Author Topic: Woah! look at this ki84! (Read 4544 times)

straffo · « **Reply #45 on:** March 30, 2005, 11:13:35 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Dinky2003
But do they censor the media that talks about those events? No.

And the German censor the media ?
No.

The German have done a work on their memory the Japanase still have not started.

Have the Japanese done this : http://www.verbrechen-der-wehrmacht.de/

Or something similar ?
Not yet.

Will they do something like that in the future ?
I don't know
Perhaps it's against their culture ?
Who knows ?

Dinky2003 · « **Reply #46 on:** March 30, 2005, 11:19:44 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by straffo
And the German censor the media ?
No.

The German have done a work on their memory the Japanase still have not started.

Have the Japanese done this : http://www.verbrechen-der-wehrmacht.de/

Or something similar ?
Not yet.

Will they do something like that in the future ?
I don't know
Perhaps it's against their culture ?
Who knows ?

Games are a form of media. The Germans do not allow any games that have anything related to the Nazis into their country. Until recently, Germany didn't even allow blood and death to be depicted in games. Also, Germany is hesitant to air anything related to the Nazi's history in WWII.

Also, if you go to Japan, there are many monuments and museums dedicated to their history, even if they contain stuff related to their "darker" moments in history.

Unfortunately I cannot view that website on Firefox, so I could not tell you if Japan has a similar project.

Hawklore · « **Reply #47 on:** March 30, 2005, 11:21:32 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by mechanic
good looking skin.

i hope we dont offend any Kamikaze veterans who might read these boards......

Thats bad.. really bad...

-Figured I had to add a smiley because I laughed at it..-

mechanic · « **Reply #48 on:** March 30, 2005, 11:44:17 AM »

straffo · « **Reply #49 on:** March 30, 2005, 01:20:19 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Dinky2003
Games are a form of media. The Germans do not allow any games that have anything related to the Nazis into their country. Until recently, Germany didn't even allow blood and death to be depicted in games. Also, Germany is hesitant to air anything related to the Nazi's history in WWII.

wrong and again wrong.
Game are entertainment not education.

You just have to open an hisory manual used by a German to now they learn their history including the darkest parts.

Quote

Also, if you go to Japan, there are many monuments and museums dedicated to their history, even if they contain stuff related to their "darker" moments in history.

lookup this : Ienaga Saburô

Quote

Unfortunately I cannot view that website on Firefox, so I could not tell you if Japan has a similar project.

I'm myself using Firefox 1.0.2. and have no trouble at all (except some translation difficulties but the picture don't need translation)

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; fr-FR; rv:1.7.6) Gecko/20050318 Firefox/1.0.2

oboe · « **Reply #50 on:** March 30, 2005, 02:03:26 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by mechanic
good looking skin.

i hope we dont offend any Kamikaze veterans who might read these boards......

When in played Warbirds and was a member of 27th Sentai, we had a Japanese squadmate who had an uncle who never returned from his kamikaze mission.

Just sayin'.

Dinky2003 · « **Reply #51 on:** March 30, 2005, 02:09:39 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by straffo
wrong and again wrong.
Game are entertainment not education.

You just have to open an hisory manual used by a German to now they learn their history including the darkest parts.

lookup this : Ienaga Saburô

I'm myself using Firefox 1.0.2. and have no trouble at all (except some translation difficulties but the picture don't need translation)

Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; fr-FR; rv:1.7.6) Gecko/20050318 Firefox/1.0.2
[/B]

Computer games are not purely entertainment. You can learn things from even some FPS games. On top of that, simulators are considered to be a valid form of education. If this were the 1980's, yes, I'd agree with you.

This is not the case now.

Yeah, you can open a Japanese history book and find out about the darker parts of their history too. *gasp*

Looked up that author, he wrote a book about the expansion of Japan into Asia before and during WW2. Point being?

I've been to Japan, and I know what I saw. They're not afraid of their history, they don't confine it to the history books, and they certainly don't throw a fit over a video game depicting a kamikaze attack, or similar events. The Germans on the otherhand, throw the slightest fit over a swastika or a game that even MENTIONS what Hitler did while in charge of Germany.

The website does not work on Firefox for me. I don't know why, but my computer is wacky when it comes to errors.

indy007 · « **Reply #52 on:** March 30, 2005, 02:28:30 PM »

It's a good looking skin. I'd fly it... but what do I know, I'd fly a neon pink b17 with bullseye's all over it if they let me.

Kweassa · « **Reply #53 on:** March 30, 2005, 09:41:38 PM »

Quote

I've been to Japan, and I know what I saw. They're not afraid of their history, they don't confine it to the history books, and they certainly don't throw a fit over a video game depicting a kamikaze attack, or similar events.

