforcement of access to tools by the people, citizens, or subjects; The government crosses a soft imperceptable line from servents of the people, to the overserers of the people. This is why you cannot get many Americans to be reasonable about limiting the 2nd Amendmant. It's real purpose is for the people to kill the members of the government if or when they succeed in crossing that soft imperceptable line. England taught our founders alot in 1776 about that "line".

beet1e · « **Reply #216 on:** March 25, 2005, 03:22:19 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by bustr
Beet,

I assume in england you can purchase chlorox and ammonia for cleaning purposes? Mix 1 to 1 in a sealed glass container. Throw into a crowded class room, subway stop, store, your favorite pub on a saturday night. Can you purchase nitrogen based fertilizer in england? I know you can purchase deisle fuel.

Can you purchase small propane canisters for saudering copper tubing. You can produce home grown napalm in your bath tub. Take some styrafoam and petrol along with the propane. All bug sprays can be boiled down on your stove top to create concetrated toxins which are lethal to humans. Smear some of the resulting slime on a small sharp object and bump into someone in a crowded shopping mall. It goes on and on....Are you adovacting progessive banning for each technology every time people kill each other with it?

But they don't, do they. I never heard of anyone making a chlorox/ammonia bomb, and throwing it into a crowded room, and even if they did, I doubt that they would kill 16 people, which is how many died in each of the Hungerford and Dunblane tragedies.

In the US, they could use any of those methods you suggested, but they don't generally. When they want to kill lots of people, they use a gun. Also, have you noticed that police and military use guns in place of swords? I wonder why that is. Erm... read nashwan's post again!

Replicant · « **Reply #217 on:** March 25, 2005, 03:29:52 PM »

Beetle, you mean you're not watching 'The Two Ronnies', or are you like me and watching it behind your laptop?

lazs2 · « **Reply #218 on:** March 26, 2005, 10:48:23 AM »

beetle what are you talking about? in the U.S. the worst slaughters have been because of explosives and deadly, purposful use of motor vehicles. That is the fact. It is easier to use a gun in a lot of cases tho so that is the most popular right now.

using your country as an example is silly since you are nothing like us. you are much less likely to commit murder no matter what your gun laws are.

lazs

beet1e · « **Reply #219 on:** March 26, 2005, 11:43:58 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
beetle what are you talking about? in the U.S. the worst slaughters have been because of explosives and deadly, purposful use of motor vehicles. That is the fact.

You're just fishing for ways to divert attention away from guns, by presenting hypothetical scenarios of mass killings by any other means. I know all about murder by explosives. We lived with the IRA threat for a couple of decades.

But the fact remains that when someone flips his lid and wants to go on a killing spree, a gun is the instrument of choice. He doesn't want to have to rendez-vous with some underworld figure to buy semtex, and then acquire the other bits he'll need - battery, wires, timer, detonator. Why bother doing that, when your grandfather's gun is right there on the dresser in the bedroom or wherever it was.

lazs2 · « **Reply #220 on:** March 26, 2005, 12:04:56 PM »

how had is it to drive your car up onto the sidewalk and mow down people? some of our feeblest and weakest citizens have done it.

you don't need plastic or conventional explosives to make bombs all the literature is out there for making very effective bombs with common materials.

lazs

beet1e · « **Reply #221 on:** March 26, 2005, 01:40:18 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
you don't need plastic or conventional explosives to make bombs all the literature is out there for making very effective bombs with common materials.

The point is that it would all take time. But you are right, and look what happened with Timothy McVeigh - OK City, 168 (?) dead...

But the question is... how often does that happen? It's rare. But we're hearing about these school shootings/church shootings almost every week.

Which solution is easier/quicker for mass murder: - make a bomb using explosives, but first learn how to do it off the internet, go out into the desert to test prototype, build the real deal, carry it to school (undetected) position it, and detonate at the opportune time...

Or........

Grab your grandad's gun off the dresser.

Come on, Lazs - even you know the importance of having your big green gun safe.

lazs2 · « **Reply #222 on:** March 27, 2005, 10:51:33 AM »

How many school shootings does it take to make 168 dead? The federal government under the biggest gun control regiem ever in America (klinton reno) burned 28 children alive and then went on to shoot a few more at ruby ridge.

I never needed a "big green safe" in the past. Too many druggies out stealing everything they can get their hands on these days tho... I don't only use the safe for guns tho. It is fireproof for any fire I might have in my house and a great place to store important pics and papers.

There is allways a gun on the loose in my house tho when I am there.

lazs