Gretna: Tragedy meets callousness

[crowMAW]

Originally posted by BTW
Your story is BS. First of all the bridge (Crescent City Connection)exits in Orleans parish, not Gretna. Gretna police have no authority there. Orleans Parish police (NOPD) stopped people from crossing the bridge, and 80% of NOPD is black.

They had the Police Chief of Gretna, Aurthur Lawson, on CNN tonight.  He admitted that he had ordered his officers to close the bridge and turn away anyone trying to cross.  He said. "Our city was locked down and secured, for the sake of the citizens that left their valuables here to be protected by us."

If what you say is true and he was out of his jurisdiction with no authority to close the bridge, then I hope he and his officers are held accountable for their actions.

Sorry...that is a piss poor excuse.  HWY 90 and over that bridge was the only sure route for supplies to get in and people to get out of NOLA during the peak of the flood.  I would not have blamed the crowd if they'd rioted and tossed those guys off the bridge.

[Goth]

Originally posted by crowMAW
They had the Police Chief of Gretna, Aurthur Lawson, on CNN tonight.  He admitted that he had ordered his officers to close the bridge and turn away anyone trying to cross.  He said. "Our city was locked down and secured, for the sake of the citizens that left their valuables here to be protected by us."

If what you say is true and he was out of his jurisdiction with no authority to close the bridge, then I hope he and his officers are held accountable for their actions.

Sorry...that is a piss poor excuse.  HWY 90 and over that bridge was the only sure route for supplies to get in and people to get out of NOLA during the peak of the flood.  I would not have blamed the crowd if they'd rioted and tossed those guys off the bridge.

And I would have. Half the anarchy was created by the idiots in New Orleans, the other half was created by Mayor Nagin's piss poor leadership.

[FiLtH]

The zoo wasnt the only place the animals escaped from.

[Simaril]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
You say that there are those who don't succeed, so they end up blaming society.  But then you go and blame society for those who don't succeed.  You say that there is nothing that they can do.

Not really -- reread it.

We are all responsible for our choices, but its simply true that opportunity isnt equal for all. But I strongly suspect that the limiting factors are less societal (based on government, rules, programs) than subcultural (based on the belief systems we grow up taking for granted).

Think of that old Brando movie, On the Waterfront. Brando was a thug's enforcer, living in the past ("I coulda been a contenda") -- but in the end he made a dangerous choice because it was the right thing to do. Making the right choice didnt make his life better, it didnt get him a house in the suburbs or a better job. He did what was right, and it defined WHO he was, not WHERE he was.

My point is that you can make the right choices and end up in a bad spot. It may be politically correct conservatism to blame the poor as societal failures getting their just reward, but it doesnt make me a liberal to see the situation with a bit more complexity.





BTW, no sarcasm intended, gotta love a BBS where a hint of liberal thinking gets pounced upon...its a refreshing change from the culture at large!:aok

[Raider179]

Originally posted by crowMAW
They had the Police Chief of Gretna, Aurthur Lawson, on CNN tonight.  He admitted that he had ordered his officers to close the bridge and turn away anyone trying to cross.  He said. "Our city was locked down and secured, for the sake of the citizens that left their valuables here to be protected by us."

If what you say is true and he was out of his jurisdiction with no authority to close the bridge, then I hope he and his officers are held accountable for their actions.

Sorry...that is a piss poor excuse.  HWY 90 and over that bridge was the only sure route for supplies to get in and people to get out of NOLA during the peak of the flood.  I would not have blamed the crowd if they'd rioted and tossed those guys off the bridge.

That is disgusting. It's property over people clear as day. "for the sake of the citizens that left their valuables here to be protected by us." So much for being a good neighbor or even acting as a decent human being. That might be the sorriest thing I have heard yet.

[ASTAC]

Sorry..maybe I'm callous..but If i lived in a nice town, and people who acted like animals (white, black, hispanic, etc) tried to come my way, I'd grab a gun and help defend the bridge. Sorry, but riff raff is riff raff, regardless of if they felt abandoned in NO, the behavior of the people there was unnacceptable and they would not be welcome in my community.

[Pooh21]

Yep if they want to smear poop over walls, loot, and kill each other, let them do it in the dry parts of their own town like they did.

[BTW]

The first exit off the bridge leads to dry ground and Orleans parish - check map quest. But the people crossing the bridge skipped the first exit - they were headed for Oakwood mall in Gretna. The media isn't gonna report that tidbit.

Damn the truth - make a good story.

[crowMAW]

Originally posted by BTW
The first exit off the bridge leads to dry ground and Orleans parish - check map quest. But the people crossing the bridge skipped the first exit - they were headed for Oakwood mall in Gretna.  