That's because most of the ultra-right wing militaristic war-time politicians in Japan have never faced proper judgement from the law. All of them(with a few exceptions, such as Tojo Hideki) were released scot-free after the initial trials, bred two~three generations of younger ultra right-wingers, who now consist the majority of Japanese politicians.

Germany has almost no remnant of the old Nazis left in their political circle. Japan however, (when it comes to politics. The Japanese people, is a different story) has ALL of their remnants still left.

Ofcourse they don't go hush-hush into these kind of stuff. They promote it everyday. The same type of propaganda is still alive after 60 years.

Karnak · « **Reply #54 on:** March 30, 2005, 10:30:31 PM »

What Kweassa said.

A lot of people don't realize that once the communists started getting a leg into post-war Japanese society we backed off the war time government and turned to them to keep the communists out, as they knew how to do it.

There were political reasons for it.

Japan has never come to honest terms with what it did in the '30s and '40s.

Some Japanese have. I recall Flying Dutchman here on this board condemning his government for not being honest about what happened. But the Japanese nation has not.

straffo · « **Reply #55 on:** March 31, 2005, 01:10:25 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Dinky2003
Computer games are not purely entertainment. You can learn things from even some FPS games. On top of that, simulators are considered to be a valid form of education. If this were the 1980's, yes, I'd agree with you.

This is not the case now.

But it's your perception , not the perception of the German

Quote

Yeah, you can open a Japanese history book and find out about the darker parts of their history too. *gasp*

Looked up that author, he wrote a book about the expansion of Japan into Asia before and during WW2. Point being?
[/B]

Well I expected you to find articles like this one : http://www.indiana.edu/~japan/Digests/textbook.html

Quote

I've been to Japan, and I know what I saw. They're not afraid of their history, they don't confine it to the history books, and they certainly don't throw a fit over a video game depicting a kamikaze attack, or similar events. The Germans on the otherhand, throw the slightest fit over a swastika or a game that even MENTIONS what Hitler did while in charge of Germany.[/b]

Please look at Kweassa post above , it describe perfectly my thought.
I've nothing against the Japanese as individuals I've lot of respect for some Japanese player and will wing with them without any afterthought.
It's just the society wich I've trouble with.
As Karnak wrote some like Fdutchmn have a clear vision of their past , like I as a French I know (and I'm ashamed) what happened in Algeria for example

Quote

The website does not work on Firefox for me. I don't know why, but my computer is wacky when it comes to errors. [/B]

Any error message ?
If any send me a mail to sort this out : fdejager(at)cegetel.net

TexMurphy · « **Reply #56 on:** March 31, 2005, 02:35:07 AM »

Speakin of nations that havent delt with their WW2 time.

Sweden.

My god do I get pissed everytime I think about it.

Neutral. Yeah right. Do you really think a nation beeing neutral would have stopped germany from invading it?

Sweden was basicly in a economical union with germany. We supplied germany with ore and lumber. Plus that we allowed free passage for german train convoys to Norway.

Pre WW2 Sweden was a poor country. The reason we are a well beeing country today has its roots back in the WW2 politics. While all of europe got drained economically and infrastructuraly sweden didnt suffer nearly as much. Sure we had shortages as the rest of the world but our export industry was picking up and our infrastructure was improving.

This closed the gap between rest of europe and sweden. Then during the post war years in the 40s and during the 50s swedens economy started taking of much faster then rest of europe as most of europe was still rebuilding.

That is how sweden went from a poor european country to a economicaly strong country.

Also the swedish voulenteers that fought in WW2 fought for two nations Finland and Germany. Fighting for Finland is natural since its a "brotherhood country" but the support was strong for germany among both people and government. Ofcourse the government has never officially said it supported sweden nor has it delt with the facts that the only reason sweden never got occupied was a more or less economical alliance with germany.

Pisses the poooooooooop out of me.
Tex

straffo · « **Reply #57 on:** March 31, 2005, 02:47:03 AM »

All nations have skeleton in the closet ,and some need to clean up (my country included)

Engine · « **Reply #58 on:** April 04, 2005, 06:18:03 AM »

Mine is infallible!

I think that Ki84 is absolutely gorgeous, but I probably wouldn't fly it. Too tragic.

Schutt · « **Reply #59 on:** April 04, 2005, 07:52:48 AM »

Looks perfect to me to suicide kill troops. Concerning that the ki 84 falls apart in steep dives in ah2 it would not be to difficult to auger while dive bombing a capital ship.

I think having kamikaze skin in the game would be ok as it can remind you of how the kamikaze actually sufferd during the war. It would constantly spin off such discussions. I did not know that they had korean kamikaze pilots nor did i know that they were forced to do it most of the times. So i already learned from the thread.