Hmmm...the folks they were interviewing could have been lying.  But one of them said, "We got to the top of the bridge. They stopped us with shotguns."  Is the exit at the end of the bridge or mid-span?

The interview I watched had video of the site.  The witness was indicating that there was an incline up the ramp to the bridge, which was shown on the video.  She explained that the officers were just on the other side as they climbed up the incline and on to the bridge superstructure.

It appears from maps of the area that the exit ramp is after you cross the bridge.  The witnesses are indicating that they were stopped before they could cross.

[Chairboy]

Don't worry crow, BTW's already made up his mind.  I'm sure he's comfortable in his reality that's filled with swarms of 'darkies'.

Unless he can offer another explanation for his vehemence...

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by Chairboy


Unless he can offer another explanation for his vehemence...

Maybe first hand experience.....but I'm just guessing here.

 Those dirty cops protecting their community!  

[BTW]

Chairboy, there were gangs looting stores three hours after the storm. They weren't looting out of need. They stayed for the soul sake of stealing. They looted every part of the CBD and were crossing the river to Oakwood Mall. And they weren't just looting, they were burning down the places they looted. Sorry you feel the police shouldn't intervene.

I wouldn't hesitate to blow a looters brains out, I don't care the race .

[mosgood]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
Maybe first hand experience.....but I'm just guessing here.

 Those dirty cops protecting their community!  

Sounds like that police chief was doing the job that the city he works for asked him to do.  We'll see if he's re-elected.  My guess is that he will be by the people that he is charged to protect.  

From how the media showed how bad things were down there, it sounds to me like he was protecting a secure area on the border of hell.

So, if that crowd that positioned itself near his position started to grow, he might have had to do more than shoot over their heads, if they decided to rush them.

Why he didn't offer to take in children and babies..?  Don't know....  I'm sure a lot of people down there during that time had to make a lot of very diffecult decisions.

His town was secured by some tough choices.....  the mayor of NO failed his city... this guy didn't.

[midnight Target]

Maybe it is time to ask ourselves this question:

Why do a majority of black people see the response of the government (federal, state and local) as obviously racist, while a majority of white people don't?

I just wonder what would happen if we all just attempted to understand the mindset that would lead a person to the conclusion that they are being treated differently based on their skin color. They don't dream this stuff up out of the clear blue sky. We all saw the pictures after the flood of white people "finding food" and black people "looting" the same food. Is it so hard to imagine a group of white cops seeing a large group of black people as looters, while the black people see the white cops as racists. Maybe they're both wrong, but the attempt to understand is the first step to solving the problem.

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by midnight Target
Maybe it is time to ask ourselves this question:

Why do a majority of black people see the response of the government (federal, state and local) as obviously racist, while a majority of white people don't?

I just wonder what would happen if we all just attempted to understand the mindset that would lead a person to the conclusion that they are being treated differently based on their skin color. They don't dream this stuff up out of the clear blue sky. We all saw the pictures after the flood of white people "finding food" and black people "looting" the same food. Is it so hard to imagine a group of white cops seeing a large group of black people as looters, while the black people see the white cops as racists. Maybe they're both wrong, but the attempt to understand is the first step to solving the problem.

  I`m gonna be sorry I went here with you, but here goes.
  First of all I don`t see the issue being discussed as a white/black/red/yellow thing. it`s a people thing. There were people of all color involved I believe.
  I believe every person has a right to protect their personal and private property. I don`t believe this was the case in this instance. Forbidding a group of people passage on a public road IMHO is wrong. The fact that they were trying to leave a disaster area just makes it worse. The manpower could have been used to "help" the people get out would have seen to have been the way to go.

 

Is it so hard to imagine a group of white cops seeing a large group of black people as looters, while the black people see the white cops as racists.  

  Not hard at all, I would say. Maybe it stems from the facts of what we have witnessed and the law of averages. A large percentage of the time when we see rioting and looting on a large scale we see black people doing it. Sad, but true.
  It`s easy to understand why the black people see the white cops as racist. That`s what has been taught for generations, especialy in the south.

We all saw the pictures after the flood of white people "finding food" and black people "looting" the same food.  

  I would think that most of the people who read/watched this would also consider the source of this. That being the media. The media will put whatever spin on things that produces the most "sensationlism" and I hope the majority of folks understand this. Remember I said "I hope" because sometimes I wonder if common sense isn`t a lost art.
  Does white/black racism still exist and is it still a strong factor in our times? You betcha it does. It`s alive and doing quite well. It is also most definitely a two way street. I see more racism from blacks towards whites than I do the other way around in this area.
  A reasonable human would hope that in a catastrophic situation as this that racism, prejudices and differences would be set aside on both sides of the issue. It doesn`t seem to happen though and I don`t see anything changing in the near future.